Oppo with Power Cord Anyone?

PolkWannabie

Early B. wrote:

That's for you to determine. A tweak in my system may have no impact at all in yours.

For instance, some people swear by various isolation techniques. So far, I haven't heard any differences in my system after experimenting with several types of isolation options.

You missed my point ...

unc2701

Ok, here, lets try this. I found half my program, so please download the attachment, it's the first couple seconds of Whites Stripes, "Ball and a Biscuit" in a text file. These are the actual samples. This is what goes over his digital connection from the Oppo to the receiver. Edit it in any way you like and I'll read it your results back in. I guarantee you won't get anything that sounds like RF noise, louder volume, nada.

zombie boy 2000

Certainly not with these kickin' Viewsonic monitor speakers I'm rocking the casbah with...:p

Good to see the gauntlet has been thrown.

mlhm5

sell a unit with a power cord that might detract from its full potential. Does not sound like the Oppo I know. The company that puts upgrades on their website and has probably the best customer service of anyone selling DVD players.

Doesn't figure.

zombie boy 2000

Did you happen to notice the interconnects that were supplied with it? I'd say it's safe to say that they "detract from the Oppo's full potential"

Early B.

mlhm5 wrote:

sell a unit with a power cord that might detract from its full potential. Does not sound like the Oppo I know. The company that puts upgrades on their website and has probably the best customer service of anyone selling DVD players.

Doesn't figure.

Do you expect premium parts on a $150 DVD player?

pearsall001

Early B. wrote:

That's for you to determine. A tweak in my system may have no impact at all in yours.

For instance, some people swear by various isolation techniques. So far, I haven't heard any differences in my system after experimenting with several types of isolation options.

Hey Early, nice write up about the power cord being used with the OPPO player. That's the beauty of trying out tweaks. You get to use them in your system with a sound that you're very familiar with. You pretty much know if the tweak made any difference after some carefull listening. I just love these guys that need to wip out the SPL meter or state that if something can't be measured therefore you possibly can't hear any difference. Who gives a **** in my opinion. If it makes your system sound better, then you found yourself a winner. If some of these guys would pony up some coin & buy some tweaks to try maybe then they would get the drift. I think most of this stuff comes with a 30 day home trial, if you don't like it, send it back. Let's spend less time measuring & more time fine tuning our systems. Let the fun begin. Your's truly "The TWEAK KING" (second only to Joe, hearingimpaired)

hearingimpared

There he goes talking about me again!;)

louthewiz

Gentlemen I read this thread from the first post until the last and I like to see firmly minded people stick up for what they believe in ,and if they feel their dvd player plays better or sounds different with certain tweaks then great.
I have a pioneer elite dv-09 and I think it is the best piece of equipment I have ever owned hands down , and over the years I bought other dvd players and none that I've owned even came close to the video and audio quality that the pioneer has and even my buddies tell me the same thing and I feel that the quality comes from the great build quality and premium parts it was built with is what makes the player what it is,.
Now I feel that good quality interconnects and speaker wires does make a difference in sound quality for sure, But when it comes to power cords they are specifically designed to deliver the best performance when first put together and just because you put a $50.00 power cord on that same player when it came with a $5.00 stock cord and still believe or feel that the new cord made an audible difference is purely beyond me .
A new 6 foot power cord can not possibly make any physical or audible difference whatsoever in sound quality just because it's bigger or sheilded yadda yadda yadda because copper is copper whether it be oxygen free ,stranded ,solid or whatever the end result will always be the same 110volts going to the power supply module in the component.:rolleyes:

Early B.

louthewiz wrote:

A new 6 foot power cord can not possibly make any physical or audible difference whatsoever in sound quality just because it's bigger or sheilded yadda yadda yadda because copper is copper whether it be oxygen free ,stranded ,solid or whatever the end result will always be the same 110volts going to the power supply module in the component.:rolleyes:

Kindly share with us your personal experiences with various after market power cords that support this position...

hearingimpared

louthewiz wrote:

A new 6 foot power cord can not possibly make any physical or audible difference whatsoever in sound quality just because it's bigger or sheilded yadda yadda yadda because copper is copper whether it be oxygen free ,stranded ,solid or whatever the end result will always be the same 110volts going to the power supply module in the component.:rolleyes:

You are dead wrong about the "sheilded." A power cord is a really great antenna and picks up EVERYTHING that comes its way. After the thousands of miles of power cables and hundreds of feet of house wiring, this last "6 foot power cord" unshielded vs. shielded is night and day. I've heard it. I have four in my system now. If I could afford it on all my gear, especially my turntable and VPI power and hz conditioner and Oppo, I would gladly spend the money for it. It makes that much of a difference. I've heard it. At the minimum it lowers the noise floor very audibly.

hearingimpared

louthewiz wrote:

because copper is copper whether it be oxygen free ,stranded ,solid or whatever the end result will always be the same 110volts going to the power supply module in the component.:rolleyes:

If copper is copper, then please explain your claim of, "Now I feel that good quality interconnects and speaker wires does make a difference in sound quality for sure," If copper is copper then where does the "difference in sound quality for sure" come from? Is zero ohms in a copper wire the same zero ohms in silver wire resistance or reactance? If that is the case why does silver sound so much different? I'm sure you are going to deliver the knock out punch with the power cord does not carry the signal . . . this is true however it brings all kinds of unwanted signals to the table and that is what a good power cord will eliminate. I've heard the difference. A power conditioner with a good power cord is even better.

louthewiz

The reason silver brings a better signal is because it is a better conductor of electricity,and gold is much superior.
I am a retired licensed electrician and I was in the business for the past 25 years
Now a shielded power cord and a nonshielded one is going to deliver the same amount of current no matter what,Interconnects carry an audio signal between components because the equipment has filters to filter out "Induction" in the electrical path of the audio spectrum,a power cord carries the same induction no matter what and the same power cords that these snake oil dealers sell is insane when anyone who can use wire strippers and a screwdriver can make one by going to your local home depot and purchasing the materials for $9.99 and people say they can hear or see a difference is not true because I have gone to several blind tests with stock power cords and those other brands and they all sounded the same to me.
And the reason it might sound better with a power conditioner is because the unit also has the same filter built into the preamps and amplfiers and avrs that we use in home thater,Now remove the power conditioner which all it is really doing is filtering out the noise with the same fancy power cord and the noise will still be there so 6 feet between the wall socket and the component is going to have a 60hz induction noise no matter what...

PolkWannabie

Without touching the argument of whether or not some flavor of power cord is better then some other ...

It was already stated by the thread originator that that at least two changes were made to the rig in question and that the author was not going to go back and perform an A/B test of the power cord that was previously in play versus the one that replaced it to see what effects were the result of the power cord swap.

Early B. wrote:

You are correct, so I gotta make a correction to my statements about the power cord. I had forgotten that I recently changed an interconnect from the receiver to my amp which powers the front speakers. The interconnect is a DH Labs Air Matrix which is silver coated copper, I believe. So some, most, or all of what I was hearing could probably be attributed to the interconnect, not the power cord. Of course, I have no idea, and don't ask me to do an A/B test on thepower cords 'cause I really don't give a damn.

So while there may in fact be loudness or other sonic differences there really is no subjective let alone objective way to get a handle on what change was responsible for the differences.

Early B.

Yeah PW, and believe me when I say there's been a huge improvement in the sound. I can prove it -- been watching a couple of movies this week and my wife has commented more than once that the system sounds better.

PolkWannabie

Now if you only knew which change you made that was of real benefit ...

This was the point I was trying to make earlier ...

Personally I like to make changes one at a time and live with them for awhile, unless they're initially horrible and break in is not a factor, so that I know what I'm getting or losing from adding, changing or deleting and given piece.

To each his/her own ...

Early B.

PolkWannabie wrote:

Now if you only knew which change you made that was of real benefit ...

More than likely the interconnect made the biggest difference. In my experience, that's always been the case.

louthewiz

0k guys I just wanted to add that we are all one big happy family and we don't want to screw that up in any way and I feel that we need to continue to communicate and get along jsut in case we need help in the future.

Next is my review on the dvd rewinder and the way it makes my dvds sound better..


http://www.dvdrewinder.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=1:eek:

Early B.

