MartyCube... Lets get ready to CRANK THE BASS!!!!!!!!

124

Comments

  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    oldrocker wrote: »
    And the Kracken has FINALLY been released... :D

    Have fun with it....

    I'm home with my kido an hour before my wife gets home every night.....

    DANCE PARTY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    and tonight shes got to run to the store.....


    Might have to watch a bit o War of the Worlds......... just the bass heavy parts hehehe......
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • oldrocker
    oldrocker Posts: 2,590
    I am so glad that thing is working out for you...
    Rock on!!!!!
  • oldrocker
    oldrocker Posts: 2,590
    I just remembered that my wife is hitting the gym after work tonight, I was invited. I now know why I declined as it just might be time to blow the cobwebs out of my SDA's for a few.... >:)
  • oldrocker
    oldrocker Posts: 2,590
    Stay safe in the morning, don't know if you folks have as much fog as we do here. Man it's thick, can hardly see past the front porch.
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    edited March 2015
    Been tweaking things a bit more. Here is where I stand as of tonight after doing the following:

    1. Re-Run Audyssey
    2. Tweak the levels of the sub to equal things out a bit more
    3. Run REW
    4. Build custom EQ based on my REW graphs
    5. Load into MiniDSP
    6. Re-measure

    So this is what we are looking at after #6. Keep in mind my AVR only has Audyssey 2EQ, so I'm QUITE limited above 80hz.

    Sub only:

    A6E77A22-900A-492D-9BFB-4682AFB1040F.jpg

    Sub + all mains

    7F9BFE8B-06EF-41FE-BC03-A8E65B33F319.jpg


    I'm likely picking up another EQ piece that will allow me to remove the MiniDSP and get a flatter response for now.

    Initially I wanted the MiniDSP to set the highpass on the sub and also additional EQ's. This other device will let me get the EQ and additionally the subsonic filter on the Dayton amp matches what I was using with the MiniDSP and keeps the driver safe.

    I will still be able to play with a house curve with the other EQ device and its not as flexible to input the numbers yourself, BUUTTT its a better device from what I've read and seen...

    Plus I am looking more for a set and forget type deal. This is that.

    For my 2 channel I may well utilize the MiniDSP to EQ things, or I've seen folks stack the MiniDSP on top this other item. But I dont plan to do that as it ends up with too many things in the chain, and too much to buy decent cables for all those connections.
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • ZLTFUL
    ZLTFUL Posts: 5,640
    So clandestine Dan... ;)
    "Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."

    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    edited March 2015
    My main issues I see right now which are hard to see in those graphs is the crossover point for the subs and mains is causing a major dip.

    Now thats where I may have to come up with some "unique" solutions to fix the dip that occurs there.

    The reason I say "Unique" is that the lowest AVR can set the LFE is at 80hz. The LSi 15's are MORE than comfortable down to 60hz as shown by Ryans graphs.

    I cant set the LFE that low in the AVR. I can with either the MiniDSP or the manual crossover on the amp.

    I think the MiniDSP is going to be the better bet to set it as I can specify how steep of a drop it is (12 db, 24 db, 48 db) which hopefully can help the dip.

    So throw out some suggestions. I have a couple more hours to play with things tomorrow while my wife and daughter go see a movie so lets put together some things to try and see what we can come up with.

    Currently I need to take some more measurement to double check myself as well.

    I am going to take a 3 measurements in "Stereo" tomorrow as follows:

    1. Sub Only
    2. Mains Only
    3. Mains + Sub

    That graph should help illustrate better what I am looking at with the Frequency Response.
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • ZLTFUL
    ZLTFUL Posts: 5,640
    Hey Dan, just a thought (and probably not ideal but worth a shot), why not run the fronts as large/full range and see what happens?
    "Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."

    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    ZLTFUL wrote: »
    Hey Dan, just a thought (and probably not ideal but worth a shot), why not run the fronts as large/full range and see what happens?

    In order to do that I have to turn "double" bass on and then its tends to bloat the low end from what I rememeber. I may try that for giggles tonight and run a sweep to see.

    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • ZLTFUL
    ZLTFUL Posts: 5,640
    I am hating your AVR more and more each day! ;)
    "Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."

    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    ZLTFUL wrote: »
    I am hating your AVR more and more each day! ;)

    LOL, can you imagine how much I like it :smile:

    PS my free time just died as my niece is sick so the 4 of them (MIL, Niece, Daughter, Wife) are not going to the movies.....

    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • ZLTFUL
    ZLTFUL Posts: 5,640
    BOO!
    "Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."

    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    I saved my REW sweeps because I thought I might want some other pics of the graphs.

    This is what I am talking about, notice that from 80-90hz the decent dip. I'm trying to combat that if possible.

    I do want to take a sweep of just the main L/R + sub instead of All channel stereo. I think that codec might be throwing things off since my surrounds (which are closer to the mic) are also set at 100hz instead of 80.

    2015-03-31%20After%20MiniDSP%20correction%20applied%202%20all%20-%20truncated.jpg
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    edited April 2015
    So quick update. I haven't had time to run more graphs but for giggles and to appease @ZLTFUL so he would stop blowing up my phone with texts (kidding bro :wink: ) I moved the Fronts from 80hz down to 40. I left the LFE at 80 and since they were not "full range" the double bass setting is still off.

    I'm not sure what this will look like graph wise but since its raining here today and I cant put another 20k on my bike with Skye tonight I am going to try and run some more sweeps to see how its improved my setup...

    I'd also like to publicly THANK @ZLTFUL for selling me the AS EQ1 he no longer needs since his new Denon X4100 has XT32 and SubEQ. It arrived later on Monday instead of Saturday so I haven't had time to set it up.

    My goal is to hopefully be able to use JUST the SVS unit to dial in my sub. I am going to pull the MiniDSP from the loop and see how the SVS does.

    I know one person whose running BOTH these items in his setup and he told me he uses the SVS to dial things in and get them flat and then the MiniDSP to create a shelf house curve. This *may* be the route I take, but I'm not sure.

    For now the AS-EQ1 will keep me sub at least dialed in good while I wait till my next AVR gets purchased for XT32 and SubEQ which will render the AS-EQ1 duplicative and it will get sold. It looks like my new AVR will be purchased either late this year, or possibly waiting for 2016 new models to drop the prices on the 2015's I'm looking at now. I'm also not sure if I should wait for HDCP 2.2 and HDMI 2.0 or not, but thats another thread.

    I will post graphs when I have them of the new 40hz mains crossover (hopefully tonight), and then take screenshots of the pre and post Audyssey graphs once I have them (likely next weekend at the earliest).
    Post edited by EndersShadow on
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • ZLTFUL
    ZLTFUL Posts: 5,640
    Looking forward to seeing how these changes work out for you.

    Also, don't be surprised if the Sub EQ is crossed over a little higher than you suspect. I found with the Denon that Audessey likes to roll it off a little higher to keep the transition from subs to mains flatter.
    "Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."

    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
  • oldrocker
    oldrocker Posts: 2,590
    After reading all the data and analyzing everything that has been posted.
    I have to say, I have NO clue what you guys are talking about. "deer in the headlight" look here. So if I may offer one little tidbit, Crank it and rock the foundation..... B)
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    ZLTFUL wrote: »
    Looking forward to seeing how these changes work out for you.

    Also, don't be surprised if the Sub EQ is crossed over a little higher than you suspect. I found with the Denon that Audessey likes to roll it off a little higher to keep the transition from subs to mains flatter.

    Can SubEQ be crossed over HIGHER than the LFE setting in the AVR?

    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    edited April 2015
    oldrocker wrote: »
    After reading all the data and analyzing everything that has been posted.
    I have to say, I have NO clue what you guys are talking about. "deer in the headlight" look here. So if I may offer one little tidbit, Crank it and rock the foundation..... B)

    :smile: . Basically looking for a flat response if possible with the device so that the SPL doesnt vary much between frequencies...

    Think how the commercials used to be MUCH louder than the TV show so you had to keep turning it down when they came on...

    Kinda like that.....

    A shelf/house curve is basically a linear boost the lower you go to a certain frequency, any anywhere after that the response is FLAT.... here is a decent example picture

    1284d1163539365-house-curve-options-80-curved-flat.jpg

    And a BUNCH of good reading here


    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • ZLTFUL
    ZLTFUL Posts: 5,640
    Dan,
    Here is my understanding as the AS-EQ1 works slightly different than it does on the Denon.
    When you are running your setup program, it gets to the sub section. The AS-EQ1 takes over at that point to EQ the subs. When it is complete, it sends a "flat" return to your AVR's room correction for the full LFE range. I think that is 180hz tops on down?

