Should Polk design a Beryllium tweeter??

cnh
cnh Posts: 13,284
edited January 2010 in Speakers
Having heard a number of Focal offerings with Beryllium tweeters..I can honeslty say that it's a pretty incredible speaker!

I know this is a rare earth material and not readily available...but could this be a new step toward a higher series of Polks above the Vifa tweeter in the LSis...does anyone care?

A purely hypothetical question, of course...

cnh
Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
[sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
Post edited by cnh on
· Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
«1

Comments

  • gidrah
    gidrah Posts: 3,049
    edited January 2010
    I honestly believe that the Vifa tweeter offers all that can be had within a realistic price range. How would the Be tweeters merge with their mids and XOs?
    DIY it. I've wanted Polk to try SDAed compression horns for years.
    Make it Funky! :)
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited January 2010
    It would be nice, but I'm doubtful that we would see a Polk with a Be tweeter.

    There are one or two available commercially, but the one I'm familiar with wouldn't fit in the LSi series tweeter cutout.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Midnite Mick
    Midnite Mick Posts: 1,591
    edited January 2010
    I don't think there are any true Be tweeters. Some that say they are only have a trace of it.....maybe incorporate a ribbon?
    Modwright SWL 9.0 SE (6Sons Audio Thunderbird PC with Oyaide 004 terminations)
    Consonance cd120T
    Consonance Cyber 800 tube monoblocks (6Sons Audio Thunderbird PC's with Oyaide 004 terminations)
    Usher CP 6311

    Phillips Pronto TS1000 Universal Remote
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited January 2010
    Focal and ScanSpeak's are as close as it gets. It's companies like Usher you have to watch out for.

    Ribbons can sound nice, but domes have better off axis and can generally be played lower.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited January 2010
    cnh wrote: »
    Having heard a number of Focal offerings with Beryllium tweeters..I can honeslty say that it's a pretty incredible speaker!

    I know this is a rare earth material and not readily available...but could this be a new step toward a higher series of Polks above the Vifa tweeter in the LSis...does anyone care?

    A purely hypothetical question, of course...

    cnh

    Well, berryllium tweeters goes back to some Vintage Yamaha Speakers NS-1000M from the mid 70s. I haven't heard one but people says that is an excellent speaker. But it's doubtful that Vintage Yammy speaker sounds as good as the newer JM labs offerings with BE tweeter. Usher speakers also offer BE tweeters in some of their speakers. To say that BE metal sounds better than the other material such as Aluminum, or Magnesium, Titanium or even other soft dome tweeters is highly debatable. I guess it comes down to how the tweeter is designed and manufactured and not only based on the materials.

    There are some Vifa Ring Radiator line up that supposedly better than the ones in the LSi speakers.

    Accuton offers Diamond tweeters and B&W also makes their own Diamond Tweeters. So, everyone is doing things differently but there is no solid proof of what sounds superior to another.
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,249
    edited January 2010
    The only thing, and I do mean the only thing that I do not like about the Beryllium tweeters is that the imaging lacks pinpoint spatial locational cues and proper imaging [vaguely important]. That said, it is one of the nicest sounding [not for critical listening] tweeters I have heard. Even when you are way off axis. It is very natural, non-fatiguing tweeter with a wonderful roll off and exceptional range.

    If only they could address the imaging thing.
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited January 2010
    Who's Be tweeter are you referring to Tom?
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,249
    edited January 2010
    Focal's. Honestly didn't know that anybody else made them.
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • DeusExa
    DeusExa Posts: 491
    edited January 2010
    treitz3 wrote: »
    Focal's. Honestly didn't know that anybody else made them.

    Paradigm, Usher, etc.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited January 2010
    http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=8713

    WANT...
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited January 2010
    face wrote: »
    http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=8713

    want...

    buy?
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited January 2010
    No, not yet at least. I can get them for a little less, but I have other things to buy right now. The good thing, they're practically a drop in for the tweeters I'm using now.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • mantis
    mantis Posts: 17,205
    edited January 2010
    The lsi's didn't lack in the mid to upper ranges. It was the low end that suffered. They need to figure out how to get rid of that woofer and tighten up the Lsi15. I would rather a tigher less bass speaker then one that tries to go where it doesn't belong.

    The Vifa tweeter is amazing. I would leave it alone.
    Dan
    My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • LuSh
    LuSh Posts: 887
    edited January 2010
    Focal? Who the hell would want to mimic a Focal? Has anybody listened to them? Yikes...home theatre sure...two channel? Maybe if I was a reviewer and needed to review gear.

