Receiver for S60 setup

I am looking to purchase a sound system for my living room in a new house. I'm thinking about getting the S60's from the front L/R, the S35 for the center, and I haven't decided on the surround speakers yet (they may have to be in ceiling due to the open floor plan). I've read that some of these towers are power hungry, so I'm not sure what to get for the receivers. Looking at specs, the Onkyo's seem to have more power for the price when compared to the Yamaha. I'd like to spend not much more than $600 or so. For that price range, the Onkyo TX-RZ720 gives 110 W/Ch (8 Ohms, 20 Hz–20 kHz, 0.08% THD, 2 Channels Driven), while a similarly priced Yamaha, like the RX-A670 or RX-V683 don't get any more than 90 W/Ch. However, I've heard some horror stories about Onkyo's reliability.

So, the question is: How much power do I really need to power the S60's? Should I be worried about the less power that the Yamaha receivers have when compared to Onkyo? Denon also seemed less. Or is the power going to be important? Do you have any other suggestions for receivers? Also, should I be bi-amping these towers using two of the unused channels on the receiver? Will that help? Thanks!

Comments

  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,704
    The S60 is an easy load.

    Pioneer Elite

    Do NOT try to bi-amp with an AVR because it's not even close to actual bi-amping.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


    President of Club Polk

  • mark090852
    mark090852 Posts: 993
    McIntosh MA252 Integrated Amp, LUMIN D2 Network Music Player, Yamaha Aventage RX-A840 receiver, Emotiva XPA Gen3 2 channel amp, Polk LSiM 703 speakers. Oppo UDP-203 Blu-Ray player, Polk LSiM 705 speakers. Polk Signature S20 speakers.
  • deronb1
    deronb1 Posts: 5,021
    Not sure if Pio has changed their bass management, but my Elite went from 50 to 80 hz and up. Really stuck in my craw.
  • mlurie31
    mlurie31 Posts: 8
    Hmm, I've only been looking at Onkyo, Yamaha, and Denon for this pricerange. Is there a reason you think Pioneer Elite is better?
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,704
    edited March 2018
    Yeah, their rated power for 5 channels driven is the same as it is for 2 channels driven. I don't know of any other AVR's that are. Their calibration program is much better.

    Edit: I just noticed you have a $600.00 budget. You're not getting a Pioneer Elite for that money.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


    President of Club Polk

  • ken brydson
    ken brydson Posts: 8,638
    F1nut wrote: »
    Yeah, their rated power for 5 channels driven is the same as it is for 2 channels driven. I don't know of any other AVR's that are. Their calibration program is much better.

    Edit: I just noticed you have a $600.00 budget. You're not getting a Pioneer Elite for that money.

    Maybe a gently used one...
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,704
    There is that.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


    President of Club Polk

  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,902
    mlurie31 wrote: »
    Hmm, I've only been looking at Onkyo, Yamaha, and Denon for this pricerange. Is there a reason you think Pioneer Elite is better?

    In your 600 buck price range, new receivers will have fairly weak power supplies in them, no matter the brand. Yamaha, you want the Avantage series, Pioneer you want the Elite series. Pioneer will have ice amps in them, which hold their power ratings better across all channels driven.

    The Sig series of Polk speakers are not power hungry, they are fairly easy to drive. However, keep in mind you may want to move up some day. So grab a receiver that has preouts, which will enable you to add an amplifier someday should you need to in order to drive a different speaker you may have your eyes on.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • WLDock
    WLDock Posts: 3,073
    edited April 2018
    mark090852 wrote: »
    Yes, that refurbished SC-LX501 for $449 with a three year warranty is a great option if you want a powerful feature rich AVR for cheap. You really can't beat this for the money....you really have to experience Pioneer's D3 amps in a home theater to know what all are talking about. The only drawback is there are no preouts if you want to add an amp later...but you will have to make that call.

