Very bass shy CRS+'s

audiocr381ve

These speakers are hardly putting out any bass. If I didn't have my sub going, I wouldn't be able to stand them. Is this normal?

I mean, I don't have a ton of amplification. I'm using an old Marantz 1150 integrated (amp section only) which is 75wpc @ 8ohms. I'm not hearing a whole lot of dynamics either.

I'm using the stock 16mh inductors on them and am wondering if those need to go.

They are sitting on my tv stand now, but I have tried putting them on spiked stands and it didn't make a difference. What's going on with these things? I also did the pressure test and everything looks fine.

ambiophonics

I am guessing you have confirmed that they are hooked up in phase with each other?

heiney9

I can tell you right now they are positioned terribly. Seriously, on top of a cabinet like that? They need to be free standing stands. No wonder they sound awful.

H9

codyc1ark

From that pic I'd gander to say placement. My CRS's didn't lack in bass at all, and I didn't have great placement. The need to be away from that wall, I'm guessing that having them so close is messing up what's coming from your PR. Do you have more room for placement options? I had to move on from mine because I couldn't get a great setup placement wise, otherwise I would still have them. I will have thm again, good luck, outstanding speakers.

-Cody

heiney9

I can tell you right now they are positioned terribly. Seriously, on top of a cabinet like that? They need to be free standing stands. No wonder they sound awful. I'm also betting the Marantz is a poor choice for those since you claim on stands they sound the same. Have you upgraded the x-voers? If so, maybe you made an error.

H9

audiocr381ve

I'll mess more with placement. Maybe it's my position in the room too? I'm almost dead center when listening.

heiney9

audiocr381ve wrote: »

I'll mess more with placement. Maybe it's my position in the room too? I'm almost dead center when listening.

You should be dead center about the same distance away as the speakers are apart. Based on the photo they should NOT be on top of a cabinet, not that close to the back wall, and should be about twice again farther apart. About 5-6 feet.

H9

TennMan

Have you done the battery test to be sure the MWs are all in phase?

nspindel

Haven't we been through this before? Sell the house, get one where you can position your speakers better

Face

heiney9 wrote: »

I can tell you right now they are positioned terribly. Seriously, on top of a cabinet like that? They need to be free standing stands. No wonder they sound awful.

Before **** smacking him about placement, how about we help him with his bass issue first?

With them backed up against the wall there should be an abundance of bass.

First, is that integrated common ground?

Are both speakers connected properly and are all drivers wired correctly? The battery test will help determine that.

audiocr381ve

nspindel wrote: »

Haven't we been through this before? Sell the house, get one where you can position your speakers better

We moved Mr. Smarty Pants. This is my new man sanctuary. I do wonder they are in phase. I made a lot of modifications to these guys, something definitely could have gone wrong. Searching how to do the battery test now

Okay, I through them on stands. Getting better for sure. I haven't had them this far up yet. Take a look...

audiocr381ve

Face wrote: »

Before **** smacking him about placement, how about we help him with his bass issue first?

With them backed up against the wall there should be an abundance of bass.

First, is that integrated common ground?

Are both speakers connected properly and are all drivers wired correctly? The battery test will help determine that.

Hey Face! I'm about 80% sure about the amp being common ground. I remember doing some research about it when I first took it home.

I'm going to do the battery test now.

Face

With music playing walk around the room, can you hear an abundance of bass elsewhere? If so, your listening position is in a null and you'll either need to re-arrange your room or install treatments.

heiney9

Face wrote: »

Before **** smacking him about placement, how about we help him with his bass issue first?

With them backed up against the wall there should be an abundance of bass.

First, is that integrated common ground?

Are both speakers connected properly and are all drivers wired correctly? The battery test will help determine that.

How about getting them placed properly and then trouble shoot. His placement is horrible, simply horrible. 20" apart, on a table pretty much against the wall. That was my first suggestion, now he states he has done extensive mods, so now I'm thinking maybe something got crossed up. See I can only comment based on the info given and slowly but surely more info is coming to light. Didn't know he moved either, as he has had these for awhile............actually for him an eternity.. So I was also thinking why no bass all of a sudden as he had never complained of that before.

H9

nhhiep

given the speaker and box size, it will almost be bass shy. My SDA 1C has more drivers and bigger box, yet still needs a sub to help out below 60hz. even thought on paper, it should go a lot lower than that. Mine are just 3" from back/size walls at the corner.

Very nice little SDA speaker you have there, I was a call late for a $75 CRS on CL recently.

Joe08867

Actually up against a wall would not make them bass heavy. The passive is on the back of the cab and needs at least a foot to breath. They should be spaced like 2b's.

I would double cheack the wiring just in case but I really think it's placement as well.

heiney9

You have your 1C's set-up incorrectly or you need better gear, because I have zero issues with deep, floor shaking bass with my 1C's. CRS+'s put out as much bass or more as a Monitor 10B, they are not bass shy, however anything below about 40-45Hz would start to become inaudible.