    You will have an easier time with it than I would since you have REW and the mic to test between tweaks.
    "Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."

    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    ZLTFUL wrote: »
    Dan,
    Here is my understanding as the AS-EQ1 works slightly different than it does on the Denon.
    When you are running your setup program, it gets to the sub section. The AS-EQ1 takes over at that point to EQ the subs. When it is complete, it sends a "flat" return to your AVR's room correction for the full LFE range. I think that is 180hz tops on down?

    You will have an easier time with it than I would since you have REW and the mic to test between tweaks.

    Yeah but 32 points aint exactly a quick thing to do either lol.....

    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • oldrocker
    oldrocker Posts: 2,590
    Thanks for the info and description. I wish I knew what you guys so easily know... :o
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    oldrocker wrote: »
    Thanks for the info and description. I wish I knew what you guys so easily know... :o

    I wouldn't say "know"..... I'd say I'm fast with the google :smile:....

    And I post a lot of different places to get my info..... what can I say... I get around :wink:
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • oldrocker
    oldrocker Posts: 2,590
    My jealousy is the best form of flattery I can give... at my age. D'oh...
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    edited June 2015
    I realized I never posted a "after" graph from running the SVS AS-EQ1 I got from Ryan....

    The sub blends in much better with my mains, however there is still a problem around the 90hz range that hopefully my next AVR will solve since my AVR EQ is now the limiting factor.

    Sorry for the crappy picture.... my laptop blew up recently and so this is from a text I sent Ryan after I ran the EQ. I will find a better picture later tonight to post.

    4B409E3E-2418-4D0D-93A3-450E14340A15.jpg
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • ZLTFUL
    ZLTFUL Posts: 5,640
    I can't remember if I ever asked you Dan, did you do the DB840s on the 15s?
    "Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."

    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    ZLTFUL wrote: »
    I can't remember if I ever asked you Dan, did you do the DB840s on the 15s?

    Long time ago
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • ZLTFUL
    ZLTFUL Posts: 5,640
    Ok. I would think that would have fixed any hole but like you said...maybe it just is your AVR that is the limiting factor here with the crossover points.
    "Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."

    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    ZLTFUL wrote: »
    Ok. I would think that would have fixed any hole but like you said...maybe it just is your AVR that is the limiting factor here with the crossover points.

    Yeah I think it's something else......

    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    edited August 2015
    So quick update on things....

    I love the sub as it is... but well, in this hobby you get used to something then you want to do better :grin:

    I'm thinking hard about upgrading my driver from the current one (Stereo Integrity HT-15 dual 2 ohm sub wired for 4 ohms) to their newest driver the HST-15.

    The HST-15 can handle 1500 watts RMS, has over 4" of travel, 3" of that linear. That translates into a MASSIVE difference of SPL in the sub 20hz arena, and importantly lets me turn off my existing subsonic filter and run this thing in my current box all the way down to 3hz........

    Additionally as it can handle all my current amp can take and then some, there might be an upgrade to something like a Crown XLS 1500 (bridged for 1550 watts @ 4 ohms) in my future as well.

    Will post some graphs later, but lets just say this thing measures about 3db more SPL from 80hz to 20 give or take (using just my existing amp) and then it changes drastically in my favor below 20hz.

    I'm not sure how low the SVS AS-EQ1 will measure and correct so there may be a limiting factor there, but I'm not sure.

    Alternatively may try to build another sub to go duals since the price for that is about the same as this upgrade, however I'd still need a different amp since my Dayton can only drive down to 4 ohms.
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,517
    edited August 2015
    Couple pictures of the beast (the 18" is pictured though I'd use the 15".

    HST18_FrontAngle.jpg
    HST18_Front.jpg
    HST18_Side1.jpg


    Here are side by sides of the original HT-18 (mine is the 15" model of this) against the new HST-18

    HT-18

    SI18FrontQuarter.jpg

    HST-18

    HST18_FrontAngle.jpg




    Surround doesnt look too crazy on the 18", but on the 11" driver hehehe.... diff story

    HST11OffCenter.jpg
    stereointegrity.com/wp-content/uploads/HST11Side.jpg
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)