Center channel for 2.3 TL
gmcman
Posts: 1,408
I'm using the 2.3 TL's as my 2ch setup, but they also share the space of my big TV so I'm going to let them serve double-duty for movies.
I have a CS350, and CS400 but haven't used the 400 much as it has been with the RT800's in the game room.
Moving forward, I have a Def Tech Pro 2000 coming as a trial but that may get paired into another system...jury is out until I get ears on it.
My main question is...would a CS1000P blend well with the 2.3's or would the powered subs be too overbearing?
Another consideration based on my other thread is the Def Tech CLR 3000 and while a different design, it uses 6.5" mid drivers so maybe the midrange might blend well, possibly better than a 5- 1/4" driver.
I understand a timbre match is essential, but neither share the drivers of the SDA's so looking for possible user experience on these larger centers.
I have a CS350, and CS400 but haven't used the 400 much as it has been with the RT800's in the game room.
Moving forward, I have a Def Tech Pro 2000 coming as a trial but that may get paired into another system...jury is out until I get ears on it.
My main question is...would a CS1000P blend well with the 2.3's or would the powered subs be too overbearing?
Another consideration based on my other thread is the Def Tech CLR 3000 and while a different design, it uses 6.5" mid drivers so maybe the midrange might blend well, possibly better than a 5- 1/4" driver.
I understand a timbre match is essential, but neither share the drivers of the SDA's so looking for possible user experience on these larger centers.
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Comments
As I told another poster (and you come to think of it) the CS1000p is the same center as the CS400. Just with a pair of powered woofers on each end. It is also a good match for the 2.3's and at least you have it in your possession. The CS1000p is not so easy to find anymore. You would need to look and wait and look and wait.........................................
Set it up and set it to large and keep it moving. No crossover is needed.
Bedroom 2 channel system:Integra DTM 40.4,Nakamichi BX-100,TiVo mini,Musical Fidelity X-LPS,X-PSU,Carver TFM-25,Sony KV-34XBR970(last of the widescreen tube sets before production stopped)Technics SL-1200MKII,Shure V15 Type V MR cartridge,Polk RT-55(with SL-6506 tweeters),Polk PSW-200 in plexiglass(2),Sony Playstation 3 slim.Monster Power HTPS-7000,Monster AVS-2000, PowerVarious Kimber,Audioquest and MIT interconnects and speaker cables.
My choice for center to pair with my 2.3TLs is the LSiM706C. Vocals are much more natural sounding than the RT series center speakers and it holds its own and blends beautifully with the 2.3s.
Enjoy the journey and try out a few centers to see what sounds best to your ears.
polkaudio Fully Modded SDA SRS 2.3TL's + Dreadnaught, LSiM706c, 4 X TC265i Rears, SVS PB13 Ultra x 2
Pass Labs X1, Pioneer Elite SC-67, Sunfire Signature Cinema Grande 400, Oppo BDP-83SE, Sony SCD-C333ES
HT: Atohm front speakers and IB subwoofer. The rest is all Polk Audio: CSiA6 center, 500-LS ceiling, RT/FX, RTi8, Monitor 4 rears, plus Yamaha CX-a5100 AV Preamplifier/Processor, Yamaha MX-a5000 11.1 channel amplifier, and Sony XBR55-AE1 OLED TV.
I've recently replaced my DT clr3000 cc with a pair of RTA-11TL's as my cc.
I moved to an AT screen and built new cabinets for the 11's and mounted them behind the screen.
They sound awesome!!
That would be a 4 ohm load i do believe
Yes.. I maintained the same volume as the original cabinets.
Yes this is a 4 ohm load now but I'm driving them with an Emotive XPA-1 monoblock amplifier.
I'm not experiencing any combing issues what's so ever. It's nice not having the voices coming from below the screen now...
These produce an excellent natural male voice along with great clarity.
I used to really hate listening to music while the cc was on but now I just can live without it.
I forgot to take a picture after I installed the deflector under the top driver.
I completely agree... its ugly!
Luckily its behind the screen...lol
Hey welcome to the forum. But oh no, yet another Dog!
