R50s to RTi8s as an experiment

Ron Temple · September 2006

Ok it's 2:00AM so don't be too critical...

I was bored today...just upgraded my screen to a 57"1080P Mits DLP...thought about front speaks (LS90s) but passed...said screw it let's see what the RTi sounds like matched with my CSi3.

I've been pretty happy with the R50/CSi3/R15 performance even after listening to a friends Ascend 340se fronts, 170se surrounds running through a HK 330, as well as, GR Research AV2s all around run on Marantz with 180w monblocks on these 4 ohm speaks. I preferred the AV2s by a wide margin over the 340se's, but thought the Ascends were an upgrade over the R50s, but not a killer upgrade (to my ears). I went to Magnolia for an hour or two and listened to Viena Acoustics Mozarts and was very impressed, but not blown away. Listened to some LSi15s and 7s with similar results (another store).

I'm getting to a point...I've been listening to speakers.

Anyway, bored, wife gone for the weekend, why don't I go to Frys and try out some 8's...what will it hurt...I don't have the front end to power LSi's, RTi10s or 12s and I can
always return them.

So I picked them up, hooked them up, calibrated and listened to some DVD A content, mostly Porcupine Tree, getting to be my favorite band, excellent 5.1 mixes. Well it was better. Kind of like the R50s on steriods. No breakup or compression at higher volumes etc...and then I started to notice some things. Everything seemed more live, real punch, better bass (though my sub was never lacking), the midrange started to expand, imaging improved, then oops...seemed like I was listening to different recordings and content...wtf...

Suffice to say, I've stayed up past my bedtime, totally juiced, checking out movies and concerts...whole new ballgame. I'm not easily impressed outside my home, but the Rti8s are much better than I expected and since they are in my house, a 1/3rd of the price of the VA's, 2/3rds of the AV2s(without me having to spend $2Gs on the front end), I've got to say I'm impressed and may have to keep them.

I've been a member for over a year, but am really just starting to realize the value of Polk speakers. The entry level product is good enough that upgrades had better be excellent or you won't bother. The RTi line, while I'd heard it in store, is blowing me away at home. Who'd a thunk...

halo · September 2006

Glad to hear the "experiment" worked out. The CSi3 is a better match to the RTi's. The CSi25 is the match to the R series. Maybe that has something to do with it? I own the R series in my HT. The only thing holding me back from upgrading to the RTi's is the $.

Early B. · September 2006

Dammit, now you gotta upgrade to a Csi5. While you're at it, change out those rear speakers, too, especially if you play music in 5.1.

Speakers set up in stores usually sound horrible. Gotta test drive them to know what they really sound like.

BTW, glad you're lovin' the RTi8's.

Ron Temple · September 2006

Early B. wrote:

Dammit, now you gotta upgrade to a Csi5. While you're at it, change out those rear speakers, too, especially if you play music in 5.1.

Ya know, I almost walked out with 4s for surround, but I figured I'd probably take the 8s back. I really am/was considering heading north of the RTi line. Now I'm not exactly sure.

I'd love the CSi5, but it won't fit...a common problem.

I'm looking for a warm, refined, defined sound. The LSis might be the ticket, but as said, the 8s are surprising me. They are more speaker than I expected.

Sherardp · September 2006

awesome experiment, keep the 8s for awhile, add the rti4s and see how the whole rig sounds to you. You may end up being very content in the end. I know I have.

Willow · September 2006

Ron Temple wrote:

Ya know, I almost walked out with 4s for surround, but I figured I'd probably take the 8s back. I really am/was considering heading north of the RTi line. Now I'm not exactly sure.

I'd love the CSi5, but it won't fit...a common problem.

I'm looking for a warm, refined, defined sound. The LSis might be the ticket, but as said, the 8s are surprising me. They are more speaker than I expected.

Heck if you get the 4's our systems will be the same. I am powering my 8s with my HK335 it's also powering my csi3 (same as you due to size limitations) and I have 4's as rears. Now I know I need an amp...but suffice to say that I am very pleased. Now did you remove those brass jumpers and add better ones?
Glad to hear you are enjoying your new speaks. What a better time than when the wife is away... that's when I crank mine up more than usual as well.
Keep us posted

Ron Temple · September 2006

Willow wrote:

Now I know I need an amp...

Even the little Audiosource AmpOne I'm using makes a "big" difference. I can't bear to listen to the R50s without it. Won't even try the 8s with just the receiver. I lose too much detail.

