Refinishing a pair of 5JRs.
11tsteve
Posts: 1,166
Well, I pretty much suck at DIY threads, but I thought I would try again, try to contribute.
I have had winter lay off from my job these last two weeks, and so decided it was time to tackle this pair of 5JR I have had laying about for nearly a year. I bought them on Ebay for $24 + ship, and when they arrived, I knew immediately these would be my entry into veneer. The vinyl laminate was pretty beat up, but I was unsure what kind of time this would involve. Plus I have been spending a huge amount of time trying to get this stupid pair of Infinity RSb speaks done and sounding correct, which took way more time and money than anticipated. Thank God for Trey there, and his knowledge and patience.
I started stripping the vinyl, and to be honest, I thought "no big deal... what is everyone complaining about?. The first speaker must have either been light on adhesive to start, or time had done something, because that one stripped very easily. I had 75% or so done in a couple of hours, mostly using a heat gun.
The second one? Yeah, not so much. Using the gun, it still came off in tiny shards. So I switched to an iron with a dishtowel under it. This heated up large sections, and really helped in some ways, and also allowed me to watch "The Sopranos" while I worked. Both methods of heating worked in different ways, for different things. But that second speaker took the better part of three afternoons.
I have redone the crossovers using Clarity caps I had laying around, and Mills. After the Infinity crossovers, this was like a snap together model kit by comparison.
I have applied new Armacell gaskets, I acquired a couple of RDO-194 tweets a while back from geppy, and I have some Dynamat, new screws and hurricane bolts ready to go.
Tomorrow the veneer starts. A big thanks to F1nut for answering a few rookie questions in an effort to get the right things. I have carpentry skills (I build pole sheds... which means I know how NOT to cut off my fingers with a saw), but this will be a new level for me.
I have a 4' x 8' sheet of Red Oak paper back to work with, and I will most like stain them with a maple stain... I did the Infinitys this way and I was pleased with the color.
Have I forgotten anything yet?
and as a side note... I have always wanted to refinish my RTA 11T with veneer... now after this.... man, I don't know.
I have had winter lay off from my job these last two weeks, and so decided it was time to tackle this pair of 5JR I have had laying about for nearly a year. I bought them on Ebay for $24 + ship, and when they arrived, I knew immediately these would be my entry into veneer. The vinyl laminate was pretty beat up, but I was unsure what kind of time this would involve. Plus I have been spending a huge amount of time trying to get this stupid pair of Infinity RSb speaks done and sounding correct, which took way more time and money than anticipated. Thank God for Trey there, and his knowledge and patience.
I started stripping the vinyl, and to be honest, I thought "no big deal... what is everyone complaining about?. The first speaker must have either been light on adhesive to start, or time had done something, because that one stripped very easily. I had 75% or so done in a couple of hours, mostly using a heat gun.
The second one? Yeah, not so much. Using the gun, it still came off in tiny shards. So I switched to an iron with a dishtowel under it. This heated up large sections, and really helped in some ways, and also allowed me to watch "The Sopranos" while I worked. Both methods of heating worked in different ways, for different things. But that second speaker took the better part of three afternoons.
I have redone the crossovers using Clarity caps I had laying around, and Mills. After the Infinity crossovers, this was like a snap together model kit by comparison.
I have applied new Armacell gaskets, I acquired a couple of RDO-194 tweets a while back from geppy, and I have some Dynamat, new screws and hurricane bolts ready to go.
Tomorrow the veneer starts. A big thanks to F1nut for answering a few rookie questions in an effort to get the right things. I have carpentry skills (I build pole sheds... which means I know how NOT to cut off my fingers with a saw), but this will be a new level for me.
I have a 4' x 8' sheet of Red Oak paper back to work with, and I will most like stain them with a maple stain... I did the Infinitys this way and I was pleased with the color.
Have I forgotten anything yet?
and as a side note... I have always wanted to refinish my RTA 11T with veneer... now after this.... man, I don't know.
Polk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2
Post edited by 11tsteve on
Comments
-
nice work...I'm going the whimp route with my RTA 12's...I'm going to sand the vinyl a bit, body fill the couple places that are bad and have them painted matte black...guy i know paints furniture and is going to help me out...Marantz 1152 DC- Denon DP 1200, Soundsmith Carmen MKII- ADS L980 - Blue Jeans IC's
-
It sounds like that veneer removal was a ****, but you sure have the cabs looking good and ready for their new skin now. I have a feeling these are going to turn out very nice, and you will be rewarded for all your efforts.
