Joule Electra Preamp owners?

heiney9

For your ears.......perhaps not for someone else's. Be interesting to list what tubes you've actually tried. There are some stellar 5751's out there. And most sound different and one even sounds exactly like one of the early version of the 3m, bp Sylvania.

Ever listened to the Mazda Silver plate 5751? Wowzers

Look I get it, you guys trust and like the sound it was voiced with, doesn't mean someone can't do something different, rolling tubes that someone might like better.

There are no absolutes in this game and Jesse, I'm surprised you are stating there is with this.

heiney9

Also if what you have in yours sounds so good and is the only combination, why so many variations?

Again, playing devils advocate a bit.

tonyb

Agreed Brock, but narrowing down the preferred options help a lot. You can tube roll, just that knowing some of the best tubes were already included with his pre's are a godsend.

Aside from tubes, there are many other ways to fine tune your systems sound, right ? Nobody ever complains about not being able to roll transistors in the SS gear, your stuck with what ya get, minus of course a will to pay for upgrades.

Tube rolling has it's merits, and drawbacks. Finding the best NOS tubes can get expensive, depending. Tailoring the sound obviously is a benefit. Aside from Joule's first attempt at the LA-150, I've heard nobody ever say they felt a need to tube roll out the tubes that came with their pre's. That's a pretty good accomplishment to please so many different ears with a certain set of tubes if you ask me. So even though his pre's are obviously voiced to his idea of what good sound should sound like, he must have had a pretty good grasp on it to please so many out of the box. In essence you can say, it was a plug and play tubed pre he created, nothing to fuss with, just let it warm up and enjoy. Plug n Play is not a terminology normally associated with tubed gear.

That concept plays well to some and some it won't, I get that. It pains me to see companies I respect, love their sound too, like Cary.....ship out 5k pieces of gear with crap tubes in them to keep costs down. Now your hunting up tubes you have to shell out more coin for and it's hit or miss if they'll sound decent enough for you. That's all I'm sayin'....some prefer that method, some won't, not a big deal.

heiney9

I roll op-amps, but transistors is a bit more than "plug-n-play".

No doubt including some of the better old stock tubes goes a long way. If new gear came with the old stock tubes from the 50-60's, I doubt you'd hear too many people talking about tube rolling on that gear too. There's a reason they don't, hard to source, hard to warranty.

But a kitchen table maker that could charge "extra" to ensure a supply of old stock tubes, that would be neat.

H9

tonyb

True Brock, but many new gear makers don't take the time to do the research for you. That's on your dime, and saves them some dimes also. NOS Tubes aren't going to get more plentiful as time goes on that's for sure. I appreciate having it narrowed down, saves me time and money. Show of hands for anyone who doesn't want to save time and money. lol

heiney9

I think most would. But part of the fun for me is the hunt and experimenting. even if someone told me or sold me what they thought were best for them, I'd still hunt and roll tubes.

But, I also realize not everyone likes to "tinker" with tubes like that.

H9

george daniel

I know that I am a dinosaur here,, but I have rolled a few tubes in my old Joule,, and I keep coming back to the Syl/RCA combo,, not to say there is nothing better,, I have not found it yet. The only pre that I have owned that really responded amazingly well to tube rolling was the EE Minimax and the Dared,, the Minimax was incredible to rolling!!
Thank you kindly

heiney9

I agree George, the Mini-Max was a rollers dream. The Avant is that way also, to a lesser degree. But the Avant uses 8 tubes, so the combinations are enough to keep one up nights....lol.

Personally, I like to change it up a bit once in awhile and tube rolling is just subtle enough to do that without changing the entire character of the piece of gear.

Still amazes me something 50-60 years old not only survived, but still operates at its highest potential today just like it did back then.

H9

tonyb

heiney9 wrote: »

Still amazes me something 50-60 years old not only survived, but still operates at its highest potential today just like it did back then.

H9

Wish I could say the same for myself.

F1nut

heiney9 wrote: »

For your ears.......perhaps not for someone else's. Be interesting to list what tubes you've actually tried. There are some stellar 5751's out there. And most sound different and one even sounds exactly like one of the early version of the 3m, bp Sylvania.

Ever listened to the Mazda Silver plate 5751? Wowzers

Look I get it, you guys trust and like the sound it was voiced with, doesn't mean someone can't do something different, rolling tubes that someone might like better.

