Car Problem

BaggedLancer

appadv wrote: »

I think we've established that already...

Oh, in that case enjoy the red sox game!

Serendipity

audiobliss wrote: »

Just don't try listening to music. Next you'll blow those beautiful speakers Trey sweat so much over! :eek:

No music, I had taken apart my system and brought my HTPC with me to demo some DVD-Audio discs at Lasareath's house, since he wasn't sure if his DVDP could play DVD-Audio discs.

Well, I guess that never happened.

Now how do I go about finding the thermostat?

Serendipity

Also, a friend of mine told me that if the water pump needs replacing, the timing belt should be replaced too.

Does this make any sense?

audiobliss

I really can't say for sure. I've heard of having them both replaced at the same time before, but I think because they have similar life spans and so if one's bad, the other is likely to need replacing. But not because the have anything to do with the other.

How many miles are on the car and how many since the timing belt was last replaced, assuming it is a timing belt instead of a timing chain.

Serendipity

audiobliss wrote: »

I really can't say for sure. I've heard of having them both replaced at the same time before, but I think because they have similar life spans and so if one's bad, the other is likely to need replacing. But not because the have anything to do with the other.

How many miles are on the car and how many since the timing belt was last replaced, assuming it is a timing belt instead of a timing chain.

63,000 miles on the car, timing belt has never been replaced.

About time?

Serendipity

audiobliss wrote: »

...assuming it is a timing belt instead of a timing chain.

Sorry for the dumb question, but what's the difference between a timing belt & timing chain? I always thought they were the same thing.

Frank Z

Chain = Metal
Belt = rubber/nylon

BaggedLancer

Belt is what your father used to beat you with......chain is what he used to lock you to the the fence while he beat you with the belt.

kidding

audiobliss

You have to replace a timing belt, not a timing chain. Though chains do stretch, so I suppose if your engine lasted long enough you'd have to replace it. I don't know.

I don't know how general this is, but we have to replace the timing belt on the Jetta every 90,000 miles. So I'd say you're good to go on the timing belt. Again, assuming your Maxima has a belt instead of a chain. I personally have no idea.

Serendipity

audiobliss wrote: »

You have to replace a timing belt, not a timing chain. Though chains do stretch, so I suppose if your engine lasted long enough you'd have to replace it. I don't know.

I don't know how general this is, but we have to replace the timing belt on the Jetta every 90,000 miles. So I'd say you're good to go on the timing belt. Again, assuming your Maxima has a belt instead of a chain. I personally have no idea.

Thanks.

First thing in the morning tomorrow - I'll do the test that Shannon described, and post the results.

sucks2beme

60,000 is about timing belt replacement time on most cars I've had.
The pump is often driven off the timing belt, and is changed
at the same time because 90% of the labor to get to it is done to change the belt. If the pump was going bad, you'd hear noise, or be low on coolant.
Do some online research, or drop $20 on a manual. I'd hate to see you tear it all apart for nothing. Often, you do a search on the description of the problem, and the magic of the web shows you a hundred guys who had to solve the same problem as you. Did you smell antifreeze when you popped the hood? Got any drips around your parking spot?
You could also have a blown head gasket. That would cause overheating too.
Do you smell any odd exhaust odors, or see white smoke?
And yes, I've had the sticky thermostat get me.

mrbigbluelight

Shannon W. wrote: »

Squeeze the top radiator hose when the car is hot if the hose feels like there is pressure on it then its not stuck but if you can collapse it and it feels empty then its stuck! also while the car is cooled off take the radiator cap and let the car run and shine a flashlight inside the radiator to see if you can see water circulating inside it. If you cant see any movement after the car warms up rule out the thermostat then you can almost bet its the water pump! Good luck if you need to I could pm you my Phone number to try and walk you though diagnosing this. Also I'm glad to try and help but doing it over the phone or just not being there is Tough..

Shannon "RSP"

That's dead on advice.

Serendipity

mrbigbluelight wrote: »

That's dead on advice.

OK - I did the test Shannon described and there is pressure in the top radiator hose. However, when I opened up the radiator cap (after letting the car sit overnight), the coolant in the radiator was VERY full - some came out of the top. As a result I was reluctant to have the radiator cap open and run the car - it seemed like more coolant would just come out the top.

