When is Polk releasing a new speaker line?
Comments
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Worth a listen, especially towards the end where the stated business goal for Sound United is more acquisitions and defining brands so product lines do not cannibalize the business...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-4qoEF59BM
Buying out Classe was a good idea because it was basically bankrupt but still enjoyed great name recognition in the luxury end of the market. They also possessed some pretty cool technology that could be used elsewhere for home integration stuff. I doubt Sound United bought Classe's brand so they could use it with Polk. Different markets entirely. Polk is good performance for a budget, and has been since they started appearing in big box stores.
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Note his words, "they're highly interested in getting their microphones into homes."
Think about that.
Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
I doubt Sound United bought Classe's brand so they could use it with Polk. Different markets entirely.
Sound United used Polk Signature 60's for the unveiling of the Marantz KI Ruby Reference gear. That's $8000.00 worth of gear driving $900.00 speakers.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
nooshinjohn wrote: »They were dismissive of the brand even back when Polk was at it's best. I remember Shelley's Stereo (still in business BTW) telling me that Polk speakers were nothing but a waste of money and time, and that Maggie MGII was a far superior product to anything Polk could offer.
They had been reps for the brand pretty much since it was founded, but the owner at the time was so put off by the SDA's and insulted by the concept itself that he refused to even properly show them.
My experiences with Polk's dealers during the SDA era was exactly the opposite. With regard to Shelley's, I wouldn't trust any word or recommendation from a dealer who sells a brand he deemed "a waste of money and time".
It's really interesting that someone in the business of selling stereo loudspeakers would be "put off" and "insulted" by the concept of SDAs, when actually, SDAs come closest to the original sound localization and interaural crosstalk cancellation specifications of the original three channel, three speaker stereo system invented by Dr. Harvey Fletcher's research team at Bell Laboratories in the late circa 1930.
In historical perspective, two Bell Telephone Laboratories scientists, F. K. Harvey and M. R. Schroeder, presented a paper at the 12th Annual Convention the the Audio Engineering Society on October 11, 1960 which stated:
"Critical listeners were sought in these tests because of a desire to set permanent standards. At the moment, only a small percentage of people fully appreciate high fidelity. Even less appreciate or understand stereo. However, there is a growing sophistication evidenced among users of stereo equipment. Anticipating the future, it seemed wise to avoid naive or unconcerned personnel in these tests to prevent establishing loose standards which eventually might have to be abandoned.
The listeners chosen were sophisticated in the art of sound localization either by working in this field or by education before testing. They were felt to be the equal of any serious listener who is accustomed to playing the same records many times and thus becomes familiar with the more subtle artistic and technical effects."
Reference: Harvey, F. K. and Schroeder, M. R., "Subjective Evaluation of Factors Affecting Two-Channel Stereophony", Journal of The Audio Engineering Society, Vol. 9, No. 1, January 1961, pp. 19-28.
The truth is that conventional, two channel, two speaker stereo systems are a "gimmick" that was necessitated by the commercial impracticality of recording and re-producing three channel stereo media.Proud and loyal citizen of the Digital Domain and Solid State Country! -
Sound United may not have bought Classe so they could use it with Polk, but my Signature 60s as well as all my other speakers sound just fine with the Classe amp I have powering them. That's the problem with the audiophile crowd, they get so caught up in the "Name" and price and being able to afford them that they promptly start looking down their noses at everything else.
I very rarely buy something because of the name on the label, I look for the ratings of the quality of the product, the longevity of the product, whether they have good customer service, and if they stand behind their product. Polk checks all those boxes for me, as does Marantz, Rotel, Parasound, Outlaw, etc.
Buy whatever you like and be happy.Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2 -
1975
1979
1980
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Stereo Review Nov. 1985
all scans taken from the scanned periodical collection at www.americanradiohistory.com (a phenomenal resource!)
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If anyone perusing this thread would like to read the whole text from which the scan above was taken, see:
https://www.americanradiohistory.com/Archive-HiFI-Stereo/80s/HiFi-Stereo-Review-1985-11.pdf
The Editorial in that issue is a pretty interesting read, too
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I've met a guy who was a reg. guy but didn't know his set of gifted to his wife sda-crs+'s needed an interconnecting cable to sound their best.
What is a 'reg. guy'?
Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits. -
The opposite of TonyM, I suppose.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Polk speakers were rarely reviewed by stereophile back in the day, other than the fairly bad Rta11t review. It was not until the last 15 years that stereophile started to take Polk seriously with several reviews.
Let's see: 2019 - 15 = 2004. Therefore, if you are telling the truth, there should not be any positive reviews of Polk speakers in Stereophile prior to 2004.
Here are some excepts from a 2001 Stereophile review of the RT25i:
"Polk Audio is the Rodney Dangerfield of high-end audio. Why does this conscientious, innovative, and well-organized company garner no respect from hard-to-please audiophiles?
As it had been nearly two decades since I'd critically listened to a Polk design, I jumped at the chance to audition their entry in the Bob Reina Search for Speaker Nirvana at Cheapskate Prices: the $320/pair RT25i."
The RT25i's reproduction of vocals was to die for, due to the speaker's superlative timbral and dynamic performance and its resolution of detail in the all-critical midrange. I'd never heard Janis Ian (Breaking Silence, Analogue Productions CAPP 027) or Mighty Sam McClain sound more natural, and the angelic integration of Crosby, Stills & Nash's voices on "Guinnevere" (Crosby, Stills & Nash, Atlantic/Classic SD 8229) floated in three-dimensional space, each vocal line easy to follow individually.
Soundstaging reproduction was beyond reproach, with the three-dimensional image of each instrument in Stravinsky's The Firebird (Mercury Living Presence/Classic SR 90226) reproduced on a wide, deep, ambient stage. In fact, the Polks' imaging specificity was so precise that, even with the speakers spread fairly far apart in my home theater, the central dialogue image was tightly focused on the screen."
https://www.stereophile.com/standloudspeakers/417/index.html
Here are some excepts from a 2003 Stereophile review of the LSi7:
"I immediately noticed four areas in which the LSi7's performance excelled:
1) Continuous and extended dynamic range on all types of music, from the softest passages to the loudest bombast. Although I've heard some affordable speakers that excelled at microdynamic resolution and others that had dramatic capabilities in high-level dynamics, this is the first affordable speaker I've heard that excelled at both.
2) Extraordinary retrieval of detail and ambience.
3) Pinpoint image specificity on a wide, deep soundstage.
4) Detailed, extended, airy, and natural high-frequency resolution.
Fans of jazz drummers should die for the LSi7."
https://www.stereophile.com/standloudspeakers/795/index.html
Pass Laboratories is one of the most highly regarded high end electronics manufacturers. During the same pre-2004 time period, I only found two Stereophile reviews of Pass Labs products:
The Aleph 3 power amplifier (4-29-97), and the XA 160 monoblock power amplifier, (11-30-03).
Therefore, by your reasoning, since Stereophile did not review a lot of Pass Labs products prior to the last 15 years, this is proof that the reviewers at Stereophile did not take Pass Labs seriously.
With regard to Stereophile's RTA 11t review (7-30-2010), John Atkinson concluded it this way:
"The Polk company may have an excellent reputation for product reliability, dealer support, and service backup, but I can't help but wonder what those attributes are worth when the basic sound quality of their products is compromised, as I felt the RTA 11t's to be. Of high perceived value, it failed to deliver the musical goods, in my opinion. It may have a reasonably neutral tonal balance, but its sound is flawed by a spitty, rather exaggerated treble and a loose, not particularly well-defined bass. These aspects would be more forgivable if the severe lack of midrange clarity, coupled with a recessed presence region, hadn't rendered the speaker's sound so musically uninvolving. Ultimately, I feel the RTA 11t, at $950/pair, just isn't competitive in a high-end environment."
https://www.stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/polk_rta_11t_loudspeaker/index.html
These comments in the RTA 11t review gave me some insight and pause for reflection:
"As Polk declined to supply review samples of the RTA 11t, we bought a pair from a local retailer."
"Nevertheless, for this review, I have chosen a model from a company renowned for its marketing strength: Polk Audio."
"In fact, since its founding in the early '70s, Polk has become one of the most commercially successful specialist loudspeaker companies in the US."
"Polk Audio may have the appearance of a marketing-led company, but according to surveys in the trade press, they appear to have loyal dealers who have a good regard both for the performance and saleability of Polk loudspeakers and for the level of service backup offered by the company."
I don't recall that Polk ever advertised in Stereophile, all the while taking out full color 24-page ad spreads in Audio magazine's annual equipment directory and full page ads in Audio's regular issues. Polk also advertised in High Fidelity and Stereo Review magazines, but again, I recall no such advertising love for Stereophile. Maybe Stereophile's circulation numbers weren't high enough.
Post edited by DarqueKnight onProud and loyal citizen of the Digital Domain and Solid State Country! -
Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
I've worked with a thousands of people.
There's regular people and then there are "special" people. People who stand out from the regular people.
Common sense was lacking with this fellow.
Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them. -
nooshinjohn wrote: »nooshinjohn wrote: »They were dismissive of the brand even back when Polk was at it's best. I remember Shelley's Stereo (still in business BTW) telling me that Polk speakers were nothing but a waste of money and time, and that Maggie MGII was a far superior product to anything Polk could offer.
They had been reps for the brand pretty much since it was founded, but the owner at the time was so put off by the SDA's and insulted by the concept itself that he refused to even properly show them.