I used to build Pole Barns many years ago, honest work, but a tough way to make a living. -
That should work, as long as your friend uses the right type of paint. You don't want the solvent in the paint to soften the vinyl.nice work...I'm going the whimp route with my RTA 12's...I'm going to sand the vinyl a bit, body fill the couple places that are bad and have them painted matte black...guy i know paints furniture and is going to help me out...
You don't have to remove the vinyl to apply veneer, if the majority of the vinyl is intact. Remove any loose vinyl, wipe it down with denatured alcohol to remove all wax and dirt. Fill any voids with wood filler, then sand the cabinets with a 220 grit pro grade paper. Vacuum them thoroughly, then wipe them down again with denatured alcohol. Prime any filled areas with brush-on lacquer, or sanding sealer, then use the PSA backed Veneer. For the edges, you can use the matching PSA backed banding. I did a pair of Monitor 10s that way, and they came out beautiful: http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?149215-Monitor-10-Rebuild-with-quot-TL-quot-ModHome Theater/2 Channel:
Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer
dhsspeakerservice.com/ -
i was not aware this could be done. All I have read is that the vinyl must be stripped off, and to be honest, not stripping it almost sounds like more work. Or at least a longer process. That being said, those 10's look so beautiful westmassguy. You always do such quality work.Polk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2 -
Thanks. The 5s are relatively small, 10s are quite a bit larger. My 2As are my next veneer project, and the vinyl is staying put. Sanding sounds worse than it is. You just want to remove any nubs and make sure the edge along the back is flat. The exposed particle board always seems to swell a bit. If you remove the vinyl, you still have to go over the entire surface and check for flaws, voids, chips etc. which have to be filled and sanded too. Works out the same in the end.i was not aware this could be done. All I have read is that the vinyl must be stripped off, and to be honest, not stripping it almost sounds like more work. Or at least a longer process. That being said, those 10's look so beautiful westmassguy. You always do such quality work.Home Theater/2 Channel:
Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer
dhsspeakerservice.com/ -
I see your point. When I do my 11Ts, I will be studying this process.Polk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2 -
I managed to get one speaker veneered this weekend. For a first time, I rate the experience perhaps a 7/10, and the results probably a 6.5/10. I struggled with the bevels, partially with anchoring the veneer until the glue set, and partially with the compound angle at the corners, plus getting the butt joints to work properly.
The bigger sheets I left slightly oversized in case something was slightly out of square, and trimmed to fit after the glue had set. This process, while I don't know if it is entirely correct, seemed to work out well for me. I used an extremely sharp wood chisel to shave with the grain, and a razor knife across the grain. Then lightly sanded to make the corner.
I am using the Better Bond cold press glue and a 4" roller. I seem to also have a slight issue with getting enough adhesive at the edges, even though after rolling it appears to be even an complete, so I will need to pay better attention to that.
I thoroughly enjoyed myself, and these speakers were meant to be a learning curve, and I hope the second one I can figure out how to make my work be a bit more exacting.Polk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2 -
I'd say the veneer looks very good. You might try to locate a small Laminate Trimmer/Router for finishing your corners and overlaps, they can make the task much easier and do a very clean job of it, although the trimmer would not be much help on the bevels. There are trimmers that have an adjustable base for angles, but they can be a little pricey.
-
Looking good. The Beveled edges can be a challenge if you've never veneered before. Oak is an open grain. I use a product called Wunderfil to fill any imperfection in the veneer, especially near the joints. It can also be used as a grain filler, if you want a perfectly smooth finish. It's available in many colors to match specific wood species, red oak being one of them. Once stained and sealed, it will match the oak perfectly.Home Theater/2 Channel:
Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer
dhsspeakerservice.com/ -
i thought the router, but right now I need this project to stay as low cost as possible. Aside from a couple of mills and the veneer and glue, most everything else I needed I have lying around from other speaker upgrades. But I do appreciate the advice... Home Depot has a nice little DeWalt on sale right now thought......