Office: PC, Marantz CD-1, Marantz AMP-1, Denon UDR-F10 Cassette, Acoustic Technologies Classic Speakers, SVS SB12 Plus Subwoofer, MIT AVt2 speaker cables, IFI Purifier2, AQ Cinnamon USB cable, Groneberg Quatro Reference IC's
Spare Room: , Antique Sound Labs Wave AV-8 Monoblocks, Tisbury Mini Passive Pre, Tjoeb 99 tube CD player (modified Marantz CD-38), Analysis Plus Oval 9's, Zu Jumpers, AudioEngine B1 Streamer, Klipsch RB-61 v2, SVS PB1000 su, Blue Jeans RCA IC's
Living Room: Pioneer SX-N30 Network Receiver, Pioneer PD10AE CD Player, Furman M8-LX Power Conditioner, Polk RT265 In Wall Speakers, Polk DSW Pro 660wi Subwoofer
I found these on Ebay, turned out to be local with beat up cabinets. The owner did the 0198 and crossover up grade so they worked out perfect for my situation.
Now I have a dt 3000 and Elac cc stand sitting around... hummm
Owehoooooo
Maybe not overpower, but possibly slightly heavy on the mid bass? I don’t know, purely speculation. Yes, it did sound good but hard to tell without hearing movie dialogue.
That’s what I was pondering since being a long time RT800/CS400 user, would I have even more of that “RT” sound with the CS1000p or would the bass blend nicely into the lower end.
I agree, the CS400 is an excellent center, but after mods to the SDA it seems just slightly off timbre now.
To it’s defense, after the Audessey room correction, I did find the “dialog level” in the Marantz remote app to lower the output of the center slightly and that did help...same with the CS350.
Definitely worth a try, I like the fact it uses a 3 1/4” midrange and I would assume it gives a more seamless blend into the midrange.
Sometime in this life when you have some free time (hopefully before we’re both too old to remember what this was all about
Anyway text me.
Bedroom 2 channel system:Integra DTM 40.4,Nakamichi BX-100,TiVo mini,Musical Fidelity X-LPS,X-PSU,Carver TFM-25,Sony KV-34XBR970(last of the widescreen tube sets before production stopped)Technics SL-1200MKII,Shure V15 Type V MR cartridge,Polk RT-55(with SL-6506 tweeters),Polk PSW-200 in plexiglass(2),Sony Playstation 3 slim.Monster Power HTPS-7000,Monster AVS-2000, PowerVarious Kimber,Audioquest and MIT interconnects and speaker cables.
I somewhat disagree. RT55's (black) did NOT use the same woofers as the RT55i's (blue) and yes both used different tweeters as their crossover's were different.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Polk-Audio-RT55-RT800-Speaker-Woofer-MW7017/132641362399?epid=25019950342&hash=item1ee20a91df:g:MDEAAOSwi7RZE3Wg:sc:USPSPriority!61705!US!-1:rk:1:pf:0
Crossover was REO455-1
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Polk-Audio-MW7200-RT2000i-RT1000Pi-RT55i-RTi100-speaker-6-5-woofer/132702556498?epid=1650757286&hash=item1ee5b05152:g:MtoAAOSw1zpbSQk7:sc:USPSPriority!61705!US!-1:rk:2:pf:0
Polk CS400 woofer
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Polk-Audio-CS400-Center-Speaker-Woofer-MW7018/132238621106?epid=16018333926&hash=item1eca0939b2:g:MDEAAOSwi7RZE3Wg:sc:USPSPriority!61705!US!-1:rk:2:pf:0
Polk CS400i woofer
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Polk-Audio-MW7204-CS400i-speaker-6-5-woofer/132702559487?epid=805744732&hash=item1ee5b05cff:g:KvoAAOSwFuZbSQop:sc:USPSPriority!61705!US!-1:rk:3:pf:0
So even the speakers and centers use different driver numbers. One would think if they were the same drivers Polk would not of stocked all the drivers and put different numbers on them. They would of had the same numbers for both the CS400i and RT55i drivers and ditto for the RT55 and CS400
I have tried the CSIA6 and the CS400 with my SDA's. The CS400 is a better match for my 2.3TLs IMHO. I really was not too crazy for the CSIA6 as I found it underwhelming. The CS400 is a better match in my setup but I am still not satisfied. I was considering a CS1000p, but after reading some of the comments about it being a bright speaker, I think I will pursue a LSIM 706C. I will hold out until the next friends and family sale, unless Russ wants to buy one and store it at my house.
As for brightness I guess that is very subjective. I don’t have a problem with brightness on my CS1000p. Nor did I have it with the CS-400 when I had it, unless the program material was mixed brightly (like most movies are in order to compensate for the sound coming through the screen and dispersion out into the large hall that is the theater) THX processing always applies a reciprocal EQ to tame that.
