Trouble sleeping

ryanjoachim

Every night without end, I end up tossing and turning trying to find a comfortable position. Every time I wake up I have to switch sides because my back is killing me. I've tried different pillows, less pillows, more pillows...it's been consistent across 3 different mattresses.

Just wondering if anyone else has issues like this, and if so...were you able to find something (besides prescriptions) that helped you?

BlueFox

Are you taking Lipitor or something similar? Lipitor was killing me. I could not sleep more than a few hours before my lower back was in agony. All my joints ached all day, and the back was always hurting. Finally, after researching, I realized it was the drug. After quiting, within a couple of weeks the joint stopped aching, and I could sleep longer. However, it has taken a few years of intense gym work to try and repair the muscle damage to the lower back that resulted from that drug.

Anyway, exercise is a good cure for most sleep related issues.

Tony M

I don't know about back pain but heard it's tough to live with. Good luck to you finding relief.

For my shoulder pain which was very severe for 1 1/2 years I wore out but have since fixed, An antique massaging chaise and then a Panasonic 1800.00 massage chair. One motor in my Panny massage chair has a worn out bearing now but I still use it with ear plugs.

I did get some minor sleep listening to relaxation music but that was during the daytime hours + very mild pain meds.

ryanjoachim

I'm not on any medications right now, just having a lot of back pain. I've seen the doctor, but all they tell me is "go get some physical therapy". I've been in a couple car accidents in the past which have definitely cause some issues, but I can't really afford physical therapy.

My back usually doesn't bother me unless I've been sitting or laying down for an extended amount of time. When it happens while I'm sitting down, I can usually just pop the lower back and be fine for a while after that.

BeefJerky

ryanjoachim wrote: »

I'm not on any medications right now, just having a lot of back pain. I've seen the doctor, but all they tell me is "go get some physical therapy".

Has your doctor based that "diagnosis" on any imaging studies? X-rays, MRI? If not, it is time to find a new doctor.

I've been in a couple car accidents in the past which have definitely cause some issues, but I can't really afford physical therapy.

That could certainly have something to do with it.

billbillw

What kind of mattress are you buying? Firm? Plush, Pillowtop? Sounds like you are not getting enough support. Most of the recommendations I see these days is for a firm non-pillow top mattress, then put a 3" latex foam topper on it to give softness without loosing support.

TECHNOKID

ryanjoachim wrote: »

I'm not on any medications right now, just having a lot of back pain. I've seen the doctor, but all they tell me is "go get some physical therapy". I've been in a couple car accidents in the past which have definitely cause some issues, but I can't really afford physical therapy.

My back usually doesn't bother me unless I've been sitting or laying down for an extended amount of time. When it happens while I'm sitting down, I can usually just pop the lower back and be fine for a while after that.

Try an inversion table before going to bed and when getting up. Just a few minutes should help relieve the pain a little before you go to bed.

billbillw wrote: »

What kind of mattress are you buying? Firm? Plush, Pillowtop? Sounds like you are not getting enough support. Most of the recommendations I see these days is for a firm non-pillow top mattress, then put a 3" latex foam topper on it to give softness without loosing support.

Too hard of a mattress is sometime just worse. I got rid of mine and invested in an electric bed with memory foam mattress. While the memory foam top layer provide slight comfort, after a few hours I still feel pressure and pain from the foam mattress pressuring my haching body. I spend steadily money on pillows, 1 doesn't seem to be enough (creates shoulder pain) while 2 is too much (create neck pain). Like ryanjoachim, I still toss and turn in bed all night, often barely sleep a few hours a night (no sleep at all last night). I do have an inversion table beside my bed, does not always allow me to sleep afterward but at least provides for a "pain break/relief"!

bobman1235

Does insurance not cover physical therapy? If it's an HMO maybe you can get your doc to officially recommend it?

ryanjoachim

My doc is perfectly OK with referring me (x-rays don't show any obvious damage, but because of my accidents she's ok with recommending PT), but since it is an HMO (Kaiser) I'm required to use someone in their network. The closest person is 45 minutes (one way) away. That means I would have to take at least 1.5-2 hours off of work each trip, and spend that much more in gas.

I've tried 3 different kinds of beds - spring, pillow top, and a standard "firm" one (not sure exactly what kind, but it wasn't marketed as anything special).

evhudsons

Inversion table is actually a great idea. My wife has back pain and the table helped. It was under $100 I believe.

For sleep, I put on rain audio with no music, no thunder. You can find free share versions of audio like rain or gentle waves on freesound.org

I also take a melatonin, you can get it at the pharmacy stores like walgreens. It works great and is all natural. My vet even recommends it for my dog who is skittish during storms and has a heart condition.

If you are married or have a partner, getting a little sumpin sumpin helps too! :twisted:

Good luck!

WilliamM2

ryanjoachim wrote: »

My doc is perfectly OK with referring me (x-rays don't show any obvious damage, but because of my accidents she's ok with recommending PT), but since it is an HMO (Kaiser) I'm required to use someone in their network. The closest person is 45 minutes (one way) away. That means I would have to take at least 1.5-2 hours off of work each trip, and spend that much more in gas.

If your insurance is like mine, you have to hit your deductible first as well. I was paying about $185 for each visit to PT.

In my case it was my neck, according to x-rays, everything was normal. But after an MRI, I was having emergency surgery to prevent paralysis 4 days later. Should have never ever been in PT in the first place. I'd get an MRI, sadly, also very expensive.

Tony M

ryanjoachim wrote: »

I'm not on any medications right now, just having a lot of back pain. I've seen the doctor, but all they tell me is "go get some physical therapy". I've been in a couple car accidents in the past which have definitely cause some issues, but I can't really afford physical therapy.

My back usually doesn't bother me unless I've been sitting or laying down for an extended amount of time. When it happens while I'm sitting down, I can usually just pop the lower back and be fine for a while after that.

Get another Doctor quickly!!

I went to my Doctor's office of ten years and he didn't believe my shoulder pain was anything worthy of prescription help or anything else for that matter. Well I needed surgery and major pain meds of which I only got the first. The shoulder Doc I went to wasn't ever around and his assistant was a bafoon!!! I suffered more than a month or more before the Real shoulder doc shows up and in 3 min. determins I need surgery just by moving my arm in a few directions. The Doc unfroze it 2 days later and then forgot to prescribe f"N" pain pills to help me cope thru phisical therapy. UNBELIEVABLE pis-pour medical help out there these days when it comes to helping people with pain.
Ever since elvis died, the rules of helping people have changed for the common man/woman.

Your not hurting enough for prescription pain meds,...... just sit differently, walk more, exersize more, strech more do more do more do more...well if it wasn't for the F'N' accident/s maybe those cures would help. But our bodies have been injured and some injuries damage bodily parts beyond it's ability to repair or rebuild. The Brain is continually fed signals that's something's wrong and sometimes, pain meds cut off that signal and allow people to function at near full capacity again. And at minimal cost if you don't have to buy what helps off the street.

Get a new doc who has had pain and see if he /she helps. That is if you've tried all the over the counter drugs you can find and are almost abusing them for relief.

I like "Schiff" Brand Melatonin to help me sleep when my neck isn't bothering me to much here lately. It has a stress reliever in it too.

ryanjoachim

What does Melatonin do? I have a hard time as it is waking up in the morning, would this make it harder?

steveinaz

Ryan
Maybe hit the 'net for some free advice on physical therapy exercises that you could do at home. Wish I had a better solution for you.

ryanjoachim

steveinaz wrote: »

Ryan
Maybe hit the 'net for some free advice on physical therapy exercises that you could do at home. Wish I had a better solution for you.

Couldn't hurt. I seem to remember sleeping better while actively doing Crossfit, so that seems to be a dead-giveaway that exercise is a good idea.

Too bad I can't afford Crossfit anymore. Maybe next year.

Evrythngmatters

ryanjoachim wrote: »

Every night without end, I end up tossing and turning trying to find a comfortable position. Every time I wake up I have to switch sides because my back is killing me. I've tried different pillows, less pillows, more pillows...it's been consistent across 3 different mattresses.

Just wondering if anyone else has issues like this, and if so...were you able to find something (besides prescriptions) that helped you?

Believe it or not alot of back issues are caused by a lack of abdominal strength. I know you were in accidents but strengthening your abs will alleviate alot of the work your back is doing. Right now your back is doing double duty. I may be off base but after looking at most of the pics on here from audio gatherings I would say alot here need this advice. Hell, at least you may live longer to listen to your equipment. As a long shot, move to California where "IT" is legal and problem solved.:idea:

bobman1235

Evrythngmatters wrote: »

Believe it or not alot of back issues are caused by a lack of abdominal strength. I know you were in accidents but strengthening your abs will alleviate alot of the work your back is doing. Right now your back is doing double duty. I may be off base but after looking at most of the pics on here from audio gatherings I would say alot here need this advice. Hell, at least you may live longer to listen to your equipment.

This. Spend 15 bucks on a swiss ball and do a few exercises in front of the TV. Made a big difference for me (though I never had severe back pain, it still helped).

rebuy

ryanjoachim wrote: »

What does Melatonin do? I have a hard time as it is waking up in the morning, would this make it harder?

I think it is a hormone naturally produced by humans, among others.
We use this as a sleep aid at our house and it seems to work. My understanding is that as you age your body produces less and that could be why older people have more trouble sleeping than younger folks. You can take this one hour before bedtime and see if it works for you. We have not experienced any bad side effects from taking Melatonin and have suggested it for others who seem to find benefit from it.

Can be bought OTC in varying doses, we usually use a 3 mg. tablet.

Cost about 4 to 8 dollars.

A lot of sleep aids bought OTC are made with Diphenhydramine which is an antihistamine.

Melatonin is safer and more natural.

Hope this helps.

You should not have a harder time waking up in the morning as you should get a more restful night's sleep when taking the medicine.

bobman1235

rebuy wrote: »

A lot of sleep aids bought OTC are made with Diphenhydramine which is an antihistamine.

Yup, that stuff is just Benadryl and it gives me a bit of a "hangover", but it does work in a pinch.

ryanjoachim

rebuy wrote: »

I think it is a hormone naturally produced by humans, among others.
We use this as a sleep aid at our house and it seems to work. My understanding is that as you age your body produces less and that could be why older people have more trouble sleeping than younger folks. You can take this one hour before bedtime and see if it works for you. We have not experienced any bad side effects from taking Melatonin and have suggested it for others who seem to find benefit from it.

Can be bought OTC in varying doses, we usually use a 3 mg. tablet.

Cost about 4 to 8 dollars.

A lot of sleep aids bought OTC are made with Diphenhydramine which is an antihistamine.

Melatonin is safer and more natural.

Hope this helps.

You should not have a harder time waking up in the morning as you should get a more restful night's sleep when taking the medicine.

Thanks for the info! I'll definitely give it a shot.

gdb

Carisiprodal/Soma= comfy sleep

BeefJerky

WilliamM2 wrote: »

If your insurance is like mine, you have to hit your deductible first as well. I was paying about $185 for each visit to PT.

In my case it was my neck, according to x-rays, everything was normal. But after an MRI, I was having emergency surgery to prevent paralysis 4 days later. Should have never ever been in PT in the first place. I'd get an MRI, sadly, also very expensive.

Agreed. A doctor shouldn't really even be prescribing PT without an MRI, especially when it comes to spinal problems. The risk is just too high.

tony millard wrote: »

Get another Doctor quickly!!

