Emotiva DAC

13

Comments

  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited October 2010
    steveinaz wrote: »
    NOT junk, just a typical $299 DAC. There's no free rides bubba.

    I don't mean to disagree. You are right, generally, the more you pay, the better equipment you can expect. However, companies have been known to use their name to sell the product. Wasn't it the oppo bdp that was found inside the shell of a 2k product recently?

    Every $299 dollar product isn't built equal. Hell, you can buy a $1500 13'' macbook pro or you can buy a dell that has the same specs for $600. With the mac, sure you get better packaging, but damn if it doesn't perform the same.

    A lot of the manufacturer direct companies are selling products based on this concept (this can also be seen in DIY, much more value for the money). Whether they are actually delivering what they say, who knows.
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,432
    edited October 2010
    cokewithvanilla wrote: »
    I don't mean to disagree. You are right, generally, the more you pay, the better equipment you can expect. However, companies have been known to use their name to sell the product. Wasn't it the oppo bdp that was found inside the shell of a 2k product recently?

    Every $299 dollar product isn't built equal. Hell, you can buy a $1500 13'' macbook pro or you can buy a dell that has the same specs for $600. With the mac, sure you get better packaging, but damn if it doesn't perform the same.

    A lot of the manufacturer direct companies are selling products based on this concept (this can also be seen in DIY, much more value for the money). Whether they are actually delivering what they say, who knows.

    Welcome to Captialism. Manuvering the waters can be treacherous. Experience is the best tool. The only way to get experience is to invest the time and money, if you won't/don't/can't then you have to make due with your selections, etc.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • cfrizz
    cfrizz Posts: 13,415
    edited October 2010
    ohskigod wrote: »
    uh, if it was a few.....it wouldnt be that big of a problem. just sayin....lol

    Sorry Lou, but it is the same few people who do the crapping in these threads over and over again. More might agree with those vocal few, but they have decided to simply let the threads be and let others who are not quite so reactionary deal with the questions.

    They are reacting to behavior and comments made in the past, but hasn't been seen here in quite some time.

    There is no problem until those vocal few MAKE it a problem. Those vocal few could learn a lot from the silent rest who might agree with them.

    This is no different than the vocal few who were still complaining 2 years after the fact that TBB or whatever it was called was closed.

    Get over it and move on already.

    Now if we get another influx of Emotiva is the be all to end all gushers again, have at it, I might even join you!:D
    Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
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  • sucks2beme
    sucks2beme Posts: 5,683
    edited October 2010
    So the BUZZ is it's great. Better than a benchmark.
    What were you expecting? Them to announce it sounds like crap?
    Meaningless drivil until somebody reliable reviews it,
    Over at Head-fi it's called FOTH(flavor of the month).
    There's always some new product that gets a lot of attention and hype.
    A lot of people buy it. A couple announce it's great, a couple of months later
    reality comes to visit. We have NO idea how it sounds. It looks promising,
    but only ears can tell.
    I have no problem with links to describe it. But NONE of us know if it's
    great, horrid, or just so so.
    "The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." --Thomas Jefferson
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  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited October 2010
    sucks2beme wrote: »
    So the BUZZ is it's great. Better than a benchmark.
    What were you expecting? Them to announce it sounds like crap?
    Meaningless drivil until somebody reliable reviews it,
    Over at Head-fi it's called FOTH(flavor of the month).
    There's always some new product that gets a lot of attention and hype.
    A lot of people buy it. A couple announce it's great, a couple of months later
    reality comes to visit. We have NO idea how it sounds. It looks promising,
    but only ears can tell.
    I have no problem with links to describe it. But NONE of us know if it's
    great, horrid, or just so so.

    Good point. Sorry for my ignorance. I thought perhaps there was something that can be had from it's specs. I know it is widely believed that specs don't matter as much as the actual listening, but I figured there has to be at least a guide line to follow based on specs. You can't simply buy based on price and who is manufacturing the unit (I mean, I'd find it hard to do)

    Things like, "oh look, they use that same tweeter in a 5k speaker" with polk's Lsi series.
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  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited October 2010
    cokewithvanilla wrote: »

    Things like, "oh look, they use that same tweeter in a 5k speaker" with polk's Lsi series.

    Sorry but things doesn't work like that. :)

    LSi are good overall speakers. It's not just the tweeters alone.
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
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  • cfrizz
    cfrizz Posts: 13,415
    edited October 2010
    Trust your ears over specs, only YOU will know if your ears like it or not in your system.
    Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
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  • nooshinjohn
    nooshinjohn Posts: 25,924
    edited October 2010
    cfrizz wrote: »
    Trust your ears over specs, only YOU will know if your ears like it or not in your system.



    This.
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2800 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon MiND2 Shunyata Triton

    “When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson

    How many flies need to be buzzing a dead horse before you guys stop beating it?
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  • sucks2beme
    sucks2beme Posts: 5,683
    edited October 2010
    It's kind of like picking the super bowl winner during the pre-season.
    Or benchtop racing. Chipsets and marketing wow only go about so far.
    There's still a lot of 10+ year old DACS that kill all these new wiz-bank
    units. It's all about design and implementation. You have to have both.
    There's still a lot of older big name units I'd buy in a heartbeat if I could.
    "The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." --Thomas Jefferson
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  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,650
    edited October 2010
    sucks2beme wrote: »
    It's all about design and implementation. You have to have both.
    That sums it up nicely.ie.You can hype the fact that your using a discrete analog output stage but that does not neccessarily mean it will outperform a premium IC opamp.It depends on the design and implementation.
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  • mdaudioguy
    mdaudioguy Posts: 5,165
    edited October 2010
    cokewithvanilla wrote: »
    I didn't read this, but it looks like there is some information for people who know more than I here, http://emonatics.com/XDA-1.shtml does that help for a quality judgment, or not?
    remote2.jpg
    That's a pretty cool looking remote! :cool:
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  • cfrizz
    cfrizz Posts: 13,415
    edited October 2010
    Good grief, it looks like you can use it for a weapon!
    Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,432
    edited October 2010
    mdaudioguy wrote: »
    remote2.jpg
    That's a pretty cool looking remote! :cool:

    I know!!! A cool looking remote always improves the performance and sound quality of a unit. If my Dared tube pre-amp had a cooler looking remote, it would sound 10 times better, I'm sure of it. :rolleyes::)

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited October 2010
    heiney9 wrote: »
    I know!!! A cool looking remote always improves the performance and sound quality of a unit. If my Dared tube pre-amp had a cooler looking remote, it would sound 10 times better, I'm sure of it. :rolleyes::)

    H9

    If the remote looked good enough to alter your emotional state......

    :p
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  • sucks2beme
    sucks2beme Posts: 5,683
    edited October 2010
    I would like nothing better than a $300 Dac kick butt and
    take names. I think it would really spur a lot more people
    into pc source audio. I also would like the Cowboys to win all the
    rest of their games this season. And hit the lotto.
    Oh well, time to crank up the 2 channel rig.
    "The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." --Thomas Jefferson
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  • nooshinjohn
    nooshinjohn Posts: 25,924
    edited October 2010
    mdaudioguy wrote: »
    remote2.jpg
    That's a pretty cool looking remote! :cool:

    Set your phasers to STUN, and be careful to to kill the ensign in the red uniform.:p:D
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2800 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon MiND2 Shunyata Triton

    “When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson

    How many flies need to be buzzing a dead horse before you guys stop beating it?
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  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,650
    edited October 2010
    Inquiring minds want to know how much of the build cost is in that fancy aluminum cased remote?
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  • mdaudioguy
    mdaudioguy Posts: 5,165
    edited October 2010
    FTGV wrote: »
    Inquiring minds want to know how much of the build cost is in that fancy aluminum cased remote?

    I'm guessing it weighs in at about 4 lbs... Nothing says quality like a hefty remote! ;)
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  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited October 2010
    mdaudioguy wrote: »
    I'm guessing it weighs in at about 4 lbs... Nothing says quality like a hefty remote! ;)

    but I bet if it had a cheap remote, someone would be talking trash about it.
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 29,427
    edited October 2010
    My remote is rinky dink for my Candela.

    Plastic, has 30 plus slots for buttons but only the bottom left holes have buttons... lol

    Thats ok, Klaus wanted 200 bucks for a solid aluminum remote with two buttons. I told him to kick rocks and give me that plastic one...


    And my previous comments about Emotiva had nothing to do with their sound quality or quality in general. But they are quickly becoming my favorite joke in audio. Next up is toasters and microwaves that enhance your sound... probably will have big bitchin blue lights too and a solid remote
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited October 2010
    Vr3MxStyler2k3 wrote: »
    My remote is rinky dink for my Candela.