So - looks like a water pump or thermostat then?

heiney9

appadv wrote: »

That's a good thing, that there's no coolant leaking then.

Rant: On a side note, first it's PC problems and then this. Everything's been going belly up around here and it's really frustrating.

LOL, when it rains it pours as I'm in the same boat right now. Car repairs, etc. Grab a cold one and relax, nothing you can do about it.

I'd say T-stat if not that then the waterpump, those are basic items not knowing the complete in's and out's of the car.

Some cars like mine have an auxillary coolant pump that circulates water after the engine is shut off as well as 2 fans, each with 2 speeds all thermostatically controlled, etc if one or more fails over heating can happen.

Usually in the situation as you describe it it's the T-stat. Best way to check is to have the car running for awhile. Being aware of the fan (so you don't get your hand caught) feel/squeeze the lower radiator hose (after the t-stat) and the upper radiator hose, if the lower is cold a collapsable and the upper is warm/hot and firm your t-stat isn't opening. When this happens the coolant doesn't circulate properly, hence the overheating.

H9

sucks2beme

Spring a few bucks for a cooling system check. The fan might be a little slow coming on, or only come on with a/c on. The fan relay turns on with the A/c,
but if the sensor is not working well, standby for trouble. Clogs could cause it ,too. They can also pressure check the system. If there's a head leak, that
would show up.

Serendipity

Thanks for all your help. I will try and fix it right after I take my midterms this week. Hope it isn't a big problem and is an easy fix.

Again, thanks for all your advice!

disneyjoe7

Over heating is lack of flow, either water or air. The other reason is lack of pressure, not making 14psi or so the boil temp point is lowered.

So knowing this a look into radiator looking for dirty tubes, this would prevent flow. Leaks around any hose, water pump, would prevent pressure from building up. A bad radiator cap could cause this also lack of pressure. If all that looks ok does the fans work? The quickest way is to turn on AC and look for all fans on, this is not 100% but would tell you fan motors work and get power.

Hope that help.

BTW just my $.02 I doubt that a timing belt could ever cause over heating.

sucks2beme

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

Over heating is lack of flow, either water or air. The other reason is lack of pressure, not making 14psi or so the boil temp point is lowered.

So knowing this a look into radiator looking for dirty tubes, this would prevent flow. Leaks around any hose, water pump, would prevent pressure from building up. A bad radiator cap could cause this also lack of pressure. If all that looks ok does the fans work? The quickest way is to turn on AC and look for all fans on, this is not 100% but would tell you fan motors work and get power.

Hope that help.

BTW just my $.02 I doubt that a timing belt could ever cause over heating.

Unless it jumped off mark a tooth either way.
That would have more than running hot going on. It would idle rough
and be hard to start. Not likely.
Bad radiator cap would show up with leaking fluid. Bad water pumps
tend to make noise and leak out the weep hole, but most import
engines hide the pump under a cover and drive it off the timing belt.
The chances of the pump rotors not moving enough water
on a car of this age ....I bet not. If it was older or high milage, then I'd
believe it. They still move water fairly well up to the point of complete failure.
With no obvious signs or odor of antifreeze, I'd bet on a fan, restriction,
head leak,partially stuck thermostat(I like this one) or really bad air pocket in the system. Change the thermostat, flush the system, pressure check
the system. Better to pay someone a few bucks to run through the
options than ruin the engine by overheating.

Serendipity

sucks2beme wrote: »

Unless it jumped off mark a tooth either way.
That would have more than running hot going on. It would idle rough
and be hard to start. Not likely.
Bad radiator cap would show up with leaking fluid. Bad water pumps
tend to make noise and leak out the weep hole, but most import
engines hide the pump under a cover and drive it off the timing belt.
The chances of the pump rotors not moving enough water
on a car of this age ....I bet not. If it was older or high milage, then I'd
believe it. They still move water fairly well up to the point of complete failure.
With no obvious signs or odor of antifreeze, I'd bet on a fan, restriction,
head leak,partially stuck thermostat(I like this one) or really bad air pocket in the system. Change the thermostat, flush the system, pressure check
the system. Better to pay someone a few bucks to run through the
options than ruin the engine by overheating.

