very noob wire question.
Comments
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Maybe next year, you will explain just what in the world you really mean.Keep thinking about it. -
Maybe next year you will realize I already did.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Speedskater wrote: »Maybe next year, you will explain just what in the world you really mean.
He has been explaining it for years. The tests don't give the results he wants or agrees with, so they must be invalid. -
Thanks for dropping in Bill, you're always good for a laugh.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
northernwind wrote: »Why only quote that one part when my whole post clearly explains my point rather well?It confuses people like HEADROT who probably didn't even bother to read my post only to read what you quote and go along with it.
So let me just rephrase to get my point across.You can hear the difference with cable?So that test shouldn't be 50/50 for you by nature?It should be 100,it's like asking the difference between a violin and trumpet while blinding folding me,I can tell you every single time.
It's like not some of these people are even average,they are the very people who are promoting these cables and doing the claiming,yet they still can't tell.
Also it is easy to call something rigg when it doesn't go the way you like,so much easier if you just accept the result and chalk it up the fact that you might be able to hear better than those people.
For the record, I read and understood this entire thread in full......... Have you?
Taken from a recent Audioholics reply regarding "Club Polk" and Polk speakers:
"I'm yet to hear a Polk speaker that merits more than a sentence and 60 seconds discussion."![:\](https://forum.polkaudio.com/resources/emoji/confused.png ":\")
My response is: If you need 60 seconds to respond in one sentence, you probably should't be evaluating Polk speakers.....
"Green leaves reveal the heart spoken Khatru"- Jon Anderson
"Have A Little Faith! And Everything You'll Face, Will Jump From Out Right On Into Place! Yeah! Take A Little Time! And Everything You'll Find, Will Move From Gloom Right On Into Shine!"- Arthur Lee -
That is not how I would describe the concept. The point is to COMPARE the results of the test with 50/50 (the null hypothesis) to see whether the outcome differs from pure chance, from what you would get by flipping a coin. If for sake of argument beer A and beer B were exactly the same, the outcome should be 50/50 or not off by a statistically significant margin. If A were a trumpet and B were a **** the result should be 100/0. If A were say 12 ga Monoprice and B were 12 ga boutique cable, you have an interesting test.Conceptually. Any test where the results average 50/50 is flawed by nature.There are many things in life where a blind A/B test is impractical, if not impossible, so why apply it to some if it can't be applied to all?
Agree that it is often impractical (as in the case of speaker wiring) or impossible. But I don't see why it can't be used where practical, as long as it is done right.Main HT (family room): Polk Monitor 7 (1987-original owner) (L/R) / CSi40 (C) / RTi38 (SL/SR) / SVS 20-39PC (sub), Outlaw 975 pre/pro / Outlaw 7075 amp, Oppo BDP-93 Blu-ray, LG 42LM5800 teevee
2ch (family room): CRS+ (1987), Outlaw 1050 AVR, Denon DCM-420 CD
Kitchen satellite 2ch: Polk M3II, Topping TP-20 Tripath amp fed from 975 rec line out
Home office: Model 5 (1978-Danish Peerless), Lepai 2020A+ Tripath amp fed by laptop dock
Awaiting assignment: PSW202 (NIB) to be wired inline in home office rig; Monitor 5JR (1988), Model 4 (1983-US Peerless) -
I would, out of curiosity, and to learn exactly how the sound is degraded if my ears could detect it. But I'm weird in a lot of ways.Well, first off....who would even want to do a test between oxidized cables and non oxidized ?
I may have expressed my point unclearly. Yes there is a lot of real estate there and I would be very curious to see (hear) valid testing of audible differences at all various levels. It would be difficult and expensive to do right though, and it would have to be done by someone with no vested interest.Second, you have no "boutique" cables mentioned anywhere. Neither Monster or Monoprice are considered in that category. Thirdly, there's a hell of a lot of real estate between your 36 bucks and the 50,000 dollar cables
I agree with this. I just don't have an infinite budget. So i need to make decisions on how to invest in the discovery in ways that ideally will maximize the audible (pleasure) ROI.Frankly if you use coat hangers and like the sound....rock on. Audio however is a journey more or less of discovery. If you don't care to take any steps on that journey, cool....but a lot of others do.Main HT (family room): Polk Monitor 7 (1987-original owner) (L/R) / CSi40 (C) / RTi38 (SL/SR) / SVS 20-39PC (sub), Outlaw 975 pre/pro / Outlaw 7075 amp, Oppo BDP-93 Blu-ray, LG 42LM5800 teevee
2ch (family room): CRS+ (1987), Outlaw 1050 AVR, Denon DCM-420 CD
Kitchen satellite 2ch: Polk M3II, Topping TP-20 Tripath amp fed from 975 rec line out
Home office: Model 5 (1978-Danish Peerless), Lepai 2020A+ Tripath amp fed by laptop dock
Awaiting assignment: PSW202 (NIB) to be wired inline in home office rig; Monitor 5JR (1988), Model 4 (1983-US Peerless) -
This all makes sense to me. I would add that I also don't care if someone chooses to spend their money unwisely, on things they think makes a difference but don't, really. (Not talking only about cable or even only audio gear here.) if it makes you happy and doesn't hurt me, go wild. There is a lot of snake oil being sold in all sorts of realms though, and I think it is sad if someone makes an uninformed choice and falls for it. Then again, they have themselves to blame for not getting informed, for not applying sufficient critical thinking in advance.I agree...and have stated before audio is played on many levels and can accommodate any wallet to go along with that. If you can't afford another level, there's no shame in it, just don't poo-poo the others that can play on different levels. Make sense ?