Outside of that, in most cases I have trouble trying to tell if the center is playing or if the sound is coming from the 3.1’s. I usually have to look at the display on my preamp.
Bedroom 2 channel system:Integra DTM 40.4,Nakamichi BX-100,TiVo mini,Musical Fidelity X-LPS,X-PSU,Carver TFM-25,Sony KV-34XBR970(last of the widescreen tube sets before production stopped)Technics SL-1200MKII,Shure V15 Type V MR cartridge,Polk RT-55(with SL-6506 tweeters),Polk PSW-200 in plexiglass(2),Sony Playstation 3 slim.Monster Power HTPS-7000,Monster AVS-2000, PowerVarious Kimber,Audioquest and MIT interconnects and speaker cables.
Oh and location in very important also ... it can't be to low or to high or it just won't sound right...
Just my thoughts on the subject tho...
Denon AVR-X4200w; Peachtree Audio NovaPre; B&K TX4430; Bryson BPD-1; Mains: Dynaudio Emit 10; Center - Polk cs400i; Heights, Center Surround - Klipsch KHC - 6 In-Ceiling; Surrounds - Monoprice in-ceiling; Sub - HSU VTF-2 MK5; LG UP870 4K BDP; NVidia ShieldTV
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Master Bedroom
Marantz SR-5007; Parasound HCA-1000A, PSB Imagine B, NHT Super One CI surrounds, Martin Logan Dynamo (original), Squeezebox Touch
Bedroom 2 channel system:Integra DTM 40.4,Nakamichi BX-100,TiVo mini,Musical Fidelity X-LPS,X-PSU,Carver TFM-25,Sony KV-34XBR970(last of the widescreen tube sets before production stopped)Technics SL-1200MKII,Shure V15 Type V MR cartridge,Polk RT-55(with SL-6506 tweeters),Polk PSW-200 in plexiglass(2),Sony Playstation 3 slim.Monster Power HTPS-7000,Monster AVS-2000, PowerVarious Kimber,Audioquest and MIT interconnects and speaker cables.
If you can decode DD/DTS Master Audio or Atmos/DTSX... turn off or disable your cc speaker and you'll see for yourself just how much content actually comes from the center channel.
Now as to the differences in the part numbers between the center speakers and the RT55's. Since they were in different cabinet volumes, they would have different winding's on the voice coils. Same as the drivers in the different SDA's, even though they looked alike.
Bedroom 2 channel system:Integra DTM 40.4,Nakamichi BX-100,TiVo mini,Musical Fidelity X-LPS,X-PSU,Carver TFM-25,Sony KV-34XBR970(last of the widescreen tube sets before production stopped)Technics SL-1200MKII,Shure V15 Type V MR cartridge,Polk RT-55(with SL-6506 tweeters),Polk PSW-200 in plexiglass(2),Sony Playstation 3 slim.Monster Power HTPS-7000,Monster AVS-2000, PowerVarious Kimber,Audioquest and MIT interconnects and speaker cables.
My progression of ownership of RT series speakers was RT2000's with CS400, then RT5000 system (RT3000 plus CS1000P) and finally SRT's with the SRT center channel. The highs are all basically the same across the the RT series family (which is why I ultimately ditched them all for a pair of SDA's for both music and HT). What improved as you progressed up the models was mid range and bass performance (and the addition of SDA on the SRT's of course). The CS1000P is a CS400 with two additional mid drivers and an internal amp to improve bass performance. The base ports are moved off of the center pair of drivers and placed behind the outside powered drivers in the CS1000P. That bass performance gain is substantially noticeable. Unfortunately, the highs are the same. The CS1000P is the hands-down winner by a mile between the two.
To your second comment on the LSiM706C, I can't speak to whether or not the 3 1/2 driver helps blend highs and midrange but the sonic engine that Polk developed for this series has very natural sounding vocals that the CS series of center channel speakers simply cannot accomplish.
