Speaker Wire - Newbie needs advice

sross17
sross17 Posts: 14
edited April 2008 in Basic Hookup/Wiring Questions
Hi guys,

I'm still a newbie and have received some pretty useful tips here before...need some more help if I may ask?

I just completed my speaker setup and am still using very old "cheap" speaker wire. I keep seeing that Blue Jeans has good speaker wire? I am planning to re-wire my HT system and want good enough speaker wire that I'm not "depleating" my system of it's potential. Here's what I have...

Yamaha HTR5940 Receiver
Denon 1930Ci DVD/SACD/DVDA
RT800 Front Mains (Bi-Wired currently)
Csi3 Center
DSW500 Sub
FXi A6 surround

My surround speakers are about 25 feet away from my receiver at the back of my family room. The fronts are only about 5 feet to each side of my receiver. In all, I will need close to 100 feet of speaker wire (wiring through walls).

Any suggestions of the kind of speaker wire I should use would be very helpful. Would like to keep it under $150.00 if possible.

Thanks guys!
Post edited by sross17 on
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  • phuz
    phuz Posts: 2,372
    edited January 2008
    http://www.signalcable.com

    Hard to beat.
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  • sross17
    sross17 Posts: 14
    edited January 2008
    Thanks for the advice regarding signal cable. I have looked at what they have to offer and if I get their ultra speaker wire...I'm looking at about $140.00 just to wire my fronts. I still have 25 feet per speaker of wire needed for my rear surround speakers. I would love to afford these speaker wires, but unfortunately out of my budget. Should I be looking at their entry level wires?
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  • MikeC78
    MikeC78 Posts: 2,315
    edited January 2008
    If you're on a budget, go bluejeans. Most manufactures use the same Belden wire that BJC sells for a lot less. May not look as pretty, but your wallet will.
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  • marvda1
    marvda1 Posts: 4,903
    edited January 2008
    give this a try and have some fun.
    http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/whitelightning/moonshine.html
    Amplifiers: Norma IPA 140, MasterSound Compact 845, Ayre v6xe, Consonance Cyber 800
    Preamp: deHavilland Ultraverve 3
    Dac: Sonnet Morpheus 2, Musical Paradise mp-d2 mkIII
    Transport: Jay's Audio CDT2 mk2, Lumin U1 mini
    Speakers: Rosso Fiorentino Volterra II
    Speaker Cables: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2, Organic Audio Organic Reference 2
    Interconnects: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2, Argento Organic Reference 2, Argento Organic 2
    Power Cables: Argento Organic Reference, Synergistic Research Foundation 10 and 12 ga.
    Digital cables: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2 bnc, Tellurium Q aes, Silnote Audio Poseidon Signature 2 bnc
    Puritan PSM156
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  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,781
    edited January 2008
    marvda1 wrote: »
    give this a try and have some fun.
    http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/whitelightning/moonshine.html
    Why on earth would you want the positive lead to be twice the guage of the negative lead?
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  • MikeC78
    MikeC78 Posts: 2,315
    edited January 2008
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    Why on earth would you want the positive lead to be twice the guage of the negative lead?

    :DGood question!
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  • jakelm
    jakelm Posts: 4,081
    edited January 2008
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    Why on earth would you want the positive lead to be twice the guage of the negative lead?

    Some people cant stand to see wire there and unused.

    But honestly, it should be the other way around, for a better ground.
    Monitor 7b's front
    Monitor 4's surround
    Frankinpolk Center (2 mw6503's with peerless tweeter)
    M10's back surround
    Hafler-200 driving patio Daytons
    Tempest-X 15" DIY sub w/ Rythmik 350A plate amp
    Dayton 12" DVC w/ Rythmik 350a plate amp
    Harman/Kardon AVR-635
    Oppo 981hd
    Denon upconvert DVD player
    Jennings Research (vintage and rare)
    Mit RPTV WS-55513
    Tosh HD-XA1
    B&K AV5000


    Dont BAN me Bro!!!!:eek:
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  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,781
    edited January 2008
    jakelm wrote: »
    Some people cant stand to see wire there and unused.

    But honestly, it should be the other way around, for a better ground.

    Since the signal is AC, I would think it would be best to have them the same gauge. Poor design in my opinion.
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  • jakelm
    jakelm Posts: 4,081
    edited January 2008
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    Since the signal is AC, I would think it would be best to have them the same gauge. Poor design in my opinion.

    Then just clip the green wire.....no the red....no the blue...cut it..cut it....:confused::confused:






    explodes into a million peices....:mad::eek:
    Monitor 7b's front
    Monitor 4's surround
    Frankinpolk Center (2 mw6503's with peerless tweeter)
    M10's back surround
    Hafler-200 driving patio Daytons
    Tempest-X 15" DIY sub w/ Rythmik 350A plate amp
    Dayton 12" DVC w/ Rythmik 350a plate amp
    Harman/Kardon AVR-635
    Oppo 981hd
    Denon upconvert DVD player
    Jennings Research (vintage and rare)
    Mit RPTV WS-55513
    Tosh HD-XA1
    B&K AV5000


    Dont BAN me Bro!!!!:eek:
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  • mojo_13
    mojo_13 Posts: 22
    edited January 2008
    I bought all my wire from monoprice.com and was very satisfied with it and at a great price. But I also agree if you can afford it bluejeans is the way to go.
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  • marvda1
    marvda1 Posts: 4,903
    edited January 2008
    that's why it's called diy, you have questions about how they do it all you have to do is try the way you think would sound the best, compare and use the best sounding method.
    Amplifiers: Norma IPA 140, MasterSound Compact 845, Ayre v6xe, Consonance Cyber 800
    Preamp: deHavilland Ultraverve 3
    Dac: Sonnet Morpheus 2, Musical Paradise mp-d2 mkIII
    Transport: Jay's Audio CDT2 mk2, Lumin U1 mini
    Speakers: Rosso Fiorentino Volterra II
    Speaker Cables: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2, Organic Audio Organic Reference 2
    Interconnects: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2, Argento Organic Reference 2, Argento Organic 2
    Power Cables: Argento Organic Reference, Synergistic Research Foundation 10 and 12 ga.
    Digital cables: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2 bnc, Tellurium Q aes, Silnote Audio Poseidon Signature 2 bnc
    Puritan PSM156
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  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,781
    edited January 2008
    marvda1 wrote: »
    that's why it's called diy, you have questions about how they do it all you have to do is try the way you think would sound the best, compare and use the best sounding method.

    I'll just do it the way I always have. 12ga or 14ga speaker wire, put bananas on end, done.

    No point putting a fancy name on a poor design, and pretending it's something special.
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  • marvda1
    marvda1 Posts: 4,903
    edited January 2008
    why do you say it's a poor design? i'm sure the guy tried it more than one way and found his way to sound the best. the home depot orange extention cord diy speaker cable also has three wires and people configure it in different ways.
    and back to your "poor design", tara labs had a well regarded speaker ( the one with the tfa return) which consisted of a single cable for each positive and negative post and the + and - wires were different gauges. now did tara labs have a "poor design) ?
    Amplifiers: Norma IPA 140, MasterSound Compact 845, Ayre v6xe, Consonance Cyber 800
    Preamp: deHavilland Ultraverve 3
    Dac: Sonnet Morpheus 2, Musical Paradise mp-d2 mkIII
    Transport: Jay's Audio CDT2 mk2, Lumin U1 mini
    Speakers: Rosso Fiorentino Volterra II
    Speaker Cables: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2, Organic Audio Organic Reference 2
    Interconnects: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2, Argento Organic Reference 2, Argento Organic 2
    Power Cables: Argento Organic Reference, Synergistic Research Foundation 10 and 12 ga.
    Digital cables: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2 bnc, Tellurium Q aes, Silnote Audio Poseidon Signature 2 bnc
    Puritan PSM156
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  • marvda1
    marvda1 Posts: 4,903
    edited January 2008
    sorry sross17 for getting the thread off topic. let's get back on topic.
    if someone thinks it important enough, start a new thread on the topic.
    Amplifiers: Norma IPA 140, MasterSound Compact 845, Ayre v6xe, Consonance Cyber 800
    Preamp: deHavilland Ultraverve 3
    Dac: Sonnet Morpheus 2, Musical Paradise mp-d2 mkIII
    Transport: Jay's Audio CDT2 mk2, Lumin U1 mini
    Speakers: Rosso Fiorentino Volterra II
    Speaker Cables: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2, Organic Audio Organic Reference 2
    Interconnects: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2, Argento Organic Reference 2, Argento Organic 2
    Power Cables: Argento Organic Reference, Synergistic Research Foundation 10 and 12 ga.
    Digital cables: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2 bnc, Tellurium Q aes, Silnote Audio Poseidon Signature 2 bnc
    Puritan PSM156
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,781
    edited January 2008
    marvda1 wrote: »
    why do you say it's a poor design?

    The signal going to your speakers is AC, that means current flows both directions. Why would more resistance on one wire be considered a good design? If the lengths are short enough, I doubt it would matter much. But on longer lengths, I would never use 16ga, which is all that wire is on the negative side.
    i'm sure the guy tried it more than one way and found his way to sound the best.

    I'm sure he tried it both ways, and then imagined his way sounded better.

