If I switched to rti12's, would I still need my sub?
Right now I have (this is a 5.1 system) 2 rti10's for my fronts and a polk psw450 subwoofer. I switched to rti12 fronts, would I still need that psw450? Or would the 12's be capable of producing similar bass quality? I understand it won't be exact, but is it comparable?
Post edited by mva5580 on
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You'll still want a sub, especially for movies. They'll produce a little more bass than your Rti10's but not a HUGE difference.
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I would not run a sub with either one of those speaker choices. I like big full range speakers and a sub isn't always the best choice when going for a coherent sound. I know most on here will disagree but I don't care. Too many people get a powered sub and do not know how to balance it into a system thereby making the low octaves sound too fake for me.
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I respectfully disagree on not needing a sub. I don't think the Rti12's have a ton of usable bass under about 45-50hz, and my sub plays to 18hz. If I didn't have it the bottom end would be missing and home theater experience would be very underwhelming. For music I could live without the sub but HT is a different story.
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Quick, simple answer....yes!"2 Channel & 11.2 HT "Two Channel:Magnepan LRSSchiit Audio Freya S - SS preConsonance Ref 50 - Tube preParasound HALO A21+ 2 channel ampBluesound NODE 2i streameriFi NEO iDSD DAC Oppo BDP-93KEF KC62 sub Home Theater:Full blown 11.2 set up.
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C'mon, he's talking 5.1 HT... you like 5.0 better?? Clearly, you're referring to music.I would not run a sub with either one of those speaker choices. I like big full range speakers and a sub isn't always the best choice when going for a coherent sound. I know most on here will disagree but I don't care. Too many people get a powered sub and do not know how to balance it into a system thereby making the low octaves sound too fake for me.
However, OP, want and need are two different things... Could you enjoy a movie without a sub? Yes. Do you want to?? -
Definate YES on needing the sub for HT. I would not run my Rti12's without the sub. Tried it and it aint no good.....Parasound HCA-2003A & 2205A
Front: Rti12's
Center: Csi A6
Side surrounds: Polk Rti A1's
Atmos: Mirage Nanosats
APC H15
Power cords by Pepster, Morrow MA4 IC's, AQ Midnight, AQ Chocolate HDMI's[/SIZE]
The rest is TBD. -
Also a yes. I run equivalent speakers; RTiA9's and while they do put out some impressive bass, they don't come close to replacing my Empire!Source: BRP Panasonic UB9000, CDP Emotiva ERC3 - Display: LG OLED EVO 83 C3 - Pre/Pro: Marantz 8802A - Amplification: Emotiva XPA-DR3, XPA-2 x 2, XPA-6, Speakers, Mains/2ch-Focal Kanta No2's, C-LSiM706, S-702F/X, RS-RTiA9's, WS-RTiA9's, FH-RTiA3's, Subs - Epik Empire x 2
Cables: AudioQuest McKenzie XLR's/CDP/Amp, Carbon 48/BRP, Forest 48/Display, 2 channel speaker cable: Furutech FS Alpha 36 12AWG PCOCC Single Crystal (Douglas Connection)
EXPERIENCE: next to nothing, but I sure enjoy audio and video MY OPINION OF THIS HOBBY: I may not be a smart man, but I know what quicksand is.
When I was young, I was Superman but now that old age has gotten the best of me I'm only Batman -
yup.....try it.....turn it off n try it......yup......you make the call....EDIT
LET YOUR EARS DECIDE.. -
Upgrade and keep the sub.AVR: Onkyo Tx-NR808
Amplifier: Carver A-753x 250 watts x 3
Fronts: Polk RTI A7 (modded by Trey VR3)
Center: CSI A4 (modded by Trey VR3)
Rear: FXI A4
Sub: Polk DSW Pro 660wi
TV: LG Infinia 50PX950 3D
Speaker Cable: AudioQuest Type 8
IC: AudioQuest Black Mamba II -
Well, lets keep in mind the OP's sub, the psw450. For movies you may want to keep the sub in the mix, for music though, I dunno man try it both ways and decide for yourself. The posters that say keep it, have way better subs than the 450. Let your own ears decide it's fate.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
I would mostly agree that you probably need to still run a sub for HT for RTi-12s. I used to own a pair and actually ran a pair of DSW-PRO 600s with them for HT. There are always exceptions to the rule however. I tried bi-amping the RTi-12s for a bit sending 400 wpc to each RTi-12. I can tell you in this configuration there were many times were I turned off my subs and I never even noticed they were off, even in HT appliciations. I can tell you for a fact that given enough good clean power, RTi-12s can put out some seriously hard hitting and low bass.
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Well, lets keep in mind the OP's sub, the psw450. For movies you may want to keep the sub in the mix, for music though, I dunno man try it both ways and decide for yourself. The posters that say keep it, have way better subs than the 450. Let your own ears decide it's fate.
Translation: Upgrade your fronts AND your sub:cheesygrin:My System Showcase!