Will try to change the thermostat first. But I'd rather have a mechanic look at it because I don't know much about cars. Unless the thermostat is something the average Joe could do...

sucks2beme

The thermostat used to be easy. I don't have any wrench time on the **** 4 cyl.
If in doubt, spring for the mechanic.
I have always wrenched my own where I can. Good mechanics have
been hard to find. What I hate around Dallas is the wait for them to look at it
is always longer than the time to fix it myself. I've always tried to learn the
guts of ever car I've owned. Either way, get a manual for your car and study it.
Like everything else, knowledge is power. It's hard to BS a smart owner.

Serendipity

sucks2beme wrote: »

The thermostat used to be easy. I don't have any wrench time on the **** 4 cyl.
If in doubt, spring for the mechanic.
I have always wrenched my own where I can. Good mechanics have
been hard to find. What I hate around Dallas is the wait for them to look at it
is always longer than the time to fix it myself. I've always tried to learn the
guts of ever car I've owned. Either way, get a manual for your car and study it.
Like everything else, knowledge is power. It's hard to BS a smart owner.

I'm probably going to have my dad take the car to a mechanic. But I also want to learn about it myself so I can tell if the mechanic is incompetent/dishonest. You're right, knowledge is power.

Keep the advice coming!

Thanks!

Serendipity

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

Over heating is lack of flow, either water or air. The other reason is lack of pressure, not making 14psi or so the boil temp point is lowered.

So knowing this a look into radiator looking for dirty tubes, this would prevent flow. Leaks around any hose, water pump, would prevent pressure from building up. A bad radiator cap could cause this also lack of pressure. If all that looks ok does the fans work? The quickest way is to turn on AC and look for all fans on, this is not 100% but would tell you fan motors work and get power.

Hope that help.

BTW just my $.02 I doubt that a timing belt could ever cause over heating.

No dirt in the radiator as far as I can tell, and no dirty tubes. If you look at the picture attached on the first page of this thread, that fan is also working.

disneyjoe7

Ok a back yard mechanic test was radiator fill of water if no check oil. If oil is milky problem you have a leaky head casket and water is getting into oil. If fill water I would start engine let ideal and check these 2 things a pretty firm radiator upper hose, if soft than something is not allow pressure build up. Second look at exhaust and see if there seems to be heavy fog / smoke, also smell the exhaust if kind of odd not gassy then maybe you have a blown head casket.

Serendipity

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

Ok a back yard mechanic test was radiator fill of water if no check oil. If oil is milky problem you have a leaky head casket and water is getting into oil. If fill water I would start engine let ideal and check these 2 things a pretty firm radiator upper hose, if soft than something is not allow pressure build up. Second look at exhaust and see if there seems to be heavy fog / smoke, also smell the exhaust if kind of odd not gassy then maybe you have a blown head casket.

No smoke in the exhaust, and AFAIK, the coolant is not mixing with the oil either. I don't think it's a blown head gasket because there is no heavy fog/smoke coming out of the exhaust.

BTW, I had a blown head gasket on my lawnmower and it was not pretty. Smoked so much that the neighbors wondered WTH was going on.

disneyjoe7

Other then changing out thermostat. I would start engine let it warm up checking for pressure on hoses / leaks, see if fans turn on and cycle off. For this don't have AC on this should turn fans on by itself, you what to see if the engine computer will do it also.

Serendipity

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

Other then changing out thermostat. I would start engine let it warm up checking for pressure on hoses / leaks, see if fans turn on and cycle off. For this don't have AC on this should turn fans on by itself, you what to see if the engine computer will do it also.

I don't have the AC on (it's really cold in NYC right now) and the radiator fan comes on by itself when the engine has reached a certain temperature.

So yes, the fans do turn on and cycle off.

Does this mean anything?

audiobliss

That they're more than likely functioning properly.

Serendipity

audiobliss wrote: »

That they're more than likely functioning properly.

Haha, I'd think that too but disneyjoe told me to check the fan again to see if the engine computer turns them on and off.

P.S. You got my PM?

audiobliss

Yeah, I did. Sorry I haven't taken time to reply to it yet.

Basically, I don't know enough to really be able to give you any more advice. I'd personally say stay away from rental cars. I'd imagine they'd be beat to death.

audiobliss

Oh, and I'll *try* going the speed limit on my next tank so I can give you some mileage numbers.

It'll probably be Thursday or Friday before I fill up on that next tank, though.