Oops...just measured, looks like I can fit a CSi5 in the TV stand...maybe I can convince my wife to stay away a couple more days ;^)

Early B. · September 2006

Ron Temple wrote:

I'm looking for a warm, refined, defined sound. The LSis might be the ticket...

The RTi series certainly ain't considered to be warm and refined. As you mentioned, that's the domain of the Lsi series. If that's what you really want, then you won't be content with the Rti series. If you can afford it, just go straight to Lsi's all around, and get a multi-channel amp to power them.

Ron Temple · September 2006

Early B. wrote:

The RTi series certainly ain't considered to be warm and refined. As you mentioned, that's the domain of the Lsi series. If that's what you really want, then you won't be content with the Rti series. If you can afford it, just go straight to Lsi's all around, and get a multi-channel amp to power them.

Warmer than I expected, nice imaging and detail...larger upgrade than I thought.

I've got the LSis in the back of my mind for down the road, but this was spur of the moment. I'll check the 8s out very well before I make a final decision.

BIZILL · September 2006

save that hard earned cash and keep the rti 8's. then get yourself hooked up with some rti 4's or 6's 'round back or even try the fxi3's or 5's. if you go with lsi's up front, you may have to change to all lsi's. and that would be much more expensivo than going with the rti's.

Sherardp · September 2006

BIZILL wrote:

save that hard earned cash and keep the rti 8's. then get yourself hooked up with some rti 4's or 6's 'round back or even try the fxi3's or 5's. if you go with lsi's up front, you may have to change to all lsi's. and that would be much more expensivo than going with the rti's.

Agreed

Ron Temple · September 2006

BIZILL wrote:

save that hard earned cash and keep the rti 8's. then get yourself hooked up with some rti 4's or 6's 'round back or even try the fxi3's or 5's. if you go with lsi's up front, you may have to change to all lsi's. and that would be much more expensivo than going with the rti's.

Certainly is the more economic solution;) . It's not a question of money, just timing. If I keep the RTis, I'll want to know I'm satisfied and not get the itch next year. WAF isn't really an issue, but I feel guilty about a never ending stream of toys, unlike some here (you know who you are

). If the 8s stay, 4s or 6s will follow, a 5 and maybe some FXs...and more power...and bass traps...and an SMS-01...or a DD15...and a new bedroom set and a diamond ring (choke)...

Ern Dog · September 2006

I did the same thing recently and bought my HK-635 "to test it out against my Onkyo and then I'll return it." I was only fooling myself because I knew it would sound awesome. So I kept it and then the guilt came and last a few days- then it was gone. Getting new gear is so much fun, you can't beat it. So, I say keep the Rti8's and get the whole enchilada as you mentioned.

Ron Temple · September 2006

Some of the blush has worn off. Some content, depending on my mood, can seem a bit harsh, others smooth as silk. I think it's the tweets, because the midrange is outstanding. Power, interconnects, sources would probably change impressions, but that's what this is all about. I've got what i've got. I have them crossed at 80 and haven't experimented because they (by ear) seem to blend better with the sub than the R50s. I had a 10db hole between 40 - 60hz. I'm getting better upper bass definition...better slope I suppose.

I like these speakers a bunch. I'll give them some time to grow or diminish on me.

VR3 · September 2006

If you do mostly music...

Try your Xover around 55hz

aaharvel · September 2006

Vr3MxStyler2k3 wrote:

If you do mostly music...

Try your Xover around 55hz

Yes. I have my avr's crossover for all 5 speakers set to 60 and I find it MUCH cleaner sounding than an 80hz crossover and I have the smallest rti's in the lineup.

VR3 · September 2006

80hz is NASTY.

Unless you got 99.99% HT.

Ron Temple · September 2006

I'll give it a try at 60...

VR3 · September 2006

Try it for 2 weeks - calender it...

Reason I say this, its going to be alot different. You are going to get rid of alot of PUNCH and "VOLUME" - but... once you get adjusted, I think once you try to switch back after 2 weeks - it will sound bloated and messy...

BIZILL · September 2006

got mine diggin' down to 60, but can easily do 40hz.