    The real question is why go to all the bother? Buy real speaker wire and be done with it.
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  • cambir
    cambir Posts: 1,046
    edited January 2008
    sross17 - go with the bluejeans...you won't be dissappointed. I just wired speakers in a zone 2 (60-70 feet from source) with their "12-white" wire and it sounds great.
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  • daboyz
    daboyz Posts: 5,207
    edited January 2008
    ^^^^^+1^^^^^^
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  • vonnie123
    vonnie123 Posts: 326
    edited January 2008
    Monster Z2 is nicely priced at 1.29 per foot/retail is $5 per foot. Just bought some myself and made a couple of cables with GLS Audio terminations.

    accessories4less.com

    good service/prompt shipping.
    [
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  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,136
    edited January 2008
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    Why on earth would you want the positive lead to be twice the guage of the negative lead?

    Protons are bigger than electrons!:D
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,729
    edited January 2008
    Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • sross17
    sross17 Posts: 14
    edited January 2008
    Thanks to all for your help. I was leaning toward the Blue Jeans cable...seemed right for my budget. I just purchased 100 feet and should have it by Friday.

    I must admit this hobby is worse than a drug (I'm hooked) :o - I couldn't help myself and just picked up a Panamax M5100 Power Conditioner as an added toy along with a few new CD's.

    Nickleback
    Nine Inch Nails - Downward Spiral (Hybrid SACD)
    Velvet Revolver

    Absolutely rocked out last night and pissed off my neighbor. Oops

    Thanks again!!
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  • daboyz
    daboyz Posts: 5,207
    edited January 2008
    It'll only get worse...............
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  • vonnie123
    vonnie123 Posts: 326
    edited January 2008
    Better, but more expensive!
    [
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  • mmadden28
    mmadden28 Posts: 4,283
    edited March 2008
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    If the lengths are short enough, I doubt it would matter much. But on longer lengths, I would never use 16ga, which is all that wire is on the negative side.

    So what is the general consensus on what a 'longer length' is, with respect to when a certain guage wire should (or should not ) be used? Over 20'? 10? 50?

    Thanks
    ____________________
    This post is a natural product. The slight variations in spelling and grammar enhance its individual character and beauty and in no way are to be considered flaws or defects.

    HT:Onkyo 805, Emotiva XPA-5, Mitsu 52" 1080p DLP / polkaudio RTi12, CSIa6, FXi3, uPro4K
    2-chnl : Pio DV-46AV (SACD), Dodd ELP, Emotiva XPA-1s, XPA-2, Odyssey Khartago, LSi9, SDA-SRS 2 :cool:, SB Duet, MSB & Monarchy DACs, Yamaha PX3 TT, SAE Tuner...
    Pool: Atrium 60's/45's
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  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited March 2008
    mmadden28 wrote: »
    So what is the general consensus on what a 'longer length' is, with respect to when a certain guage wire should (or should not ) be used? Over 20'? 10? 50?

    Thanks

    The longer the length the higher the Ga needs to be to overcome resistance. Here is the bad part. Capacitance also increases. You lose some highs, and some detail. I have run 14 ga in wire lengths up to 35'. Not really a problem. Some would suggest 12ga. The rear sound tracks are usually capped off at upper levels knowing the limitations of long runs in movie theaters never mind home systems. Now SACD's like Dark Side of the Moon have extended highs all around. I still had no issues with the 14ga runs for the rears. I have tried a bunch of different cheap speaker wire, and have found the best bang for the buck for surrounds is the WalMart speaker cable in the automotive section. Not the A/V section. Save your money for the short runs in the front where it matters most. Try to match the center speakers cable to the mains. If you are using a receiver for amplification you are not going to see big differences with speaker cables. That being said I still recommend a decent set of cables for the front.
    Ben
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
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  • John K.
    John K. Posts: 822
    edited March 2008
    MM, there's no need to seek a "consensus" on the point of appropriate gauge for various lengths of run. This explanation of speaker wiring by a veteran audio professional is frequently cited and the table of suggested gauges can be used with confidence.
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  • strang22
    strang22 Posts: 32
    edited March 2008
    http://www.signalcable.com/

    the best place i have seen
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  • tinman67gz
    tinman67gz Posts: 15
    edited March 2008
    Of all the advice I saw here no one mentioned that you will need special cable for you in wall application. It will be sheilded to keep from picking up distortion from other electrical sources. Oh yeah, it's a code issue too.
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  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,781
    edited March 2008
    tinman67gz wrote: »
    Of all the advice I saw here no one mentioned that you will need special cable for you in wall application. It will be sheilded to keep from picking up distortion from other electrical sources. Oh yeah, it's a code issue too.

    In wall cable is not shielded. It just has an outer jacket that is fire rated, and does not emit noxious fumes when burned.
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  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited March 2008
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    In wall cable is not shielded. It just has an outer jacket that is fire rated, and does not emit noxious fumes when burned.

    Having been an electrician I fully agree. Kinda like Plenum rated cat5 cable.
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
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