APC review or panamax

2

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  • TECHNOKID
    TECHNOKID Posts: 4,298
    edited August 2011
    OK, time to close the thread (westom AKA w_tom) has arrived. Myke, I hope you got your answer as this thread is now doomed with ''google surge protector'' on board!
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 51,700
    edited August 2011
    With any luck, by this time tomorrow westom and his 34 posts of BS will be long gone.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

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  • TECHNOKID
    TECHNOKID Posts: 4,298
    edited August 2011
    F1nut wrote: »
    With any luck, by this time tomorrow westom and his 34 posts of BS will be long gone.
    That would be nice as the OP had to start a second thread in order to stay focussed on his needs. With w_tom's post that can again lead the discussion way out of context. I know he is still online focussing on this thread hoping someone will bite so he can come back with his rethoric cut and paste which he likes to pollute the net with.

    Anyway, I'm out and hope this thread is dead all night and westom falls asleep on it.
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  • westom
    westom Posts: 45
    edited August 2011
    mike - those who don't know will identify themselves by posting personal attacks and insults. Will not post actual numbers or hard facts that answer your questions. Their entire contribution will be to insult and attack those who actually know this stuff.

    Others have posted useful recommendations.

    Those who insult most never quote manufacturer specs numbers. They cannot discuss what they do not understand. Will even make claims that the manufacturer does not make. The only thing they really understand is insults. Be cautious of their answers. Otherwise expect to waste plenty of money on solutions that do nothing useful.

    Watch them get into a tizzy because you might realize how much was posted containing so few useful facts. For example, to recommend filtering, his 'subjective' dB numbers were also near zero filtering.
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  • TouchOfEvil
    TouchOfEvil Posts: 967
    edited August 2011
    westom wrote: »
    mike - those who don't know will identify themselves by posting personal attacks and insults. Will not post actual numbers or hard facts that answer your questions. Their entire contribution will be to insult and attack those who actually know this stuff.

    Others have posted useful recommendations.

    Those who insult most never quote manufacturer specs numbers. They cannot discuss what they do not understand. Will even make claims that the manufacturer does not make. The only thing they really understand is insults. Be cautious of their answers. Otherwise expect to waste plenty of money on solutions that do nothing useful.

    Watch them get into a tizzy because you might realize how much was posted containing so few useful facts. For example, to recommend filtering, his 'subjective' dB numbers were also near zero filtering.

    Instead of ranting about what you think is worthless why not give a solution to the OP. Maybe make a suggestion to cure his issues that he has already mentioned.
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 51,700
    edited August 2011
    Talk about a selective memory. I posted hard facts which had you backpeddling like a ****. Not an attack nor an insult, just the truth.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 51,700
    edited August 2011
    Here's another truth, your BS spam is all over the net. The irony about it all...the more you post, the more you drive people away. Funny stuff.

    http://forums.steampowered.com/forum....php?t=1882852

    http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/archive/1708902

    http://community.discovery.com/eve/f...7119469801/p/2

    http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/archi...t-1256149.html

    Quote:
    westom (aka w_tom) is a well known internet nut on a religious crusade
    to eliminate the scourge of plug-in suppressors. He is here because he
    uses google groups to look for "surge".

    http://www.adras.com/Surge-Protectors.t21970-88-3.html

    http://groups.google.com/group/rec.v...2&rnum=6&pli=1

    http://www.velocityreviews.com/forum...ctor-link.html
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • TECHNOKID
    TECHNOKID Posts: 4,298
    edited August 2011
    TouchOfEvil wrote: »
    Instead of ranting about what you think is worthless why not give a solution to the OP. Maybe make a suggestion to cure his issues that he has already mentioned.
    F1nut wrote: »
    Talk about a selective memory. I posted hard facts which had you backpeddling like a ****. Not an attack nor an insult, just the truth.
    Why bother responding to the troll, we are simply making it worse and ignorance will not go away. If we start ignoring him, he will be talking to him self and hopefully leave. He does not have anything to bring to the OP, he has a history to hit multiple sites and forums with the same cut and paste bable (never ever brought any evidence of his claims) and this has been happening for years and under God knows how many AKAs. Just ignore ignorance, ignore the troll.
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  • TECHNOKID
    TECHNOKID Posts: 4,298
    edited August 2011
    F1nut wrote: »
    Here's another truth, your BS spam is all over the net. The irony about it all...the more you post, the more you drive people away. Funny stuff.

