Mubarak has RESIGNED

steveinaz

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110211/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_egypt

fossy

I am proud of the people of that country.Standing up for what they believe in.Hope it gets better for them .

nooshinjohn

I fear the cure may be far worse than the disease. Does anybody remember 1979?

vc69

nooshinjohn wrote: »

I fear the cure may be far worse than the disease. Does anybody remember 1979?

Fixed it for ya.

nooshinjohn

^^^I guess you don't remember history as I do. My wife and her family lived it, and I remember the first "Nightline" broadcast, which came to be as a result of a similar "coup". I pray that the good people of Egypt have a better fate.

vc69

Nah. I know that the potential for a worse situation exists. I just choose not to live in fear of it.

carpenter

Unfortunately, I'm pretty sure The Egyptians are screwed. There isn't a single democratic- Arab country. not one. I hope Egypt will be the first, but I have 22 (the number of Arab countries) reasons to doubt it.

Cosmic_American

This isn't a coup, its a people's revolution. I hope the Egyptian people will be allowed to have truly free elections so that democracy can take hold, but with Suleiman and the military taking over, I guess will just have to wait and see.

tonyb

nooshinjohn wrote: »

I fear the cure may be far worse than the disease. Does anybody remember 1979?

Sure do, that turned out well eh? If democracy is the goal, then rock on, but I have a feeling it's not. Only time will tell. I did however get a kick out of our prez calling for him to step down. Wonder how he'd feel if the situation was reversed ?

Cosmic_American

carpenter wrote: »

Unfortunately, I'm pretty sure The Egyptians are screwed. There isn't a single democratic- Arab country. not one. I hope Egypt will be the first, but I have 22 (the number of Arab countries) reasons to doubt it.

I hope this will spread across the Arab world. First Tunisia, then Egypt. Once the people realize they have power pro-democracy revolutions become very possible, maybe this is just the beginning. Not that I'm getting my hopes up...

dkg999

Hopefully the devil they don't know isn't worse than the devil they did know. It's going to be a struggle for the people and hopefully that struggle leads to something better, not just something different.

tonyb

carpenter wrote: »

Unfortunately, I'm pretty sure The Egyptians are screwed. There isn't a single democratic- Arab country. not one. I hope Egypt will be the first, but I have 22 (the number of Arab countries) reasons to doubt it.

Well, you could possible count Iraq, but that one still has a way to go.
I also find it interesting that Mubarak is worth 70 billion....yes billion, along with his sons who are also billionaires. Someone had their hands in the public trough for along time while the people pretty much lived in the stone age outside major cities. No wonder the people want him gone. Who's to say the next leader up to bat won't do the same thing ? Regardless, some of that coin has to get back into the benefit of the people and not just the one leader.

nooshinjohn

vc69 wrote: »

Nah. I know that the potential for a worse situation exists. I just choose not to live in fear of it.

As do I... The "I fear" part of my post was only a figure of speech.

That said, with much of the Middle East in various states of unrest and the growing influence of extremist groups in the region, it would be unwise and foolish to not pay attention to what is happening.

nooshinjohn

Cosmic_American wrote: »

This isn't a coup, its a people's revolution. I hope the Egyptian people will be allowed to have truly free elections so that democracy can take hold, but with Suleiman and the military taking over, I guess will just have to wait and see.

Study history. You are dead wrong in your belief that this is anything less than a coup. Look into the democratic beliefs of Iran.:rolleyes:

Cosmic_American wrote: »

I hope this will spread across the Arab world. First Tunisia, then Egypt. Once the people realize they have power pro-democracy revolutions become very possible, maybe this is just the beginning. Not that I'm getting my hopes up...

What is forming there is called a "Caliphate", and the "democratic" movements happening across the region have the singular goal of establishing "Islamic-Socialism" in each member state, and governed by Sharia Law. Sounds pretty peaceful to me:rolleyes:...

Danny Tse

Removing Mubarak from office is merely the first step to....something.

The next step is trying to figure out what that next step is. And whether the military, or whoever is in charge, will go along.

Still, it's a successful first step.

cnh

I'm with Danny. But I am also NOT naive. Democracy is a tough thing to implement. Some would argue that we don't even really have it in this country? lol

But let's hope for the BEST!

cnh

F1nut

I did however get a kick out of our prez calling for him to step down. Wonder how he'd feel if the situation was reversed ?

My thoughts, exactly.

Cosmic_American

What's happening in Egypt isn't an Islamic movement, the people are tired of an oppressive dictator and a military state where they have no rights. They were pushed to the point where revolution was necessary. I know what happened in Iran but that doesn't mean every revolution will have the same fate. The Egyptian people want a democracy, they gathered in Tahrir "Liberation" square to force out Mubarak, not to establish Sharia Law.

