Audio Stories

24

Comments

  • Clipdat
    Clipdat Posts: 12,560
    edited November 2018
    @FMalitz - My first exposure to HiFi was my father's stereo when I was a kid - An Onkyo Integra A-8250 integrated hooked up to a pair of Snell Acoustics bookshelf speakers, source was a Nakamichi 480 cassette deck.

    I can still vividly remember how great it sounded. I thought about tracking down one of those Onkyo integreateds on ebay, and maybe the other components as well, but I'm sure it wouldn't sound as sweet as I remember!

    onkyo_11.jpg

    deck-nakamichi-480-2-cabezales-funcionando-leer-todo-D_NQ_NP_763143-MLA28245326047_092018-F.jpg
  • mlistens03
    mlistens03 Posts: 2,767
    My uncle has a Nakamichi 480! I’ll have to get a pic the next time I’m over there. :)
    Sounds sweet, although I haven’t heard all that many cassette decks. Better than the few I’ve heard. :)
  • Clipdat
    Clipdat Posts: 12,560
    I'm sure that part of the allure is that VU meters are 10 times cooler when you're a kid.
  • mlistens03
    mlistens03 Posts: 2,767
    Clipdat wrote: »
    I'm sure that part of the allure is that VU meters are 10 times cooler when you're a kid.

    Very true, VU meters are pretty sick. ;)
    But it genuinely sounded great compared to other cassette decks I’ve heard.
  • Clipdat
    Clipdat Posts: 12,560
    I re-read my comment and see how it could be misinterpreted. I wasn't trying to call you a kid or imply anything like that. I was thinking back to my own childhood and how cool to me those VU meters looked bouncing to the music.

    Hell, as an adult, VU meters are super cool. It's just 10 times that when you're a kid. That's all I meant. :)
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,711
    He is a kid.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


    President of Club Polk

  • Clipdat
    Clipdat Posts: 12,560
    In the context of my story and VU meters, I was using the word "kid" as something that means under 12 years old.
  • mlistens03
    mlistens03 Posts: 2,767
    Don’t worry about it. :) I actually didn’t take it that way, but I was agreeing* with you, VU meters are sick. ‘Specially when they are blue, with a black gloss faceplate around them and green tubes behind. :p

    *I think I spelled that wrong, but my spel checker didn’t catch it, and I couldn’t think of anything better, so...
  • dromunds
    dromunds Posts: 9,969
    The Nak sounded good because the Naks were good
  • joecoulson
    joecoulson Posts: 4,943
    I got into audio because Jesse made me. I didn’t want to, but you can’t argue with the creator
    The end
  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,903
    joecoulson wrote: »
    I got into audio because Jesse made me. I didn’t want to, but you can’t argue with the creator
    The end

    Yep, ya don't argue with Jesse. Plus the man has a boat....I think he may have some Dago blood in him. :)

    3gponi2gari0.jpg
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,903
    "Before I get back to work, I'd like to address the issue of why people do not manufacture tube type receivers:
    1) all tube electronics, properly done, cost more to manufacture. The pricing structure on receivers is extremely critical to sell through. If you examine the market, you'll notice that all the major Japanese brands are nearly identical in price, features and performance. It's a commodity business.
    2) the EPA has nothing to do with this. One of the most dangerous things you have in your home are florescent lights yet over the last eight or nine years, your government endeavored to outlaw incandescent bulbs forcing us to expose our families to the poisons blasted out by a broken florescent bulb. Apparently they rescinded that along with the help of LEDs which can also be toxic in their composition! While it's true, tubes do indeed have toxins in their guts, they are, after all, sealed. Broken glass envelopes tend to be far rarer than broken light bulbs. We can even market tubes and tube amplifiers in California!
    3) there is an innate insecurity about the maintenance and longevity of tube type electronics. That's our reason for existence. We have addressed all of the arguments except cost. And even that is been mitigated with our newest model."

