If you have an hour and a half

2

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  • mrbigbluelight
    mrbigbluelight Posts: 9,785
    edited September 2006
    opus wrote:
    Mr Blue,

    I am not real good posting pictures so could you post a picture of a cat holding a cuckoo clock for me. I will edit and add in the caption later.;)



    cat-cuckoo.jpg
    Sal Palooza
  • MrNightly
    MrNightly Posts: 3,370
    edited September 2006
    Demiurge wrote:
    For the record, you've made posts like this before. You definitely are into the conspiracies. If you want to deny it I'll be glad to post some links to some of your other posts.

    Why would I deny that I am intrigued by the theories? While to you and others that think like you, it's a bad thing, to me I am looking at all sides of the picture.

    Someone links a website that refers to the $20 bill. That stuff just makes me laugh. All the stupid uptight conspiracies like that are just that, stupid.

    But if you actually research Pearl Harbor, Operation Northwoods, recent ship bombings, and yes, 9/11, some things may appear out of the normal. When I first ran across Operation Northwoods several years ago, and saw what had been released info wise, it flat out floored me.

    And please, don't expect me to think that the most technologically advanced county on the planet, with fingers in all parts of the world, can't get along. And I'm not talking about Republicans and Democrats. Most, if not all, of those people are simply puppets on a string. But whatever. I'm not going to change your point of view, and you aren't going to change mine.

    But as Mr.Blue said above, do your research. And I'm not talking about googling 3 web pages. But then again, the average American is too busy/lazy/tired to actually put energy into anything these days... so why not just accept what is spoon fed from the TV, Media, New's world... Afterall, it's on TV, it must be true :rolleyes:
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  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited September 2006
    Plenty of fact and just plain truth.

    Our government/military willing to slaughter their own citizens (among others) to influence public opinion?

    You didn't debunk what I said. There's no Democrat or Republican in elected office that would devise such a plan, and there's no military body or otherwise that would implement and go along with it.

    Operation Northwoods was proposed by Lyman Lemnizter (A military general, not an elected official). He was consequently removed of his position by JFK for even suggesting such an operation. In fact, it was first sent to Secretary of Defense McNamara, and was rejected both by him and JFK.

    I didn't say that something such as this may not be in someone's head. By and large, the population in this country isn't going to elect someone as kooky enough to do or even think of something such as that, or 9/11. It's part of the checks and balances. It's why generals in the military aren't allowed to declare war.

    Since a plan existed, perhaps more than one, and it's on offical government documents -- the conspiracy crowd gets all up in arms and excited. They want it to be true that the govenment is up to something nefarious.

    If a general drew up a plan to nuke California, and proposes it to Donald Rumsfeld, is there a conspiracy there? Or does that general need to be fired? Seems pretty obvious to me. We have checks and balances in this country, and nothing like 9/11 would ever happen here by instruction of our governmental body.

    You guys are looking for fire where there's no smoke.
  • jdhdiggs
    jdhdiggs Posts: 4,305
    edited September 2006
    Plans for doing something and actually doing it are two VERY different things. Did you know we have comprehensive battle plans to invade Canada and Mexico? Does that mean we are going to do it? No.

    As you said, they guy who thought of Northwood was fired and it was never executed. How is this any kind of evidence that 9/11 might be a conspiracy? If anything, it shows the exact opposite.
    There is no genuine justice in any scheme of feeding and coddling the loafer whose only ponderable energies are devoted wholly to reproduction. Nine-tenths of the rights he bellows for are really privileges and he does nothing to deserve them. We not only acquired a vast population of morons, we have inculcated all morons, old or young, with the doctrine that the decent and industrious people of the country are bound to support them for all time.-Menkin
  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited September 2006
    MrNightly wrote:
    Why would I deny that I am intrigued by the theories? While to you and others that think like you, it's a bad thing, to me I am looking at all sides of the picture.

    Someone links a website that refers to the $20 bill. That stuff just makes me laugh. All the stupid uptight conspiracies like that are just that, stupid.

