How much

VR3
VR3 Posts: 28,746
edited June 2010 in DIY, Mods & Tweaks
How much labor will one of you goobs charge me to modify two crossovers? Just the tweeter network and resistors.
- Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
Post edited by VR3 on
· Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
«1

Comments

  • toucanet
    toucanet Posts: 580
    edited May 2010
    Sounds like a job for Ben.

    He recently did mine and I am enjoying the difference.

    Good luck.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    Alright -- Hopefully he will PM me or something...

    I want to upgrade the tweeter network on these Def Techs -- it tamed the highs on my BP10B back in the day and I think it will do the trick here for sure...
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    Real tiny xover board - real basic, air core on the tweet, iron core on the woof...

    Im going to line the inner cabinet with sound barrier for parts express too...

    Gotta bring these speakers a little more up to snuff with the Tylers...
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    Pics
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    For as little parts that are on there - I think Ill just do the whole thing... I mean my BP10B had twice as many parts....
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    I dont know how the network is right now...

    Im thinking Solen capacitors with a Dayton film and foil bypass cap on the tweeter network...

    Mills resistors
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    Woofer network -

    22 uF
    8.2 uF
    5w 30uj

    Tweeter network
    6.8 uF
    5w 1uj
    5w .47uj
    5w 20uj

    There are the values of the parts
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    Heres what I came up with

    Solen 2.0uF 400V Polypropylene Capacitor
    Solen 6.8uF 400V Polypropylene Capacitor
    Solen 8.2uF 400V Polypropylene Capacito
    Solen 20uF 400V Polypropylene Capacitor
    Mills 0.5 Ohm 12W Non-Inductive Resistor
    Mills 1 Ohm 12W Non-Inductive Resisto
    Mills 20 Ohm 12W Non-Inductive Resistor
    Mills 30 Ohm 12W Non-Inductive Resistor
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited May 2010
    Vr3MxStyler2k3 wrote: »
    I want to upgrade the tweeter network on these Def Techs -- it tamed the highs on my BP10B back in the day and I think it will do the trick here for sure...
    Be aware that film caps have lower ESR(series resistance)than do electrolytics.So while changing the 'lytic' cap in series with tweet to a film type should improve hi frequency detail it may also sound a bit brighter.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    Dayton DFFC-0.01 0.01uF 400V By-Pass Capacitor

    Throw one of those on the 6.8 in the tweeter network

    Thanks for the info - I have done a similiar modification to the BP10B a few years back and found positive results with the bypass cap... so hopefully this will do the same since it has the same tweeter and midbass
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • zingo
    zingo Posts: 11,258
    edited May 2010
    I can do the solder work if Ben doesn't want to and you are okay shipping them.
    Jake
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    Here is the new thought process

    Dayton DFFC-0.01 0.01uF 400V By-Pass Capacitor x2 (surrounds)
    Mills 0.5 Ohm 12W Non-Inductive Resistor x4
    Mills 1 Ohm 12W Non-Inductive Resistor x4
    Mills 20 Ohm 12W Non-Inductive Resistor x4
    Mills 30 Ohm 12W Non-Inductive Resistor x4
    Dayton PMPC-6.8 6.8uF 250V Precision Audio Capacitor x2 (surrounds)
    Dayton PMPC-8.2 8.2uF 250V Precision Audio Capacitor x2 (center)
    Dayton PMPC-20 20uF 250V Precision Audio Capacitor x2 (center)
    Dayton PMPC-2.0 2.0uF 250V Precision Audio Capacitor x2 (center)
    Auricap 6.8uF 400V Capacitor x2 (center)
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    After some digging in my old email address I found some pics of the BP10B crossovers I had done back in the day

    Very similar size crossover.. similar config

    Thoughts?
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    The project is under way --

    Ordered 3/4" sonic barrier and all the caps mentioned above.

    Should be here in a few days.

    The second pair of Def Techs should be here in a week or so...

    Yep yep!

    In all honesty, the Def Techs are kind of ****... lol

    The enclosure is built nice - but zero dampening at all in the cabinet - just a little bit of cheap poly fill...

    The crossover network have the cheapest components you can find...

    But I will fix all that and bring them up to snuff... should sound fantastic!
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    Alright - I received the first thing of Sonic Barrier and the second order of crossover parts for the surrounds...

    Just trying to see how I can fit all of this on there without weighing down the board and with some extended leads I think this will work...
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited May 2010
    Which model of Def Tech's are you working on?I must say the stock xover parts are about as poor quality as I have seen from a big name brand speak.I would expect your upgrades to be well worth the effort.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited May 2010
    Mounting the resistors underneath?
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    thats the current plan but the mills are a good bit smaller than the current resistors - so they may actually fit on the board, if not - underneath should work fine
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    Def tech is notorious for using really **** crossover parts and inflating specs

    But I actually like their general sound signature and due to past experience know with xover mods can be good speakers.

    The speakers I am working on right now are the Studiomonitor 450...

    The cabinets on DT are pretty nice...

    Usually 3/4" MDF sides and tops - the front and back (where drivers are mounted) are usually 1 to 1.5" medite (thicker than MDF and stronger)

    So the cabinets are usually a good start but their towers usually have lackluster bracing.
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    Heres a xover out of DTs totl center channel ($1200)

    Same **** parts - just more of them
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited May 2010
    That's pretty awful for a $1200 speaker.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    Yup - god awful.

    I really like Def Tech speakers - dont get me wrong. But they definitely play the field with their stuff.

    Their average model lasts 10 years -- very little changes when they do change models.

    Their drivers are usually pretty stellar -- their 6.5" midbass is highly regarded.

    But they usually use pretty cheap parts - and not to mention, while I like the grill sock + cap look, you gotta admit its a pretty cheap alternative to a good finish haha
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited May 2010
    Vr3MxStyler2k3 wrote: »
    Heres a xover out of DTs totl center channel ($1200)

    Same **** parts - just more of them
    Thats nasty:eek:Those ferrite core coils are prone to saturation distortion.It looks like they have added another steel laminate bar on top to help prevent it?
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    They seem to like to use iron core inductors on the midbasses - not sure why.

    This particular centers has a powered 10" sub - the crossover is shared with that speaker as well as the amp itself is volume and phase.
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited May 2010
    Vr3MxStyler2k3 wrote: »
    They seem to like to use iron core inductors on the midbasses - not sure why.
    Yeah after a closer look it appears that the center rods are laminated and not ferrite.Thats certainly better but not as good as air cores which will not be prone to saturation distortion but cost considerably more because of the extra copper needed to wind them.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    What do you use to extend the wires on the capacitors?
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited May 2010
    Chassis wire or other the remains of other trimmed leads.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited May 2010
    Face wrote: »
    That's pretty awful for a $1200 speaker.
    Mike have you ever seen a pic of a Theil xover?Some models are littered with 'lytics' and your fave Solens.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    Hope you guys dont mind me posting in this thread - its kind of like my notepad...

    lol

    R1 = 30uj
    R2 = 1uj
    R3 = .47uj
    R4 = 20uj
    c1 = 22uf
    c2 = 8.2uf
    c3 = 6.8uf

    Im such a nerd - I want to start on this right now lol
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,746
    edited May 2010
    This may show my noobism in soldering and capacitors...

    But since the 22uf is a 20 and a 2 -- can I just connect one lead from the 20uf and a lead from the 2uf together - then back into the slot I would otherwise have to extend?

    Sorry if this is a stupid question
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter