Efficient Speakers For a Set Amp

verb

Ah, my bad. Didn't read the full document. Interesting, thanks Doc! And @Faustin ! Graphs, love em!

mhardy6647

Put my kids through school generating and interpreting graphical data

tonyp063

Just so you folks know, there are people here reading this thread, not commenting too much, but paying very close attention.

Thank you. Carry on please.

Faustin

Because of their rather large footprint, they do not have a lot of WAF.In fact the first thing my wife asked was "where are you going to put them"? Didn't really answer the question and honestly, I really don't know what I am going to do with them.

mhardy6647

Faustin wrote: »

Because of their rather large footprint, they do not have a lot of WAF.In fact the first thing my wife asked was "where are you going to put them"? Didn't really answer the question and honestly, I really don't know what I am going to do with them.

oops. Sorry!

Faustin

oops. Sorry!

[/quote]

Ha! I ain't worried none. They will get use one way or another. Interesting enough, now that they are assembled my wife started asking questions about them. She was curious as to the fact that they were not a "box". With a little time, wine and bs, I think I can convince her to let me move her grandma's dining room table and china hutch to the barn to make space for more speakers. Oh, and the drivers are out of the baffles as stain and hand rub poly is being applied.

vcwatkins

Sorry, drifting a bit here... @mhardy6647 , if you happen to see this, I had a few questions related to the 40-1354 MLTQWT's.

Drivers
I have Dynamatted the driver baskets, glued the magnets, ordered plugs from Planet10. I also read somewhere of other 1354 tweaks and wondered if you had thoughts on these?:
- shave down the gasket to even with the frame
- rubber cement on edge of whizzer
- foam donut tucked under whizzer to snug up connection to cone
- Dammar or other coating added to cone and/or whizzer (this was NOT recommended by the guy who recommended the first three)

Port
And, regarding the port, is it preferable to run the port PVC through the baffle? I'm considering gluing it to the back of the baffle, flush trimming to cut the hole, then rounding over the edge of the hole. Any thoughts?

Thanks for any help,
Craig

Edit: source of driver tweaks: http://myhifisite.50megs.com/1354tweaks.html

mhardy6647

of course I'd see your post!

So, I did only the basket damping and phase plugging of the drivers in mine (I don't think I did anything with the magnets); that other stuff sounds kind of extreme. That said, since those drivers are still (relatively) cheap & plentiful, one could certainly go hog wild on one pair and also keep or acquire a control pair, just in case.
(can you tell I am kind of conservative when it comes to hifi?)

The tubing on mine is simply flush-cut to the front baffle. Rounding sounds nice, but I have no data

Hope this helps!

vcwatkins

Very helpful as always. Hope to glue up tomorrow. Many thanks!

Faustin

After playing around with the 8" drivers and the OB design, I ran across a used pair of 10" Audio Nirvana FR drivers for sale, so of course 1 thing leads to another and farther down the rabbit hole I go. Modified the hole size and popped them in. Have to say these drivers are heavy and very nice sounding. Listening to Florence and the Machine Live, Unplugged as I type and I am liking what I am hearing. I think they would really shine in a bass reflex enclosure to deepen the bass, but for now I am enjoying them in the OB.

mhardy6647

Well, no comment on Audio Nirvana, but I will mention that, for better or worse (and not to belabor the obvious!) the trick with dipole radiators is placement -- in other words, if the space you have your OBs in and your time constraints permit it, spend some quality time movin' them suckas around a little in a quest for optimal placement.

The issue of quality vs. quantity of bass could also play a role here. I don't know the T/S parameters of that particular driver offhand, but if it's OB-friendly, you may get more bass (much more ) from a different alignment (enclosure design), but it may or may not be prettier bass.

I should probably note that I an not at all an over-the-top OB fanboy -- the main goal here was to get @Faustin into some easy high sensitivity loudspeakers.

I think we've got our clutches in him umm, I mean, he's on the golden path.



https://youtu.be/45YoZCo8dvU

Have fun!!!

Faustin

Thanks for the input Mr H. If you are interested in exploring info on this particular driver (and other cool stuff) check out commonsenseaudio.com. Next up is selling some equipment to make room for, and to fund a SET amp.

mhardy6647

Oh, I know them (David Dicks) well...

vcwatkins

Finally (dry) assembled the ML TQWT's Friday night and brought them in for a listen.
Couldn't believe what I was hearing.

These are the Bob Brines designed mass loaded folded, tapered quarter-wave tube (ML TQWT) speakers that @mhardy6647 mentions above. I hooked them up in the study rig (Project Pre Box S2, Pass ACA) and ran through some demo tracks (notes below). They instantly drew me in with mesmerizing three-dimensional imaging and impressively realistic detail. Vocals, skins, cymbals, plucked and bowed strings, piano keys - all sound round, organic, live.

This is one fun little system, although I have a few things to do yet. I need to install the phase plugs when they arrive, take some measurements, maybe make adjustments, then do the final glue-up. But right now I am LOVING this little study rig.

I can't thank @mhardy6647 enough for the help and encouragement on this and the ACA thread.

