Can this possibly sound as good as it looks?

brettw22

Originally posted by gmorris
I could take a **** in a box, and slap a patent on the side, but it'd still be a piece of ****.

ROFLMAO!!!!! GREAT line (but was 'guarantee' in the movie)..........

Polkitup2

From the Best Buy add...

"Presenting big booming bass that transforms tired tones into thunderous celebration. Boost your home theater to its maximum potential with this 125W sub.

Just like having the booming car next to you at the stoplight right in your living room. What could be better? Hell, buy two of them and put them in your big old SUV and move your HT to your garage!

aaharvel

what's sad about all this is that KLH actually invented the first acoustic suspension loudspeaker.

Henry Kloss specifically.

KL oss, H enry

TheReaper

Originally posted by BrentMcGhee
I love going into bestbuy or circuit city and asking questions that i already know the answer to and listen to the **** they will feed me. It is really fun. If you have not tried it yet i really recomend doing it one time. Or even better than that i like to ask questions about made up technology and listen to there bs then.

If you want to have fun in the DVD section. Ask if they have the 1980 version of Flash Gordon, or Robin Hood Men In Tights.

ND13

Originally posted by aaharvel
what's sad about all this is that KLH actually invented the first acoustic suspension loudspeaker.

Henry Kloss specifically.

KL oss, H enry [/QUO.

Wasn't Henry Kloss involved in Advent, Acoustic Research, and Cambridge Soundworks?

Mjr7531

When I first saw the sub in the picture, I seriously thought that it was a car sub. It isn't, right?

Brent, I follow you pretty closely, I'll nod along with people talking about their "amazing" subs and know that when I come home to my Home Theater and listen to the sub in it, I won't be killing brain cells and it'll actually sound good.

I was talking to Joe at the SVS production plant, he was tellin' me about how he once saw a guy driving with headphones so the guy's subs wouldn't hurt his own ears. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by BrentMcGhee
I love going into bestbuy or circuit city and asking questions that i already know the answer to and listen to the **** they will feed me. It is really fun. If you have not tried it yet i really recomend doing it one time. Or even better than that i like to ask questions about made up technology and listen to there bs then.

It's even better when you correct them while they're talking to another customer.

Originally posted by mhardy6647
Not to roil the waters, but... I thought that Bose had a key patent on bandpass boxes which constrained the use of them by other commmercial interests (unless they take out a license)?

They do, it's called a 6th Order Bandpass, they patented it, but who says you can't make em' in WinISD?

aaharvel

Originally posted by ND13

Originally posted by aaharvel
what's sad about all this is that KLH actually invented the first acoustic suspension loudspeaker.

Henry Kloss specifically.

KL oss, H enry [/QUO.

Wasn't Henry Kloss involved in Advent, Acoustic Research, and Cambridge Soundworks?

i'm not sure about that- but I do know he was one involved with KLH from the start- such as with the KLH model 6 loudspeaker; one of the first of it's kind.

michael_w

Most of my friends don't seem to think much about any improvements in my system unless it involves bass. The only improvement that got them interested in hearing my system was when I built a massive sub that shakes the crap out of my room (sounds good too ).

When I go into Future Shop or other big box stores I get the exact same reactions from the sales associates. They are on commision and will push their product as much as they can. (especially extended warranties)

LiquidSound

"Blose has a lot of patents.......not worth the paper they are printed on." -F1nut
But that paper is worth making "speakers" out of.

As far as the sub goes, I've been using it like a backpack for a couple weeks now. That one note action is GREAT for unlocking my back muscles after yardwork. See those big ports? It also doubles as a leaf blower during heavy bass scenes.

michael_w

You can even blow leaves at night with those neon lights...

lomic

When I first moved out of my folks place I took a KLH sub my dad had lying around. I always wondered why it sounded unbearable, so I messed with the knobs and found out this "crossover" thing shouldn't be set at 200Hz.

So I started listening to movies and music on it at my new place, and it just didn't feel like what I expected from a subwoofer - not even ever having heard a good subwoofer before, this just didn't do it for me.

So I came to these forums and a week later I had my HSU. Been happier than a pig in s*** ever since There's my story involving KLH.

mhardy6647

It is difficult to underestimate the late Henry Kloss's contribution to hi-fi. He was one of the original triumverate at Edgar Villchur's Acoustic Research company. AR DID in fact invent the acoustic suspension speaker, which provided deep bass from a small enclosure (albeit at reduced efficiency). The AR-1, which used a novel 12" woofer and the legendary WE 755 8" fullrange as a "tweeter" is still highly sought after (mostly for that 755... look on eBAY sometime).

Kloss went on to found KLH. The most reputable story on the name is that it's Henry's initials, backwards, although I have also read that the "L" and "H" were investment partners. The KLH 6 is particularly well known. KLH was also known for their 'table radios'. KLH today, like Advent, is just a trade name owned by some foreign holding company.

Kloss' next venture was Advent. Besides the famous "Original Advent" loudspeaker, the Advent 300 receiver and 400 table radio were exceptional products. Kloss also built a consumer projection TV well before its time. Advent also sold one of the first broadly marketed hi-fi cassette decks with Dolby NR.

Kloss' next venture was Cambridge Soundworks. The original CSW speaker series were designed by him. My daughter has a pair of the CSW model Sixes (with crossovers re-worked by me) that are excellent bargain speakers.

Kloss' last foray was Tivoli audio. Tivoli makes very nice table and portable radio products not dissimilar to the old KLH radios of the 1960's.

gmorris

Originally posted by brettw22
ROFLMAO!!!!! GREAT line (but was 'guarantee' in the movie)..........

Tommy & Richard.....

ND13

Originally posted by mhardy6647
It is difficult to underestimate the late Henry Kloss's contribution to hi-fi. He was one of the original triumverate at Edgar Villchur's Acoustic Research company. AR DID in fact invent the acoustic suspension speaker, which provided deep bass from a small enclosure (albeit at reduced efficiency). The AR-1, which used a novel 12" woofer and the legendary WE 755 8" fullrange as a "tweeter" is still highly sought after (mostly for that 755... look on eBAY sometime).

Kloss went on to found KLH. The most reputable story on the name is that it's Henry's initials, backwards, although I have also read that the "L" and "H" were investment partners. The KLH 6 is particularly well known. KLH was also known for their 'table radios'. KLH today, like Advent, is just a trade name owned by some foreign holding company.

Kloss' next venture was Advent. Besides the famous "Original Advent" loudspeaker, the Advent 300 receiver and 400 table radio were exceptional products. Kloss also built a consumer projection TV well before its time. Advent also sold one of the first broadly marketed hi-fi cassette decks with Dolby NR.

Kloss' next venture was Cambridge Soundworks. The original CSW speaker series were designed by him. My daughter has a pair of the CSW model Sixes (with crossovers re-worked by me) that are excellent bargain speakers.

Kloss' last foray was Tivoli audio. Tivoli makes very nice table and portable radio products not dissimilar to the old KLH radios of the 1960's.

I thought I wasn't imagining things, thanks for the confirmation. Henry Kloss is/was the man. I'll always keep my Smaller Advents that my father purchased new in 1972 at Ovation in Memphis. Even as inefficient as they are they really sounded great with the Marantz 1060 integrated fronted by the Philips(Holland) tt and the Roberts reel to reel he got at the same time. I don't know where the Philips ended up at but he still has the Roberts, but it needs new heads. I'll also never let the Advent Maestros go. They are a beautiful speaker, IMO, and they rock. But again, very inefficient. I'd probably let the Prodigy towers go at some point, but was thinking of using them all, with this little Advent center I have, for a HT system.

audiobliss

Great post, mhardy6647; now I know a little something about Henry Kloss and those three companies!

VR3

The sad thing is only 2 of those 5 are still making good products...

Cambridge, Tivoli. Does Acoustic Research even exist anymore?

I have nothing but respect for KLH - their products fit a nitch that I even use time to time. They are incredibly loud and inaccurate - but they can take loads of power and SPL. I am talking about their speakers, not their subs. Their speakers, even their cheap bookshelfs are just flat out loud and take loads of abuse. They are perfect for parties... and that is their first use - they shouldn't be used for critical listening and arnt meant to be.

As for Advent... Advent is lame... I mean... wireless speakers? lol No thanks.

aaharvel

Originally posted by ND13
I thought I wasn't imagining things, thanks for the confirmation. Henry Kloss is/was the man. I'll always keep my Smaller Advents that my father purchased new in 1972 at Ovation in Memphis. Even as inefficient as they are they really sounded great with the Marantz 1060 integrated fronted by the Philips(Holland) tt and the Roberts reel to reel he got at the same time. I don't know where the Philips ended up at but he still has the Roberts, but it needs new heads. I'll also never let the Advent Maestros go. They are a beautiful speaker, IMO, and they rock. But again, very inefficient. I'd probably let the Prodigy towers go at some point, but was thinking of using them all, with this little Advent center I have, for a HT system.

MHardy & ND13- I wasn't aware of Kloss's History with AR or Advent- only with KLH. Good posts from both.

ND13

Originally posted by Vr3MxStyler2k3
The sad thing is only 2 of those 5 are still making good products...

Cambridge, Tivoli. Does Acoustic Research even exist anymore?

I have nothing but respect for KLH - their products fit a nitch that I even use time to time. They are incredibly loud and inaccurate - but they can take loads of power and SPL. I am talking about their speakers, not their subs. Their speakers, even their cheap bookshelfs are just flat out loud and take loads of abuse. They are perfect for parties... and that is their first use - they shouldn't be used for critical listening and arnt meant to be.

As for Advent... Advent is lame... I mean... wireless speakers? lol No thanks.

I'll agree that the new Advent stuff is lame, come on they're into TVs and all kinds of crap now, BUT prior to about 1994 or so Advent was one of the best speakers for the money on the market. That is if you like acoustic suspension sound.

heiney9

Originally posted by ND13
I'll agree that the new Advent stuff is lame, come on they're into TVs and all kinds of crap now, BUT prior to about 1994 or so Advent was one of the best speakers for the money on the market. That is if you like acoustic suspension sound.

Never really cared for the Advent's of the 90's. They weren't anything special. The Polk 5B's and 7C's always sounded better to me, by a wide margin. Don't remember what the $$$ difference was back then, if there was one. Customers almost always choose the Polks over the Advents.

Haven't listened to those generation of Advent's in a long time so I'm only going on my memory here. It's just a general impression about those 90's Advent's & they were certainly better than some speakers of that time.

ND13

Originally posted by heiney9
Never really cared for the Advent's of the 90's. They weren't anything special. The Polk 5B's and 7C's always sounded better to me, by a wide margin. Don't remember what the $$$ difference was back then, if there was one. Customers almost always choose the Polks over the Advents.

Haven't listened to those generation of Advent's in a long time so I'm only going on my memory here. It's just a general impression about those 90's Advent's & they were certainly better than some speakers of that time.

I believe that is just what I said in a nutshell. You have to go back to the 70's and 80's to find the good Advents. They still had a couple of decent sounding speakers up til about 92 or so.

George Grand

Kloss
Lowe
Hoffman

The 3 founders of KLH. Anybody see a pattern?

I would venture to say the average age on this forum is about 19.

If anything, Mr. Kloss co-invented the acoustic suspension loudspeaker, with a man named Edgar Villchur. It is no big secret that Villchur was the real genius in that venture.


George Grand (of the Jersey Grands)

TroyD

If memory serves, Villchur, as George alluded to, had the idea for the acoustic suspension loudspeaker. Kloss was actually more in tune with the business aspect in terms of production and so forth. The first acoustic suspension loudspeaker was the AR-1 if I'm not mistaken.

BDT

heiney9

Here is a link to an interview Stereophile did with Edgar Villchur. Basically talking about the founding of AR and their designs, etc. Pretty good read.

http://www.stereophile.com/interviews/105villchur/index.html

H9

heiney9

Slight diversion here. I notice Roy Allison was involved with AR and Edgar Villchur. Did he in fact start his own company? I seem to remember sometime in the late 70's early 80's reading about 'Allison Acoustics' speakers. Seems they were cube-like with multiple small drivers. Seems from my memory they were very Bose 901 like in configuration. Nothing like the Bose sound....I don't think.

Someone....George Grand, shed some light on this if you can.

H9

michael_w

nvm missed earlier post so this one is irrelevant...

heiney9

Originally posted by heiney9
Slight diversion here. I notice Roy Allison was involved with AR and Edgar Villchur. Did he in fact start his own company? I seem to remember sometime in the late 70's early 80's reading about 'Allison Acoustics' speakers. Seems they were cube-like with multiple small drivers. Seems from my memory they were very Bose 901 like in configuration. Nothing like the Bose sound....I don't think.

Someone....George Grand, shed some light on this if you can.

H9

Nevermind. I read the Stereophile article in January when it came out and hadn't read it again until now and realize Allison is coverd in a seperate article...my bad :rolleyes:

If someone can comment furthur beyond the article, especially if you owned/heard Allison speakers...give a holler.

H9

neokeelo

Originally posted by BrentMcGhee
The sad thing about it though guys, is that there will be plenty of ill educated, ignorant people that will buy that thinking that is the most amazing thing. And then after they hear it they will still beleive that is by far an awseome sub. I mean come on, did u guys look at the specs of that thing. a 12inch sub with 125rms behind it and it only manages to dip down to 30hz, and i would be willing to bet that it has a very noticable drop in db well before it ever hits the 30hz mark.

I cant not even to begin to tell you how disgusted i am with the lack of of inteligence that todays society has for good sound. Especially the kids idea of the more bass (no matter how distorted or one noted it may be) the better it sounds. It is ashame that audio quality has taken a back seat these days. Just look at most of the crap that is put out by professional recording studios. They could care less about the audio quality they just are trying to get it out so the kids can play it on there boomboxes as fast as they can so they can move onto releasing there next crappy recording of no talent bands.

I swear if i see another Honda Civic with three 15's flying through the parking lot with a garbled mess of monotone mush spewing from the trunk i think i might have to kill myself.



Well, okay i am done. I just had to vent a little bit.... pheewww

Thank God somone agrees with me! When I was in high school ( only 3 years ago) I hated all the people who had crappy huge subs in the back of there car. You can't even hear the music when it is like that. It drowns out the mids and highs. I guess thats ok if all you want is that crap they listen to anyway

mhardy6647

i actually worded my AR comments on Henry rather carefully -- I don't know who is more responsible than whom for AR's technical nor business success (the early AR's were almost without competitors for some time). Nonetheless, by whatever means, ol' Henry (like Bob Carver, in this respect) was involved in a lot of things that were/are important to us ol' guy audiophiles.

Roy Allison made some excellent speakers in the late '70's and beyond as "Allison Acoustics". I think that the brand has been fairly recently resurrected.

Someone commented about the Advent cassette deck and projection TV. The Advent/Dolby deck was identical to a Wollensak model and I assume a Wollensak OEM product. And, projection TV FAR predates Advent, but ol' Henry was indeed ahead of his time in seeing a consumer market developing for big screen TV.

Parting shot: Anyone who wants a nice little table (or portable) radio should take a look at the Tivoli product line! :-)

ledhed

Just to make a point of today's youth (That would be me too I guess). My friend put two subs in his truck-LOUD but the continuous bass that just rumbles as soon as the thing turns on. Anothre friend has a factory Infinity system in his Tiburon. This thing has extreemly TIGHT bass, feels like my **** is kicked for a brief second when the bass is meant to hit. Anyway, to the point. Most kids I know wouldn't think the Tiburon had anything special to it. It's pathetic the way people look at brands and think that automatically means good sound. Sorry, my rant

BrentMcGhee

Originally posted by ledhed
Just to make a point of today's youth (That would be me too I guess). My friend put two subs in his truck-LOUD but the continuous bass that just rumbles as soon as the thing turns on. Anothre friend has a factory Infinity system in his Tiburon. This thing has extreemly TIGHT bass, feels like my **** is kicked for a brief second when the bass is meant to hit. Anyway, to the point. Most kids I know wouldn't think the Tiburon had anything special to it. It's pathetic the way people look at brands and think that automatically means good sound. Sorry, my rant

Yep yep yep...... well at least me being more into the home audio side of things i do really dont have to put up with alot if ignorance becasue all of the little ghetto kids could care less about home audio they have there aiwa boom boxes with the 1000 watts of power gigatubes on them..... the ignorant normally spends all there time around car audio. I feel kind of bad for the educated people on the car side i do not know how they put up with it.

Car audio has gotten so bad though.... I had to buy a new cd player for my car two weeks ago becasue my other finally just died and i just felt dirty and disgusting standing in cructfhield looking at the wall of all the car audio equipment becasue i know that 99% of everyone that ever stood right where i was is a moron. Especialy when not 10 feet away there were these two ingorant punks that were playing with all of the subwoofers, and not only were the disapointed when they asked a sales guy if they had and 15's but they would keep turning the subs all the way up (by the way completley distorting) and all i would hear was.... Damnnnnn!!!!! that **** is tight dawg!!!!!!!

AAAArrrgrrggghhhhhhhh!!!! I need to stop coming back to this thread... i am going to end up having a heart attack at 20!!!!