Polk speakers were rarely reviewed by stereophile back in the day, other than the fairly bad Rta11t review. It was not until the last 15 years that stereophile started to take Polk seriously with several reviews.
The SDA concept was not well received overall or by the audiphile community. Heck, in this forum, that is made up of Polks biggest fans there is no consensus on SDA. I see it as a great "idea" that at times could make a great sound, but not something that was overall seen as good by the audiophile community.
Also Polk back in the day were adamant that everything had to be based on the same 6.5" woofer and basically the same tweeters in most all models. To those that loved Polk that was seen as a plus, but those that were more on the fence, it looked to be a cost cutting measure to simply inplement the same basic drivers in everything to just save money, but not to reach higher into audiophile quality.
(Not a jab against Polk or the older vintage speakers, but how others tend to see this stuff)
The doped cone mid-woofers may look the same, but they are in fact different drivers. I am certain that as with most manufacturers, they were going for a cohesive look between series in much the same way as Infinity did.
SDA’s we’re reviewed often back in the day, and the reviews were favorable. As Matt said in a post about why they stopped making them, the dealers could not be bothered with them to set them up for a proper demo, especially since they took up so much real estate in what was mostly a common speaker room. Typically they were toed in, too close to a wall, and generally sounded bad in the typical sound room of the time. And sales people would take the easy way out and disparage the brand rather than move a 100 to 200 pound refrigerator for best effect.
Please do me a favor KM and get your facts right before quoting me, or better yet, just don’t quote me at all...
Or better yet put you back on Ignore where you belong.
Not really in the mood for jerks that are only here to argue. -
nooshinjohn wrote: »They were dismissive of the brand even back when Polk was at it's best. I remember Shelley's Stereo (still in business BTW) telling me that Polk speakers were nothing but a waste of money and time, and that Maggie MGII was a far superior product to anything Polk could offer.
They had been reps for the brand pretty much since it was founded, but the owner at the time was so put off by the SDA's and insulted by the concept itself that he refused to even properly show them.
Polk speakers were rarely reviewed by stereophile back in the day, other than the fairly bad Rta11t review. It was not until the last 15 years that stereophile started to take Polk seriously with several reviews.
The SDA concept was not well received overall or by the audiphile community. Heck, in this forum, that is made up of Polks biggest fans there is no consensus on SDA. I see it as a great "idea" that at times could make a great sound, but not something that was overall seen as good by the audiophile community.
Also Polk back in the day were adamant that everything had to be based on the same 6.5" woofer and basically the same tweeters in most all models. To those that loved Polk that was seen as a plus, but those that were more on the fence, it looked to be a cost cutting measure to simply inplement the same basic drivers in everything to just save money, but not to reach higher into audiophile quality.
(Not a jab against Polk or the older vintage speakers, but how others tend to see this stuff)
1C's and SRS's were reviewed by Julian Hisrch back in the day and they got pretty high marks. Audio magazine did a couple reviews as well.
The thing with the rags back then is there were only about 3-4 audio mags and they could only devote so much space for gear, and there was lots of gear back then so you won't see a lot of any one brand reviewed in the 80's and 90's.
https://polksda.com/srsreview.shtml
https://polksda.com/sda1creview.shtml
H9
"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
I sold SDA's back in the mid 90's. We were a mid level dealer and had a special room upstairs set up with all Nakamichi separates PA7; CA7; OMS7, Dragon, etc. Demoing a pair of the big boys and also a pair of 1C's (not at the same time, obviously). 1C's and especially 2B studio's were a ridiculously easy sale after a proper demo.
We sat people in the sweet spot and blew most people away with the sound. Sold a lot of SDA's with the proper demo. But we had sale people that hated Polk and never sold it unless the customer insisted on it.
H9Post edited by heiney9 on"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
I have a pair of RT25i's and I bought them based on the Stereophile review DK makes reference to.
They are excellent sounding speakers and I feel (unmodded) they do voice reproduction slightly better than my modded 5B's w/RD0's. Fantastic bookie by any standards.
H9"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
Sold a lot of SDA's with the proper demo. But we had sale people that hated Polk and never sold it unless the customer insisted on it.
Why did they hate Polk?
There are audio brands that I don't particularly care for due to various reasons (sound quality, reliability issues, poor customer service, etc.), but there isn't a brand that I hate, not even the ones I've had issues with (e.g. Cary, Graham, Pioneer).
I completely understand an audio product not being to a particular person's liking, but some of the vitriol spewed toward Polk just seems like envy and jealousy due to their success. Some of it bears similarities to mental illness.
During the 80s and 90s, "high end" "audiophile" companies were not particularly known for making reliable products nor for providing good customer service. Many of them operated on the verge of financial insolvency and many of them are no longer around today.
