Home Ownership And You!

Jstas

So don't feel like writing more about it right now because I'm dead tired but this is what I did on my Christmas vacation.

That's just the first coat, BTW. Got at least 2 more to do

I'll write more later.

Jstas

So, I've been working on the office/lieberry at the house. In my previous abode, I converted one of the 3 bedrooms to a home office and had floor to ceiling bookshelves in the room. They were not built in despite looking like they were. I brought them all with me to the new house.

So the goal is to get those bookshelves modified and installed in the new house. However, I had to fix the problems with the room they were going in, first. Additionally, I found that the room had solid wood floors underneath the carpet.

In the corners, where I was able to easily check, the floor wasn't that bad. Had an orange tinge to it but really not too big of a deal. But that's important for later.

So you saw the pictures above with the water damage in the wall above the window. Well, I got that fixed, just needs to be painted. I didn't take too many pictures because all it entailed was cutting some 2x4's and some shims to get everything straight to the existing wall and then hanging sheetrock and mudding it out. It's still not perfect but the window was installed poorly (imagine that) and I leveled the sheetrock to the window and cut the ceiling in from there. But I didn't rip down big chunks of the ceiling and there's a bit of a dip where there's likely some swelled sheetrock from water damage. Most people would blow it off and not care or even notice but I notice and it bugs me. But it's a colossal effort to fix and I'm not doing it right now. Maybe in the future.

Anyhoo, no pictures of that, really. So, ends of the room, the floor was in fairly good shape. As I pulled up carpet, the fresh new hell got deeper and deeper.

Short story? Captain Halfass covered up water damage with new carpet and left it there to mold and rot under the carpet.

The whole story, now.

So I got the gray carpet up. This is the worst of the fun I found.



Doesn't look so bad, right?

You'd be incorrect.

This is why.



You see the 3rd and 4th boards in from the wall? The joint between them is raised an inch and a half off the subfloor, like a mountain ridge. I always wondered what was up with the bulge in the carpet there, why it would flex down and pop back up. Now I know.

What this is, basically, is water damage. The roof leaked above the window. I thought it was the window that leaked but when I pulled the trim, the frame was solid and dry. Also, the rot inside the wall...looks like Captain Halfass neglected the gutters and they filled up with crap and pushed water up, under the flat roof which then trickled down to where all the water damage was. It dripped down the window and seeped into the flooring where the old oak eagerly sucked it up and swelled.

That swelling caused cupping halfway across the room. Since Captain Halfass didn't do anything about it and just covered up the damage after the leaks were fixed, the cupping is permanent. The boards either need replacing or severe sanding.

In this picture, you can see the severity of the cupping progression from top to bottom as it gets closer to the wall. The first 2 feet of boards near the wall were cupped so bad that they flashed like a disco ball when you ran a flashlight beam across them.



This is a floor level view about halfway across the cupping



And this is where it finally starts to be stable wood again, about 6 feet from the wall.



So after assessing the entire floor, the boards directly under the leaking area were so far gone that they were not salvageable. So I got my hand oscillating cutter and pulled them out.





I even tried sanding them some to see and they were just bad. Here's where I had sanded again after I pulled the board. I wanted to see if these would clean up or start splintering and disintegrating under the sanding like the boards I removed did. Here you can see inklings of fresh wood which meant I could get to a fresh surface. Unlike where the boards I pulled out were mold blackened through most of the board.



Now here's where the fun starts, like pulling carpet, padding, tack strips and staples wasn't the fun part!

I thought I was working with 3/4ths inch thick flooring or at least 5/8ths 'cause the extension is fairly new and would have been the oak flooring in everything else from the 50's and 60's around here.

Nope.

3/8ths thick tongue and groove...or, rather, bevel and groove. One side of the boards are a V-notch, the other side is a double bevel that makes a V that fits the V-notch. This floor is quite old because I talked to a flooring guy and he told me that this would have been what's called a "contractor grade" now and fell out of use around 1955-1957 when more modern, precision milled stuff started hitting the market. Given that this extension on the house was put in around then, this floor is about 65 years old or so. Problem with that is...fat chance finding it. About all you can find is the straight oak boards and even then, they are 5/8ths thick which was too thick for this application.

So what I had to do was I went and bought four 1 x 8 x 6 red oak boards. I then ripped them down to 1 x 2 x 6 boards which were still too thick. So my dad set his saw up to rip down 1/2 inch thick boards from those 1 x 2 x 6 boards. We then ran them through the planer and took off 3/32nds. We didn't cut them down to 3/8ths because it would allow me to sand them down to level with the surrounding boards. Those surrounding boards weren't 3/8ths even the entire length because of the water damage. So here's the new red oak boards in the repair.



I ended up face nailing them with 1 1/4" 16 gauge nails since there was no tongue to nail in to. We tried cutting the bevels and Vs to match but as precise as my dad's tools are, we couldn't get it done. So I face nailed them with the tiny nails so you can't even tell. All I did was sand them with the wood and then a little dab of a dark brown stain on the now shiny heads and they disappeared in the polyurethane.

Thing is, though, remember that orange tinge I mentioned? Well, when I started sanding, which you can see in the top of the picture with the repair, there was a host of odors from pet accidents to how the floor in my grandmother's bedroom smelled when she became incontinent. So that was fun. But once I got to the parts that didn't have those smells, there was more than just the woody, pencil shaving smell that oak has. There was a sweet smell, like shellac. Given the orange tinge and when the floor was installed, there's a 95% probability that the floor was shellacked when installed. Since the compounds needed, polyether polyols, to make polyurethane varnish were not introduced by DuPont until about 1956 and didn't see wide-spread use outside of new construction until about 1960, shellacked oak floors were what was done prior.

OK, so big deal?

Well, it is. 'Cause I started sanding spots that were gouged to see how deep the damage went given how thin the floor boards were. What I found was the vibration was making what looked like localized finish damage pop up in huge blisters. Especially around the water damage.

You know what it looked like? Did you ever go to a bar, sit at the bar and the bar's top finish has these cloudy, orangey-yellow splotches everywhere? That's what happens when you get a nick in the top coat, water gets in to it and you put hot and cold stuff on it. The finish layers separate and the cloudy splotches are space between layers. It happens most often when someone takes dissimilar finishes and covers one with the other. Like putting polyurethane over shellac or acrylic over lacquer.