    But if you actually research Pearl Harbor, Operation Northwoods, recent ship bombings, and yes, 9/11, some things may appear out of the normal. When I first ran across Operation Northwoods several years ago, and saw what had been released info wise, it flat out floored me.

    And please, don't expect me to think that the most technologically advanced county on the planet, with fingers in all parts of the world, can't get along. And I'm not talking about Republicans and Democrats. Most, if not all, of those people are simply puppets on a string. But whatever. I'm not going to change your point of view, and you aren't going to change mine.

    But as Mr.Blue said above, do your research. And I'm not talking about googling 3 web pages. But then again, the average American is too busy/lazy/tired to actually put energy into anything these days... so why not just accept what is spoon fed from the TV, Media, New's world... Afterall, it's on TV, it must be true :rolleyes:

    I'm willing to bet I spend far more time researching politics and current events than the vast majority of the people on this board. I actually consider it a hobby.

    There's differences of political opinion, and then there's just sheer stupidity. The people who believe in these conspiracy theories aren't running on all cylinders. It's a waste of time to argue with them. Most Democrats and Republicans can agree there was nothing amiss with 9/11. Planes were hijacked by Middle Eastern terrorists and slammed into financial and political interests in the United States to strike a blow to Democracy. It's as simple as that. As JD already pointed out the groundwork to go to war in the Middle East was there long before 9/11. Boming of the WTC during the Clinton Administration, bombing of the U.S.S. Cole, various consulate bombings, etc.

    Going to war in Iraq could have been done on the merits of Saddam breaking all of the U.N. resolutions he agreed to since the end of the first Gulf War alone.

    The place where some Democrats and Republicans are at odds are in how to handle the reaction. Even there war has been politicized, but that's a completely different topic.
  • shack
    shack Posts: 11,154
    edited September 2006
    I think the whole thing was a conspriacy by illegal, ****/****, hispanic aliens, who used to be Mormon but converted to Islam...to shift funding from after hours school glee clubs to **** **** history month. They were hoping the conservatives would be so preoccupied that they wouldn't notice. Had it not been for Brokeback Mountain, it would have worked. Robert Redford knew about it but was sworn not to tell Oliver Stone. There's a website.
    "Just because you’re offended doesn’t mean you’re right." - Ricky Gervais

    "For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible." - Stuart Chase

    "Consistency requires you to be as ignorant today as you were a year ago." - Bernard Berenson
  • zombie boy 2000
    zombie boy 2000 Posts: 6,641
    edited September 2006
    I just spit coffee all over the screen...