There are no absolutes in this game and Jesse, I'm surprised you are stating there is with this.

Ah no, did not try that one.

It's like this, after trying 4 or 5 others with none coming close and my being extremely pleased with everything about the Sylvania and RCA combo in the Joule I had there comes a time to call it a day. That and the overwhelming fact that other Joule owners found the same makes easy to realize what you have is as good as it gets.

tonyb

Does it matter ? Roll tubes if you want, don't if your happy. Doesn't have to be a big deal.

I'll wait for others with Joule pre's to experiment, then they can post up what they find they like better. So far, like I said and Jessie confirmed, most fine what was in there to be pretty darn good. So do other owners.

Another pre, another circuit design may be more cooperative with a bigger variety of tubes one may want to roll, but for these particular pre's, they seemed to nail it from the gitgo. That's not to say one might find a different variation of the 6350's or 5751's they might like slightly better.

Your a different animal Brock, and I mean that in a good way. You like to change things up every so often, insert a different flavor from time to time. Myself....I like the same flavor, one that I like anyway, and want to keep it consistent.

heiney9

I get it and I'm certainly not intending to say one way is right/wrong. Mostly I am asking just for conversation.

I do like to mix things up a bit, things get stale once in awhile, and we get complacent about the sound. Many times I've swapped some tubes and really dug them only to go back to what I had before and was "re-amazed" at the initial sound. Sometimes the style of music will dictate a tube change.

I like tweaking with the tubes, but if I had to settle on one set, I think I could. I don't change tubes as often as it seems. Many times it's just experimentation and I want to save my ultimate combo's for special listening sessions since some tubes are so hard to find/expensive.

Right now I have a quad of very early ECC82 Siemens long plates (1954/1955) w/the slant D getter marked Telefunken but with Siemens Munich codes in black between the pins. What a fantastic tube. I only play those on special occasions and not for everyday use. Same for the 1956 Valvo Hamburg long plate ECC83.

H9

heiney9

I'm also a nut, because I chase tubes all over the place on a daily basis. Many don't want to put that time and effort.

I literally check Ebay 10 times a day, but I have snagged some really good deals that way too on BIN.

But, I have slowed way down, mostly because I have or have had most all of the tubes I'd be interested in hearing. And frankly it can get a bit too tedious.

Time to enjoy the fruit of the labor of tracking said tubes down.

WagnerRC

Here is another part of history.

http://www.audioasylumtrader.com/ca/listing/Amplifier-Tube/Joule-Electra/VZN100-mkV/Musicwood-custom-mono-OTL-amps/169293

F1nut

Sweeeeeeeeet!!!

kharp1

I put a Valvo 12ax7 in place of the 5751 on my 100 and liked some of the sonics, however, overall it boosted distortion to a point that was unacceptable to me. Wasn't a lot, but could hear it "around the edges" so I switched it out for a Raytheon 5751.

JuanR

I own the LAP 150A - phono,

When I received it, it came with the following tubes:

Power Supply:
GE 6EM7/EA7 - qty.2 - CHANGED to RCA 6EM7

RCA OA2WA - qty.2

Pre:
Sylvania 6350 - qty.2 CHANGED to Sylvania Gold Brand Black Plates
Electro Harmonix 6C45Pi - qty.2

phonostage:
UNKNOWN BRAND 6DJ8 - qty.2 CHANGED to BRIMAR 6DJ8
Sylvania 6350 - qty.1 CHANGED to Sylvania Gold Brand Black Plates
GE JG 5751 2 Mica Grey Plates - qty.3 CHANGED to GE JG 3 Mica BP's


The improvement was SIGNIFICANT - everything improved - Soundstage - Vocals, etc.

I do want to change to an all SYLVANIA tube Joule - so I am waiting for my Sylvania fat bottle 6EM7's to arrive, I already have the Sylvania OA2's, and I have to yet order the Sylvania 5751 3M BP's...waiting on a deal...Got any @heiney9

I want to try an ALL Sylvania tube set since I read that Mr. Barber designed the Joules around his favorite tube - Sylvanias...so like you guys suggest that why change the tubes, i'm following that advice and trying all Sylvanias...

Any Tube Suggestions Brock?

I own 1 Raytheon 5751 Windmill - so I need another pair, waiting on the right time to buy...also will be down the line..

I want to try some Tungsol 5751's and RCA 5751's but that's down the line...

