New here

payneinthe

My story:

I'm in the process of remodeling my house. It's a long story, but my wife wanted a new bathroom and that forced me to get an entertainment center (sucks, right?). The wife then threatens to buy new furniture for the house and I negotiate a quid-pro-quo deal: if she gets her furniture, I get to upgrade the surround sound system. So hear we are.

I got my first HT setup in 2002 with a Mitsubishi WD-73733 (boy was I sad when that died last year) and a yamaha HT-in-a-box.

In 2006, I needed HDMI switching so got a Sony STR-DG810 and a set of Polk RM10s

When we moved into this house in 2010, I just used the tiny Sony speakers the previous owner had installed.

This time, I'm hoping to go a bit higher end. I bought a lightly used pair of LSI-9s and am looking for the right receiver and center to go with them. For the short term, I'll probably repurpose the RM-10s as surrounds.

I'm hoping to steal a bit of knowledge from y'all in this journey. Be forewarned, I'm impulsive (in case you couldn't already tell!)

Here's the current state of the entertainment center:

rooftop59

That sounds fun! What area of the country are you in?

A few more things will help us help you, um, spend your money. Size and layout of the room in particular. You will also need to budget for stands if you have not already.

payneinthe

I'm in L.A.

It's probably easier to describe the layout via photo than descriptively. The vaulted ceilings are probably 12'. I'm planning on mounting all the speakers on the wall (except the center which will be on a shelf). I know it is probably far from the ideal layout, but it's what I have to work with.

payneinthe

My goal is to put together as much bang for the buck as I can get. I'm not at all shy about going used to get more quality/$ than I'd be able to get new.

Given that, would http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?160104-FX1000-Surrounds-For-sale-200 be a good investment?

Inspector 24

Those would be a good start. And considering you've got the walls right next to the rear speaker locations the outward facing drivers would have something to bounce the sound off of and you may not need the extra left and right surrounds.

nooshinjohn

Welcome to the club... what part of L.A.?

I am in Woodland Hills, and building out my HT space right now...

Zeros

You mentioned a receiver for your LSi's. I can pretty much guarantee that many of the forum members will recommend that with LSi's you are going to want a receiver with pre-outs and a separate amp.

payneinthe

nooshinjohn wrote: »

Welcome to the club... what part of L.A.?

I am in Woodland Hills, and building out my HT space right now...

I'm just up the road in Northridge.

payneinthe

Zeros wrote: »

You mentioned a receiver for your LSi's. I can pretty much guarantee that many of the forum members will recommend that with LSi's you are going to want a receiver with pre-outs and a separate amp.

I'd prefer to find something that can do a good enough job with them for now and buy the separate amp later, but I am open to the idea. My budget is about $2.5k for the center and receiver. I'm hoping to find a nice used LSiC for around $400.

jflail2

I suspect you can find a good receiver with preamp outs as well as an amp and the LSic for well under 2.5k. I picked up an open box Marantz 5007 from Crutchfield for about 500 bucks, and then paid a couple hundred more for a used amp to drive my Lsi-7's.

payneinthe

jflail2 wrote: »

I suspect you can find a good receiver with preamp outs as well as an amp and the LSic for well under 2.5k. I picked up an open box Marantz 5007 from Crutchfield for about 500 bucks, and then paid a couple hundred more for a used amp to drive my Lsi-7's.

Would there be any problem driving the LSi-C from the AVR or would I need a 3-channel amp? I was leaning toward the Onkyo 929, as I would like to have a Phono input and 6+ HDMI inputs (and wouldn't mind having 4K pass-through for a bit of future-proofing). But, I don't know much about the different manufacturers. Is Marantz significantly better?

There's this other slight problem of needing to rewire the entertainment center if I go with an external amp, but that's not a huge deal.

jflail2

I honestly picked up the Marantz solely b/c it was being sold locally and marked down (and had the prerequisite pre-amp outs), so I can't comment on which is better.

And I suspect you'll want to consider a 3ch or 5ch amp, but the pros here can confirm. Just passing along what worked for my bedroom 2 ch rig. GL with your hunt.

nooshinjohn

payneinthe wrote: »

Would there be any problem driving the LSi-C from the AVR or would I need a 3-channel amp? I was leaning toward the Onkyo 929, as I would like to have a Phono input and 6+ HDMI inputs (and wouldn't mind having 4K pass-through for a bit of future-proofing). But, I don't know much about the different manufacturers. Is Marantz significantly better?

There's this other slight problem of needing to rewire the entertainment center if I go with an external amp, but that's not a huge deal.

I've got the 828 here at work, and any TV you could possibly want right here at work... give me a buzz @ 818-340-1125 and we can see what we need to get you hooked up.

John

payneinthe

Thanks, John! I take it you work in A/V?