Jstas

I mean, it's possible to do it but you need to prep the old surface first with sanding and then sealing to make sure you get anything unstable off so it doesn't keep the new top finish from bonding and you need to seal it so that something like a solvent in the acrylic doesn't cause the lacquer bond on the surface to weaken and cause it to delaminate. Then your new finish comes up with the old finish and leaves bare wood beneath it where it will eventually gray from water and UV damage and possibly mold up too causing further issues.

Guess how Captain Halfass "refinished" this floor?

So now I have spot water damage from careless furniture moving that is splitting and splintering board surfaces randomly and I have excessive cupping that has long since dried out under pressure and permanently cupped the boards.

Cupping, BTW, is when floor boards get wet and they swell. They want to expand laterally but can't because they are butt up against each other. So they smash together causing ridges at the joints, just like plate tectonics. This gives the boards a convex shape and makes them reflect light like a disco ball facet. If the water damage is fresh, you fix the leak and let the floor dry out. Most times, it will uncup itself. But if you don't let the floor dry out before you do something with it, it won't uncup. If you sand a floor that hasn't dried and uncupped yet, it will dry after your sanding and uncup itself. But now, since the edges of the boards are now thinner than the centers, you get crowning. I have this problem too from Captain Halfass' half-assed finished floor repairs elsewhere in the house.

This floor is not likely to crown, though, because of age and moisture levels. But, I had to grind down about 1/16th of an inch just to get rid of the cupping. Doesn't seem like a lot but, now I still have to take off the finish which is another sixteenth of an inch. This leaves me with a 1/4 inch thick floor which means that if this floor needs repair again, it needs to be replaced. It also means that the top edges of the grooves are very thin and extra susceptible to cracking/splintering and causing deep grooves at the joints which let dirt and moisture in, under the floor. I should have gotten two more refinishings out of this but no. Captain Halfass had to screw it up with piss poor scuff sanding and putting polyurethane down over degrading shellac that wasn't stabilized. So because he couldn't be bothered to do it right, the floor's lifetime is cut short significantly.

So I started sanding just to see and repair what was needed before calling a sanding company to come in and refinish it or rent a drum sander and do it myself. Well, with how thin and damaged the floors were, all I could picture was a drum sander hitting it, snagging splintered spots and throwing planks out like a rapid fire Pez dispenser. So I decided instead to do it with a belt sander because I could adapt to the conditions easier. Thankfully it was only about 290 square feet but that $50 (on sale) Harbor Freight, Bauer brand Makita knock-off belt sander took it all and asked for more. I burned through 16 belts in total. 12 for the first sanding and 4 for the finish sanding. With the level of damage from furniture wear, neglect and a hamfisted sanding with a drum sander prior to my ownership, it came out pretty well. Oh, also, there was fresh damage which looked to be from a moving dolly for moving gun safes. They typically have solid steel wheels with non-skid urethane liners and you're supposed to use something to protect the floor but Captain Halfass didn't. I know this because there were two arched dents in the floor that came out of the closet, wiggled a bit and then resumed the arc through the door to the room. So thanks for that parting shot, Captain Halfass, you're a peach!

Here's the start of the sanding



This is at the end of the first sanding.



Yes, those are my clothes, no I did not take the picture naked. I left the dusty clothes in the room with the rest of the dust instead of dragging it all over the house.

This is the first coat of the water based polyurethane which, everybody was like DON'T USE IT! and I'm not sure why 'cause it worked great! Only issue I ran in to was as soon as the poly hit the floor in some spots, the grain raised almost immediately. That would have happened with oil based to. I didn't sand it too much, though, because, well, the floor's paper thin already. So there's rough spots.

So here's the first coat, it's splotchy 'cause 65-70 year old oak boards will suck up a new finish like a fat kid eating cupcakes. It evened out though and I ended up putting on 5 coats.



This is the finished product.





In this picture, you can see some of the damage I wasn't able to sand out completely. This is damage from a motorized hospital bed shimmying around on the floor as the mattress goes up and down. Captain Halfass had his elderly mother living here and this was her room until she needed to go to a nursing facility.



This kind of damage is all over the floor as well as gouging from a poor sanding job prior to me and I was worried that the polyurethane was going to make it all pop out. But unless you are standing over it and deliberately looking at it, you don't see it. Most of it will be covered under bookcases and area rugs anyway.

The only way I could have made this better was to replace the floor completely.

Also, the walls are only primered. They will be painted a sandy tan and the bookcases will have a red mahogany finish despite being made from white birch plywood.

Here's the trash pile from fixing the water damage in the floor and wall, painting the walls and ceiling, removing the carpet and sanding and finishing the floors. There's 8 trash bags and 12 rolls of cut up carpet. Trash dudes took it all this morning too.




Glad this is done. I was dreading it because of all the problems I found. I didn't expect the rot in the wall to be so bad and I lost a day and a half because of that. Otherwise, I would have the color on the walls too.

But this is what I did on my Christmas Vacation. I finished the work on Saturday the 2nd and started the polyurethane. I did the last coat at 6:30 AM on Sunday to get in on the drying time window. Then I went back to bed. I could barely move on Sunday. Still aching in spots and I have an injured tendon in my leg that keeps going numb but it's getting better day by day!

Tony M

You have reminded me of my glory days when I could do what you did everyday for years.

Not anymore...what took me 6 months now takes me 2 years.

Great detailed descriptions. I felt every step of your frustration thanks to Captn
Halfass.

During my prime remodeling days, my boss showed me his parents back room that got wet from storm damage. The hardwood floor was 3/4" and it was rolled like storm waters coming onto a beach. Multiple BIG rolls. My boss asked if I could fix it in 6 hrs.. It was a 16' x 16' room. 1/2 was major waves. I told him I couldn't fix it in 2 days or even more.

May I ask how old you are again?

That is some seriously labor intensive work you just performed. I know.

pitdogg2

Very nice job there. I'm surprised capt. Halfass didn't just use deck screws and washers😉

mhardy6647

@Jstas , your floor looks quite good after sanding & refinishing.
It is fine for old(er) floors to have character. Houses are made to live in, and living in 'em leaves its marks.

Our soft (pine) floors are already getting plenty of character, some courtesy of out two grandchildren.

Jstas

Tony M wrote: »

You have reminded me of my glory days when I could do what you did everyday for years.

Not anymore...what took me 6 months now takes me 2 years.

May I ask how old you are again?

That is some seriously labor intensive work you just performed. I know.

It takes a long time because of lack of time.

I'm 43.

mhardy6647 wrote: »

@Jstas , your floor looks quite good after sanding & refinishing.
It is fine for old(er) floors to have character. Houses are made to live in, and living in 'em leaves its marks.

