Finally, my entrance into the vinyl rabbit hole!

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Comments

  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,377
    edited July 2018
    aprazer402 wrote: »
    I read through most of todays comments about the hiss and watched the video. I heard a hiss when the camera was directed at the speaker on the right for a couple of seconds. Hard to tell what it is. So it's only occurs on your Technics table but not your dad's Luxman table when it's connected to the same receiver? How many records have you played, you mentioned a couple, are they all brand new? Can you try some older ones that have been played more. Assumed you cleaned the brand new ones before you played them. If not, you need to do so.
    Ive done everything listed here, the records were cleaned with a GrooveWasher.
    With all the switching back and forth etc. have you double checked all the connections for turntable, it's interconnect cables, speaker wires and that they are in-phase? Verify the turntable's grounding wire is attached properly. Might take it loose and re-attach it again.
    Everything is connected correctly, I checked that before I came to ask for help.
    Check that the cartridge head shell is screwed tight (but not super tight, just finger tightened) onto the tone arm. Check the cartridge wiring connections at the rear and make sure they are all tight. Check stylus for dirt and clean it again anyway, and check if it's bent at all. Make sure stylus is inserted properly into the cartridge body. Double check the tracking weight your using and that the anti-skate is set to the same setting (1.5 grams or what is recommended.)
    All of these things were done as well.
    Check the wires at the rear of the receiver and along the floor and make sure other power lines are not crossing them and if so separate them a little to see if that makes a difference.
    I didn’t check that, but I just did, and none are crossed.
    Have you added any other new components to this system since the hiss appeared?
    No.
    Might want to reposition the turntable to see if a different location corrects it.
    I will try that if the issue persists.
    Do you have another cartridge to try?
    I don’t have one yet, but when my dad is back he will let me try his cartridge.
    Just some general things to check out in case you missed something.

    For only 15 your doing great!

    Enjoy!

    Thanks!
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 19,932
    WRMS = weighted root mean square

    HI/LO is input sensitivity for a "MM" (moving magnet or"moving iron") phono cartridge. Some MM/MI have outputs of a couple of millivolts, some are more like 5 to 10 mV; thus the switch on some (particularly older) components. NOT for low output MC/MM differences in sensitivity.
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 19,932
    mlistens03 wrote: »
    Ah, HAA!
    op730nul62jb.jpg
    I’ll bet it was the switch and this cap here working together to mess up the sound!
    ...

    Why?
    That little electrolytic looks like it's in the power supply (I say that based on the four diodes to its left, which I am guessing is a full wave bridge).

  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,377
    edited July 2018
    Do you see the bottom bulging? I think that’s a blown cap, although looking now, I don’t see it in the picture, be right back.
    Looking in person now, it seems to be bulging just a little bit, I’ll have to test it once I find my multimeter.
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 19,932
    certainly won't hurt to toss a new 1000 uF @ 16V in its place... but I am skeptical.
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,377
    mhardy6647 wrote: »
    certainly won't hurt to toss a new 1000 uF @ 16V in its place... but I am skeptical.

    That’s the plan. Now I just gotta find one.
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 19,932
    Too bad there're no Radio Shacks any more.

    Do you have an electronics parts supplier in your vicinity? There are still some extant in New England.
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,377
    mhardy6647 wrote: »
    Too bad there're no Radio Shacks any more.

    Do you have an electronics parts supplier in your vicinity? There are still some extant in New England.

    Not that I know of. I might try Amazon, but I’ll look around on Google first.
    Do you think if I found one in a different piece of equipment just sitting around I could use that? If it tests well, of course.
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 19,932
    edited July 2018
    Do you think if I found one in a different piece of equipment just sitting around I could use that? If it tests well, of course.
    Well... yes, but you're going to want to test two parameters. Capacitance (which is the less important of the two, as long as it's kinda close*) and ESR (equivalent series resistance). Do you have an ESR tester?

    If not, I'd recommend just plopping in a new one. Dirt cheap. If I have one downstairs, I'll PM you and I can mail it to you if I do.

    ____________
    * Even today, tolerances of +/- 20% on electrolytics aren't uncommon; in the 1960s, it was often +/- 50%, sometimes more.


  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,377
    mhardy6647 wrote: »
    Do you think if I found one in a different piece of equipment just sitting around I could use that? If it tests well, of course.
    Well... yes, but you're going to want to test two parameters. Capacitance (which is the less important of the two) and ESR (equivalent series resistance). Do you have an ESR tester?

    If not, I'd recommend just plopping in a new one. Dirt cheap. If I have one downstairs, I'll PM you and I can mail it to you if I do.