I agree, it really sounds like you need to get a second opinion. X-ray's are primarily good at showing hard tissue damage (bone), and even then it can miss some less obvious damage. They can also show certain types of disc problems on a back x-ray, but not all. However, there is more to the back than just the vertebrae and discs. An MRI is excellent at showing soft tissue and disc problems that will not appear on an x-ray. It can also give detail on the spinal cord, as well as the cauda equina which is a group of small nerves at the end of the spinal cord. In addition, it can sometimes show certain types of bone injuries that cannot be seen on an x-ray, though bone isn't MRI's strong point. Point being, if you want a proper diagnosis for chronic pain like this, you need an MRI to get the complete picture. Without it, your doctor is just assuming that there are not soft tissue problems, and we all know what assuming does. A doctor is going to have a difficult time giving a proper treatment without knowing what is actually wrong.

gwg_97

MELATONIN! It is "natural" and it works great. Trader Joes has a very good one for cheap. Also, you may want to get your B12 level checked. I had very bad back, shoulder, arm and hand pain for years. All better after Methyl B12 supplementation. Good luck!

tonyb

Many things can contribute. Having back issues myself for years, I have found a few things that help me. It's not so much the matress you use, though a good one is definately beneficial. Exercise helps alot. There was a time I was afraid to do this or that with fear of hurting my back again. If done within reason, exercise helps tremendously. Eating habits. Take some vitamins, fish oil, and for gods sake, don't eat late at night. Stop the fatty foods or at least limit them. Stretching before going to bed helps too. Also consider stress. At work,at home, whatever, do what you can to limit it. Pick a hobby that is calming. I always drink a cup of hot green tea with a teaspoon of organic honey before I go to bed. Helps calm, and helps your digestion. If you suffer from acid reflux, the tea and honey will do wonders too.Try different things to find what works for you. Being in pain is a ****

howie777

You can try Vitamin D as well. If your Vitamin D deficient (i.e. indoor job and don't spend much time in the sun) this can lead to some back pain. Not sure of the link, but it helped me. I agree exercise is also necessary so long as the doc OK's it.

I had a lot of pack pain for a while, started taking a multi vitamin along with 500% vitamin D and feel much better. Next step is exercise but I only have time consistently when I wake up. So hard to exercise in the AM for me

Howie

Fongolio

Melatonin will help you get to sleep, but not necessarily stay asleep. I use it nightly and it is very effective in getting me to sleep. It is non addicting with no side effects. I would give it at least a week of taking it every night for it to really start working well. It can be very effective in helping with jet lag as well. Good luck.

dorokusai

See a doctor, get some sleep meds to get some temporary sleep and see if the pattern changes. You probably need to get a sleep study done. I've been an insomniac for 20 years so it's not surprising to me to see others with sleep issues. I've been thru all kinds of medications and some worked better than others but I usually still wake up on them. Melatonin is garbage for me but you should try it. If you have to take heavy doses to get an effect, stop taking it.

Since you've been on multiple mattresses, that's one thing to pay attention to but it may still be the root cause as you bring all that inability to sleep with you, wherever you go. Have you ever tried sleeping on the couch? or in a chair? I know it sounds silly but see what it does to your pattern. I have 7 blown discs in my back and it's not easy for me either.

It's almost 95% mental in reality. I have however become quite the B-Movie expert and get excited when there's a movie or show on that I haven't seen already, ha ha.

Totally agree with the exercise comments from multiple people and you may want to look into Yoga. It's helped me a lot with centering and alleviated some of my early morning issues.

Good luck.

BeefJerky

dorokusai wrote: »

I have 7 blown discs in my back and it's not easy for me either.

Wow, dang, 7? Genetics or injury?

bobman1235

Fongolio wrote: »

Melatonin will help you get to sleep, but not necessarily stay asleep. I use it nightly and it is very effective in getting me to sleep. It is non addicting with no side effects. I would give it at least a week of taking it every night for it to really start working well. It can be very effective in helping with jet lag as well. Good luck.

Maybe your and my definitions of addicting differ, but "i have to take it every night to get to sleep" sounds addictive to me.

dorokusai

BeefJerky wrote: »

Wow, dang, 7? Genetics or injury?

The L series are from the effects of a past injury, no idea what the C series is from.

Tbone289

bobman1235 wrote: »

Maybe your and my definitions of addicting differ, but "i have to take it every night to get to sleep" sounds addictive to me.

I missed that one. Who are you quoting?