    As far as Onkyo / Integra reliability, they had some major issues with BGA style chip solder failures on some of their units. BGA chip solder failure has been a problem in the electronics industry as they are used in computer motherboards, gaming consoles, etc. Onkyo had a major recall and reworked the chips and performed some firmware updates to help keep the units cooler. Which is another conversation as these BIG multi channel receivers make a lot of heat. Make sure to give them room to breath which will help any AVR or amp.

    Anyway, this Integra DTR-50.4 is a beastly AVR as well: https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/intdtr504/integra-dtr-50.4-7.2-ch-x-135-watts-thx-networking-a/v-receiver/1.html

    If you wanted to jump right into the separates here is a nice combo. This refurb Integra DHC-80.3 Pre/Pro for $524 with a 2 yr warranty. This was a $2999 top of the line unit some years ago. https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/intdhc803/integra-dhc-80.3-9.2-ch-thx-networking-a/v-preamp/processor/1.html
    Then add in a new B-Stock Outlaw Audio 5000 5-ch amp for $549: https://www.outlawaudio.com/mofcart/bstock.html
    Now you are in the a/v world of separates for $1073 to start.


    You just have to decide what surround formats are important to you as well 4K, etc. over the next 2-5 years then decide what equipment works for your budget. If ATMOS and 4K are not important too you then that opens up a TON of options.
    2.2 Office Setup | LG 29UB55 21:9 UltraWide | HP Probook 630 G8 | Dell Latitude | Cabasse Stream Amp 100 | Boston Acoustics VS 240 | AUDIORAX Desk Stands | Mirage Omni S8 sub1 | Mirage Omni S8 Sub2
  • rooftop59
    rooftop59 Posts: 7,952
    I second Accessories4less.

    The marantz sr5011 will work really well. Ask @mrloren how he likes his setup!

    I love my denon, and they have the avr-x4100w for 5 bones. Look at the measurements for the 4200w:

    https://www.soundandvision.com/content/denon-avr-x4200w-av-receiver-review-test-bench

    He marantz measures very close. I slightly prefer my denon for home theater, but it is in a much larger room with a larger system.
    Living Room 2.2: Usher BE-718 "tiny dancers"; Dual DIY Dayton audio RSS210HF-4 Subs with Dayton SPA-250 amps; Arcam SA30; Musical Fidelity A308; Sony UBP-x1000es; Squeezebox Touch with Bolder Power Supply
    Game Room 5.1.4:
    Denon AVR-X4200w; Sony UBP-x700; Definitive Technology Power Monitor 900 mains, CLR-3000 center, StudioMonitor 350 surrounds, ProMonitor 800 atmos x4; Sub - Monoprice Monolith 15in THX Ultra

    Bedroom 2.1
    Cambridge Azur 551r; Polk RT25i; ACI Titan Subwoofer
  • Driving S60 towers in a 7.2 set up with a Denon avrx 3300w and it works just fine. Love the setup. Drives the speakers without any issues
  • halo
    halo Posts: 5,616
    The power ratings put out by most receivers aren't going to amount to much difference in your living room. A receiver putting out 80 wpc isn't that far behind a receiver putting out 110 wpc.

    Try to get a receiver that has preamp outputs for you main L + R speakers, at the very least; that way the receiver's built-in amp section is only driving the center channel & the surrounds, which should be relatively easy. Powered subs or a single powered sub can handle all the low notes so, really, the receiver itself isn't being pushed very hard.

    The slimline Marantz receivers don't take up much space and they offer pre-outs for the front L + R and 1 or 2 subs. 50 wpc may not seem like much but these slimline receivers deliver the goods to the center & the surrounds.
    Audio: Polk S15 * Polk S35 * Polk S10 * SVS SB-1000 Pro
    HT: Samsung QN90B * Marantz NR1510 * Panasonic DMP-BDT220 * Roku Ultra LT * APC H10
  • dolbyd
    dolbyd Posts: 430
    I agree with Halo.
    I just helped a neighbor with his set up. Slimline Marantz was what he went with. He is looking the week to add a 2 channel amp to it. Should great for S60 setup.
    Main room- RTiA9 x4, CSiA6, in ceiling Atmos RT-70 x4, SVS PC 4000 x2, Marantz 8805A, OPPO 203, Emotiva DR3 G3, Emotiva XPA-2 G3, Emotiva XPA-5 G3, Emotiva X300, Sony 75" 940E, Panasonic Plasma VT50, PS Audio Power Port X2, PS Audio AC-5 x8, AQ Rocket 33 Biwire speaker cables, AQ King Cobra XLR IC, Furman PFi20 W/Cullen cable, SoildSteel S4-4 rack, Gik room treatments

