Will Rti a5 with sub sound better than Rti a7 with sub?

jasonb01

Hello, I am trying to build a 5.1 home theater, no room for a 7.1, and after searching all over the web, I can't make up my mind on whether to go with the a7's or a5's for my fronts. I am definitely getting the Polk DSW Pro 660wi 12" sub, so I should have plenty enough bass with that so I'm not looking for my fronts to provide lots of bass. I have read that the a5's offer better midrange compared to the a7's. So should I go that route? Either one I get, I am still going to have the sub.

Also, if it matters, I am going to be using these 90% for ht, so I'm not as concerned with music capabilities. I am also set on the a6 center and the a3 rears.

Another issue I have is that I am looking at ht receivers in the $1000 range and will be stuck with that for a while, so an additional amp is out for now, at least for a year or so. I have read that the a7's like lots of power. I am going to try to get a decent receiver with pre-outs though. So given I won't have tons of power but will have a fairly nice sub, do I go a5 or a7?

Also, the money difference between the two is irrelevant. I just want the best ht experience. Any receiver recommendations around $1000 would be appreciated too!

Thanks!

gudnoyez

For 90% HT I would get the A5's they do have better midrange over the A7's with the money you save on the A5's you could spend a little more on your AVR and get the Denon X4000 those paired with that sub and A3's and a CSIA6 that would be one sweet set up. I own the A5's A3's CSIA6 and am saving for the Denon 4520ci. I bet you would be happy with those as part of a sweet 5.1 setup. BTW welcome to Club Polk.

Hermitism

From reading opinions of others, the consensus on here is the RTiA5/RTi8's are as high up the chain in the RTi series as you should go without running an amp, for best sound. I have the RTi8's, which is the old version of the RTiA5's and I'm running them with just my AVR. And I have plenty of power, but I've been told an amp would knock the brightness off a bit, which the RTi's are known for. For music purposes, the RTi's are a little too bright for some with music, but brightness isn't a problem for HT use, IMO. I have my RTi8's set to "small" and I'm letting the sub's handle the lows, which is easier on the AVR.

jasonb01

Thanks for the advice! It looks like I need to go with the a5's to meet my needs. You mentioned Denon. Denon would be a good match for the Rti series? I've seen some sites that say different avr brands actually give off a different type sound. I saw the X4000 is only a few hundred over my budget. I could swing that. Thanks again!!

gudnoyez

Denon new models have a regained momentum not saying the x4000 is better than Pioneer SC-72 but Denon's Audyssey calibration and their new models are preferred by a lot of people. I would settle with either the Denon x4000 or the Pioneer SC-72 but prefer the Audyssey calibration on the Denon. I just recently demoed both the Denon and the Pioneer but will probably settle on the Denon 4520ci. go out and demo them yourself to see what you prefer, have fun choosing your new gear.

Thorton

A lot of members like Pioneer. I'm sure they're good but have no experience. Audyssey XT32 is very good and Audyssey SUB EQ will do wonders for the 660wi.

One question on the selection of towers. What size room do you have?

Inspector 24

Your receiver will have an easier time driving the A5's than the A7's, one less driver to supply power to. That and many people report excellent gains adding a separate amp with A7's. Those woofers are power hungry.

Personally, given my experience with the RTxxi line of speakers, if I were to drive something off just my AVR I'd go for the A5's set them to small and let a good sub handle the rest.

jasonb01

First off, thanks for all of the help!!

My living room is 16' x 35', but my actual seating area and where my speakers will be set up is to one side, 16' x about 25'. The tv and the sofa are 16' apart. I will definitely be powering them off of my avr for a while, so the a5's it is. The good thing about the Rti line is it appears it's all good. No matter what I go with, I won't feel like I'm wasting my money on junk.

I never thought to look at Pioneer, mainly because I have been doing much of my browsing on Crutchfield and they don't carry Pioneer, but I saw the receiver below, last night. It appears to be their highest avr without going into the Elite line, which I also have discovered is not much different. What do you all think of this? It's only $999 on Amazon right now too. I'm willing to go maybe 12-1300 $ but that's all the receiver play money I can squeeze after buying the speakers. My system will only be 5.1, so I figured I can bi-amp the a5's for a little more power.

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Home/AV-Receivers/Pioneer+Receivers/SC-1523-K

jasonb01

I have read great things about the Audyssey calibration tool. Since I'm new to this, I will definitely need to take advantage of the auto calibration features. Pioneer uses what they call MCACC calibration. Has anyone had experience with that? Would it suffice for my setup? If it's not nearly as good as the Audyssey, I may start looking towards a different brand.

cfrizz

That looks good and it has the necessary preouts to add a separate amp later on down the line to let you operate your speakers to their full potential. Do not bother biamping all you are doing is putting even more strain on your avr, but you are not getting any additional power.