    I'm with Mantis on this one.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Midnite Mick
    Midnite Mick Posts: 1,591
    edited January 2010
    The best tweeter I have ever heard is the ScanSpeak ring radiator...quite expensive though.

    Regards,
    Mike
    Modwright SWL 9.0 SE (6Sons Audio Thunderbird PC with Oyaide 004 terminations)
    Consonance cd120T
    Consonance Cyber 800 tube monoblocks (6Sons Audio Thunderbird PC's with Oyaide 004 terminations)
    Usher CP 6311

    Phillips Pronto TS1000 Universal Remote
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    edited January 2010
    You don't think Focal's Be tweeters sound good in 2 channel? Must be something wrong with my ears then...they sound wonderful..smooth, clean, holographic--effortless. A lot better than most tweeters out there which sound horribly harsh to me regardless of what digital gear you run with them once you turn it up loud.

    I am excluding tube gear here BTW.

    cnh
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • dorokusai
    dorokusai Posts: 25,577
    edited January 2010
    The Be tweeter is overrated. Especially the Usher version of which I'm intimately familiar with.
    CTC BBQ Amplifier, Sonic Frontiers Line3 Pre-Amplifier and Wadia 581 SACD player. Speakers? Always changing but for now, Mission Argonauts I picked up for $50 bucks, mint.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • kcoc321
    kcoc321 Posts: 1,788
    edited January 2010
    Midnite Mick wrote: »
    The best tweeter I have ever heard is the ScanSpeak ring radiator...quite expensive though.

    Regards,
    Mike
    I this the one you are touting Mike?
    http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=45_229_427&products_id=1581

    It is still $100 less than the BE one...
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    edited January 2010
    dorokusai wrote: »
    The Be tweeter is overrated. Especially the Usher version of which I'm intimately familiar with.

    I remember hearing the Usher and they really are no match for Focal's version. I found the Usher a bit too shrill on the top end at loud volumes whereas the Focals don't strain an inch as you turn up the volume...

    cnh
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Knucklehead
    Knucklehead Posts: 3,602
    edited January 2010
    I found an interesting article on the subject.

    http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_14_3/feature-article-beryllium-9-2007.html
    Polk Audio Surround Bar 360
    Mirage PS-12
    LG BDP-550
    Motorola HD FIOS DVR
    Panasonic 42" Plasma
    XBOX 360[/SIZE]

    Office stuff

    Allied 395 receiver
    Pioneer CDP PD-M430
    RT8t's & Wharfedale Diamond II's[/SIZE]

    Life is one grand, sweet song, so start the music. ~Ronald Reagan
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • dorokusai
    dorokusai Posts: 25,577
    edited January 2010
    cnh wrote: »
    I remember hearing the Usher and they really are no match for Focal's version. I found the Usher a bit too shrill on the top end at loud volumes whereas the Focals don't strain an inch as you turn up the volume...

    cnh

    I didn't find them particular more shrill but I wouldn't buy a Be Focal either.
    CTC BBQ Amplifier, Sonic Frontiers Line3 Pre-Amplifier and Wadia 581 SACD player. Speakers? Always changing but for now, Mission Argonauts I picked up for $50 bucks, mint.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    edited January 2010
    Remember Doro my ears have a decade or so on yours...so it's possible I've lost some of my high end...ha..ha....

    cnh
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Fongolio
    Fongolio Posts: 3,516
    edited January 2010
    I've heard the Usher Be-718's and was very impressed with the big sound a stand mount could produce. The tweeter is berylium and sounded very smooth and revealing without being harsh. However I would never trade my SDA-1C's for a pair. Should Polk make a berylium? I'm not sure the expense is worth it. Polks have always produced exceptionally good sound without huge expense. I think the Be tweeter would drive the price up too high for what it's worth.
    SDA-1C (full mods)
    Carver TFM-55
    NAD 1130 Pre-amp
    Rega Planar 3 TT/Shelter 501 MkII
    The Clamp
    Revox A77 Mk IV Dolby reel to reel
    Thorens TD160/Mission 774 arm/Stanton 881S Shibata
    Nakamichi CR7 Cassette Deck
    Rotel RCD-855 with modified tube output stage
    Cambridge Audio DACmagic Plus
    ADC Soundshaper 3 EQ
    Ben's IC's
    Nitty Gritty 1.5FI RCM
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Midnite Mick
    Midnite Mick Posts: 1,591
    edited January 2010
    For the record Usher's Be tweeter isn't really beryllium...so not really a fair assessment of a Beryllium tweeter. Usher has developed a drop in replacement for the Be tweeter now.
    Modwright SWL 9.0 SE (6Sons Audio Thunderbird PC with Oyaide 004 terminations)
    Consonance cd120T
    Consonance Cyber 800 tube monoblocks (6Sons Audio Thunderbird PC's with Oyaide 004 terminations)
    Usher CP 6311