    I don’t have an ESR tester.
    Thanks for the offer, but I can pay for a 50 cent capacitor. I’ll replace this cap, and if it fixes it, I’ll see about maybe doing a full recap. However I’ll probably use decent caps. I can afford a few Sonicaps for my Missions, but I cannot afford a few hundred for any amplifier. :wink:
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 19,932
    edited July 2018
    ... as long as you don't have to contend with minimum orders or high shipping costs! :)

    FWIW, I'd recommend avoiding any disturbance of the tuned circuits in a receiver (i.e., don't replace any the capacitors, electrolytic or otherwise, in the tuner circuitry).
  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 5,213
    I'm tempted to just send you my NAD C 316BEE integrated if it means you'll stop messing around with vintage receivers.
    • "Electronic music is human sound adapting to indulge technology, and for some, it feels like the signature sound of energy. New and abstract sounds over hypnotic rhythms can conjure vast soundscapes for escape, pleasure, and transcendence."
  • FestYboyFestYboy Posts: 3,105
    Clipdat wrote: »
    I'm tempted to just send you my NAD C 316BEE integrated if it means you'll stop messing around with vintage receivers.

    I've been toying with the idea of sending him a 7240PE or one of my 2100PEs... Just so he has some current to play with.
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,377
    Clipdat wrote: »
    I'm tempted to just send you my NAD C 316BEE integrated if it means you'll stop messing around with vintage receivers.
    FestYboy wrote: »
    Clipdat wrote: »
    I'm tempted to just send you my NAD C 316BEE integrated if it means you'll stop messing around with vintage receivers.

    I've been toying with the idea of sending him a 7240PE or one of my 2100PEs... Just so he has some current to play with.

    Oh guys, that is totally unnecessary, these last two receivers are actually the first two I’ve ever bought that didn’t work perfectly. And the Lafayette I think is gonna be an easy fix, and I very much like the sound of it. I also love bringing these things home and fixing them up, and sending them along to friends who will certainly enjoy them. Thanks so much for the very generous offer, but I really want to get a vintage receiver. Once I find the right one (I think it’s sitting in my room) I’m gonna get it recapped and restored fully, and use it for a long time.
    Micah
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 5,213
    Fair enough, do your thing. If you change your mind, it's yours as long as you cover the cost of shipping.
    • "Electronic music is human sound adapting to indulge technology, and for some, it feels like the signature sound of energy. New and abstract sounds over hypnotic rhythms can conjure vast soundscapes for escape, pleasure, and transcendence."
  • jdjohnjdjohn Posts: 520
    Digikey or Mouser for the cap. Shipping will cost more than the cap, but there shouldn't be any minimum order required.
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,377
    jdjohn wrote: »
    Digikey or Mouser for the cap. Shipping will cost more than the cap, but there shouldn't be any minimum order required.

    Thanks!
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • jdjohnjdjohn Posts: 520
    Reading back through this thread a bit, if I'm reading it right, you're having the sound problem with your Lafayette receiver? Is it only through the phono stage, or do other sources have the sound issue as well?
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,377
    jdjohn wrote: »
    Reading back through this thread a bit, if I'm reading it right, you're having the sound problem with your Lafayette receiver? Is it only through the phono stage, or do other sources have the sound issue as well?

    All of them seem to be bad, but the phono is especially noisy.
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 5,213
    Return it again for store credit and get something that actually works. Why is it your burden that this place keeps selling you faulty gear?
    mlistens03 wrote: »
    All of them seem to be bad, but the phono is especially noisy.

    • "Electronic music is human sound adapting to indulge technology, and for some, it feels like the signature sound of energy. New and abstract sounds over hypnotic rhythms can conjure vast soundscapes for escape, pleasure, and transcendence."
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,377
    Clipdat wrote: »
    Return it again for store credit and get something that actually works. Why is it your burden that this place keeps selling you faulty gear?
    mlistens03 wrote: »
    All of them seem to be bad, but the phono is especially noisy.

    I’ve bought at least 10 amps from this guy, and they have all worked perfectly. I don’t know why these last two haven’t worked, but the first one he had fixed, but the guy must’ve done something wrong, and the second one was working when I bought it, something must have happened upon power up, because I listened to it for a few days and it’s was fine.
    I am gonna try and replace that capacitor, but I just need to find one. I think that will fix my worries, but if it doesn’t, I’ll take it back. It will cost me nothing, and if it works I’ll have an amp to enjoy for a long time.
    Also, upon testing again, the problem seems to come and go. It is usually not noticeable, and on some songs it is more/less noticeable. Maybe it only occupies a few certain frequencies?
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 5,213
    edited July 2018
    Heh, I admire your willingness to troubleshoot and seek out the issue.

    For me this would fall under the "too lazy/tired, **** it" category.