Our soft (pine) floors are already getting plenty of character, some courtesy of out two grandchildren.

There's character and then there's neglect/abuse. The softer gouges are fine. What's got me ticked off is the long, length-wise gouges cause by dagger sized splinters being ripped out by the sander because of dry rot from damaged finishes. Or the trench that runs the width of the room at both ends in front of the radiators where whomever did the sanding the last time let the drum sander sit too long. It didn't have to happen but knowing Captain Halfass, I know exactly what he did and he did it because he spent the bare minimum in money and time on maintaining the old house and then bragged to me about how much money he put in to it. Really buddy? Where? Didja bury a box of money in the yard or something?

Many projects take twice as long to finish and I already plan for stuff to take 2-3 times as long as it should. They take so long because I have to fix stuff that I shouldn't have to if Captain Halfass had just spent a few extra bucks or spent an extra hour on something.

Tony M

I LOVE your HUGE home, property and garages.

At your age, you've done wonders there!

Have you had a list of things to do in a certain order?

I just looked over ALL the remodeling you've done; The kitchen, The attic stairs, the window settee and shelving plus lighting, rebuilding the pool deck rails and pool house tear down PLUS the huge amount of yard clean-up ( the cart enlarging too ) . IMPRESSIVE!

And wasn't all this done in ONE year?

You're definitely a hard workin man that gets things DONE.

audioluvr

That's the problem with oak flooring. It's very unforgiving. a little moisture makes it swell a lot and unless it was installed with adequate spacing it buckles and warps. Looks like you've done an excellent job of restoring it though!

Jstas

Tony M wrote: »

I LOVE your HUGE home, property and garages.

At your age, you've done wonders there!

Have you had a list of things to do in a certain order?

I just looked over ALL the remodeling you've done; The kitchen, The attic stairs, the window settee and shelving plus lighting, rebuilding the pool deck rails and pool house tear down PLUS the huge amount of yard clean-up ( the cart enlarging too ) . IMPRESSIVE!

And wasn't all this done in ONE year?

You're definitely a hard workin man that gets things DONE.

Not all the posts and work done in this thread is mine. Some folks have posted their own efforts in their own homes so credit where credit is due!

We've been in this house since August of 2017. The stuff I've posted has been done in about 3.5 years. But it's barely a third of what I've done. It's just what I've posted about. Nothing here has ever been simple, though, so the stories are long and thick. But there's been a significant amount of work done here and a significant amount more yet to do. Sometimes I wish all I had to do was yard work but, this is how it goes when "good enough" isn't good enough for you.

Tony M

You've still done A LOT in those 3.5 years.
And you have other things still to do? I know you plan on building shelves for your library room you just refurbished the floor and window header in.

You just might be related Norm Abram.



I guess I was tired and mixed others work as yours. I even saw that others had posted their work too. I somehow forgot.
I am gettin older.

Sorry guys.

Jstas

There's tons of stuff left to do.

Major Projects:
- I need to finish the office, that includes the bookcases and "The Ramp of Triumph"
- The primary bathroom on the 2nd floor needs to be gutted and refinished, this includes putting the closet back in the adjacent room
- The master bath is dated, ugly and could use an updating
- The master bedroom needs a floor replacement, electric baseboard heaters removed, a wall AC unit pulled and a window put back in, drywall fixed, outlets and circuits added (master bedroom, bath outlets, lights and electric heaters are all on one 15 amp circuit) and painted with new trim and doors
- Master walk-in closet needs to be redone for better organization and use of space
- Upstairs hall and stairs need new carpet
- Upstairs hall lights need be made sense of
- Family room drywall needs to be ripped down, a badly installed and drafty window removed and closed up, new flooring, stairs repaired correctly, wiring and heating registers fixed, shiplap ceiling removed and water damage there repaired too and then getting a new fireplace put in and will wire for and install the home theater
- Fix the extremely crooked ceiling in the parlor
- Put a wall back between the dining room and the foyer and add a coat closet
- Gut the enclosed porch/laundry room, insulate it properly and then refinish it
- Completely gut and remodel the kitchen and the half bath just off the kitchen
- Remove the poorly done basement finishing, install new casement windows rated for below grade installation and install the bar my dad and I built for the old house down there
- Remodel the full bath that is in the basement
- Put a new macerating sewage lift pump (everything is below grade) and add a utility sink
- Replace both AC units with more modern units and get the ducting done correctly
- New roof on house done right
- New siding on house done right
- New windows on done right
- Gutter Helmet gutter systems on house
- Repair or replace roofs on the garages
- Fix the structural cracks on the oldest garage
- Replace all the garage doors, people and car alike
- Finish the garage closest to the house with a new floor, paint, lighting, outlets and workbenches/storage/toolbox
- Replace the pool deck decking and put a better railing system on
- Build a new pool house, add a dock, add a water wheel and trough to help aerate the lake
- Install a fence around the yard
- Rebuild the stairs in the older garage to something more like stairs and less like a climbing wall

Minor Projects:
- Fix the poorly done drywall patch in the parlor ceiling
- Remove the rest of the old knob and tube wiring
- Clean up circuits in the service panel and trace circuits
- Repair the stairs on the porch and the pool deck
- Clean up the rotting wooden yard furniture on the island and Captain Halfass' "stage"
- Fix the electrical on the island
- Replace the service panel at the pool
- Fix the outlets and pool lights wiring at the pool
- Refinish the gazebo on the island, add a lighted ceiling fan and enclose it with mosquito netting
- Trace and fix the yard wiring to various outlets
- Find and fix the weeping tile that's supposed to drain the yard but probably filled in
- Dredge the lake
- Dig out the channel that makes the island which is filled in from erosion
- Clean up Captain Halfass' illegal dumping everywhere
- Fix and repaint the porch
- Build a shed on skids for pool stuff
- Build a shed on skids for pool chemicals (so neither are permanent, don't count and structures and can be pull up to sit on the concrete by the garages for the winter)
- Build a pump house with a solar system to run an aeration system for the lake
- Pull and move a bunch of lilac to the end of the property and fill the space in with gravel to use as more parking space
- Mulch the island and trail around to the dam
- Build a compost bin and raised gardens for Jackie
- Fix an erosion problem on the levy near the dam
- Replace some closet doors upstairs
- Hang the wireless security cameras and perimeter sensors

The pool liner is likely going to have to get replaced in couple seasons and at that point I'm going to see if the pool company can make it an actual 4 feet deep when it happens. It's only about 42-44 inches deep right now.

