Yaqin MC-100B or MS-20L...TUBE AMPS

larry777

I am considering trying a tube integrated amplifier to see what all the rage is about. I was reviewing these two models from Yaqin which have good reviews especially for the price point. In Canada the MC-100B is $665 and the MS-20L at $545. Both come with a very good warranty. I know their are others,but its the "output tubes" that they use which are different. The MC-100B uses KT88-98 Tubes and the MS-20L uses EL34B. Is one type better than the other......... along with the various replacement tubes available ? It seems that the KT88-98 are the better tubes from what I can find. Does anyone have any comments on these two amps, or other similar brands ?

polkfarmboy

The kt88 should be the more powerful of the two. Although I dont know about the MS 20 Michaeljhsda has one and can clue you in. There is like 8 pre tubes on that ms20 and thats a very important section so its going to cost hundreds for some high quality. The 100B however has less tubes but it has a really cool feature where you can bypass the preamp section altogether and just use it as a power amp with the kt88's If you have a great dac with a pre built in you can alternate the pre section between the yaqin and the dac for diff music you play. I would go for the 100B for the later fact

michaeljhsda2

The MS-20L is a sweet sounding and powerful amp and it has a remote control which is a must IMHO. I've never auditioned the 100B so I can't comment on it. The amp sounds great with the stock Shuguang tubes. I tried the Mullard equivalent of the 6J1 (EF95) but they added more gain which meant background noise. The amp still sounded really good but I went back to the stock 6J1 and it's dead quiet. I highly recommend the MS-20L but only if you buy it from the Ebay seller Tabnaac based out of Canada (no affiliation). Excellent customer service! Don't order one directly from China because if there's a problem, shipping is quite expensive to and fro, not to mention it could be several weeks before you get it back.

Check out http://www.avsforum.com/t/1283685/the-new-yaqin-ms-20l-integrated-vacuum-tube-amp-thread for an extensive thread about the amp.

organ

I would take an EL34 based amp over KT88. Just MHO.

hewlew1

The Kt88 amp should have a higher output wattage over the El34's.

cnh

organ wrote: »

I would take an EL34 based amp over KT88. Just MHO.

hewlew1 wrote: »

The Kt88 amp should have a higher output wattage over the El34's.

+1, that's pretty much as I understand it as well!

cnh

larry777

Yes you are right. The MC-100B with the KT88 tubes has more power than the MS-20L using the EL34 tubes. The MC-100B is a duel Mono design with a seperate power transformer for each channel. Each channel also has its own tube layout.

organ

Don't let dual mono be the deciding factor. I doubt the MC-100 is a true dual mono because it only uses a single power cord. Not sure if it has dual PS filter caps under the hood either. If this is very important to you, take a look at mono blocks.
Some of the best tube amps I've seen and heard are not dual mono.
Are you able to audition at the store?

larry777

No I am not able to audition these amps as it will be an on line purchase...but at least from a Canadian outlet with good warranty. My interest in tube amps just peaked like a bolt out of the blue. Now I am convinced that I will try one out. Just the thought of it along with the option to roll tubes is exciting, as I have never heard a tube amp before. Both these models get good reviews on line and the price is right as a starting point. It seems that everyone who has tubes,loves the sound,so I want to find out what I am missing.

michaeljhsda2

Listen with the stock tubes for a couple months to get a baseline (they are quite good) and then tube roll after that to see if there's an improvement. YMMV

larry777

For sure. I plan on using the stock tubes for probably a year or so before any changes are made. Its just nice to know that other tubes are available to try which will keep the interest high. Do most people replace the 18 guage stock power cord with something better, and will it make a difference ?

michaeljhsda2

It sounds great right out of the box, can't see how a better power cord could make it sound better..but then again I haven't anything to compare it to.

michaeljhsda2

Just played some Tom Petty - Lovers Touch cranked all the up (50 watts!!!!) and....you had to be here. It sounded that great.

