SL -2000 to SL-2500 tweeter upgrade worth it?

Orangeman

Hello all, my first post.
I just got used a pair of monitor 5's for free when I picked up a pair of used PSB image T6's !
My fist Polks , and they sound great with my Halfer DH101 pre and DH 200 amp I built as kits.
If I could find sl2500 tweeters would the upgrade from sl2000 silver coils sound that much better? And in what ways?
Thanks for any thoughts.

westmassguy

Orangeman wrote: »

Hello all, my first post.
I just got used a pair of monitor 5's for free when I picked up a pair of used PSB image T6's !
My fist Polks , and they sound great with my Halfer DH101 pre and DH 200 amp I built as kits.
If I could find sl2500 tweeters would the upgrade from sl2000 silver coils sound that much better? And in what ways?
Thanks for any thoughts.

Welcome to Club Polk. The SL2500 is not the correct upgrade for the SL2000, and is not compatible with your crossover. The RDO-194-1 direct from Polk Customer Service is the drop-in replacement, and is superior to the SL2000 and SL2500. I'd also recommend upgrading the crossovers as will. The Capacitors are well past their prime. If you do decide to upgrade the crossovers, consider modifying them for use with the RDO-198-1, which is the best of all the improved replacement Tweeters. If you do go that route, you must do the crossover upgrade and modification along with the RDO-198-1, at the same time. Once the crossover is upgraded and modified for the RDO-198-1, you cannot use the SL2000 or the RDO-194-1.

StantonZ

The most direct (simple) upgrade is the RDO-194, whether you upgrade your crossovers or not. The good news is they can be bought directly from Polk for $48 each--if you tell them you're a Polk Forum member.

Orangeman

Thanks for the info guys.
I assume the rdo194 tweeters ae screw in replacements from the front? Just desolder the leads and solder them to the new tweeters?
And are crossover mods needed to use the rdo194's ? If so, is all the info needed found on this fourm? I assume the crossover is attached to the round speaker wire terminal plate? And the biggie......what improvements will I hear with the new tweeters? In all of your opinions is it worth it?
Thanks!!

westmassguy

Orangeman wrote: »

Thanks for the info guys.
I assume the rdo194 tweeters ae screw in replacements from the front? Just desolder the leads and solder them to the new tweeters?
And are crossover mods needed to use the rdo194's ? If so, is all the info needed found on this fourm? I assume the crossover is attached to the round speaker wire terminal plate? And the biggie......what improvements will I hear with the new tweeters? In all of your opinions is it worth it?
Thanks!!

There are four screws holding the tweeter in place, remove them, disconnect the two spade connectors, reconnect them to the new RDO-194, and re-install the four screws. It's a drop-in replacement, no modifications are required.
The crossovers can be recapped with the exact same value, metalized polypropylene capacitors, and will work with the RDO-194s.
There is an upgrade which can be done, that allows the use of the improved RDO-198s.

Orangeman

Thanks westmassguy,
What sonic improvments can you expect going from the sl2000 to the 194? Considering I got the monitor 5's free is it worth the $100.00 investment? I am blown away by the sound of the stock 5's. will I be blown into the next county with the 194's and new caps?!!
Orangeman

bluecomet

I think replacing the tweets are worth it. Especially since you paid nothing for them. If you don't like them for some reason you can always resell them on the forum for close to what you paid for them. All of the speakers that I have which came with the SL2000 tweets were replaced and I never regretted it. Enjoy.

westmassguy

Orangeman wrote: »

Thanks westmassguy,
What sonic improvments can you expect going from the sl2000 to the 194? Considering I got the monitor 5's free is it worth the $100.00 investment? I am blown away by the sound of the stock 5's. will I be blown into the next county with the 194's and new caps?!!
Orangeman

Improvements will be more detail, more accuracy, and overall, more "musical". Some feel the newer tweeters sound dull at first. This is do to the nasty resonance spike the SL2000s have around 12-13 KHz. Get the RDO-194-1s, listen to them for a week or two, then switch back to the SL2000s. Your ears will bleed.
Crossover upgrades complete the transformation. It may not be as dramatic as replacing the tweeters, unless your electrolytic caps were completely shot, but quality Polypropylene Caps, Clarity, Sonicap etc., with audio grade resistors, Mills, Mundorf MOX etc., will make your 5s sing.

