Subwoofer with 1.2tl
VCoak
Posts: 200
I am thinking of adding a subwoofer to enhance some bass at low level volumes. My system is strictly two channel. Not looking for earth shattering but just a little chest thump.
Pros and cons???
Pros and cons???
W4S SX-1000, Adcom gfp-750, Polk 1.2tl, W4S DAC 2 DSDse, 2012 mac mini (mod), JRivers ver. 19, WD Cloud NAS 2 t.b., Monster Cable AVS-2000 signature, Doug's Alpha I/C & Doug's biwire 6' speaker cables
Comments
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I would recommend using a subwoofer for home theater, and I have done that with 1C and 2.3TL speakers before. I wouldn't recommend using one for two channel use for most types of music though. I would always turn my home theater receiver to pure direct mode when listening to two channel music with SDAs. Subwoofers can be difficult to crossover and integrate with already full range speakers because of room interactions and bass cancellation. You would have to get a powerful subwoofer to make a difference and have chest thumping bass beyond what the 1.2TLs already have, but it can make a difference if done right.
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There is no benefit to using a sub with a set of 1.2TL's that are properly set up. After the updates and mods have been done, I don't even use one for HT anymore.The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
“When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson -
The most recent mods were mortite around the speakers and this improved bass. Air leak test held just under 2 seconds by gently pushing on the passive.
At loud volumes bass is amazing. But the wife as we know.... turn it down..W4S SX-1000, Adcom gfp-750, Polk 1.2tl, W4S DAC 2 DSDse, 2012 mac mini (mod), JRivers ver. 19, WD Cloud NAS 2 t.b., Monster Cable AVS-2000 signature, Doug's Alpha I/C & Doug's biwire 6' speaker cables -
The most recent mods were mortite around the speakers and this improved bass. Air leak test held just under 2 seconds by gently pushing on the passive.
At loud volumes bass is amazing. But the wife as we know.... turn it down..
You have another issue then. Your leak down should have held for 3 to 5 seconds.
The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
“When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson -
When I upgraded to with Vr3 I used mortite on all components including the back. Any thoughts on the where else to look???
W4S SX-1000, Adcom gfp-750, Polk 1.2tl, W4S DAC 2 DSDse, 2012 mac mini (mod), JRivers ver. 19, WD Cloud NAS 2 t.b., Monster Cable AVS-2000 signature, Doug's Alpha I/C & Doug's biwire 6' speaker cables -
When I upgraded to with Vr3 I used mortite on all components including the back. Any thoughts on the where else to look???
I would start with the mortite itself. That has been superseded by Armacell, and even carries the DK seal of approval.The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
“When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson -
Will look into this. Thank you
W4S SX-1000, Adcom gfp-750, Polk 1.2tl, W4S DAC 2 DSDse, 2012 mac mini (mod), JRivers ver. 19, WD Cloud NAS 2 t.b., Monster Cable AVS-2000 signature, Doug's Alpha I/C & Doug's biwire 6' speaker cables -
Armacell any recommendations on their products?W4S SX-1000, Adcom gfp-750, Polk 1.2tl, W4S DAC 2 DSDse, 2012 mac mini (mod), JRivers ver. 19, WD Cloud NAS 2 t.b., Monster Cable AVS-2000 signature, Doug's Alpha I/C & Doug's biwire 6' speaker cables
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http://www.homedepot.com/p/Armacell-2-in-x-30-ft-R-1-Foam-Insulation-Tape-TAP18230/100539553
Here you go.The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
“When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson -
Thank you sir!W4S SX-1000, Adcom gfp-750, Polk 1.2tl, W4S DAC 2 DSDse, 2012 mac mini (mod), JRivers ver. 19, WD Cloud NAS 2 t.b., Monster Cable AVS-2000 signature, Doug's Alpha I/C & Doug's biwire 6' speaker cables
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Escondido home depot here I come LOLW4S SX-1000, Adcom gfp-750, Polk 1.2tl, W4S DAC 2 DSDse, 2012 mac mini (mod), JRivers ver. 19, WD Cloud NAS 2 t.b., Monster Cable AVS-2000 signature, Doug's Alpha I/C & Doug's biwire 6' speaker cables
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did you add this to the crossover plate or just the passive sub?W4S SX-1000, Adcom gfp-750, Polk 1.2tl, W4S DAC 2 DSDse, 2012 mac mini (mod), JRivers ver. 19, WD Cloud NAS 2 t.b., Monster Cable AVS-2000 signature, Doug's Alpha I/C & Doug's biwire 6' speaker cables
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to ALL drivers and the crossover plate/terminal plate... make certain to completely remove the Mortite from everything before you apply the Armacell. You will need to use an exacto knife or pair of scissors to cut it into 12" wide strips.The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
“When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson -
Got it. Looks I have a project this weekend. Better than cleaning the leaves out of the pool. Damn santa ana winds.
W4S SX-1000, Adcom gfp-750, Polk 1.2tl, W4S DAC 2 DSDse, 2012 mac mini (mod), JRivers ver. 19, WD Cloud NAS 2 t.b., Monster Cable AVS-2000 signature, Doug's Alpha I/C & Doug's biwire 6' speaker cables -
Do you have a set of Larry's rings on these?The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
“When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson -
Sorry for the delay, No I don't.W4S SX-1000, Adcom gfp-750, Polk 1.2tl, W4S DAC 2 DSDse, 2012 mac mini (mod), JRivers ver. 19, WD Cloud NAS 2 t.b., Monster Cable AVS-2000 signature, Doug's Alpha I/C & Doug's biwire 6' speaker cables
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Found one of the inserts for the passive woofer to be stripped in the wood.W4S SX-1000, Adcom gfp-750, Polk 1.2tl, W4S DAC 2 DSDse, 2012 mac mini (mod), JRivers ver. 19, WD Cloud NAS 2 t.b., Monster Cable AVS-2000 signature, Doug's Alpha I/C & Doug's biwire 6' speaker cables
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Hurricane nuts come highly recommended, but I would see if somebody has a set of those rings first.
Between the armacell and the rings, your need for a sub will be over.The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
“When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson -
Don't forget the add good spikes.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
OOOPS!!!
forgot the spikes.
The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
“When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson -
And the Bass Brace.
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And the Bass Brace.
It was my understanding that the brace was not needed when spikes were deployed.
The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
“When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson -
I am thinking of adding a subwoofer to enhance some bass at low level volumes. My system is strictly two channel. Not looking for earth shattering but just a little chest thump.
Pros and cons???
How big is your room? Room size will determine if you need subs regardless of speaker type. I'm pushing 8,000 cubic feet and need subs to shore up the low end.Salk SoundScape 8's * Audio Research Reference 3 * Bottlehead Eros Phono * Park's Audio Budgie SUT * Krell KSA-250 * Harmonic Technology Pro 9+ * Signature Series Sonore Music Server w/Deux PS * Roon * Gustard R26 DAC / Singxer SU-6 DDC * Heavy Plinth Lenco L75 Idler Drive * AA MG-1 Linear Air Bearing Arm * AT33PTG/II & Denon 103R * Richard Gray 600S * NHT B-12d subs * GIK Acoustic Treatments * Sennheiser HD650 * -
Just a quick look at Crutchfield subwoofer specs shows that they are not capable of delivering low frequencies that the 1.2TL's are capable of.
Stock TL's are rated down to 10hz up to 26,000 hz as I remember, before mods. These subs are nowhere close to that.
Properly set up and dialed in, a sub should not even be a thought here.
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-dVolK076L3K/shopsearch/home_subwoofer.html?awcp=1t1&awcr=28884248483&awdv=c&awkw=home stereo subwoofer&awmt=p&awnw=gThe Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
“When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson -
SCompRacer wrote: »How big is your room? Room size will determine if you need subs regardless of speaker type. I'm pushing 8,000 cubic feet and need subs to shore up the low end.
The overall frequency response on the 1.2TLs was 10 Hz to 26 KHz. However, the -3db limits were 27 Hz to 20 kHz. I do believe the -3db limits are improved on the low end somewhat by physical modifications. I have noticed the bass response is quicker and tighter on my SDAs after being upgraded, but have no way of knowing to what extent.
To do better in bass output, I suspect a large output subwoofer would help fill out the bass in most larger rooms simply because they displace more air than an SDA design or a conventional tower speaker can. An SVS PB12-Plus at 14 Hz at a -3db limit can shake a room seriously, and beyond what SDAs are capable of in terms of sheer physical bass response. A PB13-Ultra would be even better. I had a couple of SVS subwoofers at one time and found they were too much for me.
I wouldn't listen to two channel music like that. Others might want to try it though.
Good suggestions on doing the upgrades to the 1.2TLs first and seeing where that takes them. A ported SVS subwoofer takes up a lot of floor space.
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nooshinjohn wrote: »
They should not be used together and my experience is that spikes are the better choice.
Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
I had little children in 1990 when they were new, so once in the habit I have always used the bracesPOLK SDA 2.3 TLS BOUGHT NEW IN 1990, Gimpod/Sonic Caps/Mills RDO-198
POLK CSI-A6 POLK MONITOR 70'S ONKYO TX NR-808 SONY CDP-333ES
PIONEER PL-510A SONY BDP S5100
POLK SDA 1C BOUGHT USED 2011,Gimpod/Sonic Caps/Mills RDO-194
ONKYO HT RC-360 SONY BDP S590 TECHNICS SL BD-1 -
That upper stability is what Polk intended when they came out with the bass brace, which was really aimed at making them earthquake resistant for folks in places like CA. The kit also included metal bars (think primitive outriggers) that one would install in place of the screw in feet. Anyway, as a side result Polk discovered that the brace also helped with tightening the bass. When I had the bass braces in use I was never really happy with them as I could still move the speaker rather easily in an arc more or less with the brace acting as a pivot point. IMO, the spikes offer greater overall stability and better bass.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
I use an 18'' def tech sub with my 1.2tl's and I'm happy with the results. As was mentioned you don't actually "need" one but a quality well integrated sub certainly does help out with the bottom end. Don't expect a 10-12'' ht sub to add anything as was noted the 1.2s already go low.
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