Network Audio Players/Streamers

Toolfan66

I have been looking pretty hard at the Cary, and Cambridge players, and honestly I would say Cary more than Cambridge.

I am okay spending good money on one, but I want this to be a long term purchase as well.

More than likely I will pull the trigger on something this weekend so I can have it coming in, and the Cary's are on sale at the moment.

So before I jump in the pool I thought I would see what some of you are using, and or would like to be using, and or have. It is amazing what some of these players go for.

Also are most of you connected WiFi or Direct to your Router (Cat5)? Yes I have read through a few threads but starting something new isn't a bad thing..

This is really just to spark conversation more than anything..

Toolfan66

Used, but big difference in price. The 700 Cary gets great reviews..

https://tmraudio.com/components/music-servers-streamers/cary-audio-dms-700-network-streamer-dms700-dac-remote-black/

https://tmraudio.com/components/music-servers-streamers/cambridge-audio-azur-851n-network-streamer-dac-d-a-converter-remote/

treitz3

My only reservation with Cary is that the do not specialize in Network streaming. You want to get one (especially if you want it long term) that can be continually updated. Cary is more of a boutique shop and I would be worried over the long haul if they abandoned or discontinued the updates.

FWIW, some of the updates when it comes to certain streamers, change the sonic signature. This (reportedly) has the units sounding better now than when they first were purchased.

I'm not trying to sway you one way or another. At the end of the day, it's your choice but I did want you to be aware of this.

As far as the hardwired -vs- over wi-fi? There are arguments both ways. IMO/IME, it completely depends on your configuration/isolation/noise levels with all of the associated gear. I personally run over wi-fi, creating a natural moat that eliminates all upstream noise but have also heard direct wired systems done up correctly. I can assure you that either way is excellent.

Implementing and configuring/optimizing things correctly would yield much more of a difference.....unless you have constant packet loss and you are bogging down the communication(s) for correcting said packet loss prior to the buffer time.

Tom

VR3

Lumin is the way

monepolk

I haven't heard the 2 that you mentioned but I'm use the Auralic Vega 2.1. I had the PS Audio Perfect Wave MKII but Vega beat it out.

Toolfan66

treitz3 wrote: »

My only reservation with Cary is that the do not specialize in Network streaming. You want to get one (especially if you want it long term) that can be continually updated. Cary is more of a boutique shop and I would be worried over the long haul if they abandoned or discontinued the updates.

Tom

This thought never crossed my mind.

Thanks..

Toolfan66

VR3 wrote: »

Lumin is the way

Which one are you using?

Toolfan66

monepolk wrote: »

I haven't heard the 2 that you mentioned but I'm use the Auralic Vega 2.1. I had the PS Audio Perfect Wave MKII but Vega beat it out.

I was looking at this a couple weeks ago, very nice looking unit..

https://us.auralic.com/products/vega-g2-1?variant=34539915509928

VR3

U1 with x1 power supply

treitz3

3 other things when it comes to streamers. Inputs/outputs/future connectivity, user interface and all in one units.

As you might have read, I did have an Auralic Vega G2. Loved, loved, LOVED that unit. Man, did it sound sublime. If you are looking for an all in one unit? You cannot go wrong with that one. It's a superb player/DAC and the LightningDS operating system is second to none. That app will definitely spoil you.

The ONLY reason I sold that was because I extracted everything out of her that I could and wanted to push the envelope further by using a different DAC. I could have easily lived with that streamer for the rest of my life, if I wasn't so obsessed with pushing that envelope. That player only has outputs and no inputs.

Both Trey and I run with the Lumin U1 with the separate X1 PS. This is the complete opposite. All outputs but no inputs. Go figure. What I am saying is that you need to look at current hookup/configuration needs as well as consider possible down the road needs.

Auralic also makes a series of streamers that I honestly haven't looked at yet - that are not all in one units. Look at the Auralic Aries series for more information. Not sure about the inputs/outputs of those units. Basically, it's a streamer without a built in DAC, much like the streamer Trey and I currently run with.

As far as the operating system goes on the Lumin and the Auralic? There are pro's and con's with both. As mentioned, the LightningDS app for the Auralic units is simply a dream come true. It's a very friendly user interface that anyone can use, right out of the gate. But, and this is a big but...it can only be ran with "iDevices". In other words, iPad's, iPhones and the like. No Windows or Android compatibility.

The Lumin operating app can be controlled by just about anything but a Windows based system and IMO, is NOT a very user friendly app. There is a steep learning curve and many of the features I got spoiled with on the LightningDS app aren't even an option with the Lumin app. At the end of the day, both apps play the music. The Lumin app is just frustrating to operate sometimes.