Just curious nhhiep, ever owned or listened to a pair of CRS+'s or are you just guessing they would be bass shy?

H9

heiney9

My question to Shane, I can't remember but is this the same Marantz you have been using all along or is this a new piece. If it's new perhaps it just isn't capable of waking up the SDA's. I thought before you were using a Marantz receiver? I could be mistaken.

ambiophonics

@ nhhiep - your SDA 1C's are bass shy? I've never heard that complaint before and am perfectly happy w/ my SDA-2's w/o a sub.

nspindel

CRS+'s are definitely not bass shy. They are 95% of a 2B in 25% of the cabinet.

And 1C's... Definitely not bass shy!

nhhiep

H9,
I was speaking in term of physics that CRS will deliver less bass than 1C because of the physical size and # of drivers.

By the way, I don't listen at a very loud level. maybe that is why mine are bass shy because I am not sending enough current/Watt to them.

yes, on the AVR, I set it to full range and in addition, send 60hz- to the sub out.

To the OP, just add a little sub and you will be very happy like me now

Conradicles

Always start with the battery test; that thing is great and will determine if there is an internal issue.

audiocr381ve

heiney9 wrote: »

My question to Shane, I can't remember but is this the same Marantz you have been using all along or is this a new piece. If it's new perhaps it just isn't capable of waking up the SDA's. I thought before you were using a Marantz receiver? I could be mistaken.

No you're right. I had a 2245 receiver. It was 45wpc. This is a Marantz 1150 integrated which is 75wpc. It's not the amp because when I had the B&K 200.2, I felt like they were still very bass shy.

The speakers are on stands now, spaced about 5 feet apart (pcs above). When I move towards the back wall while standing up, their is definitely an increase in bass. But literally everywhere else it's really bass shy. I do have room treatments on the way, so maybe that will help.

I've had a sub running with them and I just haven't thought to check in and let everyone know that I thought they absolutely needed a sub. They are extremely bass shy, like, hardly anything there bass shy.

Trying to figure out the battery test now...

heiney9

nhhiep wrote: »

H9,
I was speaking in term of physics that CRS will deliver less bass than 1C because of the physical size and # of drivers.

So if your 1C's only go down to 60Hz, then what would the CRS+'s only go down to? 75-80Hz?

You are correct to assume CRS+'s won't have as much bass as the 1C's, but they are not bass shy for that size of speaker and pack a fairly good punch provided they have proper placement and amplification and the room isn't huge.

I would check further into your 1C's if you are measuring down to only 60Hz, that is a problem. How were your measurement taken to get the 60Hz figure, I'd be curious. Maybe you measured wrong.

H9

nhhiep

H9,
I didn't say that 1Cs ONLY go down to 60hz. what I mean is that I am using the sub to help them out 60hz and below. I am sure they go much lower than 60hz, but not compare to a sub

ambiophonics

it would have been useful to know the CRS+'s were recently modded... i'm guessing something went wrong in the "upgrade" process.

leroyjr1

Having owned 3 pair I was never very happy with the bass output on the small CRS's. If more bass is what you're after I'd get a pair of 2b's or 1c's. Even with the 2b having the same crossover and number of drivers the 12" passive and bigger box made a huge difference. I'd put the CRS's in the category of bookshelf speakers.

heiney9

nhhiep wrote: »

H9,
I didn't say that 1Cs ONLY go down to 60hz. what I mean is that I am using the sub to help them out 60hz and below. I am sure they go much lower than 60hz, but compare to a sub

Ok, I misunderstood what you stated. I don't experience the same thing. I can rattle the window's if I choose too and tickle the bottoms of my feet. I still suggest atleast investigating having to use a sub with 1C's, it shouldn't be necessary except if you wanted really low bass material. Below 30Hz. When tested they varied from 20Hz-18kHz +/- 5db. I'd say they are capable of very low bass if conditions are set-up properly.

audiocr381ve

Okay, I feel like this is my first time at the rodeo.

At the binding post, I have Red as positive, and Black as negative. Is this correct? I might have wired it the other way around internally because of how confusing Polk engineers made it on the inside of the cab. I didn't do the battery test because I'm not exactly sure how it works but I did switch the cables at the back of the speakers and I'm not hearing a huge improvement but it seems like the imaging got better. Might be in my head. Normally my ear would detect if something was out of phase, but I'm stumped here.

TennMan

Here is the way the battery test works:
Disconnect the speaker wires going to the amp. Attach as short piece of speaker wire to the red and black terminals on the back of the speaker. Attach the wire going to the red terminal to the + side of a 1.5 volt battery and the wire going to the black terminal to the - end of the battery momentarily. You should see both MWs move out when you have the battery connected. The right and left speakers should both react the same way.

audiocr381ve

What about the IC? Leave it intact with both speakers not hooked up to the amp?