    good one Shack

    courtesy of The Dead Milkmen

    You know what, Stuart, I LIKE YOU. You're not like the other
    people, here, in the trailer park.
    Oh, don't go get me wrong. They're fine people, they're
    good Americans. But they're content to sit back, maybe
    watch a little Mork and Mindy on channel 57, maybe kick
    back a cool, Coors 16-ouncer. They're good, fine people,
    Stuart. But they don't know ... what the **** are doing
    to the soil!
    You know that Jonny Wurster kid, the kid that delivers papers
    in the neighborhood. He's a foreign kid. Some of the neighbors
    say he smokes crack, but I don't believe it.
    Anyway, for his tenth birthday, all he wanted was a Burrow Owl.
    Kept bugging his old man. Dad, get me a burrow owl. I'll never
    ask for anything else as long as I live. So the guy
    breaks down and buys him a burrow owl.
    Anyway, 10:30, the other night, I go out in my yard, and there's
    the Wurster kid, looking up in the tree. I say, What are
    you looking for? He says I'm looking for my burrow owl.
    I say, Jumping Jesus on a Pogo Stick. Everybody knows
    the burrow owl lives. In a hole. In the ground. Why the hell do you
    think they call it a burrow owl, anyway? Now Stuart, do you
    think a kid like that is going to know what the **** are
    doing to the soil?
    I first became aware of this about ten years ago, the summer
    my oldest boy, Bill Jr. died. You know that carnival comes into
    town every year? Well this year they came through with a ride
    called The Mixer. The man said, Keep your head, and arms, inside
    the Mixer at all times. But Bill Jr, he was a DAAAREDEVIL, just
    like his old man. He was leaning out saying Hey everybody,
    Look at me! Look at me! Pow! He was decapitated! They found
    his head over by the snow cone concession.
    A few days after that, I open up the mail. And there's a pamphlet
    in there. From Pueblo, Colorado, and it's addressed to Bill, Jr.
    And it's entitled, Do you know what the **** are doing to our
    soil?
    Now, Stuart, if you look at the soil around any large US city,
    there's a big undeground homosexual population. Des Moines, Iowa,
    for an example. Look at the soil around Des Moines, Stuart.
    You can't build on it; you can't grow anything in it. The government
    says it's due to poor farming. But I know what's really going on,
    Stuart. I know it's the ****. They're in it with the aliens.
    They're building landing strips for **** Martians, I swear to
    God.
    You know what, Stuart, I like you. You're not like the other
    people, here in this trailer park.
    I never had it like this where I grew up. But I send my kids here because the fact is you go to one of the best schools in the country: Rushmore. Now, for some of you it doesn't matter. You were born rich and you're going to stay rich. But here's my advice to the rest of you: Take dead aim on the rich boys. Get them in the crosshairs and take them down. Just remember, they can buy anything but they can't buy backbone. Don't let them forget it. Thank you.Herman Blume - Rushmore
  • MrNightly
    MrNightly Posts: 3,370
    edited September 2006
    Demiurge wrote:
    I'm willing to bet I spend far more time researching politics and current events than the vast majority of the people on this board. I actually consider it a hobby.

    And I'm willing to bet you are correct! Never debated the fact of what you study, because quite frankly, I don't know a thing about you and your personal life. Good for you to study unbiased news, and make an educated opinion for yourself. If only more were like you.
    Demiurge wrote:

    There's differences of political opinion, and then there's just sheer stupidity. The people who believe in these conspiracy theories aren't running on all cylinders. It's a waste of time to argue with them. Most Democrats and Republicans can agree there was nothing amiss with 9/11. Planes were hijacked by Middle Eastern terrorists and slammed into financial and political interests in the United States to strike a blow to Democracy. It's as simple as that. As JD already pointed out the groundwork to go to war in the Middle East was there long before 9/11. Boming of the WTC during the Clinton Administration, bombing of the U.S.S. Cole, various consulate bombings, etc.

    Going to war in Iraq could have been done on the merits of Saddam breaking all of the U.N. resolutions he agreed to since the end of the first Gulf War alone.

    The place where some Democrats and Republicans are at odds are in how to handle the reaction. Even there war has been politicized, but that's a completely different topic.

    I love how you turn this into a name calling session against those that don't share your simple truths. To call someone, me, not running on all cylinders, well, that's just plain insulting. Do you know anything about me? Why make it personal? I don't believe the "Official Story" of 9/11. So that makes me crazy? Interesting. I guess you found out that I'm the one living in a hut in the middle of Kansas, warming my hands over the open fire while munching on cooked grasshoppers, sporting a tin hat on my head. Man, I thought I had hidden my whereabouts better than that. :rolleyes: Must be the black helicopters.

    Please just explain to me why WTC 7 feel. That's all I ask.

    Oh, and keep the name calling to a minimum. That'd be a nice start as well.
    Honoured to be, an original SOPA founding member
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  • jdhdiggs
    jdhdiggs Posts: 4,305
    edited September 2006
    MrNightly wrote:

    Please just explain to me why WTC 7 feel. That's all I ask.