Anyhoo, as you are looking, you have to keep these 3 items in mind.

Inputs/outputs/future connectivity
User interface
All in one unit or flexibility with adding a different DAC down the line

Making a solid decision now will (or can) possibly save you thousands down the road, if you ever decide to change your mind.

Side note - Both aforementioned companies specialize in high end streaming and have updates often.

That said, the differences between the Vega G2 (all in one unit) and the current Lumin setup I have are minimal but undeniable. The cost difference and other upgrades to get me to where I am at now cost a few multiple thousands of dollars more though. While the differences were more than worth it to me? That may not be a road that you or others would want to go down. I just wanted more flexibility and the ability to extract everything I could out of the streaming portion of the rig.

I hope this information helps you in your decision making.

Tom

audioluvr

I'm using a Gustard X26 pro, then streaming via bluetooth off either my phone or my laptop. Very happy with this setup.

stangman67

Bluetooth though an audiophile piece of equipment is one of the deadly sins

stangman67

Happy with my Lumin so far but was also very happy with my Cambridge. Lumin has the advantage of having a very active and engaged support staff/community, which I’m sure cannot be said about Cary

audioluvr

stangman67 wrote: »

Bluetooth though an audiophile piece of equipment is one of the deadly sins

What's the difference between Bluetooth and WiFi? They both send and receive digital data via airwaves. It's the end piece that properly interprets that digital signal and converts it to analog. When I had my CA 851N I could tell a big difference between WiFi and USB and bluetooth (USB was the clear winner) but now with the X 26 I can't tell any difference between bluetooth and USB. Of course this is just my opinion on my equipment so take it as you will.

jdjohn

I use an Innuos Zen Mk3, as does @erniejade . It has ethernet input (no wi-fi), USB output, with a dual-linear internal power supply. It can auto-rip CDs, and comes with a TB (or more) of internal storage.

It has multiple options for user interface, including iOS, Android, and Windows. I can control mine on my phone, or a laptop/PC. Innuos is continually updating the system OS.

EDIT: It was really a toss-up for me between Innuos and Lumin, but the iOS requirement for Lumin products was a deal-breaker for me.

nooshinjohn

Are you going to use wired or wireless connections, Larry?

Toolfan66

nooshinjohn wrote: »

Are you going to use wired or wireless connections, Larry?

I can do either one.

nooshinjohn

Toolfan66 wrote: »

nooshinjohn wrote: »

Are you going to use wired or wireless connections, Larry?

I can do either one.

What are you using now?

F1nut

Leave it to audiophiles to overcomplicate the crap out of listening to music. .

Hard wired vs Wi-Fi
DAC vs no DAC
Inputs only vs outputs only
External power supply vs internal
Apple vs Android
Implementing and configuring/optimizing things...sounds like a PITA
High rate of obsolescence/lack of support

Seems too many have forgotten the KISS theory.

VR3

Not complicated

Lumin u1 is a transport, no different than a CD transport

The u1 needs a separate dac

If you want an all in one lumin setup you would look for the x1

motorstereo

I'm still loving my CA 851N here that I got from Stangman a short time ago. It's wired direct, controlled by my watch, phone or the unit itself and it sounds phenomenal. I can't imagine the Cary being that much better at 4 times the price but anything is possible I guess. Good luck on your decision.

tophatjohnny

Take a pass on the Cambridge unless you’re on a budget! It’s a good entry level player but without even hearing the Cary I’m guessing it’ll walk all over the Cambridge! I owned the 851n and it is ok but it always had me wondering what would it take to hear my files at a higher level! I auditioned so many players priced as high as 12k which was offered up for $9500 it was an x1 and probably 5 others from 3500-that $8k range! It was the Auralic Vega G2 that floored me and 3 years plus later it’s still killing me daily! Never an issue! If you can find one used I’d say grab it! Otherwise that Cary looks like a bet !
Looking forward to hearing what you end up with! Good luck brother

Dr_Wu

Lumin U2 Mini w/SBooster PSU ==> Chord Qutest DAC w/TeraDak LPS
via ethernet (hardwired)
Many folks dipping into streaming seem to choose the Bluesound Node - streamer/DAC combo

nooshinjohn

F1nut wrote: »

Leave it to audiophiles to overcomplicate the crap out of listening to music. .

Hard wired vs Wi-Fi
DAC vs no DAC
Inputs only vs outputs only
External power supply vs internal
Apple vs Android
Implementing and configuring/optimizing things...sounds like a PITA
High rate of obsolescence/lack of support

Seems too many have forgotten the KISS theory.