    http://forums.steampowered.com/forum....php?t=1882852

    http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/archive/1708902

    http://community.discovery.com/eve/f...7119469801/p/2

    http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/archi...t-1256149.html

    westom (aka w_tom) is a well known internet nut on a religious crusade
    to eliminate the scourge of plug-in suppressors. He is here because he
    uses google groups to look for "surge".


    http://www.adras.com/Surge-Protectors.t21970-88-3.html

    http://groups.google.com/group/rec.v...2&rnum=6&pli=1

    http://www.velocityreviews.com/forum...ctor-link.html
    To supplement the above, here is westom's contribution to CP over the years;

    Showing results 1 to 6 of 6

    Search took 0.03 seconds; generated 40 minute(s) ago. Search: Keyword(s): westom

    APC review or panamax ( 1 2)

    To power condition or not?

    Need Help New Surge Protector ( 1 2 3 4 5)

    Surge Protector/Power Strips ( 1 2 3)

    Poll: Need Help Surge protector/suppressor or conditioner?

    Note that the above was the TROLL ONLY participation on this forum through the years, never spoke about speakers, audio or video. The only times the troll ever came and posted here at CP was to dismiss surge protectors and power conditioners with IMHO, an agenda of pushing a different product (which IMHO is SPAM).
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  • TECHNOKID
    TECHNOKID Posts: 4,298
    edited August 2011
    BTW; BlueFox, Poee7R if you do reply to this thread, westom is watching like and probably has the finger ready to reply with a partial cut and paste reply ready to taylor for you. :rolleyes:
    DARE TO SOAR:
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  • BlueFox
    BlueFox Posts: 15,251
    edited August 2011
    I have nothing to add here. However, I have beed debating on whether to reply to post 25 in the 'To power condition or not?' thread.

    His statement:
    If spending $6,000 on wire makes you feel better, go for it.

    But I have found it's entirely a mental thing...

    You WANT it to sound better, so it does. To you.

    is so stupid it almost demands to be mocked. For example, if I think he is an idiot then that is mental. So, he must be an idiot, by using his logic.

    Anyway, I am listening to my Panamax filtered two-channel system now and enjoying it, so I might let it slide.
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  • zeppage2
    zeppage2 Posts: 196
    edited August 2011
    another affordable option...

    http://www.buy.com/prod/belkin-pureav-pf60-home-theater-power-console-belkin-pureav-pf60-home/q/loc/101/207514357.html
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  • digitalvideo
    digitalvideo Posts: 983
    edited August 2011
    The point is no one is mentioning the problem of the current state of condition inside your mov based devices. Just because the power lights are on outside doesn't mean the mov inside is still functioning. I am serious, please open up your mov surge protectors and just take a look at the condition of the mov which is no different than inspecting the radiator or oil in your cars engine. It's wise to do so because if the mov is damaged and your unit is still under warranty you can get a replacement for free.
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  • myke
    myke Posts: 138
    edited August 2011
    Guys i appreciate all the advice, in-fact some of it is quite humorous. With that said and a looming question long ago in a post still unanswered............, regarding the conditioners 1000w continous power max, with my sub dsw pro 600, plasma, xbox, avr, blu-ray cable box, and soon to be amp, will all that be too much - not all at once but most of which will be running with a movie in. I thought it would be too much but i'm just not too sure??
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,412
    edited August 2011
    You gear will not draw close to or more than 1000W continuous, so either the APC H10 at 1000 watts will be fine or the H15 (which has a nice display and more outlets) has a 1500W capacity.

