Onkyo Fans Rejoice! TX-SR805 Very Cool!

2

Comments

  • cheddarcheddar Posts: 2,390
    edited July 2007
    Well, it looks like hdmi 1.3 comes out in several early adopter versions. And both the xa2 and the ps3 may have been released a little too early. I have read that both may not pass audio bitstream over hdmi. Although the xa2 may be updatable at some point. The new bdp-s300 appears to still be a mystery as far as what it supports.

    The specific problem with the ps3 is that the hdmi chipset it shipped with is the Si9132. Which handles the deep color aspect of the 1.3 spec but not the bitstream audio. The newer Si9134 and Si9135 chips were not available in volume at the time of production. So I'm doubting now whether an upgrade via firmware is even possible because if it's a hardware limitation, then firmware may simply not be able to bridge the gap.

    However, I'm not sure what you mean by the ps3 not being able to decode TrueHD. If you look at the 'top' of the console if you stand it on its side, there is very clearly a TrueHD logo because the ps3 decodes the bitstream internally and instead of dumping it out to analog outs (which it lacks) it sends it out over pcm via hdmi. So the only thing missing on the ps3 at this point is DTS-MA since the third lossless track, uncompressed PCM (On Sony and Disney releases), requires no decoding and has long been available via hdmi 1.1 and up receivers. DTS-MA is a lossless audio track the same as TrueHD and is available on almost all the releases from the Fox studio. The ps3 currently only plays the DTS 'core' track on the Fox releases and unless the bdp-s300 is HDMI bitstream capable, it would still seem that there isn't any way to get this DTS-MA track decoded even with the new receivers. Since there aren't any hd-dvd studios that use DTS-MA, it would appear that there isn't any use for these new receivers at the moment except as future proofing until we can get confirmation that there is actually a player released in either format that can actually handle the advanced codec bitstreams over hdmi.

    Bummer that hdmi seems to have taken so long to get itself together. Maybe the s300 has the proper chipset...can anyone confirm this?

    Edit: Of course you can still use the ps3 to listen to both high resolution TrueHD and uncompressed PCM tracks with these Onkyo receivers. But not by taking advantage of the internal decoders of the receiver available in the HDMI 1.3 spec...and although the hdmi 1.3 part of the ps3 may not be firmware upgradable, it still may be possible for Sony to release an internal decoder for the DTS-MA tracks. At which point the HDMI 1.3 audio capabilities would become redundant...
  • scottvampscottvamp Posts: 3,297
    edited July 2007
    cheddar, thanks buddy. That helps alot. I'm probably going to go ahead and pick this 805 up. Your my PS3 informative.;)
    PS3 and HD Front Projection, life is good. Too bad Blu-Ray and the PS3 are already obsolete.....:rolleyes:
  • G-forceG-force Posts: 82
    edited July 2007
    I picked one of these up last week and am very impressed thus far.

    I paid $800 with overnight shipping included and no tax.

    Incredible feature/cost ratio!
  • scottvampscottvamp Posts: 3,297
    edited July 2007
    G-force wrote: »
    I picked one of these up last week and am very impressed thus far.

    I paid $800 with overnight shipping included and no tax.

    Incredible feature/cost ratio!

    Yep, i am VERY pleased with this unit. Sexy a$$ 50lbs unit. One of the best buys in the HT market. Handles everything i throw at it. 5 video sources with one HDMI cable to the projector. SWEET!
    With my dual amp fans, it runs as cool as can be. Guts are very well laid out. Alot of thought went into it. Audyssey self calibration is freaking stellar. Best THX DSP's i have ever heard. Leaps and bounds over past DSP's.
    Blu-Rays sound amazing. Too bad they suppose to be obsolete already. Dam PS3 $500 paperweight.:rolleyes: I make funny!!!!!!!:D
    http://www.audyssey.com/
    PS3 and HD Front Projection, life is good. Too bad Blu-Ray and the PS3 are already obsolete.....:rolleyes:
  • olilugoolilugo Posts: 405
    edited July 2007
    if your DVD player is connected to your new Onkyo TX-SR805 using HDMI and the receiver using also hdmi is connected to your tv.

    Can you watch a movie using only the TV and the dvd, and not turn on the receiver... I know what you are thinking why would you ever do something crazy like that... I have small kids and sometimes they don't want to use the receiver it is too loud and scary for them.

    I just wanted to know if there is pass through if the receiver is OFF.
    This feature seams to be present in the Pioneer Elite VSX-82TXS.
    I am also looking for a new receiver and the onkyo and the pioneer are in my short list :-)
    Current HT setup
    Mains: B&W 804s
    Center: Polk CSi5
    Surround: Polk FXi3
    Sub: Velodyne DLS-3750R
    Receiver: Pioneer SC-07
    Amplifier: Sunfire TGA5200
    TV: Sony KDS60A2020
    DBP: Sony DBP-S350
    CDP: Pioneer DV-48AV
    Interconnect cables: SignalCable analog II
    speaker cables: SignalCable Ultra Speaker Cables Bi-wire
  • scottvampscottvamp Posts: 3,297
    edited July 2007
    You are right, that is a crazy question for ME. My 805 is on a projector and not a TV. I have never used internal sound on a tv before.
    But to answer you question, i would have to say a no. Even my HDMI 3:1 switcher hub had to have power to it. The point of receiver like this is to be able to switch between sources, sound and video. (which you can custom name on this unit).
    So i guess you can turn it down, all the way down or wear earphones........
    PS3 and HD Front Projection, life is good. Too bad Blu-Ray and the PS3 are already obsolete.....:rolleyes:
  • FaceFace Posts: 14,714
    edited July 2007
    On my TX674, you can set the maximum volume wherever you like. Maybe you could just lower it for the little ones?
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
  • ben62670ben62670 Posts: 16,077
    edited July 2007
    The receiver looks good for 8ohm operation, but even at 6ohms the amp suffers pretty bad. They change the way how they rate the power to .1% at 1 kHz. That is a pretty lame output compared to the 130 very clean. The dampening factor is also a bit sloppy at only 60 again rated at 1 kHz. Lots of bells and whistles, but lacking at the driving stages. The pre outs save it a bit, but you would probably want at least a 2 channel amp for any speakers less than 8 ohms.
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
  • cheddarcheddar Posts: 2,390
    edited July 2007
    But since the preamps with these features are slow in coming, it actually makes a pretty good preamp option. Any one know when any hdmi 1.3 preamps will be hitting the street...at less than seven grand? I've been waiting patiently...
  • GaaraGaara Posts: 2,416
    edited July 2007
    You mean like the Integra DTC 9.8?
  • ben62670ben62670 Posts: 16,077
    edited July 2007
    What I don't understand is why so many people care about having HDMI 1.3 switching. I would think that audio choice would come first as in quality PrePro vs simple HDMI switching. I would think one could add a good switch if really necessary. I understand why some would want a receiver to handle surrounds, and center + an amp for 2 channel, but to purchase a receiver for the bells, and whistles does not make sense to me. Just my 2 cents.
    Ben
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
  • cheddarcheddar Posts: 2,390
    edited July 2007
    It's not the switching. It's the internal audio decoding of the pre/pro I'm looking for. TrueHD and DTS-MA lossless. I usually buy my stuff with future upgrades in mind. I probably won't use my ps3 to play blu-rays forever. When I go high end, I'll probably want some flexibility in what electronics decode what signal. Getting at least hdmi 1.3 gives me wiggle room in what I get for a future upgrade. It's saved my **** before from having to replace an expensive component because it lacked an interface that became standard...
  • ben62670ben62670 Posts: 16,077
    edited July 2007
    Just a ? I don't have any experience with HD. Don't the Players have built in decoding to send out via coaxial out or 7.1 direct input?
    Thanks Ben
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
  • GaaraGaara Posts: 2,416
    edited July 2007
    It is to my understanding that the players can't send out TrueHD and DTS-MA over coax or optical. They can send out DD and DTS but not the higher res signals.
  • cheddarcheddar Posts: 2,390
    edited July 2007
    ben62670 wrote: »
    Just a ? I don't have any experience with HD. Don't the Players have built in decoding to send out via coaxial out or 7.1 direct input?
    Thanks Ben

    Yes, they do. But not via optical or digital coax for the lossless formats. Your only option for passing a digital signal to the pre/pro without resorting to the sacd/dvd-a like analog outs is via hdmi. And your only option for having the pre/pro doing the actual decoding instead of the chips in the player is via hdmi 1.3.

    Edit: People pay a lot of money to have proprietary digital connections like denon-link on their high end gear for sacd and dvd-a. I'm not sure what the future holds, but hdmi 1.3 would seem like it has the capability to become an industry standard way of tranferring digital bitstreams to the receiver or pre/pro. Gaara, was a few seconds behind you on the button...;)
  • ben62670ben62670 Posts: 16,077
    edited July 2007
    There is no 7.1 analog RCA outs on HD players?
    Thanks again Ben
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
  • cheddarcheddar Posts: 2,390
    edited July 2007
    Yes, there are. You can transfer the signal analog with blu-ray or hd-dvd just like you can with sacd and dvd-a. But then you don't have the option of letting the receiver or pre/pro do the digital processing.
  • ben62670ben62670 Posts: 16,077
    edited July 2007
    cheddar wrote: »
    Yes, there are. You can transfer the signal analog with blu-ray or hd-dvd just like you can with sacd and dvd-a.

    Thanks. I was a little concerned about future upgrades with my 990 Pre.
    Ben
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
  • cheddarcheddar Posts: 2,390
    edited July 2007
    Now you know why I want as many connection options on an expensive pre/pro as I can get...;) If I spend all that coin for the electronics in the pre/pro, I sure want the option of running all my digital signals through the thing...
  • woofiepawswoofiepaws Posts: 212
    edited July 2007
    scottvamp wrote: »
    Yep, i am VERY pleased with this unit. Sexy a$$ 50lbs unit. One of the best buys in the HT market. Handles everything i throw at it. 5 video sources with one HDMI cable to the projector. SWEET!
    With my dual amp fans, it runs as cool as can be. Guts are very well laid out. Alot of thought went into it. Audyssey self calibration is freaking stellar. Best THX DSP's i have ever heard. Leaps and bounds over past DSP's.
    Blu-Rays sound amazing. Too bad they suppose to be obsolete already. Dam PS3 $500 paperweight.:rolleyes: I make funny!!!!!!!:D
    http://www.audyssey.com/

    How is the Audyssey feature working out? My living room is a nightmare of valuted ceilings, prow front, open at one side and open at irregular places in the back. Until I build a better room, Audyssey for $800 sounds like a bargin.
    MacBook Pro running Roon-Monoprice USB-Schiit Gungir Multibit-Audioquest Earth-Schiit Freya with Tung Sol 6SN7s-Audioquest Sky-Krell FPB 400cx-Audioquest Mont Blanc-1.2tls with all the mods.
  • olilugoolilugo Posts: 405
    edited July 2007
    I have to add, having one HDMI 1.3a cable vs. 8 RCA analog cables to support 7.1 sound. I would go with a simple one cable approach any time of the day.

    Technology rules!!! :-)
    Current HT setup
    Mains: B&W 804s
    Center: Polk CSi5
    Surround: Polk FXi3
    Sub: Velodyne DLS-3750R
    Receiver: Pioneer SC-07
    Amplifier: Sunfire TGA5200
    TV: Sony KDS60A2020
    DBP: Sony DBP-S350
    CDP: Pioneer DV-48AV
    Interconnect cables: SignalCable analog II
    speaker cables: SignalCable Ultra Speaker Cables Bi-wire
  • WilliamM2WilliamM2 Posts: 4,703
    edited July 2007
    But since the preamps with these features are slow in coming, it actually makes a pretty good preamp option. Any one know when any hdmi 1.3 preamps will be hitting the street...at less than seven grand?

    There are two that I know of, amd they are well under 7K.

    The Integra 9.8, which is $1599, and my local dealer will not budge from retail:
    http://www.integrahometheater.com/model.cfm?m=DTC-9.8&class=Separates&p=i

