Leadership

PSOVLSK · July 2015

A charlatan is a type of leader, no? Both have leadership skills.

Plus, we are talking extremes going from charlatan to leader...there's a lot of space in between.

Regardless, your point is well taken.

Ron Temple · July 2015

Mr. Temple will review your comment and chastisement, but reserves the right of sarcasm for future threads.

tophatjohnny · July 2015

tonyb wrote: »

tophatjohnny wrote: »

Two words that led me to the top of every sales position I have ever held (and made a crapload of money using these 2 words........are ya ready????????????...........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................Follow Me!!!

Last time I listened to those 2 words i woke up with horrible hangover, next to an ugly chick 2 states away.

You didn't tell me I was ugly when we were leaving the bar??????? And you knew I wasn't a chick?? Man, the thanks??

Moose68Bash · July 2015

PSOVLSK wrote: »

A charlatan is a type of leader, no? Both have leadership skills.

Plus, we are talking extremes going from charlatan to leader...there's a lot of space in between.

Regardless, your point is well taken.

Yes, I guess most of us fall somewhere between the extremes on this spectrum.

Perhaps, it's the monsters on one end of the spectrum and the saints on the other that give rise to these kinds of debates, which lead some to declare them sophistry.

sucks2beme · July 2015

And a lot of leaders we consider to be great men most likely weren't.
Sometimes the results make the man. It's a combo of what you were born with,
challenges that formed you, and being in the right place at the right time.
Anything missing, and it doesn't happen.

tonyb · July 2015

Not sure a Charlatan would classify as a leader. I would imagine they use deceptive practices more so than leadership abilities.

Some classify a good leader as one with good intentions also, that's not necessarily the case. Some were born to be led around by the nose, to kneel before others. Some others were born to pull others by the nose. Yet still others have no idea which is their destiny until challenged.

Complacency is a form of allowing ones self to be led around by the nose, of which I see an awful lot of these days.

I've been in a leadership position since I was 16. One thing I've learned is you have to be true to your word or those you lead will lose faith in you.

Moose68Bash · July 2015

sucks2beme wrote: »

And a lot of leaders we consider to be great men most likely weren't.

Another interesting distinction looms before us:

Some people are great.

Some people are good.

The overlapping set of the great AND the good is a very small subset indeed.

For example: Franklin Delano Roosevelt was a great man, but one can argue about how good he was. One might contend that Eleanor Roosevelt was good -- albeit she was, perhaps, not as great a leader as her husband.

Abraham Lincoln was both great and good, in my humble opinion.

Both Roosevelt and Lincoln were leaders, and as leaders go, they both distinguished themselves in times of great turmoil and need, and that makes them great leaders -- again, in my humble opinion.

Polkie2009 · July 2015

I liked Teddie Roosevelt's take charge approach, the man wasn't afraid to take charge and lead from the front, unlike other leaders now who want to lead from the rear.

Moose68Bash · July 2015

Polkie2009 wrote: »

I liked Teddie Roosevelt's take charge approach, the man wasn't afraid to take charge and lead from the front, unlike other leaders now who want to lead from the rear.

Yes, another great leader.

For his conservation work, I would also say he was definitely a good man.

tonyb · July 2015

Funny, you guys are equating good men and politics.....a rare bird not often seen and may in fact be extinct.

nooshinjohn · July 2015

We are all leaders and followers at many different points along the path of our lives. I personally however, will not follow anyone that cannot also be led, as that is when arrogance sets in and that always leads to a bad end.

vmaxer · July 2015

Big difference between a leader and a boss.

sucks2beme · July 2015

And a difference between a leader and the guy in charge.
Sometimes the guy in the driver's seat was the best bean counter.
Steve Jobs was a leader. The guys filling in between bouts were
bean counters. Welcome to business in the modern times.

tonyb · July 2015

Washington was of course a great leader but leadership abilities are the same in both good and evil men.

If you can define leadership as one who can get people to follow them, achieve set goals, then history is full of such men. It's not the goals that are in question, it's the ability to get there and bring others along on the same path.

nooshinjohn · July 2015

tonyb wrote: »

Washington was of course a great leader but leadership abilities are the same in both good and evil men.

If you can define leadership as one who can get people to follow them, achieve set goals, then history is full of such men. It's not the goals that are in question, it's the ability to get there and bring others along on the same path.