and thanks westmassguy... actually, the grain opened up a little more than I liked on a couple of the bends over the bevels, and I could use a little around the bevel joints. I will be hunting that down.Polk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2 -
Didn't realize you wrapped the beveled edge. That's a PITA. Oak, being a hardwood, doesn't like sharp turns. I would have cut strips and done each bevel separately. On the Monitor 10 project I referenced earlier, I used Walnut Edge Banding. Made things a lot easier.Home Theater/2 Channel:
Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer
dhsspeakerservice.com/ -
oh. well, through my discussion with Jesse, he recommended using strips on the bevels as well. and I decided to cut strips from the sheet I bought just for grain matching, but I probably lost the part about doing each face of the bevel separately. Actually, I am sure what happened is I made an assumption.
And no, you sure are right... oak doesn't like sharp turns lol. I made it work, and it wasn't truly horrible, but the good news is I have one speaker left to do, and so can experiment with that....
this is that "live and learn" part of doing projects.Polk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2 -
Better to get the kinks out and the process down on a pair of 5s than your 11TsHome Theater/2 Channel:
Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer
dhsspeakerservice.com/ -
Looks good to me. I'm reading with interest as I have at least a couple refinishing projects in my future (my 5JRs being the pair that needs it least ...)Main HT (family room): Polk Monitor 7 (1987-original owner) (L/R) / CSi40 (C) / RTi38 (SL/SR) / SVS 20-39PC (sub), Outlaw 975 pre/pro / Outlaw 7075 amp, Oppo BDP-93 Blu-ray, LG 42LM5800 teevee
2ch (family room): CRS+ (1987), Outlaw 1050 AVR, Denon DCM-420 CD
Kitchen satellite 2ch: Polk M3II, Topping TP-20 Tripath amp fed from 975 rec line out
Home office: Model 5 (1978-Danish Peerless), Lepai 2020A+ Tripath amp fed by laptop dock
Awaiting assignment: PSW202 (NIB) to be wired inline in home office rig; Monitor 5JR (1988), Model 4 (1983-US Peerless) -
May I ask where you got the veneer and how much it cost?
Ive done some veneering many years back but it was all flat surface.
I would guess the front edge would be a challenge to get it looking good.Polk Monitor 10
Polk Monitor 7 -
I bought the veneer at veneersupplies.com... and I bought a 4 x 8 sheet of 10 mil paper backed red oak for just about $56. And though they offer 2 x 8 sheets, there is what I consider to be a substantial price break for going with the full sheet.
They offer many differing products, and shipping was well packed and quick.
The front edge was a challenge for this first timer, but far from impossible. just needs focus, patience, and time. And people such as westmassguy to offer knowledge and tips.
everything is on hold at the moment... received my wood filler today.... I am having a busy work week, but then am back on lay off next week. So I will fire back up this weekend. No work plus an alleged big snowstorm. Excellent project time.Polk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2 -
I am going to chime in here to say I would not recommend veneering over vinyl, even if using PSA.but I probably lost the part about doing each face of the bevel separately.
I did mention that.
Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Polk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2 -
We'll have to agree to disagree on that JesseI am going to chime in here to say I would not recommend veneering over vinyl, even if using PSA.Home Theater/2 Channel:
Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer
dhsspeakerservice.com/ -
just a quick update. I have all of the veneer applied, I gave the back panels a little freshen of new paint, and today I have just a little touch up sanding to do and then I will start staining.
I am having a problem with getting anxious to put these back together, so I am going to have to buck up, relax, and focus on taking my time. Easier said than done.
I will be looking for a pair of stands for these. My favorite yet that I have seen are some Pangeas, but if anyone has suggestions.....?
http://www.amazon.com/Pangea-Audio-LS200-Speaker-Inches/dp/B00GLWLMGM/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1394210429&sr=8-3&keywords=pangea+speaker+standsPolk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2 -
Wow, those look great, Steve! Very nicely done. Looking forward to seeing the finished product.
I also like the Pangea stands you mentioned. I have my 5jrs on some Sanus Natural Foundations which look nice and work very well, but now seeing the Pangeas, I think they're a little nicer. -
Looking good!Home Theater/2 Channel:
Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer
dhsspeakerservice.com/ -
Thanks guys! Besides my own personal pride, it is the pressure of posting pictures here that keeps me trying! :-)
Again, not everything is turning out quite as well as I hoped for, but I am enjoying myself.