That's just what I can think of off the top of my head that needs to be done. There's about 7 trees that are either dead, leaning precariously or just in a bad spot that need to come out. I had 8 stumps I have to dig out too and still working on erosion problems. But I have a compost pile right now that's about 12 cubic yards and grows every year. So I'll have plenty of dirt.

But the stuff I've already done:
- Completely refinished two bedrooms except for closet doors
- Fixed 3 toilets not installed properly (not set on wax rings, basically shouting at the void every flush and letting sewer gases in to the house)
- Found and fixed a water problem in the basement (leaking sewage line, not water seepage)
- Fixed the attic ladder
- Fixed multiple drafty holes
- Fixed several electrical problems including removing knob and tube that Captain Halfass was supposed to have done
- Fixed several plumbing problems that Captain Halfass was supposed to have done
- Tore down the rotten pool house
- Tore down the less than legal outhouse and filled in the honey pot
- Pulled the rotten insulation out of the garage
- Cut down 9 trees that were threatening or damaging structures
- Rebuilt the deck railing to get past code
- Re-stretched the pool liner
- Put a new pad in for the pool filter
- Installed a new pool filter system
- Replaced a garage door
- Replaced tracks for two other garage doors
- Fixed door frames on one garage
- Hung all new doors upstairs
- New carpet in one bedroom
- Removed a tree that Captain Halfass left in the lake that came loose in a storm and plugged up the dam causing the lake to wash over the levy
- Put new lighting in the big garage
- Got the gas fired hanging heaters fixed in the garage
- Moved ceiling lights in the dining room and parlor
- Cobbled together crown molding in the dining room and foyer
- Replaced the ceiling fan on the porch and fixed the outlets
- Fixed the leaking spigot outside
- Uncovered a buried concrete pad between the garages
- Fixed several drainage and erosion problems in the yard around buildings
- Replaced the floodlights on the house
- Replaced the kitchen range hood with something that wasn't low enough to catch on fire and added custom made cabinets to fill in the gaps
- Replaced the tub surround, tub fixtures and water heater in the master bath, added a 100 amp service line and panel for the water heater
- Replaced and properly vented the master bath vent fan
- Replaced the tub fixtures and regrouted and recaulked the shower surround there
- Fixed gutters on the garage roof
- Put animal screens on the garage roof vents
- Fixed a hole in the garage roof
- Replaced about 18 feet of ridge shingles that blew off in a storm
- Replaced thermostats in the house and the garage with the heaters
- Repainted the dining room, parlor and kitchen

I know there's stuff I'm forgetting in that list and all this is just repair or update stuff. None of the stuff I want to do like the hydroelectric generator at the dam or put a paver patio in over the old septic system or the emergency generator for the house or turning the loft above the older garage into an apartment/office or expand the pool deck.

mrbiron

You are living in Tom Hanks’ real life version of the Money Pit.

A biker gang would really help in this situation.

Jstas

No, it's not a money pit. I'm not gutting the whole house and most of the stuff to do is just what anyone looking to update an older house to a more modern standard would do. The amount of extra I have to do because of Captain Halfass is aggravating, especially since some of the above was contingencies for the house sale and it appears he falsified documents in that case.

But we got the house for so little compared to what it could be worth in good shape that we're nowhere near upside down on the mortgage and much of this work I can do myself or with an extra set of hands that would cost me some beer and pizza. But the real heavy lifting that I was planning to do myself is mostly done. The kitchen, bathrooms and roof, HVAC and plumbing I'll get someone to do just because they can show up with an army and knock out in a day or a week or so what would take me a month of nights and weekends by myself.

Otherwise, it's just an old farm house that's had a few owners, hasn't been updated since the late 90's and needs some love to get back to it's prime shape.

Tony M

That was some list of done and to-do projects.

Thanks for the run-down. That was a lot of typing and I sure appreciate you talking about what home-ownership can entail.

I also appreciate your ability to have those future projects in your head with plans to do every one when you can.

I enjoyed the run-down list very much. Thanks.

I'll let you know, I just trimmed the back door on my back porch after.....many, many years. And I used to trim houses for a living.

They say a plumber's house usually has a leaky faucet somewhere in it. I can say there's a lot of truth to that by me and a plumbing boss I had.

I need to fix my main toilet's base stability. It's been wobbly for many years also. The anchoring bolts rusted away and I've just haven't cared since we rarely use it. It's funny you talked about the one you fixed today. Today, I used my front toilet and thought the same thing AGAIN. Sewer gas/fumes!

I actually told myself this afternoon....This toilet WILL be my next project after I finish re-trimming my last back porch window. I finished trimming that last window tonight so....

On to another of my old brain's long list of to-do projects, which by the way, is getting checked off pretty steady these past couple of years.

Jstas

So I haven't gotten much done in the past week because I've been waiting for the floor finishing to cure completely in the lieberry. I have to clean before I can do the rest of the painting and trim. A friend hit a deer and asked me to look at his car on Saturday. I also figured out how I wanted to rebuild a set of saw horses that are bugging me with their wobbliness too. I just got to finish them. It was real cold on Saturday and by the time the sun went down, it dropped back in to the 20's and it wasn't worth messing with stuff in the garage when it's that cold. Stuff starts getting brittle and breaks easier and I didn't want to run the heaters.

Sunday, though, another friend came over. He doesn't mind the cold either.

The island has a gazebo on it as well as a stone fireplace. Problem is, Captain Halfass let it all go to pot. Parts of stuff are broken and he just ripped the broken parts off and chucked them in the woods or behind stuff. I don't know how somebody can live in a trash dump like that but that's what he did. Everywhere.

But, additionally, he built a "stage" in front of the gazebo. He said it was also a "dance floor". All he did was chuck a couple of 4 x 8 sheets of melamine down with a "wood grain" finish on them. Then he staked them down with spikes into the dirt.

They looked like crap.

Additionally, I don't know how anyone was using them because they were slippery as hell. I almost dislocated my hip and broke my shoulder when I slipped and fell on them covered in pine needles and it hadn't even rained.

But Captain Halfass swore up and down that he rented the island out for groups and/or parties and said it was "good income" and I should think about it.

Additionally, there were two, very beefy picnic tables that were essentially made from 2x10's. With 2x4 frames. Captain Halfass let them sit there and rot, never took care of them. So they were falling apart. I might be able to save some of the 2x10's with a sander and a planer but we'll see. Additionally, he had two tables, one with his melamine tops which has MDF as a substrate instead of particle board so they were all swelled up and falling apart. The other one was a small square one that was capped with a stainless steel sheet. The stainless steel sheet is about the only thing that was good from it all.