Finding a decent table
The right arm to go with it
cartridge
tonearm cable
phono-stage
cable to preamp
azimuth
tracking force
tracking angle
anti-skate
leveling
vibration control
stylus type
speed control
rumble...

I am certain I am missing some here. The point is there is always something, there just seems to be more to mess with on the analog side of things. Once you get there with either setup, the rewards far outweigh the effort. (unless your kids are always finding ways to mess with that turntable setup...)

treitz3

....anti static device

Record cleaning machine

Protractor

Stylus cleaner

Rice paper for LP's

Tubes for the phono pre (if applicable)

Stylus scale....

The list can go on and on and on. The thing is with LP's and streaming? It seems the more, the merrier and the better the end result. With high fidelity systems, KISS is usually the preferred and what I have always striven to do. With LP setups and streaming setups? If one wants better sound, then all of these things matter.

For LP's, a lot of it has to do with the setup. Not so much the playback with much of what has been listed. When it comes to streaming, most of the gear is to get rid of unwanted noise/jitter/RMI/EFI, etc...

With both LP's and streaming? Yes, you can get an all in one unit and simply play music without futzing with anything else. But to extract the best out of both? Well...

Tom

jbreezy5

Confirmed vote for the Bluesound Node. It’s reliable, user-friendly app, has high compatibility with various computer devices, has a built-in dac that can be bypassed with an outboard dac, plenty of power supply upgrades are available to choose from if the built-in SMPS isn’t to your liking, easy to place due to small footprint.

Checks all the boxes. The latest version even includes HDMI.

To borrow from Tom, “At the end of the day,” it plays “the music.”

gudnoyez

Blue Sound Node direct to router to Musical Fidelity Dac = Happy Camper, but I enjoy physical media more and only Stream stuff I dont own.

treitz3

I started my streaming audio journey years ago with the BS Node2. For around $500 (at the time)? It was worth a shot.

When I had that unit, even with a MF Tri-Vista21 DAC, I also preferred physical music. On every song played. Now, it's a toss up to which has the better version. When streaming hits the right version, recording and bit rate? I overwhelmingly prefer streaming when compared to any format from my Marantz Reference SA-7S1....which ain't the best out there but it is definitely no slouch. It is the best effort Marantz put out a couple of years back.

But, I haven't optimized the Marantz like I have the streamer set up. That's next. If I can extract that much out of streaming? I can only imagine what's possible out of the Marantz (adding an external clock and a DAC), like I did with the streamer.

That said, the BS Node was the easiest to own/operate out of all 3 of the streamers I have had. It was a plug in and play unit that really had no issues from the get go.

Tom

motorstereo

Food for thought and something that got me thinking recently. I have garden hosed sized speaker wires, difficult to work with MIT shotguns, 9 gauge power cables. dedicated circuits, dreadnaught with oversized wires etc. When I was hooking up the streamer I unplugged the ethernet connection to move the router and of course the wonderful music stopped.
So that gets me to thinking........ all this wonderful music comes to my room via 28 gauge generic wires along with a few cheap plastic internet connectors thrown in for good measure. Yep it made me stop and scratch my head for a few minutes.

nooshinjohn

Here is a link to the model I have...

https://www.canuckaudiomart.com/details/649969191-simaudio-neo-380d-dsd-dacstreamer/

This one opened my eyes to what is possible with digital audio, and it does not break the bank either.
If I do make a change to my rig, it will be to move up the line.

Toolfan66

I don’t want to get to crazy, I want to buy a nice player that allows me to do what ever I decide, even Bluetooth if I so wish, or if the wife so wishes. I honestly don’t want a unit that is going to over complicate things, My reason for wanting a nice NAP/Steamer is to simplify things when I just want to turn on the system, and hit play, and I know it will do that..
I will use good cables of course, and if needed I will upgrade my router, and ethernet cable if I decide not to use WiFi, and the Cary will allow me to do that and then some.

I should add, having a new toy is always fun as well..

But Tom comes out and gives me a lot to think about with the Cary, and Trey and him throw in a really nice looking unit to think about as well.

John, I had the ethernet cable hooked to my PC, and my PC connected to my OPPO, I disconnected from that about a year ago. At one time I was running J-River through my PC, and I could use my iPad to control what I wanted to play in my files, but I honestly lost interest in it, and was never 100% satisfied, but when I would go to the audio shows, and see what they were doing I always knew it could be better with a nice NAP/Streamer, back then I was more focused on a Tube Pre, and putting the money away for that.