I have some Telefunken 6DJ8's and Bugle Boys as well to roll in place of the Brimars...but the Brimars sound so darn good!!!!

george daniel

Briars have just the right amount of sparkle

JuanR

erniejade

Looks like the 150 A got some fresh tubes!!!!!!

F1nut

I cannot recall hearing he ever used all Sylvania tubes. In fact, I'm sure he didn't. I no longer have the Joule manual, but IIRC it was 6EM7 or 13EM7 - RCA, OA2 - RCA, 6350 - RCA, 5751 - Sylvania.

What you heard about Sylvania being his favorite is correct, but you misunderstood the comment. The 5751 has the greatest influence on the sonics and that is why it should be a Sylvania.

JuanR

I don't know what happened to my super long post...but here goes another try..

My Joule LAP150A came with the following tubes:

Power Supply:
GE 6EM7's qty.2 - REPLACED with RCA 6EM7's FAT Bottles
RCA OA2's qty.2

PRE:
Sylvania 6350 BP qty.2 REPLACED with Sylvania Gold Brand 6350
Electro Harmonix 6C45Pi qty.2

Phonostage:
GE Jan 5751 2 Mica Grey Plates qty.3 REPLACED with GE JG 3M BP's
Unbranded 6DJ8's qty.2 REPLACED with Brimar 6DJ8's
Sylvania 6350 BP qty.1REPLACED with Sylvania Gold Brand 6350

The change was absolutely SIGNIFICANT - better soundstage and vocals..

I want to try an ALL Sylvania tubed Joule, the favorite tube of Mr Barber and what he designed the Joule after..

I ordered Sylvania fat bottle 6EM7's - I already have the 0A2's...

I need Sylvania 3 Mica black plates qty.3

I own 1 Raytheon Windmill 5751...need 2 more

also want toi try some Tungsol 5751's and RCA 5751's

JuanR

Maybe not all Sylvanias is what he had.,..I just like to see if I can get better Synergy...

JuanR

I don't know what happened to my super long post...but here goes another try..

My Joule LAP150A came with the following tubes:

Power Supply:
GE 6EM7's qty.2 - REPLACED with RCA 6EM7's FAT Bottles
RCA OA2's qty.2

PRE:
Sylvania 6350 BP qty.2 REPLACED with Sylvania Gold Brand 6350
Electro Harmonix 6C45Pi qty.2

Phonostage:
GE Jan 5751 2 Mica Grey Plates qty.3 REPLACED with GE JG 3M BP'sUnbranded 6DJ8's qty.2 REPLACED with Brimar 6DJ8's
Sylvania 6350 BP qty.1REPLACED with Sylvania Gold Brand 6350

The change was absolutely SIGNIFICANT - better soundstage and vocals..

I want to try an ALL Sylvania tubed Joule, the favorite tube of Mr Barber and what he designed the Joule after..

I ordered Sylvania fat bottle 6EM7's - I already have the 0A2's...

I need Sylvania 3 Mica black plates qty.3

I own 1 Raytheon Windmill 5751...need 2 more

also want to try some Tungsol 5751's and RCA 5751's

dhart86

george daniel wrote: »

Yep,, Sylvania TMBP in the front and RCA in the back,,both 5751's,, Mr Barber made it easy!

George in Jud's circuit configuration, are the follower tubes in the back?

george daniel

Yep,,he specifies a Sylvania( front) and an RCA ( rear) as the Mu follower,, 5751's,, as he stated in the manual. That is what I have in mine.

WagnerRC

I am loving this topic. I thank everyone for the comments.

JuanR

Anyone have experience with RCA 6350 black plates tube HS-getter Triple Mica? @heiney9

heiney9

No experience, but early RCA's have always been rock solid and great overall sound.

mikeyb128

JuanR wrote: »

Anyone have experience with RCA 6350 black plates tube HS-getter Triple Mica? @heiney9

I have quite a bit of experience with rca's. I have some triple mica black plates, the top mica has smooth edges such as yours, and I experienced some microphonics with them. I bought a NOS box of eight, tested as nos, every tube in the box was noisey. These were 1960 5814A. I was able to use a tube damper on the top mica and that helped a lot.

They sounded fabulous despite some minor tube ring when switching inputs on my Cary pre amp. The click of the relay would cause a slight ring.

In my experience you want to get the triple mica where the top mica is serrated.



5814 only as an example.