    And the Onkyo Pro version, which is identical, except for cosmetics. These retail for $1799, but I have been quoted as low as $1335, which seems like a steal:
    http://www.onkyopro.com/model.cfm?m=PR-SC885P&class=Preamplifier&p=i
  • cheddarcheddar Posts: 2,390
    edited July 2007
    Thanks all for the info on the integra. Could be just the thing I'm looking for. I really don't feel right about paying for amplification I won't use. I've been a loyal denon consumer for a long time. But Onkyo seems to have stepped up to the plate with an affordable pre/pro first. Time to do some research on it...
  • FaceFace Posts: 14,714
    edited July 2007
    woofiepaws wrote: »
    How is the Audyssey feature working out? My living room is a nightmare of valuted ceilings, prow front, open at one side and open at irregular places in the back. Until I build a better room, Audyssey for $800 sounds like a bargin.
    My TX674 has the Audyssey feature also. I wasn't impressed with it, it made the sound kind of dull.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
  • FaceFace Posts: 14,714
    edited July 2007
    Btw, if your HDDVD player(ex. Xbox 360) decodes TruHD, all you need is a HDMI receiver than can accept audio through HDMI to enjoy TruHD. I wish I would have waited on the XBox Elite.

    I'll probably hold off buying a new pre-pro till I can get one that'll tune in HDRadio.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
  • scottvampscottvamp Posts: 3,297
    edited July 2007
    woofiepaws wrote: »
    How is the Audyssey feature working out? My living room is a nightmare of valuted ceilings, prow front, open at one side and open at irregular places in the back. Until I build a better room, Audyssey for $800 sounds like a bargin.

    I was very impressed. Every audiophile reviews i have been very positive. A couple page write up in the new HT mag. I have the same room as you i have no complaint. The biggest thing Audyssey does is clean up your subwoofer. My SVS is very "controlled" now. I was a bit boomy and over aggressive. Now it is tight and lower.
    PS3 and HD Front Projection, life is good. Too bad Blu-Ray and the PS3 are already obsolete.....:rolleyes:
  • woofiepawswoofiepaws Posts: 212
    edited July 2007
    scottvamp wrote: »
    I was very impressed. Every audiophile reviews i have been very positive. A couple page write up in the new HT mag. I have the same room as you i have no complaint. The biggest thing Audyssey does is clean up your subwoofer. My SVS is very "controlled" now. I was a bit boomy and over aggressive. Now it is tight and lower.

    This may be what I am looking for. The sub is hard to get right and one wall had a dead zone for the mids.

    Thanks!
    MacBook Pro running Roon-Monoprice USB-Schiit Gungir Multibit-Audioquest Earth-Schiit Freya with Tung Sol 6SN7s-Audioquest Sky-Krell FPB 400cx-Audioquest Mont Blanc-1.2tls with all the mods.
  • cheddarcheddar Posts: 2,390
    edited July 2007
    Face wrote: »
    Btw, if your HDDVD player(ex. Xbox 360) decodes TruHD, all you need is a HDMI receiver than can accept audio through HDMI to enjoy TruHD. I wish I would have waited on the XBox Elite.

    I'll probably hold off buying a new pre-pro till I can get one that'll tune in HDRadio.

    I know that the ps3 can pass decoded TrueHD via pcm over at least hdmi 1.1. This is the same process that dedicated HD players use when passing the decoded signal over hdmi 1.1 and above.

    But I don't think that the 360 can handle lossless formats in any flavor. It simply downconverts the high quality signal to DD.

    http://www.engadget.com/2007/04/26/xbox-360-elite-vs-classic-the-test/
    We can now definitely confirm that despite its HDMI output, the Xbox 360 Elite still doesn't enable advanced codec support (like Dolby TrueHD). You still have the same three options as you had before: digital stereo, Dolby Digital 5.1, and DD with WMA Pro. When we played back an HD DVD with TrueHD audio (Batman Begins), it just stayed on DD5.1, nothing else happened. Bummer. But again, that's what we were expecting.
  • FaceFace Posts: 14,714
    edited July 2007
    I thought that was fixed in the last xbox online update.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
  • cheddarcheddar Posts: 2,390
    edited July 2007
    Face wrote: »
    I thought that was fixed in the last xbox online update.

    Well, the big hd-dvd add-on update doesn't mention anything about trueHD capabilities being added. Instead it talks about the same lower quality audio selections as the other article I quoted. You have to be very careful about saying that the 360 can be 'fixed' by firmware updates. As there may be nothing at all wrong with the 360. It may just be limited hardware wise in what it is capable of and TrueHD lossless audio decoding and transmission may just be beyond its capabilities.

    http://www.tgdaily.com/content/view/32042/98/
    In addition, the new update allows users to select digital stereo, Dolby Digital 5.1, DTS 5.1, or WMA Pro as the default audio output.
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