    Office- Legend L600, in ceiling Polk RC80i, Marantz 7704, OPPO 203, Pioneer Elite PDF-59 CD, PSA Stellar 300, Sony 55" 800B, Gik room treatment

    Master BR- Signature ES60, Signature S35 Center, Signature S15 Dolby Height, LSI700 in ceiling, SVS-SB4000, Marantz 5012, Emotiva XPA5 G2, OPPO 203, Pioneer DVL-919 Laser Disc, Sony 55" OLED

    Patio- SDI Atrium8 x3, Emotiva A-100 amps x3
  • mrloren
    mrloren Posts: 2,454
    My SR5010 did drive the S60 very nice. Now I'm powering them with a BasX-A300 and oh yeah my setup is sweet to me. Marantz sounds great on music. My son and his 18 year old ear bud wearing friends like coming over and blasting there tunes on real speakers.
    When I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
    Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
    Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
    Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music
  • rburgess714
    rburgess714 Posts: 614
    The 60s are easy to drive and sound great. Pioneer Elite, Marantz and the Yamaha Aventage line are all good options. Just make sure you get a unit with preouts so you can add a separate amp down the road.
    Living Room
    Parasound HINT 6, Yamaha Aventage RX-A 1060, Yamaha BD-S681, Cambridge Audio Azur 851N, Polk S60, Polk S30, Samsung 60" LED

    Office
    Cambridge Audio 851A, Auralic Aries Mini, LSiM 703s

    Douglas Connection ICs and Cables
  • Derico
    Derico Posts: 8
    Everyone here keeps saying the S60(e) are easy to drive. And i'm just here thinking, my Denon AVR-X1600H is too weak to drive them even if no other speakers are currently running...
  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,902
    I'd say that receiver is on the light side for power. Add an amp if it has preouts and power won't be a concern anymore.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • DaveHo
    DaveHo Posts: 3,471
    Derico wrote: »
    Everyone here keeps saying the S60(e) are easy to drive. And i'm just here thinking, my Denon AVR-X1600H is too weak to drive them even if no other speakers are currently running...

    No near BOTL receiver will power an easy load with authority. Some people just want something that "works". That's where that Denon fits into the food chain.
  • Check out Sony ES units. I have ES,5300 12 years old solid runs cool. In fact it is a pre/pro. The only thing not driven by Emotiva XPA5, are pair i FXI3's.
  • ugeshanm
    ugeshanm Posts: 2
    Regarding the Polk ES60 biamping capabilities, does anyone know how the internal speakers are separated? I have a Rotel 985 MK2 100wpc 5 channel driven that I am using on my front stage bed with the ES60 in biamp mode. It seems like the the power delivery to the speakers have the woofers separate from the tweeters. So if i am biamping, does that mean I am delivering 100 watts to the woofers and another 100watts to the tweeter? I am concerned as that does that sound excessive for the tweeter?
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,704
    For starters you are not truly bi-amping as that requires two completely separate amplifiers each with their own power supply AND the use of active crossovers.

    So, to address your question about the internal crossovers. The high frequency circuit is indeed separate from the mid/low circuit when the jumpers are removed.

    So then, is the high frequency circuit (tweeter) being overpowered? No. Basically, due to the components/topology in the crossover the high freqency circuit will only use 5 to 10 watts of power, so the rest of that
    channel's watts are wasted.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


    President of Club Polk