Welcome to Club Polk Jason!

gudnoyez

Audyssey is preferred over MCACC plus the Audessey sub EQ, not to mention dual sub outs on the Denon's I mentioned, you really need to get out and demo the Denon and the Pioneer and listen to them. Do you have any locations in your area in which to do so?

jasonb01

No, I'm in Baton Rouge, LA and the only decent electronics store is Best Buy, if you want to call that decent. I went in there a few days ago and they only had lower end receivers, $500 or less. The guy did tell me that they had a Magnolia location in New Orleans that carried higher end items. That's about 1.5 hours from me. Everyone I know pretty much does like I'm doing, research and buy online. I must have 20 hours spent online reading everything I can.

I think it would be easier to buy a car than a ht system! LOL

gudnoyez

Road trip!!! Call that Magnolia location ask what they carry before you make the trip if anything strikes your interest gas up your ride and go do some listening. Your choice on the A5's is a good one. Hmm decisions, decisions that's part of the fun let us know what all you end up with.

gp4jesus

Either 'A5 or 'A7 w/a good sub will sound good. YMMV partially depends upon XO frequency & if you go w/the '7*. Ultimately *they'll be happier w/ higher quality power than most AVRs can provide.

jasonb01

YMMV? Forgive my ignorance, but what does that mean?

Hermitism

your mileage may vary

edit: Meaning this claim for results will be different for every person. It may work differently in your situation, or be different in your experience.

jasonb01

Ok, thanks. I'm still leaning towards a5, but keep going back to a7 thinking I could set the crossover to have the a7 perform more as a midrange. I think I would be happier in the future with the a7's if I ever decided to invest in a separate amp, but if I never do, the a5's would be better. Decisions...decisions...

Erik Tracy

jasonb01 wrote: »

Ok, thanks. I'm still leaning towards a5, but keep going back to a7 thinking I could set the crossover to have the a7 perform more as a midrange. I think I would be happier in the future with the a7's if I ever decided to invest in a separate amp, but if I never do, the a5's would be better. Decisions...decisions...

The midrange performance is not so much a factor of the crossover as it is that the A5 has 2 drivers that are mid and woofers, whereas the A7 has only 1 dedicated mid driver and 2 separate subwoofer drivers.

The comments posted seem to indicate that the better midrange of the A5 is due to it is 2 drivers.

If your setup will be including a good quality sub, then the A5 + a sub may give you better results than the A7 - regardless of xover setting.

Inspector 24

Erik Tracy wrote: »

The midrange performance is not so much a factor of the crossover as it is that the A5 has 2 drivers that are mid and woofers, whereas the A7 has only 1 dedicated mid driver and 2 separate subwoofer drivers.

The comments posted seem to indicate that the better midrange of the A5 is due to it is 2 drivers.

If your setup will be including a good quality sub, then the A5 + a sub may give you better results than the A7 - regardless of xover setting.

Quoted For Truth.

jasonb01

That makes a lot of sense and why I even started this thread to begin with. I'm going a5 and sub, final answer. lol

Still reading up on receivers. My goodness there is a lot out there on them.

Hermitism

jasonb01 wrote: »

Still reading up on receivers. My goodness there is a lot out there on them.

Some tips on A/V receivers to remember...

All watts are not created equal. This is something I didn't understand until I joined here. The power supply is just as important. The current is just as important as the watts. When looking at AVR's online, take a look at their weight. A good power supply adds weight. Mine weighs 41 pounds. Also read the fine print, when a receiver lists it's total watts. It may say 135 watts and in fine print it may say (one channel driven). Companies try to cheat to make their units seem more powerful than they really are. Some people here say not to even pay attention to the WPC because it can be such an inaccurate figure. If you find something you are interested in, list it here to see if someone here owns it and can give comments.

jasonb01

Thanks, I was going to start a post in the receivers forum once I narrowed it down and ask for opinions, but as of now these are the 3 I'm leaning towards. All of these are around the $1300 mark, which is stretching my budget as it is, so I can't go any higher right now. The Pioneer has the lowest price on Amazon which is very appealing. I'm trying to narrow everything down so that I can order it by Tuesday so I can hopefully get it in for the weekend.

Onkyo 929
http://www.crutchfield.com/p_580TXN929/Onkyo-TX-NR929.html?tp=179

Denon X4000
http://www.crutchfield.com/p_033AVX4000/Denon-AVR-X4000.html

Pioneer SC-1523
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Home/AV-Receivers/Pioneer+Receivers/SC-1523-K

rpf65

Bit of advice. You really need to listen to those manufacturers equipment. Can't hear the exact model, at least listen to something they have to offer. Even an entry level offering. They all have different sounds. As an example, one of those AVR's you have listed I wouldn't even consider. Not because of reviews or a bad experience.

I simply have never liked the sound out of any speaker I have ever heard. Doesn't matter which one, because all 3 have very satisfied and loyal customers. I just don't like the sound.

Check accessories4less for all but the Pioneer.

If you have a Best Buy near you, and decide on the Pioneer, have it shipped for in store pick-up. Pioneer will honor the warranty, even Elite models if it is an in store pick-up.

gp4jesus

I think you've seen this advice sprinkled all through this thread but I want to make it clear:

Don't scrimp on your sub. Watch your volume til you $ave enough to get one.