He also had a couple of park benches. One was a cheapy deal from, like, Wayfair or something similar. It's falling apart so I have to bust it apart and will likely give the frame to my brother for scrap unless the rust isn't too bad. Then I can just wirebrush the living snot out of them, repaint and put new boards on.

The other bench is a municipal quality one. Should be bolted to concrete or something. But, of course, it wasn't. Not sure where I'd re-use it but the post ends were open at the bottoms near the plates, assuming for drainage and when we picked it up, there was a significant amount of sand falling out of them. South Jersey sand is very acidic so wood and metal in direct contact don't survive long and sand covering concrete is as damaging as road salt in the long run. So I don't know how rusted they are. Might be rebuildable, might be scrap. I dunno yet.

There was a sundry of various plastic lawn furniture that was so old, weather and UV beaten that we could barely pick it up without it shattering into a million pieces.

So I don't have many pictures right now, will grab more later today. It was getting dark by the time we got done last night so pictures were a waste of time and we were pretty tired. So I'll go wander out at lunch and get a few more of the aftermath.

But this is the "stage" he built. This is not that much worse than 3 years ago when we moved in. I don't know what idiot would pay to rent this out but it was a safety hazard, insurance liability and causing erosion problems.



It took about an hour and a half of two guys with garden forks, rakes and shovels to pull that stuff up. The biggest problem is that the roots from various flora had grown through the middle of the boards, in between the plastic laminate sheets. So you pull up one sheet and the other was stuck under a mat of roots. The white one, there was a 2nd sheet UNDER that one. I filled up that big trailer I built, twice, with just this stuff. We got it all up but there's a huge divot in there now. We shoved pine needles back over it but I need to either regrade (will be hard because of tree roots) or just cover it all in mulch (probably gonna do that).

Here's the pile I made of the junk I cut up and pulled off the island.



That would probably fill a 20 yard dumpster at least 2/3rds of the way by itself. The picnic table boards are actually laying on top of the mound of broken up "stage". There's only 2 tables and they are about 4 inches deep. The rest of the 3 foot height of the pile is what we pulled out of "the stage".

More pictures to come.

At least I was able to clear enough out to find the trails to the fishing spots off the island. I have to drag one log out of the way and cut a path through a couple other logs. I'll clear the paths with the rototiller and flatten them with the tractor. Then I can mulch it all.

The biggest problem here is the colossal effort to fix what Captain Halfass either screwed up through laziness or ruined through neglect. Once I get this island area straight again, I can maintain it with a lawnmower and a weedwhacker. Takes 15 minutes on a Saturday to walk the trails with a weedwhacker to keep them clear. More effort if a tree falls but maintaining the area helps the health of the area too. Fallen trees can cause erosion problems or cause damage to other trees which then fall too. In a densely wooded area, that's just part of life. No big deal. But in an area that you are trying to keep maintained and cleared for your use, leaving a fallen tree with the excuse that you "thought it looked cool" to rationalize your laziness or cheapness just ends up creating a problem significantly more expensive and time consuming to clean up.

mrbiron

don't waste your time with a dumpster when you can start a brush pile and send it to hades either this winter or in the spring

Jstas

Most of that is pressure treated. The stuff I'm looking to try and save is the burnable lumber. I'd prefer to just pitch it instead of sitting in a clouds of cancer smoke and drinking a beer.

Besides, I have a significant amount of trash around the rest of the property and back in the woods that Captain Halfass just dumped everywhere. There is junk under the pool deck, under the porch, behind the garages and back in the woods behind where I dumped the mulch from the trees. If I pull all of it out and add it to this pile, I'm still going to need a dumpster. Some of it is stuff like kerosene and gas jugs and I found a bucket of hydraulic oil that wasn't leaking when I found it but it had a hole in it and the fluid level was a little below that hole. So it probably leaked out already.

Jstas

So, here's some more pictures.

First off, here's the pile with the mound of melamine under it to show I wasn't really kidding. It seems to have settled some over night as some boards fell off this morning. Since I don't want them sitting on wet ground, I restacked them before taking this picture.



So here's the empty island now from the end of the bridge. Two park benches and a picnic table are missing from this shot as well as the "stage".



Here's the fireplace. Missing from this photo is another picnic table and the two tables I mentioned.



BTW, I'm accepting applications for the position of Bridge Troll. My last one quit right before Thanksgiving. Said I was too mean and miserable for him and cramping his style so he was going to look for work in an environment more conducive to his efforts and talents. I told him where he could shove it. The position doesn't pay, by the way. Like, literally, I'm not paying you.

So, the fireplace. It was partially buried by dirt and refuse. It's also falling apart and it's not from weathering. Well, it's not falling apart, it's been damaged like somebody was doing something with it like using it as a skateboard jump or something. Evidence on this is the white stone slab chunk in this picture. That was a 1 inch thick chunk of marble that I believe was part of a counter top that was over the wood storage box on the right. Those stones piled up are the ones we dug out from behind the fireplace and they were under about a foot of pine needles and broken, plastic yard furniture. I'm pretty sure that there was a counter almost a foot higher over that wood box on the right and it was capped with a 5 foot by 20 inch slab of 1 inch thick marble. Marble isn't the strongest stone in the world but unless a tree fell on it and the heavy trunk hit it, there's no reason for that marble to be broken. Also, the rest of the fireplace would be damaged much worse than it is. But there's no evidence of a stump anywhere on the island near enough to the fireplace to do damage to it except for one stump that was under the other table and it's 30 feet away. So a heavy trunk wouldn't have hit it, just a canopy.

So I'm thinking someone had broken it by doing something stupid. That's an expensive piece of marble too. We were unable to find the other pieces.







I was actually going to start a fire in it to burn up the leftovers in it last year. I'm glad I didn't. Like I said, we dug out around it, 6 inches to a foot of dirt, to find the end of the pad it's on. While doing that, I found tree roots growing into the fire place. If I had started a fire with those tree roots attached, there's a good chance I would have started a forest fire. In the NJ Pine Barrens, forest fires can be hard to fight because the root systems are loaded with pine tar from the pitch pines and they will spread a fire through the root system for acres. Hence the reason we have fire breaks criss-crossing the state forests.







There is power on the island. The problem is, it's a disaster. This outlet here works when the breaker in the box isn't all wonky. It's on a post.



But, like everything else on the island except the gazebo, the post is less than ideal due to years of neglect.