    Regarding #1- I guess you can be somewhat correct, depending on one's definition of "properly done". Means different things to different people making gear.

    A tubed 2 channel receiver is basically a tubed integrated with a tuner. With todays technology, I see no reason this couldn't be done. Aside from the Chi-fi products on the cheap, because one could make a case about that "properly done' aspect.

    Certainly understand the noise pollution aspect too, combining digital and analog components. I think today, many brands have overcome much of that concern. Maybe it's still there, but audible wise, they seem to do a good job reducing that effect.

    Back in the day, the boutique brands were limited, specialized, unlike today where we have multiples of choices. The market for 3k components that do one thing is very narrow, while competition in that narrow market has grown. Companies like Oppo did very well turning a dvd player into a swiss army knife. Obviously quality of sound is debatable with these types of devices.

    ….which lends itself to another thing, many don't know what quality sound....sounds like. In a world of portable devices and earbuds, far too many never experienced what good vinyl, R2R, or just quality components and speakers sounded like. Hopefully many will rediscover that lost value as they age a bit and have more disposable income. Personally, I believe when HT receivers became all the rage, they destroyed what was left of quality sound in the home, musically speaking. Now it's the convenience factor and an all-in-one solutions to audio needs.

    In my opinion, we are at a crossroads in audio, and that's the challenge. To make gear that sounds good, and can do more than one thing . If you want to sell boat loads of it that is. Obviously those that know better will always gravitate to separates for the simple pleasures of sound quality at it's best. I'm pretty fascinated, and hopeful at the same time, when I see vinyl sales increasing or new tubed gear flying off the shelf such as your experiencing with the 275. Tells me some ARE rediscovering the simple pleasures of quality sound.

    That said, I also understand the value in a piece that is hand made, unlike much of todays electronics that is put together on an assembly line with little human interaction. The value of a piece hand made by someone who understands audio, good sound, how to achieve it, rather than by a software program.

    If we can modernize, somehow, that inner audiophile of quality sound and mesh it with todays digital needs, that product would sell like crazy. Easier said than done, I know, but something to shoot for imho. Maybe we just have to get people used to listening first, re-acquainted to what good sound, sounds like. No sense putting the cart before the horse right ? I was enthused to see the crowds at AXPONA, more than I anticipated to tell the truth.

    To be honest though, for most people, much of this stuff is priced way out of their reach. 10-50k speakers, 3-20k amps, 3-10k pre amps, 5k dacs, 2-3k streamers and cables that cost a few months mortgage payments. For what a system would cost, many would rather forego the difference in sound quality for a new Benz, or a vacation condo somewhere.

    But...audio is a journey as we all know. You don't go from A-Z in a split second without a gradual experience in-between.....and that is where a piece like the 275 can come into play. Maybe it's just up to us, as individuals, to re-install that value, recreate that value of quality sound. If something doesn't have inherit value, it will eventually disappear.

    Man, I gotta lay off the caffeine... :)
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • joecoulson
    joecoulson Posts: 4,943
    What happened?!?
    The creator is playful...
    Someone broke the space time continuum
  • Polkitup2
    Polkitup2 Posts: 1,619
    Before there was audio there was silence. Those were the good old days.
  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 32,929
    edited November 2018
    Soon after God created woman from the rib of Adam, man has been looking for ways to drown out the incessant nagging... shortly thereafter, Jesse demonstrated the very first audio playback setup.

    Thus, I read on the internet*, the first line of John Lennon's Across the Universe.
    Words are flowing out like endless rain into a paper cup
    Supposedly Cynthia was talking to him (perhaps in a less than kind-hearted way) and that was his thought on the matter.