    This sounds plausible from an engineering perspective:
    Many conspiracy theorists point to FEMA's preliminary report, which said there was relatively light damage to WTC 7 prior to its collapse. With the benefit of more time and resources, NIST researchers now support the working hypothesis that WTC 7 was far more compromised by falling debris than the FEMA report indicated. "The most important thing we found was that there was, in fact, physical damage to the south face of building 7," NIST's Sunder tells PM. "On about a third of the face to the center and to the bottom--approximately 10 stories--about 25 percent of the depth of the building was scooped out." NIST also discovered previously undocumented damage to WTC 7's upper stories and its southwest corner.

    NIST investigators believe a combination of intense fire and severe structural damage contributed to the collapse, though assigning the exact proportion requires more research. But NIST's analysis suggests the fall of WTC 7 was an example of "progressive collapse," a process in which the failure of parts of a structure ultimately creates strains that cause the entire building to come down. Videos of the fall of WTC 7 show cracks, or "kinks," in the building's facade just before the two penthouses disappeared into the structure, one after the other. The entire building fell in on itself, with the slumping east side of the structure pulling down the west side in a diagonal collapse.

    According to NIST, there was one primary reason for the building's failure: In an unusual design, the columns near the visible kinks were carrying exceptionally large loads, roughly 2000 sq. ft. of floor area for each floor. "What our preliminary analysis has shown is that if you take out just one column on one of the lower floors," Sunder notes, "it could cause a vertical progression of collapse so that the entire section comes down."

    There are two other possible contributing factors still under investigation: First, trusses on the fifth and seventh floors were designed to transfer loads from one set of columns to another. With columns on the south face apparently damaged, high stresses would likely have been communicated to columns on the building's other faces, thereby exceeding their load-bearing capacities.

    Second, a fifth-floor fire burned for up to 7 hours. "There was no firefighting in WTC 7," Sunder says. Investigators believe the fire was fed by tanks of diesel fuel that many tenants used to run emergency generators. Most tanks throughout the building were fairly small, but a generator on the fifth floor was connected to a large tank in the basement via a pressurized line. Says Sunder: "Our current working hypothesis is that this pressurized line was supplying fuel [to the fire] for a long period of time."

    WTC 7 might have withstood the physical damage it received, or the fire that burned for hours, but those combined factors--along with the building's unusual construction--were enough to set off the chain-reaction collapse.

    As for Guiliani not going there to his WTC7 bunker... Uh, he had multiple bunkers AND why would you "hide" in the middle of the area being attacked...

    Here's a question for the crackpot nutjobs: If it was a controlled demolition that brought down 7, why not do it when the other towers fell? Additionally, a controlled implosion via RF would have been nearly impossible to do with the interference in the air from cops, fire, debris, cells, etc... There certainly weren't any wires.
    There is no genuine justice in any scheme of feeding and coddling the loafer whose only ponderable energies are devoted wholly to reproduction. Nine-tenths of the rights he bellows for are really privileges and he does nothing to deserve them. We not only acquired a vast population of morons, we have inculcated all morons, old or young, with the doctrine that the decent and industrious people of the country are bound to support them for all time.-Menkin
  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited September 2006
    MrNightly wrote:
    And I'm willing to bet you are correct! Never debated the fact of what you study, because quite frankly, I don't know a thing about you and your personal life. Good for you to study unbiased news, and make an educated opinion for yourself. If only more were like you.

    I don't study unbiased news, because all news is biased. You have to have some common sense when processing information. If you're too impressionable you'll end up believing clip and snip videos posted by teenagers on YouTube.

    MrNightly wrote:
    I love how you turn this into a name calling session against those that don't share your simple truths. To call someone, me, not running on all cylinders, well, that's just plain insulting. Do you know anything about me? Why make it personal? I don't believe the "Official Story" of 9/11. So that makes me crazy? Interesting. I guess you found out that I'm the one living in a hut in the middle of Kansas, warming my hands over the open fire while munching on cooked grasshoppers, sporting a tin hat on my head. Man, I thought I had hidden my whereabouts better than that. :rolleyes: Must be the black helicopters.