Also, Captain Halfass told me himself that he had run power to the island so all this electrical fun is his doing.

So here's the divot from the stage filled in with pine needles to stave off erosion. The Gazebo is in good shape, just needs so cosmetic help. I need to take the railings off as they are cracked and split and several of the spindles are broken. I'll replace them later. But I need to get the paint scraped off and then sanded and repaint it soon. Hard to do in the cold weather, though, the paint won't dry.



Here's some shots of the condition of the gazebo. There is power and there is a light fixture in there but, like everything else with Captain Halfass, it's not been maintained and I find it hard to believe that he was renting this out with it in this condition. There's also a tree that fell right next to it in the last storm. It's been there a while, death by bugs, but it was still in place and I hadn't gotten to taking it down yet. Probably a task for next weekend.






Here's the dangling light fixture which, to me, seems like kids, either Captain Halfass's own spawn and their degenerate friends or any of the myriad of people he allowed to traipse around the property like it was a park did this damage. If you turn the red switch on, the fixture immediately sparks and blows the breaker. The power to the island is currently off because of this. Additionally, none of it is GFCI'ed.



I'm surprised it hasn't burned down yet.

The goal here is to refinish/repaint the structure, enclose the gazebo in screening, fix the electrical, hang an outdoor rated ceiling fan in the ceiling, with a light and add an outlet or two. I'll likely have to replace the shingles on the roof too. It can be pretty brutal on the island in the summer but in the spring and fall, it's a nice place to be. A small, propane firepit would extend the usefulness too.

So there's still more work to do but it's coming along. Here's some shots of the trails to the fishing spots on the island that I was talking about. These three have trees fallen across them that need to be removed.







In this one, you can see the HUGE tree he just left there because he "thought it looked cool".



This is the trail I cleared last year that goes out to the point across from the dam where the deepest part of the lake is.



Here's a shot from the gazebo. Gives perspective on how large the area actually is.

Jstas

I keep talking about the number of trees that fall down here. So I snagged some shots of trees that need to come down still and trees that have already fallen. These are just on the island and next to where the pool house was.

So these two are death by bug trees standing in the middle of the island. They need to come down, there's just a significant amount of work involved. The tree on the left is 30+ feet tall at least and the tree on the right is only about 20-25 feet but all those branches are going to be a pain.



This is part of the tree that fell next to the bridge. Thankfully it didn't hit the bridge. It did, however, hit one of the park benches on the island and broke seat slats.





This tree broke in half and came down, crossing the gully that creates the island. When I was clearing brush to get to the pool house before tearing it down, I had loaded up the trailer and took it off to unload a load of brush. I heard something busting through the brush while I was, like, 300 feet away but I thought it was a deer seizing the opportunity to get past me. When I got back to the pool house to pick up the rest of the brush pile, this was awaiting me, on top of the brush pile where I was standing moments before.







This half of the tree was forked as well and I cut up the big part that would have hit me up to the brush line and left the other side where it was when the wind blew it down. It's hard to see but you can see how the trunk came down square between two other trees. The old branch coming out of the tall grass in the foreground? That's top of the shorter trunk of the split trunk. The other end came out about 5 feet further and when I cut it off with the pole saw, the rest of the trunk dropped further to it's current resting place. If the iPad's "Measure This" app is correct, from where I'm standing for that last shot to where the tree trunk is it's 45 feet. The break is about 9 feet up. This is going to require some extra help to get handled. But basically, going to try to use the pole saw to get to the broken half and cut it off at or near the break. Then hook a chain and sling or rope tied in a timber hitch to it and drag it out into the yard from between the two trees and cut it up. Can't wait for that hot, dirty, miserable day.

Lastly, here is the tree that took out the pool house. Most of it is obviously missing. It's either in the gully or was dragged out when I pulled it off the pool house. You can see here that it dropped more of itself on the spot where the pool house was. It's still alive, believe it or not. But with all that fungal incursion into the trunk as well as the bugs, that maple is on it's last legs. It's a shame too. It's gotta be a couple hundred years old judging by the size of the trunk.





The plan, when I get to the pool house rebuild, is to build a dock here. Not a real big one, just something I can tie a boat up to once I get the lake dragged and healthy again. It's not even going to be in the water, just right up to the edge and if I can't get it far enough to reach teh water, I'll just build a floating dock and a gangway. I'm going to have to deepen the area around it but if I get the backhoe I want, I will be able to do that and clear the gully too, making it deeper water.



It'll also allow me enough space to be able to pump water with a solar pump to make the waterwheel work and dump it into a trough that will let me keep water moving in the gully and keep it from filling up again. If I can build enough solar and battery capacity in to it, it will be able to run 24/7, even in the winter, to aerate the lake and keep the algae blooms down.

Or maybe, since the gully is man-made, I can rig up a small hydroelectric system here to run all that stuff and use the gully as the drainage channel? I dunno, got fingering out to do there.

Anyway, that's 5 trees that are a problem and 4 more already down that are problems in one 3/4ths of an acre. There's 11 more that are either dead or dying, elsewhere on the property, especially along the road that need to come down but I haven't figured out what to replace them with yet. I want a fence along the road to keep people out and limit the trash that blows in to the yard but I want the privacy of vegetation so I'm thinking I'm going to line the road with rhododendron or laurel or both. They are both native plants that can create a thicket so thick even deer can't get through it. Plus, they make pretty pink and white flowers in the spring and summer that are important to pollinators like bees and butterflies, they don't grow fast enough or high enough to be a problem for power lines and if I do a white beam and post fence, the evergreen shrubs will look nice against it with the bright flowers. 450 feet of fence is gonna be expensive, though.

mrbiron

That’ll be a pretty sweet spot to hang once you do**he it out. I need more land!

mhardy6647

mrbiron wrote: »

That’ll be a pretty sweet spot to hang once you do**he it out. I need more land!

More land = bigger tractor

mrbiron

mhardy6647 wrote: »

mrbiron wrote: »

That’ll be a pretty sweet spot to hang once you do**he it out. I need more land!

More land = bigger tractor

Ooo Lalaaaaa
Tractor, scary black things that go “bang”, hunting my own property, moonshine, no immediate neighbors, being able to see the night sky without light pollution, etc...

Can’t find ANY of that in Mass. Going to have to move. Head north into no-mans land, or head south. Tempting...

Jstas

Gatt dang! Tommy Silva and his arsenal of Festool tools....jealousy. I haz it.

