Myth of break in period for speakers

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  • Holydoc
    Holydoc Posts: 1,048
    edited December 2006
    johnADA wrote:
    Common sense is thrown right out the window in audio and video forums, right out the window!!!

    I agree with everything you said John except about video. There is conclusive ways to test and demonstrate that one video performance is better than another. There is also physical ways to show defects in one video performance from another. Video is not as subjective as audio.

    The difference between audio and video is that those that argue the loudest about audio without any physical proof to their conclusions usually win. Those that argue the loudest about video without any physical proof to their conclusions usually are given a foot to chew on. ;)
    Holydoc (Home Theatre Lover)
    __________________________________________
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    PolkAudio - CSi5 (Center)
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  • MSALLA
    MSALLA Posts: 1,602
    edited December 2006
    johnADA wrote:
    For the majority of posts, I would concur!!!!

    Asking what is the best is absurd at best. There is no best!!!! There are a awful lot of OPINIONS as to whats best and even those are very subjective. 2 speakers, 2 different companies, same drivers from a 3rd party, which most are, using the same box sizes, same port sizes and materials and youve got these are better because they cost 10 times more, OK!!!!

    Most every post is subjective in nature at best outside problem ones.
    Its subjective with many reasons from monies spent, how in depth of a Audiopile you believe you are and so on!!! For every pro, there is always a con on EVERYTHING thats posted.
    Common sense is thrown right out the window in audio and video forums, right out the window!!!
    There is not one thing I have ever bought that didnt settle or change in one way to another, nor anybody else. Which side of the fence do you want to sit on????

    Stupid argument at best!!!

    Whoa! slow your roll there big guy. I think most people on th fourm would agree that they have lerned alot being on here. The hole hobby is based on opinion as no 2 ears are the same. But someone can log on to the site with a question and receive many answers and information to come up with a solution.As far as the break-in, I'm a beliver and others are not. I don't think this thread will convince anyone to one side or the other.
    Michael


    Samsung 50" HD DLP
    Yamaha RX-V2500
    (2) Outlaw 200
    Adcom GFA 555
    Sony BDP300
    Denon 2900 DVD
    Lsi9's mains
    Lsi7's rear
    Lsic center
    12.1 SVS driver in 4.53 cuft. tube
    Harmony 880
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  • johnADA
    johnADA Posts: 98
    edited December 2006
    MSALLA wrote:
    Whoa! slow your roll there big guy. I think most people on th fourm would agree that they have lerned alot being on here. The hole hobby is based on opinion as no 2 ears are the same. But someone can log on to the site with a question and receive many answers and information to come up with a solution.As far as the break-in, I'm a beliver and others are not. I don't think this thread will convince anyone to one side or the other.

    Yes, there is some things to be learned, but its limited as far as factual basis.
    The idea of sound being replicated to as close as actual is what everyone says they want. But most speakers choosen use different materials than paper in which paper makes the closest replication of sound. But yet we argue to which is best and best is cloest replication. So its 2 ears, opinions, of what they would like sound to replicate as.

    Video, OK, some do have better deinterlacers and some come from the factory closer to a perfect calibration and you may say ones better than another. But if professionally calibrated with fairly close qualities of de-interlacers, there both fairly equal. Now one maybe a Sony and the other and Ilo brand, but the Sony will get the nod and the Ilo is a piece of ****. Now people go on popularity and price and not video quality.

    Just a couple of simple examples of what I see posted.
    You can learn hookups, amp types, driver type and such along this nature. Better, best, what should I buy etc, NOPE, no learning there, just subjective bull.

    As far as speaker breakin, I dont care what anyone believes. Common sense outweighs everything here 100%.
    Underwear
    Jeans
    Leather gloves and jackets
    Car engines
    Cushions
    Your House
    Your Basement
    How far would you like me to go????
    Everything breaks in, everything!!!!
    You can call it wear or anything else to support a side, but dammit, it all breaks in and is never the exact same as it was new and not exact means some type of change is made. So speakers, based on common sense break in, whether you hear it or not????????? My jacket and underwear are more comfortable now than new and so are my speakers, why, they BROKE IN!!!
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  • cfrizz
    cfrizz Posts: 13,415
    edited December 2006
    I agree with you as well John. I guess the question is: Is the break in something that can actually be heard & is it something that can be proven conclusively & factually rather than relying on one's ears?

    Or maybe more to the point, should we really be trying to listen for break in or simply sit back and enjoy the music.

    I'm for sitting back & enjoying the music!
    Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
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  • zombie boy 2000
    zombie boy 2000 Posts: 6,641
    edited December 2006
    PolkThug wrote:
    Its all Zombies and sharks!
    http://www.dumpalink.com/media/1165029602/Sea_of_the_evil_dead


    You rule Pthuggy:D

    That clip is actually from Lucio Fulci's Zombie 2 (which is actually Zombie 1 or Zombie 3 -- I just know that there was a re-release sold to the international public as a sequel).

    The shark vs zombie scene is one of the all-time great moment in cinematic history -- followed closely by that one scene from Citizen Kane (you know the one).

    I get chills everytime.
    I never had it like this where I grew up. But I send my kids here because the fact is you go to one of the best schools in the country: Rushmore. Now, for some of you it doesn't matter. You were born rich and you're going to stay rich. But here's my advice to the rest of you: Take dead aim on the rich boys. Get them in the crosshairs and take them down. Just remember, they can buy anything but they can't buy backbone. Don't let them forget it. Thank you.Herman Blume - Rushmore
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,538
    edited December 2006
    This isn't rocket science. Anyone who has taken a basic eletronics course knows that components "settle-in" after a given time, and cycling of power up/power down. Anyone who doesn't understand the concept of a rubber surround becoming more flexible with use, just isn't ever gonna get it. The combination of these 2 things can definitely have a measurable effect on how a driver sounds---now, the difference may be subtle or it may be substantial; but again, there's no voo-doo here, it's a little common sense and understanding of basic electronics/physics.

    Of course you may not be able to pick up on the subtle change.............

    Stereophile addresses this very topic on their website this month, and explains precisely how speakers break-in. Check it out: http://www.stereophile.com/reference/1106hot/
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,217
    edited December 2006
    johnADA wrote:
    But most speakers choosen use different materials than paper in which paper makes the closest replication of sound.

    Actually wood gives the most accurate sound reproduction. JVC made a pair of monitors with wood drivers that were simply sublime at reporducing music. Very impractical and very expensive.

    Speakers are organic and will change as they are used. That is what I call break in. Anything mechanical or organic by it's nature (think physics here) changes over time. If you (speaking generally here not you johnADA) disagree with that premise you have a lot to learn.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • bikerboy
    bikerboy Posts: 1,211
    edited December 2006
    I never believed any of this "break in" stuff until I heard it for my self. Preamps, speaker cables, and tubes have taken time to settle and only after many hours do their true characters come out. The EE in us all wants to measure it but I know not everything is measurable. All I know is that wires have made my system sound more real, lifelike, and easier to listen to. Thats whats most important to me.
    Main system: Lyngdorf TDAI 2170 w/ Pioneer 42" plazma-> Polk LSiM 703 w/Tivo, Marantz tuner, BRPTT: Nothingham Spacedeck-> Pioneer PL L1000 linear arm-> Soundsmith DL 103R-> SUT->Bottlehead ErosDigital: I3 PC w/ Jriver playing flac -> Sonore Ultrarendu -> Twisted Pair Audio ESS 9028 w/ Mercury IVY Vinyl rips: ESI Juli@24/192-> i3 PC server
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  • bknauss
    bknauss Posts: 1,441
    edited December 2006
    Frank, I think you missed the word "bias" in my post. An example of bias being Audioholics stands firm behind its OK that Yamaha quotes 100Wx7 channels, but the amp cannot come near to 100W coming out of all channels. Its marketing garbage, and they try to back it up with "well, testing continuous power out of all channels isn't a real world test and put's unneeded stress on the power supply".

    Frank Z wrote:
    Hold on there Hoss! You can't have it both ways. An engineer from a speaker company coughs some data from somewhere and it's the Holy Grail, but another engineer spews forth some data and it's all BS? How does that play out? Which engineer are we supposed to believe. The one that reforces our position...the rest are idiots? Nah, that horse don't race.
    Brian Knauss
    ex-Electrical Engineer for Polk
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  • Joey_V
    Joey_V Posts: 8,586
    edited December 2006
    johnADA wrote:
    How far would you like me to go????
    Everything breaks in, everything!!!!
    You can call it wear or anything else to support a side, but dammit, it all breaks in and is never the exact same as it was new and not exact means some type of change is made. So speakers, based on common sense break in, whether you hear it or not????????? My jacket and underwear are more comfortable now than new and so are my speakers, why, they BROKE IN!!!

    You may want to relax before you blow a gasket.