    Please just explain to me why WTC 7 feel. That's all I ask.

    Oh, and keep the name calling to a minimum. That'd be a nice start as well.

    Ah, name calling. Idiot, Moron, it's all descriptive. I'm sure I could do without it, but I don't know what else to call conspiracy theorists. Simple minded? What's the PC word? I've yet to meet one I could have a rational conversation with. They're other wordly, and that's fine so long as they aren't trying to convince the rest of the world that their mental reaches are bound by reality. This stuff usually gets sucked up by college students and teenagers because they're too impressionable to know any better. It's when it happens to adults that are on their own that I really get worried.

    I'm sorry I'm not sugar coating it for you, MrNightly.

    As far as WTC 7. It was hit by a large amount of debris from the other 2 towers (contrary to the conspiracy theorist fabrication that it wasn't). This is mostly because you only saw the undamaged side of the building. There are countless reports from the fire fighters (they're part of the conspiracy!) that were there talking about all of fires in that building, and the damage to the other side of the building. There was also possibly 10 tons worth of diesel fuel burning, and feeding the fire in that building.

    This also leads to the stupidity in the video. Steel is malleable. This means that when it heats up it becomes structurally weaker than it normally would be. It's why when you have an effin' airplane hanging out of the side of your structure, heating the effin' crap out of the steel, and having 100s of tons (?) of weight above it, that the structure collapses. Has nothing to do with the melting point of steel. Take a wrought iron chair. How is that metal bent into the shapes they are so the various parts can be welded together to make a chair? It's done by heat. Heat to the structure of the WTC, and the weight applied to the altered structure is what brought the towers down.

    You're also trying to give a concrete explanation to a completely unique circumstance. How many 747s have we flown into buildings filled with people in the middle of New York City?

    Read the official report

    Oh, United 93? Why did that crash into a field? The government robot stop working or something before it could hit the White House? :rolleyes: There's just no end to how stupid this discussion is.....I'm sorry if I can't take it seriously.
  • bobman1235
    bobman1235 Posts: 10,822
    edited September 2006
    Here's my biggest question - if they were using controlled demolition, why bother with the planes at all? If you go through all the trouble to fly planes into buildings, isn't that enough? That's an attack. Conversely, if all you wanted was the buildings to fall, why not just claim it was a bomb and be done with it? Why the combination?
    If you will it, dude, it is no dream.
  • dorokusai
    dorokusai Posts: 25,577
    edited September 2006
    It took me about 7 minutes to lose interest in the conspiracy....wait, alternate viewpoint video....but maybe I'm just an uneducated American. If any of the believers are attending Polkfest, please refrain from introducing yourself to me. We have nothing to offer one another at this point.

    Great link Demiurge.
    CTC BBQ Amplifier, Sonic Frontiers Line3 Pre-Amplifier and Wadia 581 SACD player. Speakers? Always changing but for now, Mission Argonauts I picked up for $50 bucks, mint.
  • jdhdiggs
    jdhdiggs Posts: 4,305
    edited September 2006
    Demiurge wrote:
    Ah, name calling. Idiot, Moron, it's all descriptive. I'm sure I could do without it, but I don't know what else to call conspiracy theorists. Simple minded? What's the PC word?

    The word you're looking for is crackpot.
    There is no genuine justice in any scheme of feeding and coddling the loafer whose only ponderable energies are devoted wholly to reproduction. Nine-tenths of the rights he bellows for are really privileges and he does nothing to deserve them. We not only acquired a vast population of morons, we have inculcated all morons, old or young, with the doctrine that the decent and industrious people of the country are bound to support them for all time.-Menkin
  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited September 2006
    shack wrote:
    I think the whole thing was a conspriacy by illegal, ****/****, hispanic aliens, who used to be Mormon but converted to Islam...to shift funding from after hours school glee clubs to **** **** history month. They were hoping the conservatives would be so preoccupied that they wouldn't notice. Had it not been for Brokeback Mountain, it would have worked. Robert Redford knew about it but was sworn not to tell Oliver Stone. There's a website.