We sometimes forget it's about the music and not the gear....even if the gear has a lot to do with the music we hear.Main HT (family room): Polk Monitor 7 (1987-original owner) (L/R) / CSi40 (C) / RTi38 (SL/SR) / SVS 20-39PC (sub), Outlaw 975 pre/pro / Outlaw 7075 amp, Oppo BDP-93 Blu-ray, LG 42LM5800 teevee
2ch (family room): CRS+ (1987), Outlaw 1050 AVR, Denon DCM-420 CD
Kitchen satellite 2ch: Polk M3II, Topping TP-20 Tripath amp fed from 975 rec line out
Home office: Model 5 (1978-Danish Peerless), Lepai 2020A+ Tripath amp fed by laptop dock
Awaiting assignment: PSW202 (NIB) to be wired inline in home office rig; Monitor 5JR (1988), Model 4 (1983-US Peerless) -
It's not just critical "thinking", but having some "experience" under your belt with various gear. That's why we usually try and push people outside their comfort zones. You can't discover anything new if your not willing to try anything new. Which is ok if your ears are satisfied with what you have.
Here on Polks forum, and many others too, we just don't talk out our collective arses. We have many members with gobbs of experience with all sorts of audio and video. I would take their recommendations over anything I read on the internet or in online reviews. We don't put a spin on anything....most of us anyway.
Stick around, get to know members on a personal level. As best you can on the internet anyway. You'll find many who won't steer you wrong in their advice or recommendations.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
He has been explaining it for years. The tests don't give the results he wants or agrees with, so they must be invalid.[/QUOTEWell, F1, it's next year & I still don't get your point. TouchSamsung 60" UN60ES6100 LED, Outlaw Audio 976 Pre/Pro Samsung BDP, Amazon Firestick, Phillips CD Changer Canare 14 ga - LCR tweeters inside*; Ctr Ch outside BJC 10 ga: LCR mids “Foamed & Plugged**”, inside* & out
8 ga Powerline: LR woofers, inside* & out
*soldered **Rob the Man (Xschop) LR: Tri-amped RTi A7 w/Rotels. Woofers - 980BX; Tweets & Mids - 981, connected w/Monoprice Premiere ICs
Ctr Ch: Rotel RB981 -> Bi-amped CSi A6 Surrounds: Premiere ICs ->Rotel 981 -> AR 12 ga -> RTi A3. 5 Subs: Sunfire True SW Signature -> LFE & Ctr Ch; 4 Audio Pro Evidence @ the “Corners”. Power Conditioning & Distribution: 4 dedicated 20A feeds; APC H15; 5 Furman Miniport 20s -
Well, F1, it's next year & I still don't get your point.
TouchHe has been explaining it for years. The tests don't give the results he wants or agrees with, so they must be invalid.Samsung 60" UN60ES6100 LED, Outlaw Audio 976 Pre/Pro Samsung BDP, Amazon Firestick, Phillips CD Changer Canare 14 ga - LCR tweeters inside*; Ctr Ch outside BJC 10 ga: LCR mids “Foamed & Plugged**”, inside* & out
8 ga Powerline: LR woofers, inside* & out
*soldered **Rob the Man (Xschop) LR: Tri-amped RTi A7 w/Rotels. Woofers - 980BX; Tweets & Mids - 981, connected w/Monoprice Premiere ICs
Ctr Ch: Rotel RB981 -> Bi-amped CSi A6 Surrounds: Premiere ICs ->Rotel 981 -> AR 12 ga -> RTi A3. 5 Subs: Sunfire True SW Signature -> LFE & Ctr Ch; 4 Audio Pro Evidence @ the “Corners”. Power Conditioning & Distribution: 4 dedicated 20A feeds; APC H15; 5 Furman Miniport 20s -
I'm not surprised you don't get it, you still haven't figured out how to post.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
If A were a trumpet and B were a **** the result should be 100/0.
You shouldn't bet on that outcome.
Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
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Actually, I was thinking of you when I wrote that as you freely admit you can't hear a difference between anything audio related.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Actually, I was thinking of you when I wrote that as you freely admit you can't hear a difference between anything audio related.