    ______________
    * so it must be true. :|
  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,903
    There's a reason Jesse works with wood glue ya know. :D:D
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • nooshinjohn
    nooshinjohn Posts: 25,034
    Did he invent that too, or just eat too much of it?
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD

    “When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson
  • halo
    halo Posts: 5,616
    Audio: Polk S15 * Polk S35 * Polk S10 * SVS SB-1000 Pro
    HT: Samsung QN90B * Marantz NR1510 * Panasonic DMP-BDT220 * Roku Ultra LT * APC H10
  • Tony M
    Tony M Posts: 11,009
    edited November 2018
    :D:D:D That there is FUNNY!!! ^^^^^^
    Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.
  • David Salz is an exceptional individual. I had dinner with him a few weeks ago. Just delightful.
  • tonyb wrote: »
    "Before I get back to work, I'd like to address the issue of why people do not manufacture tube type receivers:
    1) all tube electronics, properly done, cost more to manufacture. The pricing structure on receivers is extremely critical to sell through. If you examine the market, you'll notice that all the major Japanese brands are nearly identical in price, features and performance. It's a commodity business.
    2) the EPA has nothing to do with this. One of the most dangerous things you have in your home are florescent lights yet over the last eight or nine years, your government endeavored to outlaw incandescent bulbs forcing us to expose our families to the poisons blasted out by a broken florescent bulb. Apparently they rescinded that along with the help of LEDs which can also be toxic in their composition! While it's true, tubes do indeed have toxins in their guts, they are, after all, sealed. Broken glass envelopes tend to be far rarer than broken light bulbs. We can even market tubes and tube amplifiers in California!
    3) there is an innate insecurity about the maintenance and longevity of tube type electronics. That's our reason for existence. We have addressed all of the arguments except cost. And even that is been mitigated with our newest model."

    Regarding #1- I guess you can be somewhat correct, depending on one's definition of "properly done". Means different things to different people making gear.

    A tubed 2 channel receiver is basically a tubed integrated with a tuner. With todays technology, I see no reason this couldn't be done. Aside from the Chi-fi products on the cheap, because one could make a case about that "properly done' aspect.

    Certainly understand the noise pollution aspect too, combining digital and analog components. I think today, many brands have overcome much of that concern. Maybe it's still there, but audible wise, they seem to do a good job reducing that effect.

    Back in the day, the boutique brands were limited, specialized, unlike today where we have multiples of choices. The market for 3k components that do one thing is very narrow, while competition in that narrow market has grown. Companies like Oppo did very well turning a dvd player into a swiss army knife. Obviously quality of sound is debatable with these types of devices.

    ….which lends itself to another thing, many don't know what quality sound....sounds like. In a world of portable devices and earbuds, far too many never experienced what good vinyl, R2R, or just quality components and speakers sounded like. Hopefully many will rediscover that lost value as they age a bit and have more disposable income. Personally, I believe when HT receivers became all the rage, they destroyed what was left of quality sound in the home, musically speaking. Now it's the convenience factor and an all-in-one solutions to audio needs.

    In my opinion, we are at a crossroads in audio, and that's the challenge. To make gear that sounds good, and can do more than one thing . If you want to sell boat loads of it that is. Obviously those that know better will always gravitate to separates for the simple pleasures of sound quality at it's best. I'm pretty fascinated, and hopeful at the same time, when I see vinyl sales increasing or new tubed gear flying off the shelf such as your experiencing with the 275. Tells me some ARE rediscovering the simple pleasures of quality sound.

    That said, I also understand the value in a piece that is hand made, unlike much of todays electronics that is put together on an assembly line with little human interaction. The value of a piece hand made by someone who understands audio, good sound, how to achieve it, rather than by a software program.

    If we can modernize, somehow, that inner audiophile of quality sound and mesh it with todays digital needs, that product would sell like crazy. Easier said than done, I know, but something to shoot for imho. Maybe we just have to get people used to listening first, re-acquainted to what good sound, sounds like. No sense putting the cart before the horse right ? I was enthused to see the crowds at AXPONA, more than I anticipated to tell the truth.

    To be honest though, for most people, much of this stuff is priced way out of their reach. 10-50k speakers, 3-20k amps, 3-10k pre amps, 5k dacs, 2-3k streamers and cables that cost a few months mortgage payments. For what a system would cost, many would rather forego the difference in sound quality for a new Benz, or a vacation condo somewhere.