    That was great, I have a cramp in my side. . . you win the wittiest funniest post of the week award lolololololol lmao
  • jdhdiggs
    jdhdiggs Posts: 4,305
    edited September 2006
    Great link Demi, If you look at who live on floors 9-10, and 25 you'll know the government was not involved.
    There is no genuine justice in any scheme of feeding and coddling the loafer whose only ponderable energies are devoted wholly to reproduction. Nine-tenths of the rights he bellows for are really privileges and he does nothing to deserve them. We not only acquired a vast population of morons, we have inculcated all morons, old or young, with the doctrine that the decent and industrious people of the country are bound to support them for all time.-Menkin
  • ND13
    ND13 Posts: 7,601
    edited September 2006
    jdhdiggs wrote:

    Anyway, NIST didn't test for thermite because THEY KNOW MAN, THEY KNOW!!!!! (that it wasn't involved)

    I think it was Batman!

    NO, they meant the newly discovered specie of metal eating TERMITES, not thermite:D :D
    "SOME PEOPLE CALL ME MAURICE,
    CAUSE I SPEAK OF THE POMPITIOUS OF LOVE"
  • opus
    opus Posts: 1,252
    edited September 2006
    cat-cuckoo.jpg




    Dude, you crack me up. You may be a kook but I still like you.:p

    Allright, so you called my bluff. I don't have a good cuckoo line. +1 to the wacko from Missouri:D
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  • disneyjoe7
    disneyjoe7 Posts: 11,435
    edited September 2006
    That film is the biggest BS I ever heard, and feel you are a 40 Watt bulb to believe any of it. Every line was BS and didn't take in account for anything. Overall I watched very little of it and it insulted my intelligence.

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  • opus
    opus Posts: 1,252
    edited September 2006
    Any of you "Alternative Reality" types might want to check out the Polpular Mechanics website where they debunk many of the 911 myths. Very good reading.;)
    The Flea rig
    Hitachi 50VG825 LCD
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    LsiC, Fxi30's

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  • MrNightly
    MrNightly Posts: 3,370
    edited September 2006
    Demiurge wrote:
    As far as WTC 7. It was hit by a large amount of debris from the other 2 towers (contrary to the conspiracy theorist fabrication that it wasn't). This is mostly because you only saw the undamaged side of the building. There are countless reports from the fire fighters (they're part of the conspiracy!) that were there talking about all of fires in that building, and the damage to the other side of the building. There was also possibly 10 tons worth of diesel fuel burning, and feeding the fire in that building.

    I told myself I wasn't going to argue with you anymore, but I couldn't resist this. From your own words, you said that WTC 7 was hit by large amount of debris from the other 2 towers (WTC1 and WTC2) Well, straight from FEMA
    FEMA wrote:
    5.5.1 Collapse of WTC 2
    At 9:59 a.m., WTC 2 (the south tower) collapsed. The approximate extent of its debris is shown in Figure 5-12(A). It appears that the collapse of WTC 2 did not significantly affect the roof, or the east, west, and north elevations of WTC 7. It is unknown if there was any damage to the south elevation after WTC 2 collapsed, but both the covered, tubular pedestrian bridge (see Figure 5-13) and the Plaza bridge were still standing after the collapse of WTC 2.

    5.5.2 Collapse of WTC 1
    At 10:29 a.m., WTC 1 (the north tower) collapsed, sending its debris into the streets below. The extent and severity of the resulting damage to WTC 7 are currently unknown. However, from photographic evidence and eyewitness accounts discussed below, it was assumed that the south side of the building was damaged to some degree and that fires in WTC 7 started at approximately this time. Figure 5-14 is an aerial photograph that shows the debris clouds spreading around WTC 7 just after the collapse of WTC 1. Figure 5-15 is a photograph of WTC 1 debris between the west elevation of WTC 7 and the Verizon building. Figure 5-12(B) shows a plan-view diagram approximating the extent of this debris just after the collapse of WTC 1.
    It does not appear that the collapse of WTC 1 affected the roof, or the east, west, and north elevations of WTC 7 in any significant way.