organ

That's cool. Great to see another Canadian here. Have you decided which int you're going with? If you're looking for a more romantic and warm sound (more tubey), the EL34 is an excellent choice. If you want more bass and extension on both ends, the KT88 is for you. Yeah, use those stock tubes for a while first to get a good idea on their sound before tube rolling. I don't know what brand of tubes Yaqin ships with, but give them a minimum of 20hrs play time. They'll keep sounding better until you hit around the 100hr mark. That's been the case for most of my tubes. Some may take a little longer or less to burn in. Power cords is up to you. An upgrade in power cord usually results in a darker background and lower noise floor. A $100 PS Audio cord would be nice on those amps.

michaeljhsda2

The stock tubes are Shuguang's. If memory serves my correctly, the dealer I bought the amp from advises not using KT77's in the amp. You may want to research that further to confirm one way or the other.

larry777

I am leaning towards the MC-100B at this point but no final decision made yet. I did read that this amp can also use along with the KT88 tubes .....6550,KT-90 and KT-120's. But I am new at this and will stay with the stock tubes for awhile and when replacements are required will go KT-88/6550. The other 2 tube types also have replacement options that I will learn about as I go. The speakers that I will likely use starting off are Energy RC-70 floorstanding ( 8 ohm ) with 92db effeciency ( aprox 95db in room ) so either amp may do ok. I may look at quality bookshelf speakers later on or another type of floorstanding and possible 4 ohm....but I am not sure yet. Just trying to cover as many bases up front as possible. I will use an Arcam CD-192 player as my source. I have never heard a tube amp so this is a new direction for me entirely. One that I am looking foreward to.:cheesygrin:

michaeljhsda2

Either amp has plenty of power to drive those speakers. You wouldn't think 50 watts was enough to drive a speaker well but believe me, it does. Are you OK with not having a remote control because the MC-100B doesn't have one.

larry777

Yes,I am ok with no remote as my current stereo setup dosn't have one. Although that would be a plus with the MS-20L. Its just that I don't want the remote to sway me either way when I make a decision. Sound is the most important factor and looks is also important. I do like the look of the MC-100B as it seems more balanced. I also like the Basket that covers all the tubes compared to the MS-20L where the Basket only covers the large ones. I have 3 daughters running around the house so more coverage would be best. From reviews I can find, owners are more than happy with either amp....which is a plus.

michaeljhsda2

Larry, did you end up buying either one of these amps?

thetawave2

Just my two cents:

I bought an MC-100B from a Canadian seller (tabnaac) and if that's where you're looking I think you'd be hard-pressed to find better service. That seller is very helpful and quick to respond to orders and questions.

I am generally very happy with my amp. Although I have seen, in a Yaqin Facebook group and elsewhere, worries about the stock tubes, I have not had any problems. I think this may have something to do with tabnaac's quality controls. The sound is quite good even with the stock tubes. My setup has a nice tonal balance, although not the best I've heard, especially in medium-small rooms with a bit of near boundary reinforcement from side walls. When the speakers are placed carefully, you can get some pretty good imaging, which I hear is a characteristic strength of the stock Shuguang KT-88-98. I bought some 12AX7 tubes from JJ Tesla which were not very expensive. I haven't yet done any serious tube rolling, but from what I have read there is much to be gained from replacing the 6n8p and 12ax7 tubes especially. Although I would like to see a bit more body in the low end and perhaps a little more delicate handling of the treble frequencies, I'll hold off on commenting definitively on these until I've rolled some serious tubes.