Make sure your AVR has pre-outs for your left & right channels; center too if you can.

No one on this forum would dispute this advice. Chances are you'll forget I wrote it but you'll be thankful you read & followed same.

Enjoy. the other Tony

jeremymarcinko

I think If it were me, I would purchase the Onkyo 818 from Newegg for $700 then spend $500 or less on a nice used amp to power the front two or three.

msg

Seems to me that for HT, the center speaker is going to be more important than your fronts, anyway?, and you have that covered with the A6. If you have a sub and are concerned for fuller midrange, I'd also recommend the A5's (or even the RTi8 from the Polk Ebay store) over the A7's. I had a pair of the RTi10's, which are the previous gen of the RTiA7's your looking at, and supposed to be very similar, although the RTiA line is apparently not quite as bright as the RTi - a good thing, imho. anyway, they were nice and did well with some power, and weren't even that bad for HT without. I did feel like they were lacking a little in the midrange and were a bit too bright for my liking, overall, but I use my system for music too, though, and it's mostly only with music that I noticed this stuff, and felt them a little uncomfortable for extended listening. for HT they were pretty good. just how active are the fronts in HT anyway? if someone can answer that question, that might help you decide.

maybe I missed this, but what's your listening distance? do you want to fill the room with sound, or just full and accurate in the listening space to the seated area?

since you have the sub covered, knowing what I know now, I'd prob go A5's if solely for HT.
maybe add a second sub later if you feel the need.

I also like Pioneer AVR's, too, and that 1523 is a nice piece. I prefer the non-Elite SC line-up, myself - I don't care for the amber display or gold accents on the Elite line. I think the main thing you get with the Elite is a longer warranty? not sure.

I like Pioneer ergonomics. they're easy to work, and MCACC works nicely, as well. I like the Sound Retriever function as well. Anyway, buying from Amazon, if you want the Pioneer factory warranty, be careful you're buying from an authorized dealer. I spoke with Pioneer about this a few weeks ago. Here's their list of authorized dealers. Don't let this scare you off from a good deal, but if it's a lower price, it may be coming from a non-authorized dealer, and Pioneer says they won't honor the warranty. It's not a problem unless you have a problem with the unit, obviously
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Where-To-Buy/Pioneer+Home+Audio+Video+Authorized+Internet+Dealers?appInstanceName=default

Geoff4rfc

Jason, welcome to the fray!!!

Lots of good info given here. I see you have your front soundstage decided on and sub (maybe

For an AVR, I agree with rfp, http://www.accessories4less.com/ this website is an authorized dealer and sells refurbished equipment with a warranty.

Anyone that has purchased from there will tell you that nine times out of ten, you can't even tell it's not a brand new unit. So you can buy with confidence. And....save big time.

A few mentioned AVR's with pre-outs and that is a great idea, down the road, you may want to invest in an amp. I was new once (not too long ago ) and got an AVR with pre-outs but had no intention of ever getting an amp, I now own three amps

Already having pre-outs kept me from one less upgrade.

Happy shopping.

drummer86

At that price point for receivers make sure to check out Anthem MRX's. I think the MRX300 (maybe it's 310 now) would be hard to beat. Looks like you have an Anthem dealer right in Baton Rouge (Integrated Home Systems LLC) and two more in Metairie.

http://www.uavnola.com/products.html

http://www.wilsonaudioneworleans.com/products.htm

Always good to support your local stores too!

jasonb01

I drove 1.5 hours to the nearest Best Buy Magnolia store today and listened to the Denon x4000 and a Pioneer Elite 71, they didn't have the 72 to demo. They both sounded close to the same to me with the Denon having a slight edge. I also didn't care for the looks of the Elite. It looked dated to me with all of the amber. I called 2 other places that sold higher end equipment than Best Buy and they both recommended the x4000 when I told them my price range. They were dealers for Denon, but didn't have any to demo. These were very high end custom installer type places. If I had to choose right now, I don't think I could go wrong with any of them, but I think I would order the Denon. I'm planning to get everything from Crutchfield so I can always exchange it if I just hate it and I won't have to pay tax.

Inspector 24

My experience with AVR's has been get one that's easy, convenient and ergonomic to use and has the feature set you're looking for.

While there may be differences in sound (assuming all are set with all processing/corrections off) there is a MUCH larger difference to be had in changing speakers, adding amps, placement, room treatments...etc, etc...

jasonb01

It's over. I just said to hell with it and placed my order. Denon x4000, 2 Polk Rti a5's for the fronts, Csi a6 center and a pair of Rti a3's for the rear. Also got the DSW PRO660wi 12" sub. Feels good! Can't wait to see those cherry Polk's in person. Says it'll be here in 3 days!! I'll be going from nothing but the built in speakers in my TV to this!

Thanks so much for everyone's help! I'll be sure to post pics and an update on how I like everything!