    Phillips Pronto TS1000 Universal Remote
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Midnite Mick
    Midnite Mick Posts: 1,591
    edited January 2010
    kcoc321 wrote: »
    I this the one you are touting Mike?
    http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=45_229_427&products_id=1581

    It is still $100 less than the BE one...

    I believe that it is the same tweeter. I heard them in these.

    http://www.gamutaudio.com/products/details.asp?id=11

    Regards,
    Mike
    Modwright SWL 9.0 SE (6Sons Audio Thunderbird PC with Oyaide 004 terminations)
    Consonance cd120T
    Consonance Cyber 800 tube monoblocks (6Sons Audio Thunderbird PC's with Oyaide 004 terminations)
    Usher CP 6311

    Phillips Pronto TS1000 Universal Remote
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Midnite Mick
    Midnite Mick Posts: 1,591
    edited January 2010
    Midnite Mick wrote: »
    For the record Usher's Be tweeter isn't really beryllium...so not really a fair assessment of a Beryllium tweeter.

    They don't call it a Beryllium tweeter anymore.
    Modwright SWL 9.0 SE (6Sons Audio Thunderbird PC with Oyaide 004 terminations)
    Consonance cd120T
    Consonance Cyber 800 tube monoblocks (6Sons Audio Thunderbird PC's with Oyaide 004 terminations)
    Usher CP 6311

    Phillips Pronto TS1000 Universal Remote
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    edited January 2010
    That's what I thought as well...Focals with pure Be inverted tweeters are over 10 grand a pair and that's the LOW end!


    cnh
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Fongolio
    Fongolio Posts: 3,516
    edited January 2010
    Midnite Mick wrote: »
    For the record Usher's Be tweeter isn't really beryllium...so not really a fair assessment of a Beryllium tweeter. Usher has developed a drop in replacement for the Be tweeter now.

    (Johnny Carson voice): I did not know that. Thank you for clearing that up for me.

    (My voice): WTF. Why were they calling them beryllium? They are still some of the best sounding standmounts I've heard.
    SDA-1C (full mods)
    Carver TFM-55
    NAD 1130 Pre-amp
    Rega Planar 3 TT/Shelter 501 MkII
    The Clamp
    Revox A77 Mk IV Dolby reel to reel
    Thorens TD160/Mission 774 arm/Stanton 881S Shibata
    Nakamichi CR7 Cassette Deck
    Rotel RCD-855 with modified tube output stage
    Cambridge Audio DACmagic Plus
    ADC Soundshaper 3 EQ
    Ben's IC's
    Nitty Gritty 1.5FI RCM
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Midnite Mick
    Midnite Mick Posts: 1,591
    edited January 2010
    Fongolio wrote: »
    (Johnny Carson voice): I did not know that. Thank you for clearing that up for me.

    (My voice): WTF. Why were they calling them beryllium? They are still some of the best sounding standmounts I've heard.

    I think it had a trace of Beryllium. You can do some research online as one person really came after them regarding this. Anyway, in the end who cares, all that matters is if you dig the sound or not.
    Modwright SWL 9.0 SE (6Sons Audio Thunderbird PC with Oyaide 004 terminations)
    Consonance cd120T
    Consonance Cyber 800 tube monoblocks (6Sons Audio Thunderbird PC's with Oyaide 004 terminations)
    Usher CP 6311

    Phillips Pronto TS1000 Universal Remote
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • dorokusai
    dorokusai Posts: 25,577
    edited January 2010
    Midnite Mick wrote: »
    They don't call it a Beryllium tweeter anymore.

    Have you told Usher?
    CTC BBQ Amplifier, Sonic Frontiers Line3 Pre-Amplifier and Wadia 581 SACD player. Speakers? Always changing but for now, Mission Argonauts I picked up for $50 bucks, mint.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter