Need your expert Polk assistance!

marker

Hi Laura. About the only thing I can add here that I didn't already say on my post to you at AVS is that if you do get the 12s and the Pioneer 1014, and if you do a 5.1 system instead of 7.1, the 1014 has a feature so you can take the 2 unused amp channels and bi-amp the 12s with them.

That should be enough power for them. That receiver is identical to the Pioneer Elite 52tx, which was bench tested by HTM and measured 115.3 watts X 5 at .1% thd from 20 to 20 khz. Here is a link for the review, ratings, and power measurements:

http://www.hometheatermag.com/receivers/1204pioneer/index.html

I would definitely go with that over the Yamaha.

Also, finally, get a SVS PB10 ISD sub instead of the Polk 505 whatever you do!

HBombToo

Originally posted by marker


Also, finally, get a SVS PB10 ISD sub instead of the Polk 505 whatever you do!

marker needs to post more often;)

marker

I'd love to h bomb, but hell, I don't even have enough time to read all these threads, much less reply to them!

I told Laura that while there are a few jerks here, but that all in all by far most of them are very helpful, and I see that has been borne out in her thread here.

Plus, the fact that she is female didn't hurt either!

PolkThug

Originally posted by F1nut
I stand by my statement that they are not good music speakers, way to much sibilance from a overly bright tweeter. A group of us got to listen to a production issue of the RTi 10's or 12's (can't remember which) at Polk HQ before they hit the streets on some very decent higher end gear. The unanimous opinion of the group was they sounded very good for HT, bad for music. I rest my case.

Good thing I have a low point of reference so that I like bad sounding music.





Edit: I'm trying to bait someone to let me borrow their high-end stuff so I can do a 6-9 month A/B test.

TN_Polk_Lover

Welcome to the Polk forum!

I was amazed. You asked your questions on Feb 28, and here it is just one day later and there have been 94 replies. Couldn't have anything to do with your gender . . . na . . .
<smile>

bigsexy1

The pioneer 1014 is probably the absolute best bang for the buck receiver out there right now when taking into consideration it's true power, features, and sound quality. It would be worth almost twice what it is going for right now. At $400, it's pratically a steal for what you get for the money.

The RTi speakers are MORE than adequate for home theater duties, and are certianly no slouch on music either. Matter off fact, for rock music and movies, I personally prefer them over the LSi series.

I also concur about the SVS PB10 ISD. It is probably the best bang for the buck subwoofer out there right now.

F1nut

Originally posted by PolkThug
I'm trying to bait someone to let me borrow their high-end stuff so I can do a 6-9 month A/B test.

If it works would you ask him/her if I can borrow it too.

Laura Palmer

Hey Marker, thanks again for tipping me off to this place -- it's worked out great!

It made me happy that you backed up the receiver I was looking at too. I *thought* it was a decent receiver but I figured all the Polk enthusiasts here were just way more high-end than myself (which, well...they mostly are) hehe

But it's a sigh of relief to me that I'll be able to use it for my Polks and stay satisfied, cause I'm just not too keen on Harmon Kardon to be frank.

I was sort of taking a gamble that it would be a decent enough receiver for them. Although I don't really understand "bi-amping" or "bi-wiring" and all that stuff. In fact things like "crossover", "center large", and a lot of other technical stuff is beyond me also. Is there a very basic FAQ on the net that could explain a lot of that to me?

You mentioned that it would be only if I were doing a 5.1 setup, so do you mean that I would be using the other two speaker connectors on the receiver and plugging them into the second row of plugs on the back of the speakers? I always wondered my my RTi6's had two rows, thought maybe this was to test out two receivers simultaneously or something.

Anyway, this is how I would hook up RTi12s if I decided to go with them, because they require more power? Would it be any advantage to do that with the RTi8s also?

At this point I've definetely decided to go with towers, just not sure if it will be the 8 or 12, and how they will hook up... but that's the next exciting part!!

I hope to take a picture of my apartment in Toronto once everything is set up and sharing it here with all of you.

bigsexy1

Originally posted by Laura Palmer
I hope to take a picture of my apartment in Toronto once everything is set up and sharing it here with all of you.

Hopefully you will also be in that picture as well?

To answer your questions about biamping, yes, you basically have it right. You would take the 2 unused sets of speaker wire connectors on the back of the receiver for the 6th and 7th channels and hook them up to the second set of speaker wire binding posts on your towers after you have removed the jumperstrap connecting the top ones to the bottom ones (VERY important to do that). That way, both the tweets/mids, AND the woofers would all have their own seperate set of amp channels driving them. If you do get the 12s, that would be the way to go. The 1014 does have some decent power according to the link provided:
"This graph shows that the VSX-52TX's left channel, from CD input to speaker output with two channels driving 8-ohm loads, reaches 0.1% distortion at 121.2 watts and 1% distortion at 143.1 watts. Into 4 ohms, the amplifier reaches 0.1% distortion at 197.0 watts and 1% distortion at 231.4 watts. "
That's not too bad at all. Very respectable, even at double or triple the price it is going for!

I have also seen on other forums where it's been well established that this is indeed a pioneer elite model in regular pioneer badging.

For home theater hookup basic questions, go to hometheaterforum.com as they have a whole sub forum specifically for these type of questions.

I would suggest the 12s over the 8s. I've had both in my home, and the 12s are a much better speaker, even if you have them high passed at 80 HZ or so, much less full range. They do need a lot of power, but if you had then biamped on a Pioneer 1014, you should be set!

Willow

Originally posted by Laura Palmer
Any Canadians here know if FutureShop sells pre-amps or do I have to go to a high quality Audio Shop for that?... like Audio Shop, Audio Center, or Audiotronic?

No FS only sells receivers. No amps , no pre-amps just receivers, yes you will have to go to a boutique to get one. Laura don't forget there is a used market in Ottawa. There is Audio mart on Bank st. up a couple blocks from Somerset towards the Hill . Then there is also another one diagonally but closer towrads sommerset (forget what it's called).

As far as you comment about the 8's sounding more full than the 10's this has been noted by many as well.

Willow

Sorry which FS are you going to. The one off Ogilvie (last time I went had them) The one at South keys ....hmmm they have I think the 10's I beleive the new one on Merivale has them all.

jmierzur

Originally posted by TroyD
And I agree with Kantors, Klosses and Carvers of the world in regards to solid state amps. If you have two solid state amps of roughly equal power ratings and one of them sounds radically different, one is broken.

Troy, if you need another amp, I can sell you the Pioneer integrated for the amount I paid for the Simaudio amp. I think it would be a great deal for you as the Pioneer includes a pre-amp.

Laura, let us know the configuration of your final system.

TroyD

http://www.audio-ideas.com/interview/carver.html

Read this and give me your thoughts.

I, personally, hear differences in solid state amps but the differences are generally minor. I stand behind the premise that two solid state amps of roughly equal operating specifications sound radically (there are two big qualifiers there, if you aren't paying attention) different, one is broken. That doesn't mean that they all sound the same, it means that the differences are subtle.

That's my opinion and my experience.

Also note that I'm not ridiculing you or your opinion, extend me the same courtesy as I'm not an idiot and don't need to be treated as one.

BDT

jmierzur

Troy,

Quite right. Please accept my apology.

Some differences are not so subtle. Thanks for the link.

JM

jimed1

Laura,
Looks like this topic got way off the subject this thread was intended for.
If you are still reading these and have not decided on the subwoofer. I think you will probably be happy with the PSW12. It will not shake the house down but it will give you a nice low end extension to music and will sound good with movies. I have realized that the ones most people here recommend are really good and loud subs and believe me they are great to have, but the PSW12 should be able to add alot of bass for you. I have a PSW350 rated at 100 watts like the PSW12, and it does a great job. Later in life you can upgrade to a better sub but for now, if you don't know what a really good sub sounds like, you should be happy with the PSW12. I am not sure what they sell for new, but you might be able to find a better one on ebay or audiogon new for the same money. Someone has a PSW505 used on Audiogon right now pretty cheap. It might be really close to what you could get a new PSW12 for.

reeltrouble1

Pretty little Polkies all in a Row
Russman bowled them over with great gear for little dough
Jesse jumped in with a little RTi music bash
Get some SDA or Lsi forget other trash
Then there was Troy and Trouble and Thug to name a few
Who posted up and gave Laura their view
Still there was Frizz who stayed calm through it all
As Steve in AZ says she gave Laura her best call

This thread goes on with woofers and tweeters so bright
Did she rest with electrons dancing all through last night
So here is to all who gave this thread shout
Cuz sharing information is what the Club is about.

The "Laura" thread is destined to the "Hall of Fame"

Yea, ok, I am not quitting my day job

:cool:

RT1

michael_w

Can't you get a free PSW 202 for buying all this polk gear or did they end that offer? If it has indeed ended it's sure to come back again to the big box stores....

F1nut

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Ted, I for one think that is great. In fact, one of the funniest posts I've ever read here, Bravo!

beavis814

Laura,

I own the Pioneer 1014 and a pair of 12s. I am using the outputs for the rear surrounds to bi-amp the 12s, which was described in previous posts, and I am very happy with the sound.

If you buy this setup and decide to upgrade in the future, you can connect the pre-outs of the 1014 to a separate power amp and use the power amp to drive the 12s, which is what I plan to do. From what I have read on this forum, the 12s sound even better when driven by a power amp with a lot of power. Good luck, and let us know what you decide to do.

Toxis

Originally posted by beavis814
I own the Pioneer 1014 and a pair of 12s. I am using the outputs for the rear surrounds to bi-amp the 12s, which was described in previous posts, and I am very happy with the sound.

please tell me this is a feature on the reciever and not something you just "hooked up." If it's not a feature that allows you to do this, do you realize what you're doing to your sound?

beavis814

Originally posted by Toxis
please tell me this is a feature on the reciever and not something you just "hooked up." If it's not a feature that allows you to do this, do you realize what you're doing to your sound?

This is a feature that was designed into the 1014.

shack

Originally posted by beavis814
I own the Pioneer 1014 and a pair of 12s. I am using the outputs for the rear surrounds to bi-amp the 12s, which was described in previous posts, and I am very happy with the sound.

Pioneer has taken the concept of "ghetto bi-amping" (Using the A and B speaker output to quasi bi-amp a pair of speakers) to a whole new level by legitimizing it. What they have done is to let you divert the 5 & 6 channels to the fronts by using the B speaker connections thereby taking a 7.1 back to a 5.1 setup. It would be interesting to find out how much "actual" power is now going to the fronts all channels driven.

bigsexy1

Shack, it is actually passive bi-amping since each speaker has it's own dedicated amp channel for the tweets/mids and the woofers, and not just "ghetto bi-amping".

However, I'm sure you are right though in that it's not getting full rated power per channel when all 7 channels are driven. If it tested at 115 watts x 5, then it would probably be about 90 or so (give or take a little each way) x 7 channels. But in 2 channel mode, it would definitely be at least 115 x 4. Either way, that's still more power than not doing it in the first place.

Of course, if you go this route though, then according to a couple of self proclaimed experts here who have "extensive knowledge and experience" in these matters (and if you don't believe it, just ask 'em, they'll tell you), that would then mean you now have "powered towers", but so what?

marker

This may be a dumb question, but when you bi-amp a speaker, say for example the RTi12 by hooking up a seperate amp to each set of speaker wire posts, does each amp still have a 8 ohm load, or is it split into 4 ohm loads?

F1nut

Direct from NHT's website........

"Overview:

For those with larger rooms who prefer the placement simplicity and sound of a full frequency point-source speaker, the NHT offers the T6 Tower system.

The T6 combines the Evolution M6 monitor with its own sonically and cosmetically matched powered subwoofer, ( B6 bass module). This tower configuration employs four 12" woofers, combining high aesthetic value and full range response -- with output levels required to fill large spaces -- in one package."

Once again, what part of powered towers don't you understand?

shack

Originally posted by bigsexy1
Shack, it is actually passive bi-amping since each speaker has it's own dedicated amp channel for the tweets/mids and the woofers, and not just "ghetto bi-amping".

I know what it is.....I'm just not sure how good the power supply to each of those 7 dedicated channels are...

Originally posted by bigsexy1
However, I'm sure you are right though in that it's not getting full rated power per channel when all 7 channels are driven. If it tested at 115 watts x 5, then it would probably be about 90 or so (give or take a little each way) x 7 channels. But in 2 channel mode, it would definitely be at least 115 x 4. Either way, that's still more power than not doing it in the first place.

I doubt if that reciever is getting anywhere near those numbers per channel...even in pure stereo mode.

TroyD

What shackdaddy said.

Hey, if you want to biamp in that fashion, knock yourself out.

The NHT is still not a conventional 3-way design any more than the Polk RT3000 is. If you have convinced yourself otherwise, bully for you.

BDT

jdhdiggs

Originally posted by marker
This may be a dumb question, but when you bi-amp a speaker, say for example the RTi12 by hooking up a seperate amp to each set of speaker wire posts, does each amp still have a 8 ohm load, or is it split into 4 ohm loads?

Each amp will still see a nominal 8Ohm load. Speakers are a dynamic system where a high frequency signal is already blocked from the woofer and vice versa by the x-over. This meaning both terminals are running the same ohm rating but at different frequencies.

My thoughts thrown to the original poster after 10 days off and giddy to finally get my toys back:

If you like the 8's, get the 8's. Don't second guess yourself on this. I orignally started with the RT800's (the 8's great-grandfather of sorts) and like them much more than the 2 larger cousins from the same line. I never regretted that purchase. Also, if you add a sub, the low end performance advantage of the 10/12's will be gone since that energy is transferred to the sub (unless you turn it off for 2-channel)

Also, stay at 5.1 for now. Use the extra savings from both of the prior thoughts to get a "non-boomy" sub. In my mind, the extra $$$ spent on the sub will allow for a longer term investement in that part of your system (Upgrade in 3 years rather than 3 months). Also, the extra 2 speakers do not add very much on most movies. If the best movie sound is recorded as 6.1 (and that's fairly rair) why go 7.1 out of the gate?

To me, a good 5.1 set-up is much better sounding than an ok 7.1. Also, for this point in your audio journey, the 8's with a high quality sub will be great for 2 channel and wll probably sound better than the 12's without seperate amplification for 2-channel.


My pennies on this dollar...

shack

As I recall...the NHT Evolution is actually a sealed acoustic suspension design on top while the powered bass section is ported. Definitely not a typical 3 way speaker. Even their non powered ST4 is configured this way (acoustic suspension on top and ported woofer). With the ST4 you can do the standard single amp or bi-amp by removing the jumpers.

Willow

looks like a highjack :eek: