How to get better dynamics from the SDA SRS's?

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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited September 2010
    So you believe a NAD amp needs a NAD pre-amp, a Belles amp needs a Belles pre-amp. That's a ridiculous statement. Yes, I'd take the Aleph P too over the 750 if money was no object.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • george daniel
    george daniel Posts: 12,096
    edited September 2010
    Guys,,I dont know much about the Adcom line since the GFP 565--which had a decent phono board IIRC,, the 750 is Adcoms' top of the line pre?
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited September 2010
    Yes. If you head over to the "other" thread, I posted some links if you want to learn more about it.

    http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1412788&postcount=123

    http://www.stereophile.com/solidpreamps/133/
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited September 2010
    heiney9 wrote: »
    So you believe a NAD amp needs a NAD pre-amp, a Belles amp needs a Belles pre-amp. That's a ridiculous statement. Yes, I'd take the Aleph P too over the 750 if money was no object.

    Not every pre and amps manufactured are made for strictly 2 channels so you can't generalize that. I meant 2 channel stuff strictly. If the manufacturer advertised like they are a mate, then it is. Such as GFP750 and GFA5802.

    Yep, I know it sounds ridiculous but ain't it the truth. People choose different pre coz they think they don't like the sounds coming from the matching components. Yep, I fully understand the concept of Synergy and and Yep, I do that too (using different pre and different amps till I later found out I am just walking around the curves and not a straight line and I am back at same spot where I start off with).

    Still, I place my money in the piggy banks for P and worries about some soul things later. And at the later time, the GFP750 sounds like a money bank for the soul thingies.

    By the way, you aren't the one complaining about the dynamics, right? :D
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
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  • reeltrouble1
    reeltrouble1 Posts: 9,312
    edited September 2010
    heiney9 wrote: »
    That's a ridiculous statement.

    I might ascertain an axiom allocating applying an avenue about gear within a line made by the same manufacturer generally working well together. of coure its.....just my imagination, Absolut anyone....

    RT1
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited September 2010
    If I had any complaints I'd say at time the dynamics I have can be too startling. I still strongly disagree with your statements about having to use a manufacturer matching set.

    Mega, send me $1K and I'll sell the 750 and buy a "P" :D. Oh wait make that $1.5K because I want a remote "P"

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited September 2010
    heiney9 wrote: »
    If I had any complaints I'd say at time the dynamics I have can be too startling. I still strongly disagree with your statements about having to use a manufacturer matching set.

    Mega, send me $1K and I'll sell the 750 and buy a "P" :D. Oh wait make that $1.5K because I want a remote "P"

    H9

    Well, you don't have to adhere to my statement. Just simply saying that they are meant to be sounds great together.

    Now, come on. I've seen Remote P for about 1.5K. You can get half of that from the GFP750. I would ditch some souls stashed in the drawer for the other half. Looks like you are keeping a lot of soul things that you aren't using.

    Who knows? Nelson will probably bless and sign on the Aleph P for you coz you loved the GFP750 so much.
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited September 2010
    After RT1's scathing statements about the 750 the value has dropped in the used market, so you'd still need to send me about $1K to get an "P" w/remote.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited September 2010
    So, how much are the GFP750 worth now? I remembered they are about 7 - 8 bills before.

    Anyway, I buy souls from the devil advocates if anyone interest to sell. Just sign the contract and the cash is yours to keep. :D

    I didn't know RT1 had so much fun. I guess I missed the fun then. :p
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
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  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited September 2010
    Since the gain stages(the most important part) in both the Aleph P and 750 are essentially identical the only significant difference should be in the quality of the passive parts etc.I'll opt for a 750 and use some of the saved funds for upgrading the coupling caps and such.
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited September 2010
    reeltrouble1 wrote: »
    I might ascertain an axiom allocating applying an avenue about gear within a line made by the same manufacturer generally working well together. of coure its.....just my imagination, Absolut anyone....

    RT1

    I don't disagree one bit, perhaps I read too much into Mega's statement in that he was alluding to the fact that you can't get as good or better performance or synergy using another brand.

    I agree that all things being equal keeping it all within the same line with higher end gear is a great way to go, but not the only way.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited September 2010
    FTGV wrote: »
    Since the gain stages(the most important part) in both the Aleph P and 750 are essentially identical the only significant difference should be in the quality of the passive parts etc.I'll opt for a 750 and use some of the saved funds for upgrading the coupling caps and such.

    Well Fred I hope you can make some simple recommendations this Fall when I want to replace those caps. Because as far as I have read, that is about the only nit pik most people have. And as you and other's with great knowledge have pointed out they used just mediocre caps in that position.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited September 2010
    What values are in the signal path?
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited September 2010
    FTGV wrote: »
    Since the gain stages(the most important part) in both the Aleph P and 750 are essentially identical the only significant difference should be in the quality of the passive parts etc.I'll opt for a 750 and use some of the saved funds for upgrading the coupling caps and such.

    Still, I would put my money on P coz they looks better together. I am helping to stimulate here....economy...mood, etc.
    heiney9 wrote: »
    perhaps I read too much into Mega's statement in that he was alluding to the fact that you can't get as good or better performance or synergy using another brand.

    I agree that all things being equal keeping it all within the same line with higher end gear is a great way to go, but not the only way.

    H9

    Don't you always read a little too much? May be read again? I didn't say you can't get as well or as good as matching lines. They are already matched for you so you can spare the agony of trying to find the good and nice matching pair. :D
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
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  • reeltrouble1
    reeltrouble1 Posts: 9,312
    edited September 2010
    scuttlebutt is H9 will be pants at the fest, speaker specialists spanking heiney hiney.

    RT1
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited September 2010
    megasat16 wrote: »
    Still, I would put my money on P coz they looks better together. I am helping to stimulate here....economy...mood, etc.



    Don't you always read a little too much? May be read again? I didn't say you can't get as well or as good as matching lines. They are already matched for you so you can spare the agony of trying to find the good and nice matching pair. :D


    Reading is all we have on this text based forum :D.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited September 2010
    Face wrote: »
    What values are in the signal path?

    Signal path for H9, I think the value for remote P is about 1.5K. Yep, Push Pull for F5. ;)
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
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  • reeltrouble1
    reeltrouble1 Posts: 9,312
    edited September 2010
    heiney9 wrote: »
    Reading is all we have on this text based forum :D.

    H9

    we used to have some interesting pictures. well, as far as audio that guts thread is pretty good.

    RT1
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  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited September 2010
    heiney9 wrote: »
    ...I hope you can make some simple recommendations this Fall when I want to replace those caps.
    Sure.
    megasat16 wrote: »
    Still, I would put my money on P coz they looks better together. I am helping to stimulate here....economy...mood, etc.
    Sure the chassis of the P looks a lot more substantial and there are some better parts sprinkled around here and there.Interestingly I have seen two different chassis designs for it but I think I prefer the 750's cosmetics to both of them.
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  • Hawkeye
    Hawkeye Posts: 1,313
    edited September 2010
    I was going to suggest trying some well recorded music! Can't comment on any of the pieces you guy's are arguing about! It's in the recording! Despite the gear!!!

    What the hell do I know? I'm a SDA newb!

    Gordon
    2 Channel -
    Martin Logan Spire, 2 JL Audio F112 subs
    McIntosh C1000 Controller with Tube pre amp, 2 MC501 amplifiers, MD1K Transport & DAC, MR-88 Tuner
    WireWorld Eclipse 6.0 speaker wire and jumpers, Eclipse 5^2 Squared Balanced IC's. Silver Eclipse PCs (5)
    Symposium Rollerblocks 2+ (16)Black Diamond Racing Mk 3 pits (8)
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  • reeltrouble1
    reeltrouble1 Posts: 9,312
    edited September 2010
    I think a solid days worth of My Name is Earl re-runs should do it for them.

    RT1--Tubes Rule.
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  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited September 2010
    reeltrouble1 wrote: »
    I think a solid days worth of My Name is Earl re-runs should do it for them.
    What channel is running the Earl marathon?I think I'll skip my lawn bowling tourney and watch that instead.
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  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited September 2010
    reeltrouble1 wrote: »
    This must be the place.

    RT1
    "I reckon, if there's no other place around the place, I reckon this must be the place, I reckon"
    ~ Curly Howard

    Haven't read through the entire thread but when I owned SRSs I found them to be very sensitive to room placement vs. my 1.2 TLs and I would definitely check out some room treatments. The room I had my SRSs in was far from ideal. Also someone mentions to get an amp that doubles at a 4 ohm load. I did this with my SRS at the time by buying NAD 2200 PE and that did make all the difference in the world at low volume and at high volumes it didn't struggle not one bit.

    Believe it or not the room I had my SRSs in they sounded best right up against the back wall.

    Also, with my 1.2 TLs I currently have my sitting place on a couch right up against the back wall. There was horrible back-splash off the back walls especially with upper mids and highs. Since I couldn't afford room treatments, I placed relatively thick couch pillows across the top of the couch. This improved the back-splash tremendously and also help with lower volume listening with the dynamics.

    Spike will also help tighten the bass up. You can get spike from Myesound with the brass pads to protect hardwood floors. Here the link;

    http://www.myesound.com/Points_n_pads.html
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