TT Hunting

xsmi
xsmi Posts: 1,798
edited August 2014 in 2 Channel Audio
I was in the local B&M store in Toledo looking at turntables as I STILL can't get the speed to stay consistent on the old Sony. My salesman recommends two tables to me in my price range, both entry level but better than my old Sony. The first is the Pro-Ject Carbon which we all know and love as an entry to the higher end of what vinyl (SHOULD) sound like and this Denon, with a better cart. With the Pro-Ject I would need phono pre and the Denon has one built in. The Denon is also FULLY automatic, not HUGELY important but a plus none the less Which would you do? Spend the extra cash on the Pro-Ject? Is the sound that much better? I'm probably going to pull the trigger around Christmas.

Oops Link to Denon

http://www.musicdirect.com/p-4968-denon-dp-300f-fully-automatic-turntable.aspx
2-channelBelles 22A Pre, Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Marantz SA8005, Pro-Ject RPM-10 Turntable, Pro-Ject Phono Box DS3B, Polk Audio Legend L800's, AudioQuest Cable throughout.
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  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,590
    edited November 2013
    I AM IN LOVE with my Debut III and the Carbon is even better IIRC. something to keep in mind. The phono in the denon can't ever be better than it is on day one. Upgrading phono pres can still improve the carbon later on.

    I don't regret getting the Debut and will eventually be looking at upgrades but I know I can always upgrade the phono pre if I do all the other upgrades.
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
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  • xsmi
    xsmi Posts: 1,798
    edited November 2013
    Do you have Debut III?
    2-channelBelles 22A Pre, Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Marantz SA8005, Pro-Ject RPM-10 Turntable, Pro-Ject Phono Box DS3B, Polk Audio Legend L800's, AudioQuest Cable throughout.
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  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,590
    edited November 2013
    xsmi wrote: »
    Do you have Debut III?

    Yes I have the project debut iii.
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
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  • TNHNDYMAN
    TNHNDYMAN Posts: 2,145
    edited November 2013
    I'd have someone work on the speed pots on the sony using some deoxit. It's a pretty simple procedure depending on the model.

    That said, I like the projects and think you would be sorely disappointed in the Denon. If you want new then go up the chain. I like some of the older vintage Denon's, I just think the new one's with the built in phono pre are a waste of time. Good luck in your search.
    2-ch System: Parasound P/LD 2000 pre, Parasound HCA-1000 amp, Parasound T/DQ Tuner, Phase Technology PC-100 Tower speakers, Technics SL-1600 Turntable, Denon 2910 SACD/CD player, Peachtree DAC iT and X1asynchorus USB converter, HSU VTF-3 subwoofer.

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  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    edited November 2013
    I've never heard anyone complain about their Project turntable. That said. I only have mid-level vintage tables that, IMO, compete fine with anything new that is NOT extravagant or absurdly priced.

    TT technology has it's limits, IMO. I know the vinyl jockeys don't think so. It is an "opinion" after all, and few things are more subjective than the world of 5 and 6 figure TTs and their rare wood sculpted, gold cartridges. But we're not talking about those in any case.

    cnh
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
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  • toucanet
    toucanet Posts: 580
    edited November 2013
    Anyone has experience with the Dual 701 TT?
    cnh wrote: »
    I've never heard anyone complain about their Project turntable. That said. I only have mid-level vintage tables that, IMO, compete fine with anything new that is NOT extravagant or absurdly priced.

    TT technology has it's limits, IMO. I know the vinyl jockeys don't think so. It is an "opinion" after all, and few things are more subjective than the world of 5 and 6 figure TTs and their rare wood sculpted, gold cartridges. But we're not talking about those in any case.

    cnh
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  • xsmi
    xsmi Posts: 1,798
    edited January 2014
    Best Buy Ad.pdf

    Well,

    I ended up with this for $50 NEW! However, after reading the reviews on Amazon, maybe I should've kept saving.

    http://www.amazon.com/Denon-DP29F-DP-29F-Turntable/dp/B0000BZHGV/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1390784833&sr=8-1&keywords=Denon+DSN-82
    2-channelBelles 22A Pre, Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Marantz SA8005, Pro-Ject RPM-10 Turntable, Pro-Ject Phono Box DS3B, Polk Audio Legend L800's, AudioQuest Cable throughout.
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  • hochpt21
    hochpt21 Posts: 5,423
    edited January 2014
    Well to be blunt. Yes, you should have kept saving.