According to my research, both amplifiers have plenty of power for most people with speakers that are decently easy to drive. Some people say the MS-20L with the EL-34 tubes has a more "tubey" sound, but I haven't heard it myself.

larry777

I bought the MC-100B but havn't had a lot of time to listen to it very much. It does sound good for a new amp with stock tubes ( Recommended 100 hrs for break in to sound its best ). I also hear that the replacement of the 12AX7 and 6N8P tubes give the best overall increase in sound quality. Build quality of this amp is more than you would expect for the price. I also bought mine from Tabnaac on E-Bay .ca here in Canada ,and agree that he is a top seller (100% Rating)
that responds to your questions very quickly. I feel comfortable knowing that I will get great customer service from him. Overall I am pleased with the Yaqin MC-100B and look foreward to hearing it more over the holidays. I will keep the stock tubes for now, but will likely change the 12AX7 and 6N8P tubes down the road to start.

Conradicles

Hey Larry, what are your thoughts now that you have spent more time with the unit? I am casually looking at some Yaqin int amps myself.

larry777

I like the MC-100B. Its not even close to the 100 hr break in period so the volume stays between 0 & 1/4 %. The amp has lots of power at this setting to drive my speakers, and I can hear everything from the disc even just above the 0 setting. Many recordings do have good bass weight when it was recorded that way and the mids and highs are all present. I have read a lot of reviews on line and everyone says that this amp responds very well to tube rolling....mainly the 12AX7 and 6N8P (6sn7) tubes. Everyone seems to like the KT-88 stock tubes and leave them for last to replace....whenever they break down. So for me the MC-100B is a keeper (I also have my Sansui AU-717) and I can only see it getting better with further break-in and upgraded tubes. When that is all complete I expect to have an amp thats much better than its overall cost would indicate. When I play this amp, no other family members (4) ask me to turn it down or off. With the Sansui I do get comments as its Bass travels through the whole house when loudness is engaged. The MC-100B seems to keep the sound impact more into your room which has its advantages. The MC-100B looks good,sounds good and the glow from all 10 tubes looks really nice in lower light. The metal basket gives lots of protection to the tubes and is held in place by 2 small hex screws which are easy to remove. This review is based on my own setup as seen in my signature, and I added an upgraded power cord (Pepster) to the Mc-100B. The manual does recommend using quality interconnects and power cord for best sound. The Bias on the KT-88 tubes were set at .52v so I changed them to .55v as recommended. I will likely add more comments in the future as things progress along. I like your Romans 1:16 signature.

larry777

I just tried the Triode Mode for the first time and it sounds Beautiful and Smooth. This Amp is really starting to open up. You can hear every little tingle and all within the right balance. I'm getting more impressed,the more I listen.

Conradicles

Very cool thanks for your thoughts!

B Run

Sorry to dig up an old thread but I had a question and didn't want to start a new one. I've been eyeing the MS-20L to try with my ZU's and it looks like exactly what i'm looking for but I have one concern. A remote is definitely a must since it's in my living room and will be used a lot, but can I turn it on and off with the remote or just adjust volume and inputs? I don't want to have to flip a switch on the unit every time I want to watch tv, or worry about my wife forgetting to turn it off? Is it always on in a standby mode, and if so will that quickly run through the tubes life? I was hoping I could turn it on and off like an SS amp from the remote, but that may not be a possibility. Thanks for the help.

factorz

Just volume. I have the ms30l and it's a switch. Great unit

B Run

^That's what I was afraid of, I think i'll have to stick with the peachtree just for ease of every day use.

B Run

So does this even exist: I want a tube integrated with remote volume and remote on & off? Preferably S.E.T. with at least 3wpc and under $700-800? Am I just dreaming?

EndersShadow

B Run wrote: »

So does this even exist: I want a tube integrated with remote volume and remote on & off? Preferably S.E.T. with at least 3wpc and under $700-800? Am I just dreaming?

Your fine till you get to the price lol....

B Run

^ That's what I was afraid of. Problem is I could maybe get $700 for the iNova but if I spend that on a tube integrated i'm still out a DAC which will easily be another $400. Looks like i'm going to stick with what i've got, but I REALLY want to get these ZU's hooked up to some tubes!!! It's killing me.