Proud and loyal citizen of the Digital Domain and Solid State Country! -
DarqueKnight wrote: »Sold a lot of SDA's with the proper demo. But we had sale people that hated Polk and never sold it unless the customer insisted on it.
Why did they hate Polk?
There are audio brands that I don't particularly care for due to various reasons (sound quality, reliability issues, poor customer service, etc.), but there isn't a brand that I hate, not even the ones I've had issues with (e.g. Cary, Graham, Pioneer).
One guy hated and even made it a point in his sales pitch (as why to not buy Polk) the SL2000 tweeter. He also felt they weren't high end enough like ADS and Mirage and KEF. He was a big ADS speaker guy. But he was full of himself and Polk just didn't fit the up market image he had in mind for his customers.
One other sales guy just never really cared for the SDA's. To much of an assault on the traditional stereo speaker. SO he dismissed Polk entirely.
Silly reason's really, as we always made a good profit (commission) on Polk's.
H9
"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
Or better yet put you back on Ignore where you belong.
Not really in the mood for jerks that are only here to argue.
Good idea KM, perhaps the best one you have ever posted. If you had even the faintest of a clue as to what you are talking about, there would be no need to "argue" as you put it. No need to reply as you are back on my list anyway.The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
“When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson -
One guy hated and even made it a point in his sales pitch (as why to not buy Polk) the SL2000 tweeter. He also felt they weren't high end enough like ADS and Mirage and KEF. He was a big ADS speaker guy. But he was full of himself and Polk just didn't fit the up market image he had in mind for his customers.
One other sales guy just never really cared for the SDA's. To much of an assault on the traditional stereo speaker. SO he dismissed Polk entirely.
I never ran into that negativity toward SDAs in particular, or Polks in general, at any of the Polk dealers I visited in California, Georgia, Kansas, or North Carolina.
The attachment below is Polk's dealer list from late 1986 to early 1987. I counted 323 dealers for Polk's home audio speakers in the USA and Puerto Rico. I had the pleasure of visiting five of them and eventually purchasing from one of them.
Proud and loyal citizen of the Digital Domain and Solid State Country! -
nooshinjohn wrote: »Or better yet put you back on Ignore where you belong.
Not really in the mood for jerks that are only here to argue.
Good idea KM, perhaps the best one you have ever posted. If you had even the faintest of a clue as to what you are talking about, there would be no need to "argue" as you put it. No need to reply as you are back on my list anyway.
Good, so now that you're both on each others ignore list, that should be the end of the kindergarten-esque slap fighting. So, are you willing to put forth a little effort or are you happy sitting in your skeptical poo pile?
http://audiomilitia.proboards.com/ -
Source: BRP Panasonic UB9000, CDP Emotiva ERC3 - Display: LG OLED EVO 83 C3 - Pre/Pro: Marantz 8802A - Amplification: Emotiva XPA-DR3, XPA-2 x 2, XPA-6, Speakers, Mains/2ch-Focal Kanta No2's, C-LSiM706, S-702F/X, RS-RTiA9's, WS-RTiA9's, FH-RTiA3's, Subs - Epik Empire x 2
Cables: AudioQuest McKenzie XLR's/CDP/Amp, Carbon 48/BRP, Forest 48/Display, 2 channel speaker cable: Furutech FS Alpha 36 12AWG PCOCC Single Crystal (Douglas Connection)
EXPERIENCE: next to nothing, but I sure enjoy audio and video MY OPINION OF THIS HOBBY: I may not be a smart man, but I know what quicksand is.
When I was young, I was Superman but now that old age has gotten the best of me I'm only Batman -
It used to be common, not anymore.
Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them. -
DarqueKnight wrote: »One guy hated and even made it a point in his sales pitch (as why to not buy Polk) the SL2000 tweeter. He also felt they weren't high end enough like ADS and Mirage and KEF. He was a big ADS speaker guy. But he was full of himself and Polk just didn't fit the up market image he had in mind for his customers.
One other sales guy just never really cared for the SDA's. To much of an assault on the traditional stereo speaker. SO he dismissed Polk entirely.
I never ran into that negativity toward SDAs in particular, or Polks in general, at any of the Polk dealers I visited in California, Georgia, Kansas, or North Carolina.
The attachment below is Polk's dealer list from late 1986 to early 1987. I counted 323 dealers for Polk's home audio speakers in the USA and Puerto Rico. I had the pleasure of visiting five of them and eventually purchasing from one of them.
I worked at Columbia Audio Video in Rockford, IL. We had stores in the Chicago suburbs as well. I wouldn't say it was outward negativity against Polk with customers. More salesmen talk among ourselves. They wouldn't show Polk's first unless the customer showed interest or needed a particular trait, like a price point or size, etc.
H9"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