    However, you're not out much.
    2 ChannelTurntable - VPI Classic 2/Ortofon 2M BlueAmplification - Rogue Audio Cronus Magnum II, Parks Audio Budgie PhonoSpeakers - GoldenEar Triton 17.2 Home TheaterDenon AVR-X3300W; Rotel RMB-1066; Klipsch RP-280F's, Klipsch RP-450C, Polk FXi3's, Polk RC60i; Dual SVS PB 2000's; BenQ HT2050; Elite Screens 120"Man CaveTurntable - Pro-Ject 2.9 Wood/Grado GoldAmplification - Dared SL2000a, McCormack DNA 0.5 DeluxeCD: Cambridge AudioSpeakers - Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary; LSiM 703; SDA 2A
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  • cmy330go
    cmy330go Posts: 2,341
    edited January 2014
    Sorry, but that is a pretty terrible table.

    If budget is really tight, I'd at least recommend saving for one of these: http://uturnaudio.com/turntable-store/orbit-basic-turntable

    Or at least find a decent used one on CL.
    HT
    Mits WD-65737, DirecTV, Oppo DV-970HD, XBOX ONE, Yamaha RX-A1030, Parasound Halo A23, Rotel RB-985, Music Hall MMF-7, Parasound PPH-100, LSi-15, LSi-C, LSi-FX, LSi-7, PSW-1000, Monster HTS2600

    2 CH
    Parasound Halo P3, Parasound Halo A21, Sutherland Ph.D, VPI Classic 3 w/ 3D arm & Soundsmith Aida Cartridge, Arcam CD72T, B&W 802 S3, Monster HTS2500,
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  • xsmi
    xsmi Posts: 1,798
    edited January 2014
    I've bookmarked U-Turn. In the meantime, I've cancelled my order for the Denon.
    2-channelBelles 22A Pre, Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Marantz SA8005, Pro-Ject RPM-10 Turntable, Pro-Ject Phono Box DS3B, Polk Audio Legend L800's, AudioQuest Cable throughout.
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  • xsmi
    xsmi Posts: 1,798
    edited January 2014
    TNHNDYMAN wrote: »
    I'd have someone work on the speed pots on the sony using some deoxit. It's a pretty simple procedure depending on the model.

    How do I find the speed pots. I'm going to do the work myself. What do I have to lose?
    2-channelBelles 22A Pre, Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Marantz SA8005, Pro-Ject RPM-10 Turntable, Pro-Ject Phono Box DS3B, Polk Audio Legend L800's, AudioQuest Cable throughout.
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  • TNHNDYMAN
    TNHNDYMAN Posts: 2,145
    edited January 2014
    ^ It would help if I had a pic or model #of your sony table.... If it is like most Technics tables and has a knob for controlling speed for 33 and 45 then you remove the bottom cover of the turntable and look for where the shaft of those knobs goes. Spray some deoxit on that area and work the knob back and forth many times. After letting it dry for 30 minutes or so you can try to play a record and see if you can adjust the speed and if it holds the proper speed.

    If still having issues, spray some more and work the knob back and forth. After you have it adjusted then reassemble the bottom cover and hopefully you are good to go.
    2-ch System: Parasound P/LD 2000 pre, Parasound HCA-1000 amp, Parasound T/DQ Tuner, Phase Technology PC-100 Tower speakers, Technics SL-1600 Turntable, Denon 2910 SACD/CD player, Peachtree DAC iT and X1asynchorus USB converter, HSU VTF-3 subwoofer.

