Are Honda Elements for Girls?

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  • exalted512
    exalted512 Posts: 10,735
    edited June 2011
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    20mpg is considered poor mileage for a 4wd brick on wheels?
    -Cody
    Music is like candy, you have to get rid of the rappers to enjoy it
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  • MacLeod
    MacLeod Posts: 14,358
    edited June 2011
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    2011 is the last year for these things and so theyve got some good deals right now. I'm mainly coming at them from a car audio perspective. They're actually ideal with their flat dash, big A pillars and high flat roof. No matter what I look at, I always come back to these things. Who knows, maybe I'll look good in a dress. :wink:
    polkaudio sound quality competitor since 2005
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  • shack
    shack Posts: 11,154
    edited June 2011
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    MacLeod wrote: »
    2011 is the last year for these things and so theyve got some good deals right now. I'm mainly coming at them from a car audio perspective. They're actually ideal with their flat dash, big A pillars and high flat roof. No matter what I look at, I always come back to these things. Who knows, maybe I'll look good in a dress. :wink:

    No dress here...

    Anytime you can in a matter of a few minutes move the seats to put a kayak or mountain bike IN the vehicle...then a few minutes later arrange the seats into a bed to sleep/camp in...then hose the whole thing out and drive it to work the next day...THAT is coolness!

    Besides...the fact that chicks dig them as well...can certainly be an advantage. :wink:
    "Just because you’re offended doesn’t mean you’re right." - Ricky Gervais

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  • Jstas
    Jstas Posts: 14,718
    edited June 2011
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    exalted512 wrote: »
    20mpg is considered poor mileage for a 4wd brick on wheels?
    -Cody

    My MKX gets about 20-22 MPG, it's AWD, larger than an Element with a bigger engine and is probably just about as capable as the Element is offroad.

    The Element has long been chided for it's mileage numbers. I'd imagine that they are bad more for the fact that it's shaped like and weighs as much as a barn.

    It's 2.4L 4 cylinder is a dog too.

    In 2003-2006, the element had a K24A4 with the following numbers:
    # Power: 160 hp (119 kW) @ 5500 rpm
    # Torque: 160 ft?lbf (218 N?m) @ 4500 rpm
    # Redline: 6800 rpm

    In 2007, the changed to the K24A8 with the following numbers:
    # Power: 166 hp @ 5800 rpm
    # Torque: 161 lb?ft (218 N?m) @ 4000 rpm
    # Redline: 6800 rpm

    Sure, 160 horsepower is nice but you gotta rev the living hell out of the engine to get anywhere. It's peak torque is 4000 or more RPM so just off idle, it's not even 30% of peak. They are decidedly slow and garbage offroad because of the high torque peak. It also means that the little 4 cylinder has to lug around the 3500+ pound curb weight and whatever other junk you have in there like extra fatbodies and their bicycles.
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  • bobman1235
    bobman1235 Posts: 10,822
    edited June 2011
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    ^^ The lower power thing was the big detractor I always heard about those cars.
    If you will it, dude, it is no dream.
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  • bigaudiofanatic
    bigaudiofanatic Posts: 4,415
    edited June 2011
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    My dad has one he loves it. Element that is
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  • exalted512
    exalted512 Posts: 10,735
    edited June 2011
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    Jstas wrote: »
    My MKX gets about 20-22 MPG, it's AWD, larger than an Element with a bigger engine and is probably just about as capable as the Element is offroad.

    but your MKX doesnt have the aerodynamics of a trailer home. If I was buying an AWD brick on wheels, if I expected good gas mileage, then I'm the ****:wink:
    -Cody
    Music is like candy, you have to get rid of the rappers to enjoy it
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,526
    edited June 2011
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    I think the poll numbers speak for themselves...:biggrin:
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  • Jstas
    Jstas Posts: 14,718
    edited June 2011
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    bigaudiofanatic wrote: »
    My dad has one he loves it. Element that is

    He also chases bees with a tennis racket.
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  • Ron-P
    Ron-P Posts: 8,516
    edited June 2011
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    Hell, if anyone drives a tween, chick car, that'd be me...but I love it.
    If...
    Ron dislikes a film = go out and buy it.
    Ron loves a film = don't even rent.
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  • Jstas
    Jstas Posts: 14,718
    edited June 2011
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    Ron-P wrote: »
    Hell, if anyone drives a tween, chick car, that'd be me...but I love it.

    I like them, they're sharp. Mitsubishi should have gone with that design as a progression of the Eclipse in 2000 instead of this garbage. Probably would have sold enough to not be considering a buyout.

    [IMG]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d1/Mitsubishi_Eclipse_Międzyzdroje1.JPG/800px-Mitsubishi_Eclipse_Międzyzdroje1.JPG[/IMG]

    THAT'S a chick car!
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  • arun1963
    arun1963 Posts: 1,797
    edited June 2011
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    I went with the second option, based only on how it looks. If I was in your shoes, I'd ignore the kiddy macho opinions :smile:. You're not buying it for aesthetics, milage, power, aerodynamics, image, or whatever else. On all those counts, well yes it is a brick.

    However, quality and utility are confirmed and it's finally about how it sounds. As mentioned, if chicks really like it, you may wind up getting a lot of attention. No wonder the wife is dissuading you :wink:.
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  • Danny Tse
    Danny Tse Posts: 5,206
    edited June 2011
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    I thought the Toyota RAV4 is the "chick car".

    Yes, I drive one and I have it in the "manly" silver color. :D
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  • shawn474
    shawn474 Posts: 3,047
    edited June 2011
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    Its not as much of a chic car as the old men i see driving mazda miatas......:smile:
    Shawn
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,526
    edited June 2011
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    LOL! I was just gonna say the Miata!

    Ever seen a grown man on a tricycle? Same effect.
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  • Jstas
    Jstas Posts: 14,718
    edited June 2011
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    arun1963 wrote: »
    However, quality and utility are confirmed and it's finally about how it sounds. As mentioned, if chicks really like it, you may wind up getting a lot of attention. No wonder the wife is dissuading you :wink:.

    No, quality and utility are not confirmed. The Element doesn't have enough power to be useful for anything other than a small station wagon. It doesn't do offroad and for it's size, it's surprisingly limited in interior space. It's marketed to the "extreme sports" crowd but those are the ones who shun it the most because of it's short coming. Well, maybe not in hippie Oregon but out here on the correct coast, it's old ladies heading to the garden center that drive them. I guess it could be an "extreme garden center". As far as quality, it's the lowest rated Honda for initial quality and customer satisfaction. Kinda telling in that respect.

    Most of the "extreme sports" crowd are driving around in Ford Escapes and Rangers or Nissan Xterras and Frontiers and some Jeeps. Oh, and Subarus. Lots and lots of Subarus.
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  • Jstas
    Jstas Posts: 14,718
    edited June 2011
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    Danny Tse wrote: »
    I thought the Toyota RAV4 is the "chick car".

    Yes, I drive one and I have it in the "manly" silver color. :D

    Every Toyota is a "chick car".

    But this thread is about Honduhs. Not all Honduhs are "chick cars".
    Expert Moron Extraordinaire

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  • nooshinjohn
    nooshinjohn Posts: 25,169
    edited June 2011
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    bobman1235 wrote: »
    I'll say it again : I never saw a real man judge his manhood by the kind of car he drives.

    The above is flat out wrong. It is the sole reason why Porsche, Ferrari and Lamborghini are in business.:biggrin:
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD

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  • ohskigod
    ohskigod Posts: 6,502
    edited June 2011
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    As a driver of a boxy car (cube). Your gonna get looks. Eff em, if the car suits your needs. Get it.

    I might trade my cube in. But I've loved it the last 2 years.
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  • arun1963
    arun1963 Posts: 1,797
    edited June 2011
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    The above is flat out wrong. It is the sole reason why Porsche, Ferrari and Lamborghini are in business.

    No, all it means is that there are more of those that have the money than those who buy it only for what it does. Everything else is a nice bonus. . :biggrin:
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  • shack
    shack Posts: 11,154
    edited June 2011
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    steveinaz wrote:
    I think the poll numbers speak for themselves...:biggrin:

    Wow...I am amazed at the number of guys that have serious questions about their manhood.

    A REAL MAN could be on a pink Vespa with a wicker flower basket on the front...and there would be no doubt of his manhood...just sayin...
    "Just because you’re offended doesn’t mean you’re right." - Ricky Gervais

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  • arun1963
    arun1963 Posts: 1,797
    edited June 2011
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    Jstas wrote: »
    No, quality and utility are not confirmed. The Element doesn't have enough power to be useful for anything other than a small station wagon. It doesn't do offroad and for it's size, it's surprisingly limited in interior space. It's marketed to the "extreme sports" crowd but those are the ones who shun it the most because of it's short coming. Well, maybe not in hippie Oregon but out here on the correct coast, it's old ladies heading to the garden center that drive them. I guess it could be an "extreme garden center". As far as quality, it's the lowest rated Honda for initial quality and customer satisfaction. Kinda telling in that respect.

    Most of the "extreme sports" crowd are driving around in Ford Escapes and Rangers or Nissan Xterras and Frontiers and some Jeeps. Oh, and Subarus. Lots and lots of Subarus.

    Yeah to all that, but what if all it's supposed to do functionally, is get one from point a to b and have a bit of space. Given that, what if you're primarily buying it for the fact that it has a great listening environment.

    Off topic, but iirc, you plugged for the Edge and look how that turned out sound wise. :smile:.......repartee
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  • MacLeod
    MacLeod Posts: 14,358
    edited June 2011
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    Jstas wrote: »
    No, quality and utility are not confirmed. The Element doesn't have enough power to be useful for anything other than a small station wagon. It doesn't do offroad and for it's size, it's surprisingly limited in interior space. It's marketed to the "extreme sports" crowd but those are the ones who shun it the most because of it's short coming. Well, maybe not in hippie Oregon but out here on the correct coast, it's old ladies heading to the garden center that drive them. I guess it could be an "extreme garden center". As far as quality, it's the lowest rated Honda for initial quality and customer satisfaction. Kinda telling in that respect.

    Most of the "extreme sports" crowd are driving around in Ford Escapes and Rangers or Nissan Xterras and Frontiers and some Jeeps. Oh, and Subarus. Lots and lots of Subarus.

    I disagree John. My neighbor has one and he tows his 2 jet skis and utility trailer with it all the time and routinely has it loaded down with crap. You can yank the rear seats out in a few minutes and youve got a lot of storage. Then put them back in and haul 4 people around in comfort.

    I'm not saying its as useful as a pickup or Tahoe but for $20,000 its got a lot to offer in terms of usefulness.

    As for quality, its tied with the Rav-4 for the top spot in JD Powers quality rating in that class plus its the same engine and tranny thats in the Accord if I'm not mistaken so I'd feel pretty comfortable expecting a couple hundred thousand trouble free miles from it.
    polkaudio sound quality competitor since 2005
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    08 Car Audio Nationals 1st ~ 07 N Georgia Nationals 1st ~ 06 Carl Casper Nationals 1st ~ USACi 05 Southeast AutumnFest 1st

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  • Jstas
    Jstas Posts: 14,718
    edited June 2011
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    MacLeod wrote: »
    I disagree John.

    I don't care if you disagree. For years I've read the same stories over and over again. For years I've seen JD Powers putting the Element at the top of it's ranking while every other magazine, website and quality survey has rated it middle of the road or lower, including the beloved Consumer Reports which gives it a whopping 58 out of 100 points.

    You're going to get what you want. If it's a Honda Element that you're all jazzed about then, go for it. I don't see the allure but then again, I had a co-worker that I mocked mercilessly because his "dream car" was a Lexus ES300 (read: expensive Camry). Takes all kinds I guess.

    Personally, I think your $20K could be better spent elsewhere. I also think your rationale for getting it with the audio installation in mind is lacking. The Element may have all the stuff you talked about but it also has acres of reflective, hard surfaces courtesy of it's "hose it out" interior materials. You're raving about it but I think you're going to have to do a TON of work to get it where you need it sonically for competition.

    And I still think you're a chick even without the Element. :tongue:
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  • Jstas
    Jstas Posts: 14,718
    edited June 2011
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    arun1963 wrote: »
    Yeah to all that, but what if all it's supposed to do functionally, is get one from point a to b and have a bit of space. Given that, what if you're primarily buying it for the fact that it has a great listening environment.

    Off topic, but iirc, you plugged for the Edge and look how that turned out sound wise. :smile:.......repartee

    There's better options for basic transportation with a bit of space. The Fit comes to mind if you have a hard on for Honduh.

    Element has acres of reflective surfaces, hard plastic materials that vibrate and next to no sound deadening because you can't get the typical foam and felt materials they use for sound deadening wet when you "hose it out". If you're buying one for a listening environment you must like going to concerts in high school gymnasiums. 'cause that's what it's gonna sound like.

    Lastly, I didn't recommend the Edge for the listening environment. I recommended it because his wife said she wanted something for the family. He was worried about the listening environment. It's a good compromise for both sides. The Edge he has was doomed anyway because he already has a bias against Ford. Which makes me wonder why he got it in the first place when he could have gotten any number of the other competitors for similar prices but hey, to each his own. I recommended because I think it's one of the best crossover/soft-roader SUV's you can buy. Several hundred thousand other people think so too. That's why I recommended it. But he didn't buy it based on my recommendation anyway.

    Oh and I have an Edge too. Well, Lincoln MKX. It's an Edge in Lincoln drag. For a listening environment, it's pretty good. 40K miles on it and I haven't seen any of the issues Mac was complaining about from his Edge. However, I think it would make a fine listening environment with or without the stock stereo. The stock stereo is 5.1 channel surround sound as well. THX Certified! :rolleyes:
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,526
    edited June 2011
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    shack wrote: »
    Wow...I am amazed at the number of guys that have serious questions about their manhood.

    A REAL MAN could be on a pink Vespa with a wicker flower basket on the front...and there would be no doubt of his manhood...just sayin...

    I did catch a glimpse of myself naked this morning, and I haven't been right all day. Gravity is a ****. :biggrin:

    But seriously, I couldn't drive a wanna-be truck either; ie, Ranger, Chevy Luv, etc--any "mini" truck. I just can't do it. The 10 minutes I spent riding Bev's Honda rebel (250cc) home were the most embarassing 10 minutes I can remember--and I'm not a BIG dude by any stretch, I just felt like I was riding a kids bike.

    ...then again, I own a Suzuki Forenza--so take my observations with a grain of salt.
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  • venomclan
    venomclan Posts: 2,467
    edited June 2011
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    I have a 2005 AWD Element I bought new in February 05'. It now has 94K on it, and other than standard maintenence, it runs great. Nothing is falling apart, and I beat the crap out of it. It has planty of power for basic driving and lite towing. I have the "slowest" model, since it is AWD and the older 4-spd. The newer ones will have a little more power. For me it has been the most versitile vehical I have owned. It has a surprizing amount of space in it. I have moved twice with this car and it was a lifesaver in a lot of instances. The Element also turns on a dime, better than sedans I have owned before. It was a great vehicle for my old bulldog.

    As for mileage, I average 20-21, either going 80 or bumper to bumper in south Florida. The only drawback I do not like, like Shack mentioned, was the suicide doors. They can be a pain in the **** sometimes in tight spaces, but come in handy other times.
    Venom
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  • coolsax
    coolsax Posts: 1,824
    edited June 2011
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    Just an FYI though.. and someone can correct me if I'm wrong but they have discontinued the element line so this may be the last year you can get that model.
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  • shawn474
    shawn474 Posts: 3,047
    edited June 2011
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    steveinaz wrote: »
    I did catch a glimpse of myself naked this morning, and I haven't been right all day. Gravity is a ****. :biggrin:

    But seriously, I couldn't drive a wanna-be truck either; ie, Ranger, Chevy Luv, etc--any "mini" truck. I just can't do it. The 10 minutes I spent riding Bev's Honda rebel (250cc) home were the most embarassing 10 minutes I can remember--and I'm not a BIG dude by any stretch, I just felt like I was riding a kids bike.

    ...then again, I own a Suzuki Forenza--so take my observations with a grain of salt.

    HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!! This is great. I am 6'1, 200 lbs and my brother is 5'8" and 260 lbs. We rode his suzuki 600 one day and I swear the only thing I could think of was Jeff Daniels and Jim Carey on the scooter in Dumb and Dumber. We got so many looks from other drivers!!!! Not even the guys on motorcycles would wave!!! That poor motorcycle must have had sparks dragging behind it.

    Bottom line is who the F cares what JD Power, Consumer Reports, etc. say. I am goping to get the car that I want. (Trust me, I know. I bought a 2005 Nissan Titan :frown:). When you ask for opinions on these things, it is going to spark spirited brand debate. Nobody needs to take it personal.

    I have a buddy that drives a VW Beetle. He is married to a friend, one of the most attractive women I have ever known. He says if she doesn't mind, he couldn't give a SH$T about what anyone else thinks. :wink:
    Shawn
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  • billbillw
    billbillw Posts: 6,250
    edited June 2011
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    I don't think of chicks when I see an Element, I just have an urge to puke. To me, they are one of the ugliest cars on the road. Right up there with the Pontiac Aztek.

    They do seem practical though. Probably a good choice for someone who doesn't need a full on off-roader, but likes to do the outdoor stuff.

    MacCleod, you really think all those hard surfaces in the Element would be good for SQ audio? There isn't a lick of carpet in those. The only fabric is in the seats. Seems like they would be a nightmare of reflections.
    For rig details, see my profile. Nothing here anymore...
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