There are several reasons why some people hear improvements in interconnects, speaker cables, power cords, etc., while others don't:

1. Some people just don't give a damn and won't even try

2. Some ears are more sensitive than others

3. Ears get old with age

4. Pre-conceived ideas that these changes won't work

4a. Too left brained -- if there's no scientific evidence, it cannot be true

4b. Some people simply don't want to hear differences because it costs more money, or they won't allow themselves to be proven wrong.

5. You need a good system to hear changes (i.e., beyond entry level)

hearingimpared

Early B. wrote:

There are several reasons why some people hear improvements in interconnects, speaker cables, power cords, etc., while others don't:

1. Some people just don't give a damn and won't even try

2. Some ears are more sensitive than others

3. Ears get old with age

4. Pre-conceived ideas that these changes won't work

4a. Too left brained -- if there's no scientific evidence, it cannot be true

4b. Some people simply don't want to hear differences because it costs more money, or they won't allow themselves to be proven wrong.

5. You need a good system to hear changes (i.e., beyond entry level)

Very well put EB.

hearingimpared

Yes Lou it is obvious that you have been in the electrical industry for some time and I mean that is the kindest way. I've been in the electronics and computer industry for since 1975 until just recently. One thing I've never doubted were my ears reguardless of what a meter or oscilliscope displayed. When there is an obvious change in the sound of the music and I live with it for a while and decide that I like the way it sounds because to me it sounds like naturally sounding music then I go for it. Snake oil you say, maybe but I can tell when something doesn't work and when it does improve the performance of my gear or rig in general.

louthewiz wrote:

The reason silver brings a better signal is because it is a better conductor of electricity,and gold is much superior.
I am a retired licensed electrician and I was in the business for the past 25 years
Now a shielded power cord and a nonshielded one is going to deliver the same amount of current no matter what,Interconnects carry an audio signal between components because the equipment has filters to filter out "Induction" in the electrical path of the audio spectrum,a power cord carries the same induction no matter what and the same power cords that these snake oil dealers sell is insane when anyone who can use wire strippers and a screwdriver can make one by going to your local home depot and purchasing the materials for $9.99 and people say they can hear or see a difference is not true because I have gone to several blind tests with stock power cords and those other brands and they all sounded the same to me.
And the reason it might sound better with a power conditioner is because the unit also has the same filter built into the preamps and amplfiers and avrs that we use in home thater,Now remove the power conditioner which all it is really doing is filtering out the noise with the same fancy power cord and the noise will still be there so 6 feet between the wall socket and the component is going to have a 60hz induction noise no matter what...

Holydoc

hearingimpared wrote:

Very well put EB.

It would be very well put if EB also included the possibility that there is no difference in sound (notice I did not say there was or was not a difference. Only the fact that his statements are biased and assume there was).

In other words the following item (as an example) could be added to EB's list:

6) The desire to hear a difference is so strong that one is perceived where no difference exists

Never underestimate the power of the mind or the power of suggestion. I have been to many hypnotist shows where people believed in things that just were not there. We have all heard of or experienced an episode where a person or mass of people were made to believe in a ludicrous idea (anyone remember the Halley Comet mothership?).

I am not saying whether a power cord makes a sonic difference or not in EB's system. I am just stating that if you wish to be fair and unbiased, you need to add a few items like Number 6 above to EB's statement.

Early B.

Good point, Holydoc. However, the majority of "audiophiles" agree there are differences among cables. Otherwise, most of us would be using the lamp cord of yesteryear or cheap Home Depot cable wire. Hell, most of the naysayers don't do that.

I'm not trying to convince anyone. You can either hear differences or you can't. It's that simple. Either way is OK. If you can't, it's kinda tough to dispute the perceptions of the majority. Whether these perceptions are real or imagined are irrelevant.

hearingimpared

Holydoc wrote:

It would be very well put if EB also included the possibility that there is no difference in sound (notice I did not say there was or was not a difference. Only the fact that his statements are biased and assume there was).

In other words the following item (as an example) could be added to EB's list:

6) The desire to hear a difference is so strong that one is perceived where no difference exists

Never underestimate the power of the mind or the power of suggestion. I have been to many hypnotist shows where people believed in things that just were not there. We have all heard of or experienced an episode where a person or mass of people were made to believe in a ludicrous idea (anyone remember the Halley Comet mothership?).