    I have all my gear plugged into the H15 and my amp draws 200+ watts continuous (single ended class A amps are full on all the time, even at idle), plus I have all my Satellite gear, Plasma TV, etc plugged in and it only draws 25% of the capacity of the H15. The H15 has a feature that shows how much all the components are drawing at any given time. I don't think the H10 has that feature.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,412
    edited August 2011
    myke wrote: »
    Guys i appreciate all the advice, in-fact some of it is quite humorous. With that said and a looming question long ago in a post still unanswered............, regarding the conditioners 1000w continous power max, with my sub dsw pro 600, plasma, xbox, avr, blu-ray cable box, and soon to be amp, will all that be too much - not all at once but most of which will be running with a movie in. I thought it would be too much but i'm just not too sure??

    The numbers you are quoting are maximum continuous draw, nothing is going to draw the maximum continuously, except for something like a single ended Class A amplifer, which you don't have.

    The 1000W rating for H10 is a continous draw rating you'll be able to peak over the 1000W without issue for short periods of time. With the gear in question you won't have an issue.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • inspiredsports
    inspiredsports Posts: 5,502
    edited August 2011
    heiney9 wrote: »
    Since I have current direct experience with APC the H10 or H15 would do everything you need.

    I'm sure Panamax has an equivalent that would work as well.

    All three brands you mention have great products. If you increase your budget and want something a tad more audiophile rated you could look at PS Audio.

    H9

    All of the above is great input.

    I personally purchased a nice used APC H10 Black Power Conditioner from a Polkie in late 2009. This model has a total of 12 outlets. It has performed flawlessly and made a noticeable difference in lowering my noise floor.

    I sought out APC at the time as I work in the IT industry and have specified perhaps 100 APC computer protection units for clients. I figured their audio gear would be equally well engineered and have found that it is.

    (PS.: The H10 has 6 blue "Load" LED's stepped at 20, 40, 60, 80, 100 and 120%)
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,412
    edited August 2011
    Just an FYI, the power conditioner Rotel used to sell is a rebadged APC H15, and of course it retails for $150 more. It's the identical unit, just with a more "audiophile" name attached to it.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • westom
    westom Posts: 45
    edited August 2011
    myke wrote: »
    regarding the conditioners 1000w continous power max, with my sub dsw pro 600, plasma, xbox, avr, blu-ray cable box, and soon to be amp, will all that be too much - not all at once but most of which will be running with a movie in. I thought it would be too much but i'm just not too sure??
    A number must always exist where the power cord connects. Simply add up those numbers. The sum must be less than what the conditioner says it can provide.

    Is the considered conditioner 1000 watts or 1000 VA?
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,412
    edited August 2011
    westom wrote: »
    A number must always exist where the power cord connects. Simply add up those numbers. The sum must be less than what the conditioner says it can provide.

    Is the considered conditioner 1000 watts or 1000 VA?

    Wrong, FAIL!

    The numbers on the back of components is a MAXIMUM continuous draw, in the case of an amplifer rarely if ever will you continually draw the maximum. It still is a good idea to be sure those numbers aren't severly mismatched, in the case of the H10 and his gear, he will NOT have an issue.

    Other components draw such negligable amounts of wattage they are a non-issue except for the Plasma TV which can draw around 100-200Watts.

    Like I said in my real example with my H15 rated at 1.5kW all my gear and TV plugged in only draws on average 25% and my amp at idle draws about as much or more than his will running fairly hard.

    So I'm drawing about 375W continuous with everything powered up and running.

    The H10 will fit his needs

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • TECHNOKID
    TECHNOKID Posts: 4,298
    edited August 2011
    heiney9 wrote: »
    You gear will not draw close to or more than 1000W continuous, so either the APC H10 at 1000 watts will be fine or the H15 (which has a nice display and more outlets) has a 1500W capacity.

    I have all my gear plugged into the H15 and my amp draws 200+ watts continuous (single ended class A amps are full on all the time, even at idle), plus I have all my Satellite gear, Plasma TV, etc plugged in and it only draws 25% of the capacity of the H15. The H15 has a feature that shows how much all the components are drawing at any given time. I don't think the H10 has that feature.

    H9
    I fully agree with you that the ratings on the gears are maximum however, I would personally go with the higher rated H15 as it would be easier on it, allow for a safe margin and provide for potential addition without needing a replacement.
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,412
    edited August 2011
    TECHNOKID wrote: »
    I fully agree with you that the ratings on the gears are maximum however, I would personally go with the higher rated H15 as it would be easier on it, allow for a safe margin and provide for potential addition without needing a replacement.

    There is that thought, however my gear at idle is most likely drawing more than his when he's running hard and I am at 25% capacity. If he has the extra funds I actually prefer the H15 to the H10 aesthetically and it has a few more features.

    But if budget is an issue then I still contend the H10 will be just fine, if he maxes that out with his gear, then there is an issue.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • digitalvideo
    digitalvideo Posts: 983
    edited August 2011
    myke wrote: »
    Guys i appreciate all the advice, in-fact some of it is quite humorous. With that said and a looming question long ago in a post still unanswered............, regarding the conditioners 1000w continous power max, with my sub dsw pro 600, plasma, xbox, avr, blu-ray cable box, and soon to be amp, will all that be too much - not all at once but most of which will be running with a movie in. I thought it would be too much but i'm just not too sure??

    Is your entertainment system plugged into a 15 amp or 20 amp circuit outlet? A 20 amp circuit should carry no more than 1920 watts of continuous load, and even less on a 15 amp circuit. On the back of each electronic devce it will say how much watts it uses, you should add up all the watts each unit uses to see. NEVER plug a 20 amp surge protector into a 15 amp circuit outlet.

    I believe amps should have their own dedicated individual circuit to plug into because they have a high initial current draw and are high wattage devices, plus you can lower the noise floor and your system will sound better with less stress on each circuit. Some members over a avsforum.com have done some testing on this.
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  • myke
    myke Posts: 138
    edited August 2011
    thanks H9 & Technokid, i guess i got concerned when the amp says a real 200w/ch with 5 channels, not to mention the 58"plasma.

    what are your thoughts on tripp lite HT7300PC?

    http://www.tripplite.com/en/products/model.cfm?txtModelID=3346

    seems like a good product/co. and ample spec's which is nice to find easily
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  • myke
    myke Posts: 138
    edited August 2011
    i dont know if its a 15 or 20amp. how can i confirm (im sure its easy but just not sure) just the plug in my livingroom. house built in 2006.
    Bonus Room:
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    Panamax M5300, Xbox360, ...& more coming
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    old sony receiver (replacing soon)
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  • Polkie2009
    Polkie2009 Posts: 3,834
    edited August 2011
    I'm totally confused here, I thought there's no way a 20 amp surge protector plug design will allow it to fit a 15 amp outlet???
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,412
    edited August 2011
    Don't be concerned with anything Digital Video has to say. I will say it one more time and then I'm outta this one. The APC H10 or units similar will work just fine with the gear you have and the outlet you have unless you have extremely weird wiring in your house for some very odd reason.

    You will be FINE

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,412
    edited August 2011
    Polkie2009 wrote: »
    I'm totally confused here, I thought there's no way a 20 amp surge protector plug design will allow it to fit a 15 amp outlet???

    DV is talking out his patuttie again.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,412
    edited August 2011
    The APC home units are all 15A......see technical specs.

    http://www.apc.com/resource/include/techspec_index.cfm?base_sku=H10

    Like I said

    YOU WILL BE FINE
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • dorokusai
    dorokusai Posts: 25,576
    edited August 2011
    Either unit is fine. It's not a rocket ship and they're all generally the same anyways.
    CTC BBQ Amplifier, Sonic Frontiers Line3 Pre-Amplifier and Wadia 581 SACD player. Speakers? Always changing but for now, Mission Argonauts I picked up for $50 bucks, mint.
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