DMara

And gas price is still rising, yeah, go oil companies

bobman1235

nooshinjohn wrote: »

Does anybody remember 1979?

OOOO, I do! I love that song!

<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Lr58WHo2ndM&quot; frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

nooshinjohn

Cosmic_American wrote: »

What's happening in Egypt isn't an Islamic movement, the people are tired of an oppressive dictator and a military state where they have no rights. They were pushed to the point where revolution was necessary. I know what happened in Iran but that doesn't mean every revolution will have the same fate. The Egyptian people want a democracy, they gathered in Tahrir "Liberation" square to force out Mubarak, not to establish Sharia Law.

The facts beg to differ with your views...

According to a recent Pew survey (April - May 2010) reported by Reuters:
20% percent had a favourable view of Al-Qaeda
18% had confidence in Osama bin Laden (though it has fallen from 27% a few years ago
Also,

49% are favorable of Hamas
30% are favorable of Hezbollah
On Islamic punishments:

54% wants segregation of men and women in workplace
82% wants adulterers be stoned
84% wants death penalty for apostates from Islam
77% favors flogging or amputation of the hands of thieves

The Muslim Brotherhood will now find a way to fill the power vacuum(if they have not already done so) and will have the force of Egypt's military to pull it off.

Demiurge

Cosmic_American wrote: »

What's happening in Egypt isn't an Islamic movement, the people are tired of an oppressive dictator and a military state where they have no rights. They were pushed to the point where revolution was necessary. I know what happened in Iran but that doesn't mean every revolution will have the same fate. The Egyptian people want a democracy, they gathered in Tajir "Liberation" square to force out Mubarak, not to establish Sharia Law.

Mubarak is a bad man, but I also know that if he couldn't keep his country stable with as long as he's been there, what do you think is going to happen to whomever replaces him?

This isn't an orderly transfer of power. Egypt is vulnerable, and if you want to deny that there are outside forces that wish to turn Egypt down a much darker path than the dimly lit one they were already on, I don't know what else there is to say.

Simply throwing around 'hope' doesn't work very well in the absence of 'thought' -- something I would think most Americans would have learned over the past two years.

nooshinjohn

Demiurge wrote: »

Simply throwing around 'hope' doesn't work very well in the absence of 'thought' -- something I would think most Americans would have learned over the past two years.

Yep... gotta love the "Hope and Change".

Demiurge

When I think about 'The People', I think about Ahmadinejad. :rolleyes:

Ahmadinejad: Egyptian protests herald new Mideast

TEHRAN, Iran (AP) - Iran's president said Friday that Egypt's popular uprising shows a new Islamic Middle East is emerging, one that Mahmoud Ahmadinejad claims will have no signs of Israel and U.S. "interference."

The Iranian leader spoke as the country marked the 32nd anniversary of its 1979 Islamic Revolution that toppled the pro-U.S. shah Mohammad Reza Pahlavi and brought hardline clerics to power.

Ahmadinejad's remarks came hours after Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak announced he is transferring authority to his deputy but refused to step down, angering hundreds of thousands of Egyptians who have been demanding he relinquish his three-decade grip on power.

Tens of thousands marched down Tehran's main boulevard in state-organized anniversary festivities, chanting in support of Egyptian anti-government protesters. Some Iranians set an effigy of Mubarak on fire while others shouted: "Hosni non-Mubarak, 'Mubarak' (congratulations) on the uprising of your people."

Iran's state TV broadcast simultaneous live footage of the gathering at Tehran's Azadi, or Freedom, Square and that of anti-government demonstrations in Cairo's downtown Tahrir Square where tens of thousands had gathered by noon Friday.

Iran, which is at odds with the international community over its controversial nuclear program, has sought to portray the popular uprisings in Tunisia and Egypt as evidence of a replay of its own Islamic Revolution.

"Despite all the (West's) complicated and satanic designs ... a new Middle East is emerging without the Zionist regime and U.S. interference, a place where the arrogant powers will have no place," Ahmadinejad told the crowd.

He also urged Egyptian protesters to persevere until there is a regime change. "It's your right to be free. It's your right to exercise your will and sovereignty ... and choose the type of government and the rulers."

After his address, Ahmadinejad carried a placard reading, "Death to Israel."

The Iranian leadership's attempt to capitalize on the Egyptian uprising is underscored by its effort to deprive its own opposition of any chance to reinvigorate a movement swept from the streets in a heavy military crackdown in 2009.

Ahead of the anniversary, Iranian security forces arrested several opposition activists, including aides to Iran's opposition leaders.

Authorities also placed Mahdi Karroubi, one of Iran's opposition leaders, under house arrest, posting security officers at his door in response to his calls for an Iranian opposition rally in support of anti-government demonstrations in Egypt.