    But...audio is a journey as we all know. You don't go from A-Z in a split second without a gradual experience in-between.....and that is where a piece like the 275 can come into play. Maybe it's just up to us, as individuals, to re-install that value, recreate that value of quality sound. If something doesn't have inherit value, it will eventually disappear.

    Man, I gotta lay off the caffeine... :)

    Regarding the appeal of high-value tube products, the public doesn't want tubes. It's why we had to take a unique design approach- to assuage their concerns.
    So, all we need to do is add a radio section to integrated amplifier, right? Well, this might surprise you, but no one buys two channel, at least not in comparison to multichannel.

    I was in Cambridge England working with Arcam. They were very excited about their new two channel products. I had to point out that we will sell hundreds of amplifiers worldwide but if we cannot sell tens of thousands of surround-sound receivers, we will go out of business. Guess what: despite having probably the best sounding receivers ever made, they all broke-- I mean all! Now Samsung owns the company.

    Finally, in my 17 years working with Yamaha, I sold two FM tuners. Going forward, people are streaming. Few people listen to their FM sections at home; they listen to FM in their car.

    A 2-channel receiver is actually a great idea for one of my accounts-- audio consultants. No one else has ever asked me for one.
  • Clipdat wrote: »
    @FMalitz - My first exposure to HiFi was my father's stereo when I was a kid - An Onkyo Integra A-8250 integrated hooked up to a pair of Snell Acoustics bookshelf speakers, source was a Nakamichi 480 cassette deck.

    I can still vividly remember how great it sounded. I thought about tracking down one of those Onkyo integreateds on ebay, and maybe the other components as well, but I'm sure it wouldn't sound as sweet as I remember!

    onkyo_11.jpg

    deck-nakamichi-480-2-cabezales-funcionando-leer-todo-D_NQ_NP_763143-MLA28245326047_092018-F.jpg

    I would not hesitate to buy an Onkyo integrated. Assuming they maintain the same philosophy that they did for me from 1976 to 1983, they would drive any load reasonable and your memory is not rose-colored. Snell made some good speakers. Onkyo used quality capacitors so the odds are the unit would still sound good.

    How come people put @ in front of my name?
  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 32,929
    FMalitz wrote: »
    Clipdat wrote: »
    @FMalitz - My first exposure to HiFi was my father's stereo when I was a kid - An Onkyo Integra A-8250 integrated hooked up to a pair of Snell Acoustics bookshelf speakers, source was a Nakamichi 480 cassette deck.

    I can still vividly remember how great it sounded. I thought about tracking down one of those Onkyo integreateds on ebay, and maybe the other components as well, but I'm sure it wouldn't sound as sweet as I remember!

    onkyo_11.jpg

    deck-nakamichi-480-2-cabezales-funcionando-leer-todo-D_NQ_NP_763143-MLA28245326047_092018-F.jpg

    I would not hesitate to buy an Onkyo integrated. Assuming they maintain the same philosophy that they did for me from 1976 to 1983, they would drive any load reasonable and your memory is not rose-colored. Snell made some good speakers. Onkyo used quality capacitors so the odds are the unit would still sound good.

    How come people put @ in front of my name?

    That's a link to your moniker; a cross-reference if you will.

    Ask @lightman1 for example. :)

    Type "@" and the first few letters of your name and you'll see a drop down with you and any others with a moniker like yours.
  • Tony M
    Tony M Posts: 11,009
    2 channel was what we want in our garage, shop or outbuildings and yea, our basement rigs.

    But tinkering, building and fixing things in our man/woman spaces with a 2/4 channel receiver as the power and FM/AM source is disappearing.

    Smart phones are taking over the world of entertainment. If your phone can't connect to it, not many people will want it anymore. :#:'(
    Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.
  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 32,929
    I know some guys in northern New England with some pretty outrageous mono systems.