    I guess different people have different tolerances for what they're willing to spend time and energy trying to fix. :)
    • "Electronic music is human sound adapting to indulge technology, and for some, it feels like the signature sound of energy. New and abstract sounds over hypnotic rhythms can conjure vast soundscapes for escape, pleasure, and transcendence."
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,377
    Clipdat wrote: »
    Heh, I admire your willingness to troubleshoot and seek out the issue.

    For me this would fall under the "too lazy/tired, **** it" category.

    I’m too cheap for that. :wink: :lol:
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 5,213
    Also this sounds totally stupid, but in that youtube video you posted earlier of the issue, things still sounded "good" to me. I mean it's impossible to actually hear what someone's setup sounds like through youtube, but despite the distortion issue happening, I still got a sense that your setup sounds really nice. Must be the magic of vinyl.
    • "Electronic music is human sound adapting to indulge technology, and for some, it feels like the signature sound of energy. New and abstract sounds over hypnotic rhythms can conjure vast soundscapes for escape, pleasure, and transcendence."
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,377
    Clipdat wrote: »
    Also this sounds totally stupid, but in that youtube video you posted earlier of the issue, things still sounded "good" to me. I mean it's impossible to actually hear what someone's setup sounds like through youtube, but despite the distortion issue happening, I still got a sense that your setup sounds really nice. Must be the magic of vinyl.

    If you look on my channel I have several videos of my system. All of them use NCS music unfortunately, but it still sounds nice. The split second you saw wasn’t great, but the rest is pretty good.
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 5,213
    edited July 2018
    I need to get back into actually playing my records. A few years ago I made it a point to play at least one record a day. So every day after work I would come home and take care of any immediate needs/chores and then put on some records. It was always thoroughly enjoyable. I think I only kept it up for 4 weeks or so though.

    Not sure what my excuse has been lately aside from just laziness and/or lack of energy. I have so many records that literally just sit and never get played. :/
    • "Electronic music is human sound adapting to indulge technology, and for some, it feels like the signature sound of energy. New and abstract sounds over hypnotic rhythms can conjure vast soundscapes for escape, pleasure, and transcendence."
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,377
    Clipdat wrote: »
    I need to get back into actually playing my records. A few years ago I made it a point to play at least one record a day. So every day after work I would come home and take care of any immediate needs/chores and then put on some records. It was always thoroughly enjoyable. I think I only kept it up for 4 weeks or so though.

    Not sure what my excuse has been lately aside from just laziness and/or lack of energy. I have so many records that literally just sit and never get played. :/

    What do you use in place of vinyl?
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 5,213
    Either digital music played at my computer setup, or CDs on the nice rig in my bedroom.

    The bedroom setup sucks because there's a pesky bed in the sweet spot instead of a chair. This means that you have to be basically sitting/laying on the bed to be in the best location for listening.

    Unfortunately this results in two things. Either being completely uncomfortable because you're trying to sit on a bed, or laying back and falling asleep because the bed is so comfy and the music sounds so good when you close your eyes! :)
    • "Electronic music is human sound adapting to indulge technology, and for some, it feels like the signature sound of energy. New and abstract sounds over hypnotic rhythms can conjure vast soundscapes for escape, pleasure, and transcendence."
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,377
    Clipdat wrote: »
    Either digital music played at my computer setup, or CDs on the nice rig in my bedroom.

    The bedroom setup sucks because there's a pesky bed in the sweet spot instead of a chair. This means that you have to be basically sitting/laying on the bed to be in the best location for listening.

    Unfortunately this results in two things. Either being completely uncomfortable because you're trying to sit on a bed, or laying back and falling asleep because the bed is so comfy and the music sounds so good when you close your eyes! :)

    I tried this with my system, and although it was ok, I much prefer my chair. The bed is a nice idea though, and if you have enough pillows you can almost make a chair.
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • jdjohnjdjohn Posts: 520
    Micah, I admire you as well for attempting a fix, but here are a few things to consider:
    - Once you start working on it, the seller may not take it back. Especially since it was working when it left his shop.
    - If you're getting noise from all sources, the problem is likely to be more than that one cap. As ClipDat mentioned, that cap is related to power supply, with likely no audio signal even passing through it. Capacitors involved in filtering frequencies are the ones in speaker crossovers. I have a vintage receiver right now that I'm trying to fix, which has some low-level hiss/white noise. So far, I've replaced probably two dozen capacitors on the power supply and amp boards, AND I've replaced all eight output transistors...still no joy. Do you have the service manual for yours?
    - And talk about a rabbit hole. It's easy to start throwing parts at these old units all to no avail. I've been there. "Oh, just one more capacitor/transistor ought to do the trick!" Without proper diagnostic/testing equipment, amateurs like us are just p!ssing in the wind.
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