If you keep your eyes open, you can generally pick up a used 706 for about the same or not much more than a CS1000P simply because the 1000's are getting harder to find and are holding their value.
polkaudio Fully Modded SDA SRS 2.3TL's + Dreadnaught, LSiM706c, 4 X TC265i Rears, SVS PB13 Ultra x 2
Pass Labs X1, Pioneer Elite SC-67, Sunfire Signature Cinema Grande 400, Oppo BDP-83SE, Sony SCD-C333ES
HT:Polk LSiM 706 LSiM 705's VR3 LSiM 703's LSiM 702's| Marantz AV7704 | Sunfire TGA-7401 | Oppo UDP 203 | Sony PS4 Pro| Directv Genie HD DVR | Samsung 75" Q8 QLED | SVS PB13 Ultra | MIT EXP 2's (Fronts & Center)
ManCave: Parasound Halo A21 | Parsound Halo A52+ | Marantz AV7002 AV PrePro | Usher Dancer Mini-x DMD's | Usher BE-616 Center | SVS Ultra Surrounds | SVS SB4000 Sub |Oppo UDP 203 | MIT Shotgun S3's | PSAudio Stellar GCD | Music Hall MMF 5.3se TT w/ Soundsmith Carmen | Mytek Brooklyn DAC+ | Lumin U1 Mini | HP Elite Slice PC | ROON'd for life | Samsung 50" SUHD TV | Sony PS4
Patio Polk Atrium 8's | Yamaha R-N303BL |
Office Bluesound Node | Polk SDA SRS 2.3 | Marantz 2385 |
Bedroom Peactree Nova 125SE | Focal 905's | Chromecast Audio | SVS SB2000 Sub
Garage Yamaha R-N303BL | Polk Monitor 5B's
Closet Yamaha M80 | 2 Polk MP3K subs| Yaqin MC100B with Shuguang Treasures KT 88's & CV181Z's | Tesla E83CC's | 2 Parasound A23's | Marantz 2252B
Exactly where I was for a long time. There's something that you can't quite put your finger on about the timbre of the CS center speakers. If you listen to your 2.3's independent of the center, they have a fantastic natural warmth. When you add the CS400 back into the mix, it becomes apparent that something just isn't quite right.
The way I discovered the LSiM series as a possibility in my HT was when Polk first was offering a pair of LSiM707's to demo in-house at no cost. I picked up the pair from the Polk warehouse in Vista and had them for a couple of weeks. After demo'ing them as a stereo pair, I had @nooshinjohn and a few others over for a local gathering. During that gathering @nooshinjohn suggested we try a single 707 in the center speaker position. Wow was that ever an eye opener. I have no regrets on purchasing the 706 and have never found myself wanting to look elsewhere.
polkaudio Fully Modded SDA SRS 2.3TL's + Dreadnaught, LSiM706c, 4 X TC265i Rears, SVS PB13 Ultra x 2
Pass Labs X1, Pioneer Elite SC-67, Sunfire Signature Cinema Grande 400, Oppo BDP-83SE, Sony SCD-C333ES
I would suggest to those of you who have problems with the front channel timbre matching to make sure you are using identical cabling across the three front loudspeakers and I also HIGHLY recommend biwiring.
Bedroom 2 channel system:Integra DTM 40.4,Nakamichi BX-100,TiVo mini,Musical Fidelity X-LPS,X-PSU,Carver TFM-25,Sony KV-34XBR970(last of the widescreen tube sets before production stopped)Technics SL-1200MKII,Shure V15 Type V MR cartridge,Polk RT-55(with SL-6506 tweeters),Polk PSW-200 in plexiglass(2),Sony Playstation 3 slim.Monster Power HTPS-7000,Monster AVS-2000, PowerVarious Kimber,Audioquest and MIT interconnects and speaker cables.
Definitely agree on the amplification. My first amp with the RT series was an Adcom. Pairing a bright amp with bright speakers produced an extremely bright, almost harsh sound. A Parasound amp improved things significantly.
polkaudio Fully Modded SDA SRS 2.3TL's + Dreadnaught, LSiM706c, 4 X TC265i Rears, SVS PB13 Ultra x 2
Pass Labs X1, Pioneer Elite SC-67, Sunfire Signature Cinema Grande 400, Oppo BDP-83SE, Sony SCD-C333ES
I'm sure it's been tried. I tried a Monitor 5 but it could not keep up with the big boys.
polkaudio Fully Modded SDA SRS 2.3TL's + Dreadnaught, LSiM706c, 4 X TC265i Rears, SVS PB13 Ultra x 2
Pass Labs X1, Pioneer Elite SC-67, Sunfire Signature Cinema Grande 400, Oppo BDP-83SE, Sony SCD-C333ES