    So, from FEMA themselves, they state that there was minimal damage to WTC7 from WTC 1 and WTC 2. So that pretty much debunks what you just said about the extensive damage from the other buildings. Take a look at this link. (Don't read it if it offends your sensitive ears, just look at the pictures please!) http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/spain_fire_2005.html This building fire raged in Madrid for what, 18 hrs+ and didn't even bring the building to its knees. Not a little camp fire like in WTC7 mind you, but RAGING INFERNO! No building in the history of the world, (Except WTC 7) has fallen from Fires only. Never happened. I just find this a little startling that fires can rage for days in buildings of steel and they stand, but a few floor fires in WTC 7 for less than 7 hrs, brings the building down, neatly in it's footprint.
    Demiurge wrote:
    You're also trying to give a concrete explanation to a completely unique circumstance. How many 747s have we flown into buildings filled with people in the middle of New York City?

    You are right, this has never happened before. I'm not trying to give a concrete anything, just looking at all the sides. Afterall, FEMA themselves won't be locked into a single, "Hypothesis" but mention many possible different scenarios that could have happened. If the, "Official Story" won't commit to a single hypothesis, why should I?

    Also keep in mind, that the WTC's were designed to be hit by a 707 when they were built.

    Enjoy.
    Honoured to be, an original SOPA founding member
    Stuff...

    RTi12's - front
    CSi5 - center
    FXi3's - surrounds
    RTi4's - surrounds
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    Rotel RB-985 5-Channel Amplifier

  • mrbigbluelight
    mrbigbluelight Posts: 9,785
    edited September 2006
    opus wrote:
    Dude, you crack me up. You may be a kook but I still like you.:p

    Allright, so you called my bluff. I don't have a good cuckoo line. +1 to the wacko from Missouri:D

    Don't mind being called a kook, it puts me in good company. :)

    As long as you don't call me crazy; by crazy, I mean anyone who is capable of saying, "Our government wouldn't do <fill in the blank> !".

    Remember: "Remember the Maine !".
    Sal Palooza
  • bobman1235
    bobman1235 Posts: 10,822
    edited September 2006
    MrNightly wrote:
    So, from FEMA themselves, they state that there was minimal damage to WTC7 from WTC 1 and WTC 2.

    Just for teh record, I believe FEMA revised their initial statement, saying that the structural damage from falling debris may have been worse than they had originally guessed. But....
    You are right, this has never happened before. I'm not trying to give a concrete anything, just looking at all the sides. Afterall, FEMA themselves won't be locked into a single, "Hypothesis" but mention many possible different scenarios that could have happened. If the, "Official Story" won't commit to a single hypothesis, why should I?

    Keep in mind, by the time anyone got to study this, the buildings were COLLAPSED. So as you say, there can never be a final, concrete, definite answer to a lot of this, especially WTC 7, because it's all based on conjecture and theory. Just, some people prefer theories grounded in reality. :D
    Also keep in mind, that the WTC's were designed to be hit by a 707 when they were built.

    With that in mind, remember that they survived being hit from a 747, at least in the way people woudl expect - they didn't fall over. I think the conspiracy theorists favorite point is that no other building has ever collapsed from being on fire before, but I think a unique event will produce unique results. I'm guessing no other buildings ever had a giant chunk taken out of them, jet fuel poured into that chunk, and then that chunk lit on fire. I'm just guessing. Between the shock of the initial impact, the shock of the ensuing EXPLOSION, and then the ridiculously hot fire fueled by jet fuel, is it really that out of the realm of possibilities that this event was unique enough to cause that outcome?

