'Unspoken' Flea Market Rules

RuSsMaN

You missed the point Chuck, if I read what you just said correctly - we are all in agreement.

Now if YOU sold me a $1000 tube amp, for $500 - and I turned around and sold it for the $1000 is it REALLY worth - tell me that wouldn't be the last item you ever sold me.

Cheers,
Russ

AsSiMiLaTeD

Originally posted by madmax
You guys are nuts. If I see some SDA's going for half of what they should be and I can't buy them I want to be able to post them here. Also, if I find a really cool mint tube amp worth $1000 used laying out in the street I don't see why I should offer it for any less than what I would offer it for had I paid $2000. What does it matter? It is still worth $1000. If I offer it for $500 that is one heck of a good deal for a fellow polk member.

If you guys are worried that someone makes out even though it is a great deal for both buyer and seller, well, there is something wrong with that and you should think about why you feel that way. (no one in particular). I bought a rare car once for 11K. The guy was VERY happy to sell it for that because he really wanted the money that day. It should have sold for $18K. Does that mean I can't sell it for $18K in the future? Think it over.

madmax

nothing personal madmax, just using your post as an example...

You can post Ebay auctions, just don't sell something on Ebay and then put a link to it on the forum. Either sell it on the forum or put it on Ebay.

And don't buy something on here for $100 then turn around and sell it for $400 on here...that's not right...

Everyone is missing the point here...Jeez...

madmax

Originally posted by RuSsMaN
Now if YOU sold me a $1000 tube amp, for $500 - and I turned around and sold it for the $1000 is it REALLY worth - tell me that wouldn't be the last item you ever sold me.

Cheers,
Russ

I wouldn't care. After all I did find it out in the street for nothing and sold it to you for $500. (Which was a great deal for both of us.) If you can move that around to something you want more I would be very happy for you. I guess you could make the argument that I should have just shipped it to you for the shipping cost but then again, you were very happy to get it for $500, right?

Let me ask you this one. Someone finds out I have the two 45's you sent me. They want to give me $300 for them. I'm in need of a new pair of interconnects for $300. Is it OK if I sell them?

It's a fine line. Too fine to make rules either written or unwritten. That is my only point. On audioasylum you are not allowed to even mention that you have something for sale even though someone has just told you they have been looking for one everywhere and none are available. To me, that sucks!

RuSsMaN

Yeah, there's a lot of grey area.

Given YOU and ME in the above scenario - I'd say take that fools money! Actually, the fact you TOLD me that someone wanted them makes me grin - if I just saw you hockin' em on ebay next week - I wouldn't be MAD, but I doubt I'd be keeping my eye open for any other cool items to send you.

I'm big on the 'hooking a bro up' scenario, not so big on just unloading things well under current market, for people to pay their rent with after re-sale.

Maybe that's one of my faults, but that's just how I am.

Cheers,
Russ

jdhdiggs

I think I'm in between the two of you... If someone here hooks me up with something and I decide to part with it, I would sell it to someone here for the same price or less.

A great E-bay deal, I'd probably just post the link.

Anything else seems like it ought to be fair game. But if something is offered in this forum, it shouldn't be listed for top $ IMHO

Posting on E-bay and here? That's not cool. Advertising here to drive your E-bay price up isn't helping the forum.

AsSiMiLaTeD

Originally posted by jdhdiggs
I think I'm in between the two of you... If someone here hooks me up with something and I decide to part with it, I would sell it to someone here for the same price or less.

A great E-bay deal, I'd probably just post the link.

Anything else seems like it ought to be fair game. But if something is offered in this forum, it shouldn't be listed for top $ IMHO

Posting on E-bay and here? That's not cool. Advertising here to drive your E-bay price up isn't helping the forum.

Yep, you've pretty much got it right...

nemos2

Its a Thin line here....

The Polk forum does post when a user has signed up for the service (and what a great service at that!!) so that can serve as an indicator, but I am rather new, but I am A true Polkie, and would not go anywhere else.

Some other companies that offer forums, do not allow for sales on the forums, and that kind of sucks, because, as most of us here will admit, its great to help another fan of the same gear out with great deals, and usually it is to help the seller upgrade.

So my vote is to say thank you to POLK ( thanks for the great speakers guys, and then the Great forum and support ), and then to just attempt to follow common sense rules, and buyer beware.

madmax

Originally posted by RuSsMaN

Given YOU and ME in the above scenario - I'd say take that fools money! Actually, the fact you TOLD me that someone wanted them makes me grin - if I just saw you hockin' em on ebay next week - I wouldn't be MAD, but I doubt I'd be keeping my eye open for any other cool items to send you.

Cheers,
Russ

Actually he just up'd it to $485 + shipping. Apparently they are pretty rare. He had the whole collection except for one of the ones I had. I went ahead and let them go...

madmax

DarqueKnight

Sometimes a sale is just a sale and sometimes a sale, or even a gift, comes with certain explicit or implied conditions and expectations.

If there are any post-sale conditions or expectations on the part of the seller, they should be stated up front to avoid any hard feelings.

Some might argue that if you attach conditions to a sale or gift, it becomes a "loner" item. I don't agree with that. Conditional gifts are quite common. I'm sure most of the married guys reading this gave their girlfriends a ring immediately prior to, or shortly after becoming engaged. Was the ring a gift or a "loner"? It was a gift, made on the condition that a marriage would take place. In most states, if the engagement is called off, the woman has to return the ring. If the marriage takes place, she gets to keep the ring, even if the marriage ends in divorce.