The world we live in is truly upside down. Kids today look to thugs as role models while there is a movement afoot to remove Jefferson and Washington from history because they owned slaves. Some schools now teach that we never set foot on the moon...

Leadership qualities are being removed from education. Individual merit and achievement are being replaced with a Borg-like devotion to the collective. We need leaders today more than ever

polkfarmboy · July 2015

This summer I am leading the way with primary color shirts complimented with things like like garment died peach, yellow, teal grean, moonbeam, red and baby blue skinny jeans.... high five for my ice cold heineken you bashterds!

westmassguy · July 2015

xcapri79 wrote: »

It is somewhat puzzling that the worst dictators in the history of the world are brought up as examples of leaders, but a truly great leader such as George Washington, perhaps the greatest leader ever, has not yet been mentioned.

I urge everyone to read, 1776 by David McCullough.

Outstanding book, by an outstanding author .

Moose68Bash · July 2015

You have to wonder: Where would we be today if Washington had been killed in battle early in the Revolutionary War?

nooshinjohn · July 2015

Moose68Bash wrote: »

You have to wonder: Where would we be today if Washington had been killed in battle early in the Revolutionary War?

I have no doubt we would all be speaking German.

nooshinjohn · July 2015

On the subject of leadership, seems it is gone at every level. I had an incident at work this week that may have me calling the EEOC....

Kurt300 · July 2015

I'd say it's both nature and nurture. A few semi-random things I've experienced that have helped me develop leadership skills - military officer training (includes discipline and understanding organization and interdependencies that are vital to success), being a fan of Star Trek (including developing and adhering to a set of guiding principals, even in the face of conflict) and Robert A Heinlein (including developing and valuing competencies in yourself and others, as well as more guiding principals), personally experiencing good and bad leaders and remembering what it feels like to be under both.

I think some of the most important things in leading well is treating people well and fairly, listening to their ideas and allowing them to see the importance of constant improvement using everyone's ideas with proper credit and respect. Getting top level discretionary effort from the team comes from making a good culture, where people feel valued, safe and empowered in relation to their contributions. It's equally important to reform or eliminate poor performers who drag down everyone's motivation if they are not dealt with proactively.

Lots more on this subject, but I'm gonna rest now...

[Deleted User] · July 2015

Kurt. How do you approach continuous conflict? Conflict is common, but from a leadership position and the derivative of that conflict is one person.

What say you?

Halen

Kurt300 · August 2015

halenhoang wrote: »

Kurt. How do you approach continuous conflict? Conflict is common, but from a leadership position and the derivative of that conflict is one person.

What say you?

Halen

I once took over the mgmt of an IT division that had some long-standing personal conflicts that immediately were brought to me (before I even actually took over). In my first week, I went over several "norms" we were going to follow. For conflict: if people had trouble with each other, they should talk directly to each other about it, really listen to each other, and try to resolve it. If they could not resolve it themselves, they should BOTH come see me, TOGETHER. We would figure it out. But I told everyone that starting now, coming to me alone and talking badly about another team member was only going to make me view the person talking to me in a lesser light. I had to referee very few problems after that, but of course those were the tougher ones.

Clearly communicating the total value that someone is offering in light of their being the common cause of much conflict helped resolve some other issues. A person may be brilliant, but the net value they offer plunges if they can't get along with people. I just let them know exactly the way I viewed it, as the key first step, and tried to get them to see it, too.

Example: In the 90's, I had one very smart staff member who made people around him feel stupid, I pointed out that in my view, he currently was the least valuable person on our team. He was very defensive, and I explained further. I acknowledged that he was probably the smartest person in our entire area, but noted that both our staff and our customers would do anything to avoid asking him questions. I told him he had a huge innate advantage over the rest of the staff that he was wasting, as it was not currently worth anything. But he could immediately change his attitude and become MUCH more valuable, whereas others could not suddenly become as brilliant as him, no matter how much effort they spent.

This is all IMO, of course. And any resemblance or application of any of this to the current cast of characters on this site is not only purely coincidental, but unintended and wrong.

tonyb · August 2015

Good points Kurt.

Leadership though isn't a one trick pony. There isn't one right or wrong way to become a good.....or bad leader. Every leader has their own unique style and ways of accomplishing their goals.

Teaching people to become adaptable to these various styles of leadership is a lesson that would carry them all through out their working years.

Leadership

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