Media Room
Paradigm Studio 60 - Paradigm CC-690 - Paradigm ADP-390 - Epik Empire - Anthem MRX300 - Emotiva XPA-5
Living-room
Paradigm MilleniaOne - Rythmik F12GSE - Onkyo TX-SR805 - Adcom 5400
Headphones
Sennheiser Momentum Over-Ear - Shure SE215 - Fiio E18 Kunlun -
Translation: Upgrade your fronts AND your sub:cheesygrin:
Nah...your fronts are just fine, but once you upgrade the sub (better yet 2 subs) it's like magic happened to your system for both HT & 2 channel."2 Channel & 11.2 HT "Two Channel:Magnepan LRSSchiit Audio Freya S - SS preConsonance Ref 50 - Tube preParasound HALO A21+ 2 channel ampBluesound NODE 2i streameriFi NEO iDSD DAC Oppo BDP-93KEF KC62 sub Home Theater:Full blown 11.2 set up. -
Well, lets keep in mind the OP's sub, the psw450. For movies you may want to keep the sub in the mix, for music though, I dunno man try it both ways and decide for yourself. The posters that say keep it, have way better subs than the 450. Let your own ears decide it's fate.
Keep those 12's and look for another high quality sub and go with two subs. Then equalize everything( I recommend a antimode or velodyne sub equalizer if you can) . Sit back once you have two subs and change the front settings from large to small and back and let your ears make the choice. I did this and all I can say is it made a huge differance running the fronts at small and letting the subs handle everything 80hz and below. That being said, like Tony said it make a differance considering the sub(s). But those 12's are great fronts when powered correctly. I know this requires more upgrades but that is how it goes.......Just my 2 cents from my experiences.HT System
Parasound Halo A51 Amp, Marantz AV 8003 Pre, Arcam FMJ CD36 cd player, Marantz 7007 BD/SACD player,Acoustic Zen Matrix IC's, Analysis Plus Crystal Copper Oval IC's, Acoustic Zen Satori speaker cables, B&W 703's Fronts, Center Martin Logan Motif hybrid, Surrounds DefTech BPX, 2 X DefTech Supercube Reference Subs, DSpeaker Antimode 8033 EQ. -
^^^ I don't think he has 12s, but rather 10s, which are still pretty cool, IMHO... :cool:
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Everyone everywhere in every system needs a sub if they want to recreate the playback material. Balancing it into a system isn't the question here.I would not run a sub with either one of those speaker choices. I like big full range speakers and a sub isn't always the best choice when going for a coherent sound. I know most on here will disagree but I don't care. Too many people get a powered sub and do not know how to balance it into a system thereby making the low octaves sound too fake for me.Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
the rti12s have potential to put out good bass, then unlikely you will get there because u need to pump up the vol pretty high. I drive mine full range, but still send addition -60hz to the sub for music. For HT, you will NEED a sub regardless, otherwise u will miss the .1 channel.
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please keep us updated in your decission. love a good outcome...
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boston1450 wrote: »please keep us updated in your decission. love a good outcome.
As Col. Hannible always says; "I love it when a plan comes together"Source: BRP Panasonic UB9000, CDP Emotiva ERC3 - Display: LG OLED EVO 83 C3 - Pre/Pro: Marantz 8802A - Amplification: Emotiva XPA-DR3, XPA-2 x 2, XPA-6, Speakers, Mains/2ch-Focal Kanta No2's, C-LSiM706, S-702F/X, RS-RTiA9's, WS-RTiA9's, FH-RTiA3's, Subs - Epik Empire x 2
Cables: AudioQuest McKenzie XLR's/CDP/Amp, Carbon 48/BRP, Forest 48/Display, 2 channel speaker cable: Furutech FS Alpha 36 12AWG PCOCC Single Crystal (Douglas Connection)
EXPERIENCE: next to nothing, but I sure enjoy audio and video MY OPINION OF THIS HOBBY: I may not be a smart man, but I know what quicksand is.
When I was young, I was Superman but now that old age has gotten the best of me I'm only Batman -
Like Everyone else. Yes you will need a sub with Rti 12s .:cheesygrin:
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I would not run a sub with either one of those speaker choices. I like big full range speakers and a sub isn't always the best choice when going for a coherent sound. I know most on here will disagree but I don't care. Too many people get a powered sub and do not know how to balance it into a system thereby making the low octaves sound too fake for me.
Integrating a sub into a system is pretty fool-proof with all the room calibration built into AVR's these days. I always double check how audyssey sets my sub with an SPL meter, and its spot on every time.My System Showcase!
Media Room
Paradigm Studio 60 - Paradigm CC-690 - Paradigm ADP-390 - Epik Empire - Anthem MRX300 - Emotiva XPA-5
Living-room
Paradigm MilleniaOne - Rythmik F12GSE - Onkyo TX-SR805 - Adcom 5400
Headphones
Sennheiser Momentum Over-Ear - Shure SE215 - Fiio E18 Kunlun -
To be honest. To make the 12's perform, at there best. You need a very good, high wattage, high current amp.
Most HT receivers, are not up to the task. So i would have to say you need a sub for HT.
For music, with the right power amp..you don't.