Jstas

So, the first winter after we moved in, we had really bad snow storms. Several of the them. The tractor and snow thrower attachment got a hell of a work out shoveling out a season where we saw about 5 feet of snow from Thanksgiving to Easter. During that time, the previous mailbox and post got obliterated by the plow driver who swore up and down that he didn't hit the mailbox.

However, I'm inclined to disagree. The previous post was put up by Captain Halfass and was made from the same vinyl and trim that the siding is made of. Before we moved in, he replaced the mailbox he had on the post that was airbrushed with a lake scene that said "Calm Waters" or some other bullhockey on it. So we got a plain, cheap as could be, mailbox, in black. Whatever, it worked.

But, in January of 2018, it ended up about 15 feet down the road and 8 feet in to my neighbor's driveway. They actually brought it over to me when I was outside shoveling out. They also proceeded to tell me that the mailbox was on their property (it wasn't) and that Captain Halfass had moved it there a couple years earlier after he put the fence up. I told them I was planning on moving it to the other side anyway because I didn't like having to turn my back to traffic to check the mail and not having anything heavy to jump behind if I needed to get out of the way of an idiot. They seemed kind of disheartened at that. Like they were sad they weren't going to have something to hold over my head or something. Anyway, I went and looked at the mailbox and it was obliterated. The post and support were covered in vinyl but they were wood. The wood support for the mailbox was missing and the only thing holding the post up was one side of the vinyl post cover. The internal wood post was broken in half and you could push the whole thing over with 1 finger.

I took these pictures after a second plow had come through and buried everything the first plow did. When the snow melted, I found that the first plow did indeed hit the mail box because it took out about 6 feet of asphalt curbing and a 2 foot wide swath of dirt that was about 2 inches in to where the mailbox itself was located. These pictures are where I chucked the mailbox to take pictures and **** the county out. The messed up red reflectors on the sticks is where most of my curbing and mailbox landed. They surround a rock the neighbors have at the end of their driveway that they painted yellow.





I couldn't get to the dirt to replace the mailbox because the snow hung around for another 3 weeks. So I stuck the mail box in the snow and used the snow as the post. The first picture the vinyl support cover is still hanging on but the wood is gone, no idea where it went. I thought I could just put the mailbox back on the vinyl for now and as soon as the mailbox weight hit, it, it just fell right off. Also missing is the vinyl scroll piece off the bottom of the support and the finial cap that had a solar light in it. Found the finial shattered and scattered all over the road and no idea where the solar post light went either.

I fought with the country for a week before they came out and replaced the mailbox when the snow melted.

They gave me this.





They beat my cheap mailbox with a hammer and the bottom of the new post to get the dents out and then painted it with black paint and stuck 50 cent number stickers on.

The post was an untreated cedar post with a metal stake embedded in the bottom.

It was installed in March of 2018. It'd been leaning since since July of 2018. It was low on the priority list so I hadn't done much about it and just kept propping it up. But it started leaning so soon because the soil here is very acidic so it tends to rot stuff pretty quick. The cedar post got water logged and the stake inside it rusted enough that they both failed and the stake was no longer holding the post upright. When I pulled it out yesterday, the post came off the stake like it was just sitting on it.

So last year, I finally got Jackie to decide on what she wanted for the mailbox post. I ordered a new post kit that was fake stone from Amazon from a company called Eye Level. It's actually a really nice post. But, I didn't want to drop a couple hundred on a mailbox post only to have it knocked over the first time a plow came by and have to repair it all again.

So last November, I finally engineered out my idea and got to work. I thought I had pictures of it but, I don't so here's what I did.

I was going to use a concrete form but, it made it difficult to get things right because of the height the form would have to be vs. the black pipe I wanted for the post support. So I went without it.

I dug a 16 inch wide hole that was 28 inches deep. I put 4 inches of pea gravel at the bottom and tamped it down level. Then I took a 6 inch ABS pipe that was 24 inches long. I drilled three 1/2 inch holes across the pipe starting about an inch down and going about 3 inches down the pipe. Then I set it in the hole, sunk it about an inch and a half into the gravel then centered and leveled it. I then mixed concrete to fill the hole around the outside of the pipe. I left the pea gravel open inside the post hole for drainage so the post is less likely to rot from standing water.

I let the pipe set in the concrete for, like, a week before I did anything else. We had a ton of rain in that week too and the hole didn't fill up at all so my drainage idea worked! It was also insanely solid after the dirt around it settled.



So next thing I did was follow the instructions and that's where I went wrong, will detail later. I got a 4x4 post, ground contact rated. But I didn't like how much it wiggled in the hole. So I got four 2x4s rated for ground contact. Now the post was about 3 inches shorter than the instructions said it needed to be. So I made up that length with the 2x4s. Which is why the top looks weird. I ripped the 2x4's down to about 1.5 inches by 2.75 inches and then beveled one side at 20 degrees, then knocked off the bevel points. Then I centered them on the sides of the 4x4 and screwed them to the 4x4. This gave me a profile that would fit in the pipe better and not wobble. I also knocked off two opposite corners of the 4x4 so it was easier to drill holes through it diagonally.

I set the post in the pipe and marked the 3 holes on each side. Then drilled those holes through the 4x4. I put the 4x4 back in and checked alignment with a pencil and then bolted the post to the pipe with 7" stainless steel hex bolts and nylon lock nuts, flat washers on each end.





I did this because now, if the post gets broken or something gets screwed up with it, I do not have to dig a new hole. I pull the bolts out, pull the broken post, make a new post and bolt it in and put my new mailbox post over it. But knowing my luck, it won't work out that way and I'll be pulling a 120 pound concrete slug out of the ground with a broken piece of ABS sewer pipe stuck in it. If that happens, I'm building a block pedestal, filling it with concrete and rebar and covering it in pretty stone. Then I'm going to mount a camera watching it so when the plow driver hits that, I can see the look on his face as the plow just explodes in front of him. Jerkoff.

Anyway. Next I slid the fake stone post cover over the post and checked the situation.



The post is sticking out the top.

I was thinking "That can't be right". So I check the destructions again and it said it was right. Even found some stuff on the internet from other people saying the same thing. So instead of me over-analyzing like I normally do, I just went with it.

Yeah, should have trusted my gut.

So I pulled the cover off again and went and laid out and pre-drilled the holes in the garage instead of struggling with it on the post on the side of the road. Then I took it back, slid it over the post and mounted the mailbox arm.

Jstas

Here's why I should have deviated from the directions. If you open that picture in a new window (right click, open image in new window) and zoom in at the top, you will see a significant crack at the top.