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  • Msabot1
    Msabot1 Posts: 2,098
    edited January 2014
    A new one?? Music Hall all the way baby....very good tables....
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  • erniejade
    erniejade Posts: 6,321
    edited January 2014
    Nevermind. Someone already posed what I was going to say.
    Klipsch The Nines, Audioquest Thunderbird Interconnect, Innuos Zen MK3 W4S recovery, Revolution Audio Labs USB & Ethernet, Border Patrol SE-I, Audioquest Niagara 5000 & Thunder, Cullen Crossover II PC's.
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  • SCompRacer
    SCompRacer Posts: 8,497
    edited January 2014
    xsmi wrote: »
    How do I find the speed pots. I'm going to do the work myself.

    Some DD tables will also have coarse speed adjustment pots on the circuit board. Worth a look when you take the bottom cover off.
    Salk SoundScape 8's * Audio Research Reference 3 * Bottlehead Eros Phono * Park's Audio Budgie SUT * Krell KSA-250 * Harmonic Technology Pro 9+ * Signature Series Sonore Music Server w/Deux PS * Roon * Gustard R26 DAC / Singxer SU-6 DDC * Heavy Plinth Lenco L75 Idler Drive * AA MG-1 Linear Air Bearing Arm * AT33PTG/II & Denon 103R * Richard Gray 600S * NHT B-12d subs * GIK Acoustic Treatments * Sennheiser HD650 *
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  • xsmi
    xsmi Posts: 1,798
    edited January 2014
    This is what I had. As you can see, it's not top of the line, but it kept my vinyl spinning.

    http://reviews.cnet.com/turntables/sony-ps-lx250h-fully/4505-7860_7-20649015.html
    2-channelBelles 22A Pre, Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Marantz SA8005, Pro-Ject RPM-10 Turntable, Pro-Ject Phono Box DS3B, Polk Audio Legend L800's, AudioQuest Cable throughout.
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  • xsmi
    xsmi Posts: 1,798
    edited January 2014
    This is what I'd LOVE to have but I think it's going to be gone by the time I have the money.

    http://southbend.craigslist.org/ele/4256286661.html
    2-channelBelles 22A Pre, Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Marantz SA8005, Pro-Ject RPM-10 Turntable, Pro-Ject Phono Box DS3B, Polk Audio Legend L800's, AudioQuest Cable throughout.
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,538
    edited January 2014
    If I, "personally" was shopping for a budget table, it would be a Rega. Now, bump the budget to $1500 and I have options I like better.
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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  • mrbiron
    mrbiron Posts: 5,711
    edited January 2014
    I'd take Steve's advice. You could grab a used RP1 for a couple of clams and are supposed to get even better if you go the performance pack route. Even the slightly older Rega Planars are still sought after.
    Where’s the KABOOM?!?! There’s supposed to be an Earth shattering KABOOM!!!
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  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,590
    edited January 2014
    Also just throwing out the Pro-Ject TT's. I have a Debut-III and love it. I still need to get the speedbox upgrade, an acrylic platter and a new cartridge, but I think its going to stay put for a LONG time.
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
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  • madmax
    madmax Posts: 12,434
    edited January 2014
    xsmi wrote: »
    I've cancelled my order for the Denon.


    Whew, you almost had a Fisher-Price experience.
    Vinyl, the final frontier...

    Avantgarde horns, 300b tubes, thats the kinda crap I want... :D
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  • xsmi
    xsmi Posts: 1,798
    edited January 2014
    Madmax I consider what I have Fisher-Price! LOL
    2-channelBelles 22A Pre, Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Marantz SA8005, Pro-Ject RPM-10 Turntable, Pro-Ject Phono Box DS3B, Polk Audio Legend L800's, AudioQuest Cable throughout.
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  • Loud & Clear
    Loud & Clear Posts: 1,538
    edited January 2014
    I've always read that the Rega planar 3 is the correct entry point.