    Plastic, has 30 plus slots for buttons but only the bottom left holes have buttons... lol

    that is class right there :D
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,545
    edited October 2010
    That's Emotiva's marketing niche---rugged build=quality component. You've got to do something different to get noticed in this business. Especially when you basically have 2 buyers; average consumers buying the "cheap" stuff, and audiophiles who may overlook a lower/mid-priced component.

    Think about this for a moment; do you think Emotiva would have received the attention it gets if they had average case work/build quality? In other words, strictly on their audio performance?

    Again, I'm not trying to poo-poo on Emotiva; I think it's a high value product with obviously nice styling and build quality, and respectable specifications.
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Source: Rotel CD14MkII CD Player - Speakers: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,432
    edited October 2010
    cokewithvanilla wrote: »
    but I bet if it had a cheap remote, someone would be talking trash about it.

    Doubt it, any true audiophile knows that at a certain price point the look of the remote is unimportant. My Dared tube pre has a little key fob that looks like a car alarm remote. Glad they put the money into the gold plated pcb's, gold plated tube sockets, teflon rca's and Auricap coupling caps rather than spending that money on a fancy 4lb remote.

    Once you start moving up the line to more expensive gear the remotes are nicer for sure, but you are paying for it in the price of the upper end gear.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited October 2010
    I've seen Emotiva Remote from ERC-1. I think this is the same remote with some minor change for the DAC functions.

    While ERC-1 remote looks impressive and better than most filmsy plastic remote, it does not hold any weight against remotes from Levinson or Pass Labs Aleph P Remote. Although it is big, it's lighter in person and probably about 1LB or a little more. It does not weight a lot coz the aluminum is not milled out from one piece aluminum. If I can put it nicely, it may probably dent if you hit it to someone on the head with it. If you have seen a ML or Pass Labs remote, you know you could hit someone on the head with it and the skull will crack and you'll undoubtedly end up in a jail or something.

    So, that's the EMO difference....

    But the real turn off is the remote is too wide to hold in my palm and the buttons are too small for my finger.
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited October 2010
    Ayon remotes are also built like bricks, probably similar to Pass's.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • MillerLiteScott
    MillerLiteScott Posts: 2,564
    edited October 2010
    Couple of things.

    I could care less about the remote. I believe most would just use their universal remotes.

    Musical Fidelity remotes are pieces of plastic junk.

    I think the Emotiva DAC is much better looking than the Benchmark and if it sound just as good or better for $299. Good for Emotiva.

    The buzz about this DAC from what I have read on other forums is that it has discrete output stages but I really don't know any more than that.

    Scott
    I like speakers that are bigger than a small refrigerator but smaller than a big refrigerator:D
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,432
    edited October 2010
    MillerLiteScott wrote: »

    The buzz about this DAC from what I have read on other forums is that it has discrete output stages but I really don't know any more than that.

    Scott

    I highly, highly, highly doubt that! Even my $850 1997 Adcom doesn't have a fully discrete output stage, at some point in the output stage it uses (2) dual channel op-amps which I just upgraded to OPA627A's. Everything else is discrete.

    No way could they build a decent 100% discrete DAC for $299, not a snowballs chance in hell!!!. Period!

    Perhaps with their marketing there are some semantics going on with what "discrete" actually means. Just like the term "Class A" output, there are lots of different marketing types that throw that word around, and all Class A amp sections are NOT the same.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • MillerLiteScott
    MillerLiteScott Posts: 2,564
    edited October 2010
    H9 this is where I got it from.

    http://emonatics.com/XDA-1.shtml

    Hope the link works.
    I like speakers that are bigger than a small refrigerator but smaller than a big refrigerator:D
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,432
    edited October 2010
    That's cool Scott, wasn't trying to say you're wrong. I've read that link when the dac was first announced and it's all marketing speak. No way to tell for sure, except all of the fully discrete designs I'm aware of start at about $2K and go up to infinity. So if Emo pulled it off for $299.............well you see where I'm going.

    I think others should focus their efforts on railing against firms like Emo that write this horrible marketing gobbly **** to misinform potential buyers instead of focusing all their energy on cable debates. To me companies like Emo and many other are far more at fault for phoney, bloated, false marketing than cable companies.

    <end rant>

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,545
    edited October 2010
    Looks pretty nice for 2-niner-niner.
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Source: Rotel CD14MkII CD Player - Speakers: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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