    So break in exists for you... good. Relax.
    Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R
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  • zombie boy 2000
    zombie boy 2000 Posts: 6,641
    edited December 2006
    !!!!!!
    I never had it like this where I grew up. But I send my kids here because the fact is you go to one of the best schools in the country: Rushmore. Now, for some of you it doesn't matter. You were born rich and you're going to stay rich. But here's my advice to the rest of you: Take dead aim on the rich boys. Get them in the crosshairs and take them down. Just remember, they can buy anything but they can't buy backbone. Don't let them forget it. Thank you.Herman Blume - Rushmore
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,217
    edited December 2006
    Do cables make a difference..................

























    ................I mean once they break in? Do they have to break in?

    :D;):p :eek:
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • zombie boy 2000
    zombie boy 2000 Posts: 6,641
    edited December 2006
    Only if they're on cable risers with shatki stones on the source.... and those need their own break-in time.

    But only when the moon is in the Third House of Saturn and the 7 Stars of the East in celestial alignment.

    But even the planets and the stars need to break-in before that can happen....

    and we're talking trillions of years for that.

    So bring a six pack.
    I never had it like this where I grew up. But I send my kids here because the fact is you go to one of the best schools in the country: Rushmore. Now, for some of you it doesn't matter. You were born rich and you're going to stay rich. But here's my advice to the rest of you: Take dead aim on the rich boys. Get them in the crosshairs and take them down. Just remember, they can buy anything but they can't buy backbone. Don't let them forget it. Thank you.Herman Blume - Rushmore
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,538
    edited December 2006
    I once tried 2 pairs of identical speaker wires, but 1 set had been slathered in Asian elephant ****, on the first full moon that fell on a Wednesday...

    The elephant slathered set did sound better. For some reason they had a warmer sound to them. :D

    Would this be like the opposite of cryogenic treatment? Class? Anyone?
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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  • MSALLA
    MSALLA Posts: 1,602
    edited December 2006
    steveinaz wrote:
    I once tried 2 pairs of identical speaker wires, but 1 set had been slathered in Asian elephant ****, on the first full moon that fell on a Wednesday...

    The elephant slathered set did sound better. For some reason they had a warmer sound to them. :D

    Would this be like the opposite of cryogenic treatment? Class? Anyone?

    Would that be a steamy warmth?
    Michael


    Samsung 50" HD DLP
    Yamaha RX-V2500
    (2) Outlaw 200
    Adcom GFA 555
    Sony BDP300
    Denon 2900 DVD
    Lsi9's mains
    Lsi7's rear
    Lsic center
    12.1 SVS driver in 4.53 cuft. tube
    Harmony 880
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  • PolkWannabie
    PolkWannabie Posts: 2,763
    edited December 2006
    Only when regularly retreated ...
    Rick
    HT+ Sunfire TG IV, Dual CG Sig II's, CinePro 1K2, Oppo 981, Audio Technica PL120, Polk SRT's & F/X1000's, Samsung 71" DLP
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  • zombie boy 2000
    zombie boy 2000 Posts: 6,641
    edited December 2006
    steveinaz wrote:
    The elephant slathered set did sound better. For some reason they had a warmer sound to them. :D

    Talk about the subjectivity of this hobby....

    I actually found that the elephant **** slathered IC's introduced a certain amount of "stench" to my rig.
    That and transients became sharper, more defined.

    I'm thinking of wiping my **** with all my cables. See if I can get the same results.
    I never had it like this where I grew up. But I send my kids here because the fact is you go to one of the best schools in the country: Rushmore. Now, for some of you it doesn't matter. You were born rich and you're going to stay rich. But here's my advice to the rest of you: Take dead aim on the rich boys. Get them in the crosshairs and take them down. Just remember, they can buy anything but they can't buy backbone. Don't let them forget it. Thank you.Herman Blume - Rushmore
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,538
    edited December 2006
    ...I wonder if cold elephant **** would make them more "analytical" sounding?...hmmm
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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  • zombie boy 2000
    zombie boy 2000 Posts: 6,641
    edited December 2006
    I like to think of it as "hyper-detailed".

    Try a Bi-wire configuration with Asian elephant **** slathered cables juicing the tweeter and fossilized duck-billed platypus dung feeding the woofers.

    Steve, we're talking Audio Nirvana.
    I never had it like this where I grew up. But I send my kids here because the fact is you go to one of the best schools in the country: Rushmore. Now, for some of you it doesn't matter. You were born rich and you're going to stay rich. But here's my advice to the rest of you: Take dead aim on the rich boys. Get them in the crosshairs and take them down. Just remember, they can buy anything but they can't buy backbone. Don't let them forget it. Thank you.Herman Blume - Rushmore
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  • cfrizz
    cfrizz Posts: 13,415
    edited December 2006
    This thread has turned into conclusive proof that when there is a full moon people go crazy!!!:D :D:D :eek: :eek: :eek: :D:D:D
    Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
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  • Joey_V
    Joey_V Posts: 8,586
    edited December 2006
    If this thread aint dead... it certainly is alive! Alive with crazy nutso audiophiles who want to experiment with elephant ****!

    :):p
    Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,217
    edited December 2006
    Only true crazy people play with their own doodie. Playing with animal doodie doesn't make one crazy...........perhaps odd but not stone cold crazy!
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • zombie boy 2000
    zombie boy 2000 Posts: 6,641
    edited December 2006
    I just crapped my drawers.

    Cheapest tweak I've made in months.
    I never had it like this where I grew up. But I send my kids here because the fact is you go to one of the best schools in the country: Rushmore. Now, for some of you it doesn't matter. You were born rich and you're going to stay rich. But here's my advice to the rest of you: Take dead aim on the rich boys. Get them in the crosshairs and take them down. Just remember, they can buy anything but they can't buy backbone. Don't let them forget it. Thank you.Herman Blume - Rushmore
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  • johnADA
    johnADA Posts: 98
    edited December 2006
    Joey_V wrote:
    You may want to relax before you blow a gasket.

    So break in exists for you... good. Relax.

    I am totally relaxed and relaxed so much I think I may have **** myself.

    But really, this is whats kills me most about any type forum.
    Doesn't matter what the topic question/debate or whatever is about, when it goes against common sense, laws of nature, physics in general, I just find it ludicrous someone will make up some test, ideal etc that doesnt cover the full spectrum of possibilities to fight against it.

    Cables, name brands, myth of breaking in and the list grows each day is fascinating!!!!

    Then you get name throw- ins like, magazines, editors, Audioholics ( Pursuing the truth in audio video) as they mean something. Yeah OK, now like money didnt help pursue the truth as they state it!!!!!

    Enough, I think I need to go wipe now!!!
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  • PolkWannabie
    PolkWannabie Posts: 2,763
    edited December 2006
    johnADA wrote:
    Enough, I think I need to go wipe now!!!
    No surprise ... Opinions are like **** ... Everybody has one ...
    Rick
    HT+ Sunfire TG IV, Dual CG Sig II's, CinePro 1K2, Oppo 981, Audio Technica PL120, Polk SRT's & F/X1000's, Samsung 71" DLP
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  • RuSsMaN
    RuSsMaN Posts: 17,986
    edited December 2006
    Does everyone realize how many speakers have broken in during the course of this thread so far?
    Check your lips at the door woman. Shake your hips like battleships. Yeah, all the white girls trip when I sing at Sunday service.
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  • pearsall001
    pearsall001 Posts: 5,093
    edited December 2006
    BOSE never break in. They just sound like **** from the minute you buy 'em to the the day you get rid of 'em!!!!!
    "2 Channel & 11.2 HT "Two Channel:Magnepan LRSSchiit Audio Freya S - SS preConsonance Ref 50 - Tube preParasound HALO A21+ 2 channel ampBluesound NODE 2i streameriFi NEO iDSD DAC Oppo BDP-93KEF KC62 sub Home Theater:Full blown 11.2 set up.
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  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,136
    edited December 2006
    steveinaz wrote:
    I once tried 2 pairs of identical speaker wires, but 1 set had been slathered in Asian elephant ****, on the first full moon that fell on a Wednesday...

    The elephant slathered set did sound better. For some reason they had a warmer sound to them. :D

    Would this be like the opposite of cryogenic treatment? Class? Anyone?

    WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
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  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,136
    edited December 2006
    pearsall001 wrote:
    BOSE never break in. They just sound like **** from the minute you buy 'em to the the day you get rid of 'em!!!!!

    Your one line sense of humor is only matched by GG!!!:D
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  • zombie boy 2000
    zombie boy 2000 Posts: 6,641
    edited December 2006
    RuSsMaN wrote:
    Does everyone realize how many speakers have broken in during the course of this thread so far?

    316:D
    I never had it like this where I grew up. But I send my kids here because the fact is you go to one of the best schools in the country: Rushmore. Now, for some of you it doesn't matter. You were born rich and you're going to stay rich. But here's my advice to the rest of you: Take dead aim on the rich boys. Get them in the crosshairs and take them down. Just remember, they can buy anything but they can't buy backbone. Don't let them forget it. Thank you.Herman Blume - Rushmore
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