I am not saying whether a power cord makes a sonic difference or not in EB's system. I am just stating that if you wish to be fair and unbiased, you need to add a few items like Number 6 above to EB's statement.

You are correct! This is where I bring in the unbiased ears of my wife. She could care less what I tweak with, whatever I tweak with, and rarely knows how much I spent on the tweak (:eek: ). I bring her in ask her to pick out something she is very familiar with and loves and then I go to work and I don't lead the witness. She tells me what she hears for better or worse.

tonyb

Still makeing that poor woman decide...better or worse?
Didn't she do that years ago?:)

unc2701

Here's the thing EB... lemme use a car analogy:

Let say you take your car in and get it new tires, new shocks, new springs, get everything balanced and tuned in. You also get some new cup holders- carbon fiber and they really grip your coke can tight. You drive it home and that **** is just clinging to the road like it never has before- it handles perfectly. So you get home and you come and tell us, "Guys! you GOTTA get some of these cup holders!!!" Now, do the cup holders matter? Sure- they're lighter than the old ones and every pound matters and since your coke can doesn't rattle around so much, you might perceive your ride as being better (and let's face it- bad cup holders can totally ruin a long drive), BUT it's not the cup holders that are making the car handle so much better.

We're (well at least I'm) not saying cables don't matter and that your power cable did nothing, but the vocabulary you're using is what people use when describing an analog IC upgrade or a power cord upgrade on the amp or pre. Not on a digital source.

You're doing yourself a disservice by not going through the exercise of isolating that upgrade and seeing what it did for your system. In fact, I think everyone should do the "rusty coat hanger" test just to get a feel for what qualities bad sound has at each stage of the signal path. When I was doing studio stuff there was this engineer who could listen to the monitors and if anything was wrong, he knew right where to find it. He'd say, "There's too much shimmer on those cymbals... let's switch to the analogs out of the ADAT" and he'd be right. One of my reference CD's I use simply because it's got this section of REALLY bad compression. When that part hits on a bad system, you don't notice; when it hits on a good system it feels like someone just stuff a bunch of cotton in your ears.

I guess my point is that post #110 doesn't really have a place in this thread until you actually go through the effort.

tonyb

Cables are kind a like car tires.They all do the same thing.But you have to match the tire to the type of car you have.Audio is the same,you have a nice rig,your not going to use the crappy interconnects that came with your dvd player are ya?Hope not anyway.

Early B.

unc2701 wrote:

Here's the thing EB... lemme use a car analogy:

Let say you take your car in and get it new tires, new shocks, new springs, get everything balanced and tuned in. You also get some new cup holders- carbon fiber and they really grip your coke can tight. You drive it home and that **** is just clinging to the road like it never has before- it handles perfectly. So you get home and you come and tell us, "Guys! you GOTTA get some of these cup holders!!!" Now, do the cup holders matter? Sure- they're lighter than the old ones and every pound matters and since your coke can doesn't rattle around so much, you might perceive your ride as being better (and let's face it- bad cup holders can totally ruin a long drive), BUT it's not the cup holders that are making the car handle so much better.

The cup holder matters if it's important to you in your enjoyment of the ride. Of course, cup holders don't contribute to the handling of the car because they ain't designed to do that. However, audio cables are designed to contribute to the "handling" of the music. Also, cup holders are not a necessity whereas cables are essential.

Early B.

unc2701 wrote:

You're doing yourself a disservice by not going through the exercise of isolating that upgrade and seeing what it did for your system. ...

I guess my point is that post #110 doesn't really have a place in this thread until you actually go through the effort.

Been there, done that.

I've already gone through the effort of isolating the differences that cables make, just not in this particular instance because I don't need to. I already know from personal experience that upgraded cables are going to make an improvement, so I don't need to experiment anymore. I have nothing to prove to myself or anyone else.

unc2701

Early B. wrote:

The cup holder matters if it's important to you in your enjoyment of the ride. Of course, cup holders don't contribute to the handling of the car because they ain't designed to do that. However, audio cables are designed to contribute to the "handling" of the music. Also, cup holders are not a necessity whereas cables are essential.

It's called a metaphor... of course it's not going to hold up if analyze every aspect What you described has about as much to do with the DVD's power cable as the cupholder does with the handing of a car.