After seeing your signature, I took a look at the Pioneer Elite SC-72. With the exception of a phono input, it seems to have everything I'm looking for, including support for 4 ohm @ 210W.

payneinthe

Impulse strikes again. I pulled the trigger on those F/X 1000s. There's not enough room for them on the back wall (only about 12" clearance back there). They'll have to be side-surrounds.

tonyb

payneinthe wrote: »

Thanks, John! I take it you work in A/V?

After seeing your signature, I took a look at the Pioneer Elite SC-72. With the exception of a phono input, it seems to have everything I'm looking for, including support for 4 ohm @ 210W.

Still, not the best option running 4 ohm speakers off a receiver. You can maybe get by with 2 or 3 at moderate volumes but I would hesitate running a full blown set up of 4 ohm speakers. 4 ohm speaks love current, power hungry. Most any receiver will fall short of delivering those goods or getting a 4 ohm speaker to perform up to it's potential.

payneinthe

I expect I'll get around to external amplification in the not-too-distant future. For now, I'd like to focus on getting an AVR that can do an adequate job with the speakers, has pre-outs for future expansion and handles the video side well. Is that an reasonable approach?

Any thoughts on Onkyo 929 vs Pioneer Elite SC-72? Pioneer seems to win on power and Onkyo seems to win on bells-n-whistles.

payneinthe

It sounds to me like the consensus is that it doesn't matter what receiver. It could have 300wpc but a separate amp would still be preferred. I don't want to sound skeptical, but can someone educate me on why that's the case? I, being a dumb newbie, thought power is power.

Is a 75wpc amp better than a 210wpc receiver?

This seems to have gone beyond a simple introduction and into more specific topics. Let me know if I should restart the thread in a more appropriate forum.

payneinthe

Thanks for the explanation. If I were to go with external amplification, the Onkyo 818 is probably all I need on the AVR side.

I could probably talk myself into spending up to $1k on an amp. What should I be looking at?

payneinthe

Is this the sort of thing I should be looking for? http://www.ebay.com/itm/B-K-Reference-7250-5-Channel-Amplifier-Series-II-/161264046945

Or should I be focusing on something like an Emotiva XPA-5 or Parasound 2205?

payneinthe

Is a 2ch amp enough? We're talking about 2 LSi-9s, 2 F/X 1000 and an LSiC. Should I just bite the bullet and go 5ch?

chumlie

Bite the bullet and you will be rewarded later. Look into the used market for some fine deals. Hang around, 85 to go.

payneinthe

@chumlie, I don't have the patience for that I guarantee you I'll be done buying by the time I hit 100.

Is that BK I linked to a good deal?

Inspector 24

Meh, you can run LSi's off a receiver, just don't expect much. I run LSi9's and an LSiC off my old school Yamaha RX-V3000, but it gets used for pretty low volume TV watching duty and occasional music while cleaning duty. Never gets turned up much, but works fine when I open it up a little.

However this AVR has a transformer as large as some separate amps I've seen, large heat sinks and weighs 51lbs...TWICE my Marantz SR7005, and it's obviously all in the transformer and heat sinks...they just don't make them like they used to...

But if I were serious about using them for movies/music they'd get a separate amp.

chumlie

payneinthe wrote: »

@chumlie, I don't have the patience for that I guarantee you I'll be done buying by the time I hit 100.

Is that BK I linked to a good deal?

IMHO. Yep. That will handle anything you can throw at it.

WLDock

Being in the LA area...you should hit the used market...Look at the goodies on CL:

Integra DHC-80.2 A/V Preamp - $600 ($2300 MSRP)
http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/ele/4400192236.html

There are two Parasound THX HCA-1206 amplifiers listed:
(71lbs 6 channel beast! 200 watts RMS x 6, 20 Hz - 20 kHz, 4 Ω, all channels driven

Parasound HCA-1206 multi-channel home theater amplifier - $600 (Los Angeles)
http://losangeles.craigslist.org/wst/ele/4407479838.html

Parasound THX HCA-1206 amplifier - $700 (DTLA )
http://losangeles.craigslist.org/lac/ele/4413347799.html

So for $1200-$1300 you get a powerplant to run just about any 5.1, 5.2, 6.1, 6.2 set up. Add another amp if you go 7 or more channels. Plus a VERY powerful 9.2 channel THX Ultra2+ certified preamp that has all the bells and wistles that an A/V buff would want.
http://hometheaterreview.com/integra-dhc-802-92-channel-av-preamp-reviewed/

Inspector 24

1206 is a fantastic multichannel amp! I've owned one, loved it, would easily own again for smaller Lsi speakers.

payneinthe

@WLDock, I appreciate you doing my research for me! That Integra looks like a great deal, but I don't have the space for 2 amps, so going that route would mean getting a 7 channel amp or committing to a 5.X setup.

Inspector 24

Run just the center channel of the receiver or just the rear surrounds off the receiver and the rest off the amp. Works well for me, the receiver powers the rear center, Parasound amps do the rest.

payneinthe

As far as I can tell, that Integra does not have the ability to power any speakers. Am I missing something?

F1nut

It's a pre/pro.