Ron Temple · September 2006

I used to cut the Rs at 40 and 60 to eliminate some boominess when I had lesser subs. Since I brought in the SVS, I had no need to play with the crossover. I can see where cutting the 8s lower may create more transparency at the bottom...we'll see. My issues are at the top where screeching guitars can get a little harsh. Not that I didn't have the same problem with the R50s, but the sound was more diffuse, less detail and less evident to my brain. That added detail sounds wonderful on mellower content.

Maestro · September 2006

Would a seperate amp with more umph give you what you are searching for in sound? Say, 100 to 200 watt per channel? That way, if you do decide to go Lsi, you'll alreay have the juice to accommodate them. I'm thinking of adding a Crown amp (200 wpc) to see what my R50s will do and eventually upgrade to RTi as well.

I still get great results with my budget bangers though; I still smile every time I fire the system up!! ;-)

Ron Temple · September 2006

I'd think feeding the 8s more power would improve them significantly, based on my very limited experience. I'm sure it will happen if I keep them. As far as the Rs, a bit more juice improved them as well, so give it a go.

sterling bug · September 2006

I upgraded from the R series to the RTi line in Feb. and there is no comparison in my opinion. Well worth the money.

mr clay · September 2006

this is pretty good info, right now i have a set of older R40's as my fronts but will be upgrading in the next couple of weeks. i've been pondering the rti8's or 10's. had 10's before and loved them but the 6" midrange driver on the 10's will distort at high volume due to the pair of woofers in the same enclosure. i've listened to the 8's and 10's side by side in my store (im a car audio manager for abc warehouse and we also carry polk home audio) and i liked the 8's a bit better. of course im getting a new center as well, most likely a csi3. but i still love those old r40"s, will probably use them in another room.

my theater as of now: (subject to change without notice. lol)
50" mitsu
harmon/kardon avr525
h/k 8300 disc changer
h/k dvd player
polk r40 fronts
polk cs1 center
polk r15 sides
polk r15 rears
polk psw350 sub

Airplay355 · September 2006

The thing I noticed about the Rti series is when you take away the bright harsh sound with nice electronics (i used my musical fidelity integrated) it sounded like the detail went away too. That wasn't the case with the Lsi7's I owned (kept those over rti70's) or the sda 2B's I have (kept those and sold the lsi7's).

So the moral of this story is, if you don't like the brightness now, it isn't going to get much better. IMO of course

VR3 · September 2006

I must say I share similar experiences as Airplay..

Whole lotta brightness that goes away with better gear only to find theres not much left afterwards...

Great speakers for their purpose...

sidespin · September 2006

hmm. I can't tell if that sounded like an endorsement for the Rti-8 or not, according to airplay & vr3. These were the speakers I was considering upgrading to in the near future as well over my current r-30 & r-15 setup. .

Ron Temple · September 2006

There's no doubt that the RTi are quite a bit better than the Rs. Much better vocal presentation, broader/deeper soundstage, superior imaging, punch and detail. You will hear subtleties in note presentation that the Rs just can't catch. This is no knock on them(Rs) either. Some content on the 8s, on my rig, can sound sibulant, not fatigueingly bright, but a bit harsh. I'm not complaining. I've heard some decent speakers/setups in the mid-fi arena that handle this content differently or better, including the LSis (though only on a receiver). The real benefit, IMO, is that you don't have to break the bank to drive them. A reasonably powerful receiver or amp can make them sing, coupled with a good sub. I'm not sure this is true with the 10s or 12s.

aaharvel · September 2006

imo if you want to tame the rti's brightness, you need to pair it up with a warm sounding receiver, or preferably a warm sounding amplifier. The more powerful and the more current the better. My speakers have zero signs of brightness, even when turned up to reference level, regardless of source- FM, SACD, DTS 5.1 audio, redbook, whatever. Actually, i would classify the sound i have as neutral/slightly warm.

At first i thought my amp was overkill for my setup, and hell it probably is. But then when I turn up the volume to reference on something as adequate-sounding as your typical redbook cd, the speakers don't lose their composure and don't induce listener fatigue. Imo it's all about knowing which to gear to pair your speakers with.

fwiw.

Ron Temple · September 2006

Dave Brubeck, Diana Krall, Patricia Barber all sound extremely good on this rig. Extremely smooth, detailed, not a touch of harshness. Hard rock is great as well, depending on the recording. I guess that's true with any content. As I said, mood has alot to do with my enjoyment. I might hear something one day and be blown away, the next, I'm thinking WTF?

I suppose that's typical of all of us.

R50s to RTi8s as an experiment

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