    And BTW, before anyone says it, everyone (EVERYONE) agrees that steel would not have melted at the temperatures present in the WTC. It is ALSO generally agreed upon that it could have been WEAKENED enough to cause a collapse. Most of these videos tend to ignore the latter fact.
    If you will it, dude, it is no dream.
  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited September 2006
    I wonder if he even bothered to look at the 32 page .pdf that was posted...There were even pictures in case you didn't want to read. :rolleyes:
  • disneyjoe7
    disneyjoe7 Posts: 11,435
    edited September 2006
    Total **** if you feel that a 767 with enough fuel to bring across America isn't enough force to bring a tower down. I'll tell you're a 40 watt bulb out of 100 watt ratio, so move your F'ng butt and leave this Country. I'm DONE.

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  • Dennis Gardner
    Dennis Gardner Posts: 4,861
    edited September 2006
    It is the weight of the buiding above the weakened structure that brought them down.

    Why do you think that the tower hit 15 minutes later fell so much earlier than the building struck by the first plane???????..............it was hit at a lower point. The sad part is that no engineer other than Bin Laden ever looked into this since no engineer could fathom the intention.
    HT Optoma HD25 LV on 80" DIY Screen, Anthem MRX 300 Receiver, Pioneer Elite BDP 51FD Polk CS350LS, Polk SDA1C, Polk FX300, Polk RT55, Dual EBS Adire Shiva 320watt tuned to 17hz, ICs-DIY Twisted Prs, Speaker-Raymond Cable

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  • disneyjoe7
    disneyjoe7 Posts: 11,435
    edited September 2006
    Move

    Speakers
    Carver Amazing Fronts
    CS400i Center
    RT800i's Rears
    Sub Paradigm Servo 15

    Electronics
    Conrad Johnson PV-5 pre-amp
    Parasound Halo A23
    Pioneer 84TXSi AVR
    Pioneer 79Avi DVD
    Sony CX400 CD changer
    Panasonic 42-PX60U Plasma
    WMC Win7 32bit HD DVR


  • MrNightly
    MrNightly Posts: 3,370
    edited September 2006
    disneyjoe7 wrote:
    Total **** if you feel that a 767 with enough fuel to bring across America isn't enough force to bring a tower down. I'll tell you're a 40 watt bulb out of 100 watt ratio, so move your F'ng butt and leave this Country. I'm DONE.

    Never liked ya anyways... good bye :)


















    (JOKE)
    Honoured to be, an original SOPA founding member
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  • MrNightly
    MrNightly Posts: 3,370
    edited September 2006
    Demiurge wrote:
    I wonder if he even bothered to look at the 32 page .pdf that was posted...There were even pictures in case you didn't want to read. :rolleyes:

    If by HE, you refer to me, then you are obviously not a very astute individual.

    I posted in my post above, several paragraphs quoted by FEMA. Where the hell do you think I got those from? Umm, hello, from your 32 page .pfd that you wonder if I even bothered looking at.

    You really are looking for anything to throw in my face aren't you?

    But whatever, this thread has evolved into nothing more than name calling and people hating people and telling them they are traitors and need to leave America. Obviously a lack of open mindedness on this board.

    Peace.
    Honoured to be, an original SOPA founding member
    Stuff...

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    Rotel RB-985 5-Channel Amplifier

  • MrNightly
    MrNightly Posts: 3,370
    edited September 2006
    Don't mind being called a kook, it puts me in good company. :)

    As long as you don't call me crazy; by crazy, I mean anyone who is capable of saying, "Our government wouldn't do <fill in the blank> !".

    Remember: "Remember the Maine !".

    Remember remember, the Fifth of November. :)
    Honoured to be, an original SOPA founding member
    Stuff...

    RTi12's - front
    CSi5 - center
    FXi3's - surrounds
    RTi4's - surrounds
    SVS PB12-NSD/2 - sub :D:D:D
    Denon 3805
    Rotel RB-985 5-Channel Amplifier

  • keith allen
    keith allen Posts: 734
    edited October 2006
    I often thought a many of you were drinking the koolaid,now I know!Got run,cant miss my comet!