Orangeman

Thanks all for the advice.
Is there either a post here or a web site detailing the xover mod including the parts source for the monitor 5 ?
Looks like the tweeter upgrade and xover mod just might be in the cards. I really am surprised by how good these stock 30 yr. old monitor 5's sound. I wonder if there is some weird Synergy going on with the amplification of the same era. Hafler DH 101 pre and DH 200 amp I built as kits back in the day.
Orangeman

StantonZ

No synergy: they're just good speakers. I haven't touched my Monitor 4's (peerless tweets) in over 30 years and they still sound amazing. I upgraded my Monitor 10's because of the SL2000's AND the wider frequency response (on the low end) really benefits from the XO rebuild (not to mention getting rid of that pesky poly-switch).

PolkieMan

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?38755-POLK-AUDIO-Speaker-Wiring-Schematics-amp-More-ALL-MODELS-except-SDA

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?89117-Monitor-5-x-over-upgrade

Orangeman

Thanks again all,
After reviewing some of the posts on the xo mod I'm confused! I don't want to dump a lot of money into this project. From looking at the Monitor 5b Schematics Wouldn't a 12 and 33 mfd Solen cap and a Mills 5 or 10 watt 2 ohm resistor along with new RDO 194 tweets be ok? Also from what I gather dump the polyswitch and install a jumper , right? I'm not going to obsess over this project. I'm sure the 5's will sing after this TLC!.........No?

TennMan

Orangeman, in a previous post you said: "I am blown away by the sound of the stock 5's. will I be blown into the next county with the 194's and new caps?!!". If you are currently blown away with the way the speakers sound I would recommend sticking with what you have until you find a reason to start making changes. When you are ready to make changes I think the RDO-194s should be the first step. They are a good improvement and if you decide you want better sound than the 5s can provide the 194s will fit a lot of bigger and better speakers in the monitor and SDA lines if you decide to go to one of them. If you do the crossovers first the money spent on that will be gone for good. Just my 2 cents.

teekay0007

+1 to what TennMan said above. You could also sell the SL-2000 tweeters to make up a good chunk of the cost of the 194s. Also, in doing your upgrades/mods in stages, you can better tell what improvement each change made to the resulting sound.

StantonZ

Orangeman wrote: »

Also from what I gather dump the polyswitch and install a jumper , right? I'm not going to obsess over this project. I'm sure the 5's will sing after this TLC!.........No?

Not a jumper: a .5 (or something > .2) Ohm resister. Everything else has been "asked and answered". I upgraded my tweets (to RDO=194) before I rebuilt my XO's, but I heard a bigger difference after the XO upgrade than I did with the tweets. However, I don't regret either (the tweets were actually cheaper than the XO parts).

Orangeman

Ok guys,
I was checking cap prices and 12 and 33 uf Solen caps are around 15.00 each. I don't know the cost of a Mills or Equivalent .5 ohm 5 watt resistor to replace the polyswitch and the 2ohm resistor is but it can't be too much ( I hope ). 12uf and 33uf are the right cap values ,and a 2 ohm 5watt resistor, no? I am well familiar with electronic soldering, so unless parts are spot welded removing and installing two caps and two resistors shouldn't be a chore. Last thing , is there one source for the Solen caps and Mills resistors out there? I know there are "better" caps available but I think the Solens would do me nicely and are in my price range. They got to better then the 30 yr old originals. I think I'll do the xo mod first and see what I think. Sound like a plan? If I don't like the "new" sound I can always replace the orig parts.
Thanks to all you guys for the advice ! I had no idea there was such a helpful Polk community out there.

westmassguy

Orangeman wrote: »

Ok guys,
I was checking cap prices and 12 and 33 uf Solen caps are around 15.00 each. I don't know the cost of a Mills or Equivalent .5 ohm 5 watt resistor to replace the polyswitch and the 2ohm resistor is but it can't be too much ( I hope ). 12uf and 33uf are the right cap values ,and a 2 ohm 5watt resistor, no? I am well familiar with electronic soldering, so unless parts are spot welded removing and installing two caps and two resistors shouldn't be a chore. Last thing , is there one source for the Solen caps and Mills resistors out there? I know there are "better" caps available but I think the Solens would do me nicely and are in my price range. They got to better then the 30 yr old originals. I think I'll do the xo mod first and see what I think. Sound like a plan? If I don't like the "new" sound I can always replace the orig parts.
Thanks to all you guys for the advice ! I had no idea there was such a helpful Polk community out there.

Parts Express carries Solen and Mills
The 33uf is out of stock right now however

PolkieMan

http://www.soniccraft.com/sonicaps.htm
http://www.soniccraft.com/mills_resistors.htm I would use a .22 MRA-12

westmassguy

PolkieMan wrote: »

http://www.soniccraft.com/sonicaps.htm
http://www.soniccraft.com/mills_resistors.htm I would use a .22 MRA-12

.5 ohm is the correct value. If you review all the Monitor Schematics, and look at the revision notes, you'll see whenever a fuse was replaced with a Polyswitch, the value of the resistor downstream was dropped by .5 or .7 ohms to compensate. Same goes for the RTAs

StantonZ

westmassguy wrote: »

.5 ohm is the correct value. If you review all the Monitor Schematics, and look at the revision notes, you'll see whenever a fuse was replaced with a Polyswitch, the value of the resistor downstream was dropped by .5 or .7 ohms to compensate. Same goes for the RTAs

That is exactly why I used .5 Ohm and my results validate that line of thinking. In case you're looking for WHY replacing the PS's is advised, the ones I removed measured > 1 Ohm: once I pulled them I could hear the high-end "open up".

Orangeman

Ok, I am alittle confused. The Schematics for the Monitor 5 show the polyswitch then downstream a 5 watt 2 ohm resistor and the two caps.
Let me get this right, because I do want to do this mod. I remove the polyswitch and in its place install a Mills or whoever 5 watt .5 ohm resistor. What about the 5 watt 2 ohm resistor shown on the schematic? Replace it with a Mills or whoever good quality 5 watt 2 ohm resistor ? And then replace the two caps with Solens , 12 and 33 uf. Once I have the mod nailed down I will order parts.
Thanks guys.

westmassguy

You're correct, however, you could also just remove the polyswitch, install a jumper wire in its place, and increase the value of the 2 ohm resistor to 2.5 ohms. Six of one, half a dozen of the other. It will save you a few bucks.

PolkieMan

So sorry, I just bought what Gimpod (Tony) told me to buy for my 2.3tls and 1C

http://www.gimpod.com/partsp23tl.html

hover your mouse over the resistor/polyswitch area

StantonZ wrote: »

That is exactly why I used .5 Ohm and my results validate that line of thinking. In case you're looking for WHY replacing the PS's is advised, the ones I removed measured > 1 Ohm: once I pulled them I could hear the high-end "open up".

Orangeman

Thanks westmass. I got it nailed down now. I understand the Solen 33 uf is on backorder. Oh well, no rush. BTW - does Mills make a 5 watt 2.5 ohm resistor? I didn't get a chance yet to go parts hunting on the web. Is Mills the recomended brand for Polk xo 's ?
No prob if I have to use any other good quality brand resistor , no ?

westmassguy

Orangeman wrote: »

Thanks westmass. I got it nailed down now. I understand the Solen 33 uf is on backorder. Oh well, no rush. BTW - does Mills make a 5 watt 2.5 ohm resistor? I didn't get a chance yet to go parts hunting on the web. Is Mills the recomended brand for Polk xo 's ?
No prob if I have to use any other good quality brand resistor , no ?

You're welcome. The two most popular resistor brands are Mills, and Mundorf MOX. Get the Mills 12 watt, or the Mundorf 10 watt. Both sound excellent.

Orangeman

Thanks again to all the help from everyone,
You know, with my older ears that SL -2000 spike at 13 Khz might just sound good to me ! Guess I'll never know untill I swap in 194's.

westmassguy

Orangeman wrote: »

Thanks again to all the help from everyone,
You know, with my older ears that SL -2000 spike at 13 Khz might just sound good to me ! Guess I'll never know untill I swap in 194's.

The SL2000s sounded like finger nails on a chalk board to my 56 year old ears

PolkieMan

Yea same for me but then I didn't realize it was till I upgraded and the in was wow they did sound much better

westmassguy wrote: »

The SL2000s sounded like finger nails on a chalk board to my 56 year old ears

Orangeman

Ha! That's funny westmass, we are the same age. Maybe I like it hot. I'll see what the xo mod does and then decide if I want to try the 194's. Do you think the xo mod will tame the SL-2000's a little ?
On a completely different subject..........I don't know what genre of music you like , but Clair Bros. Audio, huge in the concert PA sound system game was hired in 1975 by Peter Frampton for his Frampton Comes Alive world tour. Well, my high school is very near the town were Clair Bros. is located. And you know what, Frampton tested the system out at the school. We all assembled in the Auditorium for a concert before anyone else got to hear the live show. Ahhhh ..........those were the days.

westmassguy

About the only thing I know of to tame the SL2000 is to disconnect it.

StantonZ

westmassguy wrote: »

You're correct, however, you could also just remove the polyswitch, install a jumper wire in its place, and increase the value of the 2 ohm resistor to 2.5 ohms. Six of one, half a dozen of the other. It will save you a few bucks.

I have a different perspective on this one (I just did my 10B XO's): keep two SEPARATE resistors (2 Ohm and .5 Ohm). Why?
1) Allows for easy "change out" later (I ended up sticking w/the .5 Ohm)
2) It does alter the behavior of the 12 uF cap somewhat

It's only a couple of extra bucks...