Now you are going to lie? You are a sad little man. -
I would add that I also don't care if someone chooses to spend their money unwisely, on things they think makes a difference but don't, really. (Not talking only about cable or even only audio gear here.) if it makes you happy and doesn't hurt me, go wild. There is a lot of snake oil being sold in all sorts of realms though, and I think it is sad if someone makes an uninformed choice and falls for it. Then again, they have themselves to blame for not getting informed, for not applying sufficient critical thinking in advance.
Generally, I don't really care what someone does or says, but this type of self-righteous, moronic statement is a little irritating. This individual has no idea what he is talking about, has no experience in the subject matter, and yet he kind enough to not care if somebody should spend their money on things that he deems do not make any difference. How very kind and magnanimous of you.
Of course, the concept of irony is lost on these clueless individuals. Irony that results from them saying things about others that really applies to them....they have themselves to blame for not getting informed, for not applying sufficient critical thinking in advance.
:rolleyes:Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits. -
Now you are going to lie?
What are you accusing me of lying about, that you admit you can't hear a difference? It's no lie, I clearly recall you stating such.You are a sad little man
Coming from you, that means less than zero.
XOXOPolitical Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Is there any thread locking/killing by mods on Club Polk when things fall apart into perpetual flame wars or are there no policies around this here? This is not a baiting statement but a real question. Some forums are moderated and have policies to where when things lapse into a state where things become personal and arguing becomes the primary function over any valid communication the thread ends up getting locked or removed so that the situation can't continue on. Some are moderated to the point where threads are locked only when there is something legally compromising in a thread, etc. Curious on how it works here.
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What are you accusing me of lying about, that you admit you can't hear a difference? It's no lie, I clearly recall you stating such.
You clearly recall me saying I can't hear the difference between anything audio related? Maybe you can't help yourself when it comes to lying, you do seem a bit delusional.
I've admitted that I can't hear the imaginary differences between cables, that's all. -
You clearly recall me saying I can't hear the difference between anything audio related? Maybe you can't help yourself when it comes to lying, you do seem a bit delusional.
I've admitted that I can't hear the imaginary differences between cables, that's all.
There it is folks. I don't expect you to apologize for calling me a liar because I understand you're not man enough.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
mccarty250 wrote: »Is there any thread locking/killing by mods on Club Polk when things fall apart into perpetual flame wars or are there no policies around this here? This is not a baiting statement but a real question. Some forums are moderated and have policies to where when things lapse into a state where things become personal and arguing becomes the primary function over any valid communication the thread ends up getting locked or removed so that the situation can't continue on. Some are moderated to the point where threads are locked only when there is something legally compromising in a thread, etc. Curious on how it works here.
The mods will do what they see fit. If you don't like a thread you are free to stay out of it. If you don't like a person you are free to put them on ignore, which you can find in your General Settings.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
The main problem with these cable threads are the naysayers who for some reason think they need to save others from themselves. The real kicker is the majority of them have no personal experience with anything other than your typical generic cables.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
The thread went south, like all cable threads do, when William happens along.
It's fine and dandy William if you can't hear a difference, and since that's the case as you have admitted, then why on earth do you keep chiming in on cable threads....if not to just start crap ?HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
That's your perception of what is wrong with these cable threads, there are just folks with contrary opinions and experiences that you don't happen to share. You appear to consider your opinion to be factual and feel obliged, just like the others do, to inject your opinions. It's how caustic and how personally it's taken and the level to which it becomes targeted personal insults rather than formulated opinions that makes something into a flame war rather than a discussion.
Unfortunately this topic is tantamount to 'religious warfare'...there's really nothing to be gained in either direction. If the newbie who is making the decision on what to buy is the innocent soul that both opinions are fighting to convince to join their side, whether one side be god or devil, then the message that goes to that newbie is 'these folks are nuts and I'm just going to read/formulate my own opinion'. Nothing achieved and lots of vitriol garnered. -
There it is folks. I don't expect you to apologize for calling me a liar because I understand you're not man enough.
And you aren't man enough to admit what it was you really said. Shocking... -
The thread went south, like all cable threads do, when William happens along.
It's fine and dandy William if you can't hear a difference, and since that's the case as you have admitted, then why on earth do you keep chiming in on cable threads....if not to just start crap ?
Thread went south long before I posted in it. But no reason to start being honest now. -
ok guys,I got the blue jean cables and am quite happy can we just leave it at that?This is not even a debate anymore.
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And you aren't man enough to admit what it was you really said. Shocking...
I know what I said and I stand by it based on everything I've seen you post on here. If you can prove otherwise, such as an example where you state that you can hear the difference between amp A and amp B, please post a link as I may have missed it.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Northernwind you are the voice of sanity. I'm sure all these posts REALLY helped you in your purchasing decision LOL
Enjoy your BJC's!