I think @Jim Shearer's comment is on the money:

Jim Shearer wrote: »

I am a single driver fan myself, but they are not for everyone. Single driver speakers will not give you ear bleed SPLs, nor can they produce chest thumping bass. If you can accept their limitations, then you may find that the right single driver speaker can deliver a mid-range goodness that is only equaled by the finest multi-way speakers, but at a very modest cost.

For less than a hundred bucks and some stuff I had on hand, I now have some uniquely enjoyable speakers.

Cost
- Pair Radio Shack 40-1354 drivers - $32
- Planet10 Phase Plugs - $35
- Natural wool batting - $28
On hand:
- 3/4" oak plywood
- 3" PVC (used sch40 iso 20 for gluing and routing stability)
- Binding posts, speaker wire, Fastons, Armacell, Dynamat, biscuits, glue

Tasting Notes
"Take Five" (24/176) - best that track's ever sounded, soundstage remarkably wide, tall, and deep; three-dimensional unlike anything I've heard - caused a trippy out-of-body floating-in-space-among-colorful-note-strands experience. Wow!

"Waltz for Debby" (24/192) - LaFaro & Motian in the room; man's laughter midway through the cut caused me to whip my head around thinking someone was behind me and gave me a chill, hehe

"A-Train" by Ellington All-Stars - well differentiated & organic horns; nuanced trombone, dynamic and detailed horn solo; piano/clarinet perfection; big band dynamics are

Shelby Lynne's "Just a Little Lovin'" - uncanny vocal detail, 3D cymbal tap splashes through 3D space; easily audible tape echo (or whatever it's called)

10 String Symphony's "Prettiest Girl" - the simplicity of 2 fiddles and 2 voices makes this one of my favorite demo tunes; the most minute detail of the wood, string, resin, and room come through beautifully

Eva Cassidy's "Autumn Leaves" - sublime guitar, piano, vocal detail and tone; excellent spatial queues; LIVE

The Greyhounds' "Cuz I'm Here" - sweet soulfulness from the unhurried amplified guitar, electronic keyboard and snare.

Dr. John's "Guilded Splinters" - John's vocal seems to come from two feet away from me in the center of the room; the girls' punctuating backgrounds coming from different points in mind-blowing three-dimensional space; crazy cool psycho-acoustic effect

Mendrugo's "Velluda" - this album, More Amor, is from a group of pals who seem to pick instruments from an elementary school box of folk instruments and improvise, making crazy trippy Spanish tinged folk music that is intimate and utterly unique. I absolutely love this strange album, even though I get weird looks from anyone around when I put it on. Spatial queues make it sound like it's in a big empty Victorian house, but the liner notes mention a cafe.

Cat Stevens' "Father & Son" (24/192) - just incredible; best this cut has ever sounded

Jonathan Wilson's "Can We Really Party Today" - the Floyd-ish production really shines with the expansive soundstage

Daft Punk's "Get Lucky" - even electronica sounds good; bass is not rumbling but
tuneful; impossible to not to tap foot; excellent detail in the synth note bending and Vocoder'd vocals; Nile Rodgers guitar stands out nicely

Joachim Kuhn Trio's "Riders On the Storm" - skin and cymbal detail on drum intro is wonderful; piano keys to die for

"Sweetman: Austin Backalley Blue" (Mapleshade) - could not stop this album, it was so musical and live-in-the-room sounding

J Street Jumpers' Is You Is (Mapleshade) album - couldn't stop listening. Oh my!

txcoastal1

Bob was a regular at LSAF for years. I have spent many of hours listening to his speakers and always with a smile. He is a great guy with a really good ear.

Glad your digging them, and I must say, I'm a little green with envy.

mhardy6647

cool.

Faustin

Very nice vcwatkins. Pictures?? I am pretty amazed as to what a full range driver can sound like.

mhardy6647

I feel like it's time to insert a diabolical bwahahahahahahaaaaa... at this juncture.

GOLDEN-EARS

Okay I'll play. Hawthorne Audio Rainier MK III Signature Editions.

mhardy6647

The Hawthorne speakers (and drivers) were nice -- they went away though, didn't they?

GOLDEN-EARS

"At the close of 2016 a decision was made to end our 12 year run of Hawthorne Audio. Diana and I felt that the time was ideal for us to retire. After some careful consideration we felt that our time of doing audio was over. 12 years, 45 countries and 1000’s of satisfied customers proudly served. While it is true that for us this chapter of our lives has ended we did wish that all of the innovations, discoveries and exclusive products we developed could somehow live on. This wish seems to have been heard and is well on it’s way to becoming a reality.

We have been contacted by a team of individuals in Canada that shares in this dream of keeping Hawthorne Audio alive. They offered to make this happen and we set about to see if this would be mutually beneficial and in keeping with our original desires. It is with great pleasure that we make this announcement. The passing of the torch is complete and we look forward to seeing where these folks take Hawthorne Audio.
For those customers familiar with the brand we have made it possible for our exclusive line of OB specific drivers to continue to be available and featured in a fresh new line of baffles and kits. Look for a continuation of innovations and product development as we move forward.

In closing, Diana and I would like to once again reach out to the Audio community with gratitude and thanks for all of the sales, encouragements, well wishes and especially for all of the friends we met along the way. This has been an adventure of a life time that we will long treasure."

Cheers,
Darrel

Faustin

Very cool.