2 channel gear - why not here?

Danny Tse

I noticed that most mass-market brands market 2 channel stereo components outside of the US. So why not here? Given that Onkyo just announced the introduction of a new stereo integrated amp and a dedicated CD player for the US market, do you think other manufacturers will follow? I noticed Harman Kardon markets a stereo integrated amp and a dedicated CD player in the UK, what's so hard about bringing them here? I would think the 2 channel market is relatively large compared to the one in the UK.

LuSh

A number of reasons. Big box retail has all but ended Audio in North America for the mass market. 2-channel in the UK is much much larger then what is here in North America. Within the next 5-10 years you'll be lucky to see a high end dealer within 100miles of you, unless perhaps you live in a larger market such as New York, LA or Chicago.

The Best Buy's and Circuit City's of the world have weeded the small man that offered friendly service and good product. The Big Boy's want to carry the "hot" items which is then eventually brought in, causing the small man to drop the line entirely, then eventually shutting down. Soon however; usually within 5 years, the electronic's maker is stuck with the Big man (because he helped kill the small guy) and the products are reduced to flyer specials, pushing the manufacturers to bow to every command the Big Box store wields. This has killed many a manufacturer. Not to mention the entire independant market in the United States. Most small guys have moved onto Custom Install. Or shifted their business to high-mid end home theatre.

amulford

How true. I know of a couple "installation" dealers that still offer some 2 channel, but it is always secondary...

wallstreet

Why bother with only 2? Get a 7 channel amp with equal power to all channels. If you want to run 2 channel, turn off all the other channels. if you want the front 2 and back 2, turn those on. my second favorite combination after 2 channel is the front 2 and side 2. With the sides being bi-pole fx1000's, it really fills the room nicely.

madmax

wallstreet wrote:

Why bother with only 2? Get a 7 channel amp with equal power to all channels.

They make more than two channels?
madmax

wallstreet

madmax wrote:

They make more than two channels?
madmax

Oh yes they do!

audiobliss

*sigh*

schwarcw

The stores are carrying what the people want to buy. HT in a box is very big. This is what the big retailers are selling. If you want 2 channel, you almost have to buy online.

I also think 2 channel is still pretty big here. But the inventory carrying costs are prohibitive for retailers who need to move volume.

Normanality

Ironic, just this morning, a longtime very good friend stopped by to say goodbye. He ran a personal audio consultant company for many years that serviced the upper and rural midwest. He only did 2 channel but
still made a good living. Says true audiophiles are a rare breed anymore.
Heading out to L.A. to work in the entertainment industry (audio side).

F1nut

I don't know maybe it's just me, but there is a lot more to good music than just filling the room.

madmax

More than two channels just confuses me. What happened to the good old days when mono was king?
madmax

wallstreet

2, 3, 5, 7, whatever. If you're not running monoblocks you've got the same problems.

dorokusai

Americans are basically audio retarded.

halo

dorokusai wrote:

Americans are basically audio retarded.

What do you expect when the majority of the people got their "learn on" from Bose infomercials?!?!

F1nut

wallstreet wrote:

2, 3, 5, 7, whatever. If you're not running monoblocks you've got the same problems.

Have you actually heard a high end 2 channel set up?

steveinaz

Culture.

Europeans mostly live in apartments, only the wealthy own homes. The apartments are typically pretty small, efficient. Multi-channel requires some real estate, because of this there simply isn't the market in Europe.

wallstreet

F1nut wrote:

Have you actually heard a high end 2 channel set up?

I've spent some time in Russman's man cave. Do you consider that high end?

F1nut

No offense to you or Russ, but maybe not if you still prefer an AVR or feel that one is close to nice 2 channel gear.

I'm not looking to start anything with you, I just don't understand your point of view.

Joey_V

dorokusai wrote:

Americans are basically audio retarded.

True... until you let them hear what true hifi can do. Then they start asking questions and the wallet begins to open.

organ

I had the exact same conversation with a sales guy a few months back. He was talking about how people don't seem to care about 2ch anymore and started talking about his vinyl rig and stuff. Cool guy.

I found a cool store that specializes ONLY on 2ch stuff and tubes. Can't wait to give them a visit.

But, like what's been mentioned before, the companies are giving people what they want. The sad truth is, us 2ch fans are the minority.

dorokusai

The gear exists, always has, and the fact there's no place to demo the gear is a sorry excuse. If you want to enjoy 2CH, get off your **** and get off your budget. You are going to die, fact, buy stereo gear now.

wallstreet

No problem, just trying to figure this out too. I would consider Classe amplifiers high end. So a product like this, http://www.classeaudio.com/delta/specs/ca2100.htm is OK because it has two channels, but a product like this http://www.classeaudio.com/delta/specs/ca5100.htm is not OK since it has 5?

Joey_V

dorokusai wrote:

If you want to enjoy 2CH, get off your **** and get off your budget. You are going to die, fact, buy stereo gear now.

I love this guy.

organ

Wallstreet,
Why buy a 5ch amp when you're only going to use 2 amp sections?

okiepolkie

steveinaz wrote:

Culture.

Europeans mostly live in apartments, only the wealthy own homes. The apartments are typically pretty small, efficient. Multi-channel requires some real estate, because of this there simply isn't the market in Europe.

I'll agree with parts of that statement. However, from shopping in "big box" type stores in Germany and Switzerland, the mulitchannel market is growing almost as much as it is here. As a result of the small, efficient homes, the speakers are smaller as well. These would most generally be compared to our HTIB systems. So, while quality multichannel systems are not as prevalent, it there is still a market.

In the "big box" type stores, options for two channel are slimming down, following the same trends as the U.S. There are a few shops here and there that specialize in two channel and high end home theater, but they are becoming more and more rare as well.

I mentioned last summer about my experience in a high end shop in Europe. They carried Sonus Faber, Triangle, Cambridge Audio, and several other ellusive products.

organ

Joey_V wrote:

True... until you let them hear what true hifi can do. Then they start asking questions and the wallet begins to open.

LOL:D So true. Gotta love the look on their faces when they first hear this thing we call "imaging" and "soundstage":D.

Joey_V

organ wrote:

LOL:D So true. Gotta love the look on their faces when they first hear this thing we call "imaging" and "soundstage":D.

The beauty is... they dont need trained ears to hear this stuff.

I just have them sit in my seat and they tell me exactly what I hear from their ears. They start commenting about how the guitar is 3 feet off the ground while the singer is 5-6 feet above ground... or how the drums sound like they're way in the back.

It's great to hear non-audiophiles hear what I hear without any training or explanations of any sort.

organ

Yeah. Normally I just tell them to focus on the ghost image in the center and go from there. This is usually the first time they hear real dynamics and clean bass. Only after a good demo will they stop calling us freaks.

Joey_V

....

organ

Wow! She must have really enjoyed them to say something like that.

I've yet to have a girl listen to my rig. They already think I'm nuts when I tell them what my hobby is.

simphiwes

its true the are very few audio fanatics and when you are, you are refered to as a freack, 2channel in IMHO is the way to go if you love your music, but for movies it is better to use the 5.1 /6.1/ 7.1/ 8.1/ 9.1/ 10.1/ 11.1 blah blah blah there is not end to this just spending more money. i personaly have once be over the moon about HT but i have sine lost interest, there is just too much work connected to it, too many formats to know. For me 2ch is the way to go.