And westmassguy, I have to say that filler is a very nice product to work with. It save just a couple of minor problems from becoming head-popping-off-in-frustration things.Polk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2 -
Glad it worked out for you. As with everything else, the more veneering you do, the easier it becomes, your joints will be tighter, less imperfections, and the less filler you'll need. Just be sure to seal the cap tightly, otherwise it dries out.Home Theater/2 Channel:
Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer
dhsspeakerservice.com/ -
Make sure you apply wood conditioner to the veneer... A number of woods will absorb stains unevenly, causing the less dense areas to absorb more stain than others, resulting in a blotchy look. I had that problem with walnut veneers....
-
does sanding sealer count as a conditioner?Polk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2 -
just a quick pic for now... I have been busy with going back to work and long hours. This is 8 coats of semi-gloss finish, sanded, and drilled for hurricane nut installs. Slowly but surely the wheels of time are grinding....
Polk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2 -
i Did my 5bs about 20 years ago with red oak veneer.. I remember using a file on the edges and they came out and still look great.My New Year's resolution is 3840 × 2160
Family Room| Marantz AV7704| Usher Dancer Mini - 2 DMD Mains |Usher Dancer Mini-x DMD's Surrounds | Usher BE-616 DMD Center | SVS Ultra Rear Surrounds | Parasound Halo A21 | Parsound Halo A52+ | MIT Shotgun S3's | Dual SVS SB 4000 Ultras | Oppo UDP 203 | Directv Genie HD DVR | Samsung 75" Q8 QLED | PSAudio Stellar GCD | Mytek Brooklyn DAC+ | Lumin U1 Mini | HP Elite Slice PC | ROON'd for life |
ManCave: HT:Polk LSiM 706VR3 LSiM 703's LSiM 702's|| Marantz AV7002 AV PrePro Sunfire TGA-7401| Sony PS4 Pro| Sony PS4 Pro|SVS PB13 Ultra| Oppo UDP 203 | Music Hall MMF 5.3se TT w/ Soundsmith Carmen | Samsung 55" SUHD TV | Sony PS4
Patio | Polk Atrium 8's | Yamaha R-N303BL |
Office BlueSound Node| KEF LS50 | Peactree Nova 125SE |
Bedroom | Focal 905's | Chromecast Audio |
Garage | Polk Monitor 5B's
Closet Yamaha M80 | 2 Polk MP3K subs| Yaqin MC100B with Shuguang Treasures KT 88's & CV181Z's | Tesla E83CC's | Marantz 2252B | Marantz 2385 |Polk SDA SRS 2.3 | LSiM 705's | -
Nice! We have a matching set now.Polk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2 -
My New Year's resolution is 3840 × 2160
Family Room| Marantz AV7704| Usher Dancer Mini - 2 DMD Mains |Usher Dancer Mini-x DMD's Surrounds | Usher BE-616 DMD Center | SVS Ultra Rear Surrounds | Parasound Halo A21 | Parsound Halo A52+ | MIT Shotgun S3's | Dual SVS SB 4000 Ultras | Oppo UDP 203 | Directv Genie HD DVR | Samsung 75" Q8 QLED | PSAudio Stellar GCD | Mytek Brooklyn DAC+ | Lumin U1 Mini | HP Elite Slice PC | ROON'd for life |
ManCave: HT:Polk LSiM 706VR3 LSiM 703's LSiM 702's|| Marantz AV7002 AV PrePro Sunfire TGA-7401| Sony PS4 Pro| Sony PS4 Pro|SVS PB13 Ultra| Oppo UDP 203 | Music Hall MMF 5.3se TT w/ Soundsmith Carmen | Samsung 55" SUHD TV | Sony PS4
Patio | Polk Atrium 8's | Yamaha R-N303BL |
Office BlueSound Node| KEF LS50 | Peactree Nova 125SE |
Bedroom | Focal 905's | Chromecast Audio |
Garage | Polk Monitor 5B's
Closet Yamaha M80 | 2 Polk MP3K subs| Yaqin MC100B with Shuguang Treasures KT 88's & CV181Z's | Tesla E83CC's | Marantz 2252B | Marantz 2385 |Polk SDA SRS 2.3 | LSiM 705's |