But you see that flat ridge that goes around the top of the column? Yeah, that's a lip that is about an inch and a half wide all around. When I was tightening up the mailbox support, the lower bracket's lower screw basically grabbed the post inside like it was supposed to and then pulled it tight to the inside wall. With how rigid the post is, it put a ton of pressure on the lip. I did not realize this until I heard the crack. I fiddled with it a bit until I figured out what happened.

Totally ticked myself off.

So, yeah, I made that crack. So I backed the support screws off until I could get the crack to close back up again. I was able to do that but everything was loose now. So I snugged them back up and the crack spread again a tiny bit. But it was getting dark. So since everything seemed straight, I figured I'd button it up. So I mounted the mailbox. Looks like it sticks out too much but it's actually right at the curb line.



There's actually a code to mailboxes and it's a Federal code. This is the correct distance and height for a mailbox.

I stuck the decorative cap on the top too. It's supposed to get a bead of silicone adhesive all the way around but I only put dabs in the corners to hold it in place since I'm going to be taking it apart to fix my screw up or just replace the whole post cover and chalk it up to "stupid is expensive and sometimes hurts". I'll pull the cap and cover and then cut the post down to below where the lip is if I can get the cover fixed. Hell, I'm going to do that anyway whether I can get it fixed or have to buy a new one. I think I'm going to get a cargo strap, some cardboard and fill the open crack with hydraulic cement, then clamp it shut until the cement cures and remount it with the internal post loser than the lip. The hydraulic cement will be the same color(s) as the fake stone so it won't be noticeable and the weather will not harm the hydraulic cement at all. If it ends up being noticeable, though, I can dye it with a masonry stain.

Anyway, here's the mailbox from the other direction.



And here's the finished mailbox when it was dark enough out that I needed to use the flash.



The stone color isn't exactly the same but I've seen people give the stones a tint that will match other landscaping well enough. The driveway retaining walls were built with a block with a reddish tint that has faded over the years. So if I can get a reddish tint to highlight this, it'll match well enough.

Additionally, the driveway was hard to see at night and in midday from sun glare. This should make it stick out better with better clarity on the address number plate too.

Also, I don't have to hear my arsewhole neighbors tell me that the mailbox is on their property when it isn't. I really hope I can get a site survey done soon. Imma have their plot marked out when it ends at mine property line so they can stop telling me how big their property is every time and they can stop yelling at me for cutting down trees that are falling on my garage from the gun club's property. They are real uptight about people being on their property and doing stuff. Yet they let their kids, grandkids and great grandkids ride dirtbikes and ATVs (not legal in town limits) all over the gun club's property that backs up to their property too and the town's "green acres" lot next to them. That's A-OK but don't you dare set foot on their property! Shame most of what they think is theirs isn't. But I'll solve that problem, get it marked out and file the survey with the town so I can put a fence up.

mhardy6647

After the bow wave from the town plow taking ours out a couple of times -- I made a swing away mailbox when we lived in MA. We had a neighbor who had an old screendoor spring on his; I put a latch on ours -- just had to remember to unlatch it when there was a storm coming.

Worked a treat.

Jstas

That sounds like a good idea. I don't know that I have the space to make one swing far enough away from the road to limit damage to it, though. I'd have to have at least a 6 foot swing arm to be able to swing it at least perpendicular with the road and have it be far enough back that the plow driver would have to be a legally blind, cross-eyed, drunken homunculus that can't see over the dashboard of the plow truck to hit it. But I have trees and vegetation that provides a privacy screen within about 8 feet of the road and the only place that I could place a swing arm and have it function would be about 4 feet from the curb otherwise I'd be putting the post in the ground inches from a Yew trunk and it'd be about 2 feet too high for a mailbox. Not my idea of fun and likely to kill the Yew.

But I'm one of those crazy people that believe in personal responsibility and think that a plow driver should be capable of avoiding mailboxes on a 75 foot wide road. If we got Vermont/New Hampshire levels of snow on a regular basis, I could understand it but I've lived in NJ for 40 of my 43 years so far and The deepest snowfall we ever got was when I was, like, 3 and it was about 26 inches deep. Hardly deep enough to conceal your average mailbox post to any significance that it could be missed.

I'd much rather build an armored mailbox post so that when they do hit it, they get taught a lesson that they likely won't remember...until they hit it again.

mhardy6647

The problem in our town in MA was, for a couple of years, the town switched to using a large truck with a wing plow on our very residential street. They wiped out a lot of mailboxes in town. Eventually, complaints from the taxpayers (!) led the highway dep't to drop back to a smaller truck & plow for all but the couple of main roads in town.

I was still glad to have made the mod; I'll post a photo if I find one.

Jstas

Oh, in that snowstorm in 2018, the county actually had to send out a mass mailing to the people who lived on county routes because plow drivers annihilated like 130 mailboxes in my town alone.

From what a local cop told me, it was a group of, like, 6 plow drivers that were contracted from a local landscaping company to help due to the snow levels that year that caused all the damage. It cost the county about $250 per mailbox to fix them what with parts and labor 'cause it was a crew of 3 guys and it would take about 30 minutes to replace one, not counting time it took to get to the next one. That's about 65 hours of labor just replacing the mailboxes, not including travel time/costs to the various broken mailboxes but also to and from the county yard that handled road repairs which was either 8 or 15 miles away, depending on which yard they came out of. It took almost 3 weeks for them to get all the mailboxes in my little 4 town area replaced according to the irate posts on my local Facebook groups. Can't imagine how many more mailboxes needed to be replaced by how many more crews across the rest of the county. Half of which is either far out suburbs or very rural.

The only one in my town on my side of the county route I live on that didn't need their mailbox replaced was my neighbor but you can see why in the pictures. There's a telephone pole immediately ahead of their mailbox so the plow doesn't hit their mailbox by virtue of avoiding the pole. There was one other on the other side of the road that had multiple boxes on a steel post frame. The steel post stayed, so did the metal boxes but the couple of plastic ones were shattered.

But the cop told me that the town actually called the county to complain too because so many residents on the county routes just outside of town were inundating them with complaints.

So between my house and the other end of town, there's like 40 houses with street side mailboxes. All of them except two were trashed by the plow drivers. They also did the neighboring towns too and had similar levels of damage.

So $250 times 130 or so mailboxes plus travel costs probably cost the county between $40,000 and $50,000 bucks for my town alone. They probably paid that landscaping company $100K to plow the roads in a 4 town section that season too.