    Two Channel Setup:

    Speakers: Wharfedale Opus 2-3
    Integrated Amp: Krell S-300i
    DAC: Arcam irDac
    Source: iMac
    Remote Control: iPad Mini

    3.2 Home Theater Setup:

    Fronts: Klipsch RP-160M
    Center: Klipsch RP-160M
    Subwoofer: SVS PB12NSD (X 2)
    AVR: Yamaha Aventage RX-A2030
    Blu Ray: Sony BDP-S790
    TV Source: DirecTV Genie
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  • xsmi
    xsmi Posts: 1,798
    edited January 2014
    This one?

    http://www.musicdirect.com/p-48256-rega-rp3-turntable.aspx
    2-channelBelles 22A Pre, Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Marantz SA8005, Pro-Ject RPM-10 Turntable, Pro-Ject Phono Box DS3B, Polk Audio Legend L800's, AudioQuest Cable throughout.
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  • xsmi
    xsmi Posts: 1,798
    edited January 2014
    EndersShadow wrote: »
    Also just throwing out the Pro-Ject TT's. I have a Debut-III and love it. I still need to get the speedbox upgrade, an acrylic platter and a new cartridge, but I think its going to stay put for a LONG time.

    I'm about a month and a half out from being able to have the Debut III with a Pro-ject MM/MC S pre brand new.
    2-channelBelles 22A Pre, Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Marantz SA8005, Pro-Ject RPM-10 Turntable, Pro-Ject Phono Box DS3B, Polk Audio Legend L800's, AudioQuest Cable throughout.
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  • madmax
    madmax Posts: 12,434
    edited January 2014
    xsmi wrote: »
    Madmax I consider what I have Fisher-Price! LOL

    No, that is just a knock off of a fisher-price. :)

    But seriously, anything that rega/music hall/project etc makes is going to be a big upgrade.
    Vinyl, the final frontier...

    Avantgarde horns, 300b tubes, thats the kinda crap I want... :D
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  • Loud & Clear
    Loud & Clear Posts: 1,538
    edited January 2014
    xsmi wrote: »
    This one?

    http://www.musicdirect.com/p-48256-rega-rp3-turntable.aspx

    Well that's a new model and more costly. I was thinking a used Planar 3 or P3-24. The P3-24 is the cat's whiskers.

    Two Channel Setup:

    Speakers: Wharfedale Opus 2-3
    Integrated Amp: Krell S-300i
    DAC: Arcam irDac
    Source: iMac
    Remote Control: iPad Mini

    3.2 Home Theater Setup:

    Fronts: Klipsch RP-160M
    Center: Klipsch RP-160M
    Subwoofer: SVS PB12NSD (X 2)
    AVR: Yamaha Aventage RX-A2030
    Blu Ray: Sony BDP-S790
    TV Source: DirecTV Genie
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  • voltz
    voltz Posts: 5,384
    edited January 2014
    I bought the Carbon iii also, and the acrylic platter and the speed boxii and new mat. I figured as my LP collection grew I'd up grade, but it still sounds so good to me I put the upgrade thought out of head for now!
    2 ch- Polk CRS+ * Vincent SA-31MK Preamp * Vincent Sp-331 Amp * Marantz SA8005 SACD * Project Xperience Classic TT * Sumiko Blue Point #2 MC cartridge

    HT - Polk 703's * NAD T-758 * Adcom 5503 * Oppo 103 * Samsung 60" series 8 LCD
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  • Jhayman
    Jhayman Posts: 1,548
    edited January 2014
    The Pro-Ject Debut Carbon is a bargain as others have said..
    Maybe look to the used market for a deal plenty out there..
    Good luck on your search
    ATC SCM40's,VTL TL 2.5 Preamp,PSB Stratus Goldi's,McCormack DNA 500,McCormack MAP-1 Preamp,Pro-Ject Xtension 10 TT,Ortofon Cadenza Red/Nordost RedDawn LS Speaker cables, Bryston BDP-2, Bryston BDA-2,PS Audio AC-3 power cables
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  • PolkieMan
    PolkieMan Posts: 2,446
    edited January 2014
    http://uturnaudio.com/
    POLK SDA 2.3 TLS BOUGHT NEW IN 1990, Gimpod/Sonic Caps/Mills RDO-198
    POLK CSI-A6 POLK MONITOR 70'S ONKYO TX NR-808 SONY CDP-333ES
    PIONEER PL-510A SONY BDP S5100
    POLK SDA 1C BOUGHT USED 2011,Gimpod/Sonic Caps/Mills RDO-194
    ONKYO HT RC-360 SONY BDP S590 TECHNICS SL BD-1
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