Heir property sometimes comes with the inheiritor having to agree to certain conditions before a property exchange will take place. Before my father died, he tranferred some of his property to me. He made it clear that if I ever wanted to sell the property, that it was to be sold to another family member. Am I free to do with the property as I want? From a legal standpoint, sure. I own it free and clear. Once you own something you own it and you can do whatever you want with it. From a moral and ethical standpoint, no. I gave my word.

If I outright gave someone a piece of gear and they turned around and sold it for the fair market value, would I be upset about it? No. Not unless I had specifically told them that I was giving the gear on condition that it was for their use only. If I didn't spell out any conditions at the time of the exchange, then I believe that I have no reasonable right to expect the receiver to act a certain way after the sale.

I do understand the other point of view. I don't see anything wrong with attaching certain conditions or expectations to a sale or even a gift. I just think it is better to make those conditions and expectations known at the time of the exchange.

Tour2ma

Every once in a while something goes down in the Flea Market that irritates someone and a rules discussion ensues. This time it was Pm's turn. I had mine when I was a relative noob. The issue then, and it still irritates me today, is the first to post, "Gee I don't know, I may be interested," feeling like they have first dibs.

What it all boils down to is neither taking advantage of nor feeling taken advantage of by another member. As has been pointed out, where that line is crossed is going vary from member to member. A first-time poster selling something is not going to have a sense of where this line is anywhere near where the long-term members would put it.

The only ironclad rule I've seen is that we don't tolerate auctioning here. All sales are on a BIN price basis. And that's a good thing IMO...

madmax

Originally posted by raife1
Sometimes a sale is just a sale and sometimes a sale, or even a gift, comes with certain explicit or implied conditions and expectations.

I agree.


BTW, Russman,
I want my amp back.

RuSsMaN

F you and your amp. Especially after you sold those rare LP's I gave you, and didn't give me my cut.

GRRRRRR

criverajr

I feel the same hook a brotha up feeling that Russ had, I have sold items here and on audiogon and feel that if I am selling it here I will leave it posted here until I see no interest here and then go to audiogon. I can tell by the number of post and replies if the item is going to sell. Russ and I made a deal for an amp I sold to him, he used it for a while, then I PM him and wanted to know if he was interested in selling the amp back to me, he sold it back to me for the same price, he could have jacked the price or even sold it to me for less, but the fact of the matter was I was the buyer and he was the seller, so if I paid what he asked and I am very happy with the unit, which I am, enough said. If no one of the parties involved has an issue than to me the sale was a success. I have yet to make a real profit from anything I sold here but I have not screwed anybody either. This is a great forum and with exception of a few bad apples, the status quo is fine.

crusher372

Using myself as an example, I visit the forum infrequently, but have used it religiously to help in equipment selections. Having sold all of my equipment for 1/2 of what I paid I was glad to help another forum member get a great deal. I have never looked at the flea market as a get rich quick scheme. Just a place to look for a great deal or offer a great deal to a fellow forum brother who could use it. If money were the motivating force for my sell than to e-bay it would have gone but money in my case was not the motivation. I do have a few issues with a brand new member listing items and disappearing to never return again but how can you police that. I like the forum as is, but I agree leave the ebay links off. E-bay is more than able to market itself.

Who wants my soap box?;)

steveinaz

2 Things:

1. Let your conscience be your guide
2. Let the buyer beware

I guess as with all deals, stick with people who are trusted buyers/sellers. Look at references from other sales. My own personal way of doing business is, whomever either email's/posts/pm's me and says the words "I'll buy it" first, gets the deal. To me "I'm interested" puts you on the list, but the first person to acknowledge they want it, gets it. I've had too many "I'm interested" deals fall through. First solid commitment gets the sale. It's kind of like bidding vs hitting the "buy it now" button. I would never sell anything "out from under" someone for a better deal. Integrity is crucial.

I enjoy passing a good piece of equipment on to someone who may not otherwise be able to afford it. I make good money, but there's no way I would have paid more for my A3CR than I did. It was a little out of my league--but a great price. My biggest thrill is hearing how satisfied someone is with the condition of the stuff I sell, knowing how stressful it is when you're as anal as I am about the condition of equipment. To me, a scratch, any scratch knocks a piece out of the "mint" or "excellent" conditon category, period. The only flaws acceptable with these categories are fingerprints and dust.

TheGrayGhost

”To me "I'm interested" puts you on the list, but the first person to acknowledge they want it, gets it. I've had too many "I'm interested" deals fall through.”

Good point, but that could get you flamed by the forum guardians that take a different point of view.

steveinaz

I should clarify:

I will give the first "interested" person the first shot at the buy; however, if another member is ready to buy it, I go back to the first member and say "ok, whats up? I've got a person ready to buy" and will usually give them a couple days to think on it. I usually post a list of all the inquiries in the order the offer was received, giving each person some time to make a decision. It can get pretty complicated at times for the buyer AND seller. I do it as fair as I possibly can and accomodate when someone ask for time to get the funds together. What I'm looking for is a SOLID commitment to buy...I'm not really worried about when/how they can pay if its a known member.

Tour2ma

Originally posted by steveinaz
I will give the first "interested" person the first shot at the buy; however, if another member is ready to buy it, I go back to the first member and say "ok, whats up? I've got a person ready to buy"... What I'm looking for is a SOLID commitment to buy...I'm not really worried about when/how they can pay if its a known member.

Very good approach...