Karroubi's website, sahamnews.org, said security officials informed Karroubi that the restrictions would remain in place until after Feb. 14.

Karroubi, and Iran's other top opposition figure, Mir Hossein Mousavi, have asked the government for permission to hold a Feb. 14 gathering in support of the uprisings in Egypt and Tunisia.

State Prosecutor Gholam Hossein Mohseni Ejehi rejected the demand on Wednesday, warning of repercussions if the rally takes place. Hossein Hamedani, a senior commander of Iran's powerful Revolutionary Guard, said any attempt by the opposition to rally supporters on Feb. 14 would be crushed.

Mousavi's aide Saleh Noghrehkar and Sadroddin Beheshti, son of another Mousavi aide, Ali Reza Beheshti, were among those arrested, according to opposition website kaleme.com. The website also said another opposition activist, Fariba Ebtehaj, a close aide to former reformist vice president, Masoumeh Ebtekar, has also been arrested.

Both Mousavi and Karroubi ran against Ahmadinejad in the June 2009 elections, which opposition says was heavily rigged. Mousavi, who campaigned on a platform calling for social and political reforms, maintains he was the rightful winner and that Ahmadinejad was declared the winner through massive vote fraud.

White House national security spokesman Tommy Vietor said in a statement Thursday that Karroubi's house arrest underscored the hypocrisy of Iran's leadership.

"For all of its empty talk about Egypt, the government of Iran should allow the Iranian people the same universal right to peacefully assemble and demonstrate in Tehran that the people are exercising in Cairo," he said.

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20110211/D9LAIKV80.html

Cosmic_American

Demiurge wrote: »

Mubarak is a bad man, but I also know that if he couldn't keep his country stable with as long as he's been there, what do you think is going to happen to whomever replaces him?

This isn't an orderly transfer of power. Egypt is vulnerable, and if you want to deny that there are outside forces that wish to turn Egypt down a much darker path than the dimly lit one they were already on, I don't know what else there is to say.

Simply throwing around 'hope' doesn't work very well in the absence of 'thought' -- something I would think most Americans would have learned over the past two years.

I never denied that there are factions that could establish something other than democracy, I said democracy is what the people want. I do hope the people succeed but I never said it was inevitable. I'm worried that the military and Suleiman will rule just as Mubarak did.

Mubarak has kept Egypt relatively stable for 3 decades, 3 decades of an oppressive regime, the Egyptian people had enough and forced him out of power. If they aren't allowed free elections then yes I believe their fate could darken even further.

Danny Tse

nooshinjohn wrote: »

The Muslim Brotherhood will now find a way to fill the power vacuum (if they have not already done so) and will have the force of Egypt's military to pull it off.

I believe the Muslim Brotherhood is bankrolled, at least partially, by Iran.

I'd love to see democracy spread in this region of the world, but it ain't going to happen fast. If it happens, it will take generations of continuous nurturing. Many of us take our freedoms and liberties in this country for granted, but it took us more than 200 years to get to our current state. And we are still "in the process".

markmarc

Getting rid of Mubarak is only the first step, the country continues under military rule. Sulieman needs to setup working groups in and outside of the legislative body to change the Constitution, or draft a completely new document.

A second problem is how will the police be rebuilt as a respected and trusted part of the rule of law.

It's a precarious time, the leaders of the demonstrations, opposition groups favoring democracy must stay vigilant and keep the people active with numerous rallies, etc., otherwise their efforts will lead to another dictator or Iranian theocracy.

Stay tuned.....

Cosmic_American

nooshinjohn wrote: »

The facts beg to differ with your views...



The Muslim Brotherhood will now find a way to fill the power vacuum(if they have not already done so) and will have the force of Egypt's military to pull it off.

I like how you removed the part that said 59% prefered democracy as the best form of government. That fact happened to support my views.

tonyb

Not to mention Egypt was Isreals only friend in the middle east. If I were there, this would catch my attention big time. Talk about being surrounded...yikes. Well, actualy we paid Mubarak to be nice to them...for over 30 years. Now I get why he's a billionaire. with our money in his pocket. You have to love our foreign policy's.:rolleyes:

cnh

I believe 'everyone' above has contributed important points. Things are certainly in flux. History is never fixed, but Gov'ts never get reformed in power vacuums. Power is a factor everywhere, including the U.S.

Since none of us is a prophet--at least I don't think any of you are? We'll have to 'wait' it out, I'm afraid?

cnh

tonyb

cnh wrote: »

Since none of us is a prophet--cnh

Uh....Al Gore wants to have a word with you.:biggrin:

Yeah, it's a wait and see type of deal, but our State department should be working the backroads to ensure democracy has a foot hold.