Circuit City trade up plan (part two)

RuSsMaN

Man, they resonate at 100 (or less depending on the enclosure), and they go out to 20K, pure and simple. First of all, music wise, not much goes out beyond 16Khz, and even less by 18Khz. These will do music justice, imo. I know it's tough to grasp for some people, not saying you are one of them, but this is an FR driver done RIGHT. I only wish they made larger drivers, like Lowther.

I am choosing not to endorse them any further than I have already. You can spend $150 for some hand-crafter Thai long-drums with the TB driver (hows that? keep me from fat-fingering it, it's a southern thing, we like to drop the 'N') , or spend less than $20 for a couple from PE, and even throw in some terminal cups.

Effin buy em already. They are STELLAR drivers, they don't even have an impedance curve worth making a Zobel for, they are FLAT.

Cheers,
Rooster

rs159

Will do then...

I've also been thinking of making myself a little "travel" rig for ambient background music in hotel rooms and such. Does the Russman think the two inchers would be up to the task? (Now the computer told me all this so it's probably not dead on) In a vented enclosure I could get the twos down to ~140hz F3, and that was stretching it. In a sealed enclosure it starts to roll off somewhere in the 300s. Still a lot better than most clock radios though. I'm actually quite critical of my "background music", BTW

The thing is, the calculated optimal box size for the twos was around 3-4" tall, while the threes and above were all <9", not great for travelling, obviously.



I guess I should tackle my projects one at a time, but I just can't help myself.

RuSsMaN

It depends. Your best bet for traveling maybe a headphone amp and rig.

I have heard other people integrating the nOrh 3.0's with a small computer rig (which is what I used to use when I traveled at my last job). Subbing the sats for the 3.0's. Dude, you could make them as small as you want, I wouldn't go with the 2" alone, period. 100Hz from a 3" in a small vented enclosure (5x5x5 ****) would be better than the 2" in ANY enclosure. Follow?

You need to hear the quality, then you can decide how low you want to go. I can listen to the 3", without any issues, for an extended period. Obviously you lack a little low-end, but chances are you are listening for vocal clarity, strings, horns etc, not thump-adump.

Cheers,
Rooster

rs159

I follow. I guess if I wanted to get really elaborate I could go isobarik and make myself a teeny tiny little "bass module", but I'd need another suitcase for it all! Not to mention the robery factor, I go on cruises often and you can't exactly fit two speakers, a bass module, amps and such, media, AND everything else like your camera in those itty bitty safes.

rs159

Originally posted by RuSsMaN
...You need to hear the quality, then you can decide how low you want to go. I can listen to the 3", without any issues, for an extended period. Obviously you lack a little low-end, but chances are you are listening for vocal clarity, strings, horns etc, not thump-adump.

Cheers,
Rooster

I follow that too. (I'm going to get hell for this), but I've heard indoor public adress systems that sometimes they played music over. While they distorted in the bass (stupid 'tards ran 'em full range), they actually sounded fairly OK in the vocals and highs. They werent the last word in detail, and it was mono, but it was listenable - unlike most clock radios and little boomboxes today that sound like nails on a chalkboard.

rs159

And I think that one aspect of sounding "big" is the highs. People expect their little boomboxes to sound small, and their main complaint is the lack of bass (my, how the general population loves bass, I go into radio shack and the speakers are playing around 50db and the subs are at 80). But subliminally, they know that it sounds like nails on a chalkboard and better systems are clearer (but, of course the first thing they consiously notice is bass). More detail = "bigger" sound IMO, even if there's not much deep bass to speak of. But enough philosohpy for tonight...

RuSsMaN

Literally, we are talking a 30 wpc integrated, and a portable cd player. Even if you added a sub (as if you needed one with the vocal and midbass clarity of the TB making up for the low-end), if you found the *right* bass driver, you could run it free-air on a thin board.

You do have options, and for convenience alone, a small pc rig with portable player may be your best bet, that is, if you don't want an audiophile rig in the ho-tel...

Cheers,
Rooster

I'll get some pics of my *tiny* TB 4" DIY creations tommorrow.

rs159

I'll be waiting... For now, I need sleep so I don't look like a pothead in the morning.

RuSsMaN

Here are a couple TB projects at the PE site, if you haven't seen them.

http://www.partsexpress.com/projectshowcase/Kuze3201/Kuze3201.html



http://www.partsexpress.com/projectshowcase/sdss11/sdss11.htm



Cheers,
Rooster

TroyD

shoot, who cares how it sounds. Cool factor alone is astronomical...

BDT

rs159

Certainly a conversation piece. Your neighbors ask "are those things SPEAKERS?" and you say yes of course. They ask how they sound. You turn on the system - "Oh my god, honney, that sounds better than the BOSE speakers at our house"

rs159

Oops, looks like I hijacked my own thread.

rs159

Hmm, I just got an IDEA! Build a bass module (or subwoofer, but with limited volume and driver size it might not be wise to call it that) that has a removeable back so you can put all your stuff inside the box. Takes less space, everything's protected, and the only downside might be puzzled looks from airport security (what would you think if you saw a small box with tons of electronics inside?)

I would have to figure a way to protect the sub's driver, but that shouldn't be too hard.

I guess the closest thing you could compare it to would be this.

HBombToo

can i have some of what your smoking?

evil twin

rs159

Hell na, I paid good money fo' dis

HBombToo

you Bastage! but i don't anyway because of tests so your on your own. change a few laws IM IN!

rs159

Sorry to hear of your "situation"

HBombToo

waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.

Funny Stuff!

Twin

rs159

Hey guys, it's me, and I'm as -NOT- stoned as ever

Anywho, I've been thinking about the travelling rig and I decided that the speakers don't have to be the most wonderful quality because I will take headphones when I need more extended bass and more volume without making anyone mad.

With that in mind, I tried to get myself thinking, so I said to myself "good sound from a small enclosure". The first thing I thought of was bose (blech), and the second thing I thought of was that little Tivoli radio.

Metropolitan reception and almost perfect reception out at sea (if there were any stations there) make the radio portion completely insignifigant to me.

My thoughts are to make a small (around 6"w, 5"h, 5"d) enclosure and put a single (mono, if you didn't catch my drift) Tang Band full ranger in there, and somehow integrate an amp and preamp in the same box. It has to be durable (it can be packed between clothes and things, but the knobs cant randomly fall off), good looking (unlike so many CD clock radios of a similar size), and it has to have at least one input on the back (no ****). I would use a CD or MP3 player (mp3 most likely since I'm not dragging all my CDs along) for a source.

A sealed box would be preffered for simplicity, so stuff doesn't find it's way up the ports, and a ported design for something so small seems like it would fit -very- tightly (unless, of course, somebody's allready done something this small with the Tangs, if so then please tell me more).

A division in the box could be made for the amp/preamp, with holes for ventilation.

Any suggestions on the amp? Don't forget it has to be able to sum the signal to mono. I can solder, that's about it, so kits are fine but building something from scratch is a little too much.

Or perhaps an internal amp is a bad idea and something like the rat shack amp you will see if you click here just set atop the speaker would be a better Idea.

I know I will get hell for the whole mono thing, but remember that for serious listening I would have headphones, and serious listening probably wouldn't go on that much anyway. This thing would get the most use providing ambient background music when nothing is on TV (particularly true on cruise ships, most cruise tv sucks), but there still has to be SOME entertainment (other than, umm, other early morning activities )

rs159

Sorry that was kind of long winded, I didn't want to be vague

RuSsMaN

If you want to do what you mentioned above, just buy the Tivoli. What are they, $99? And they have your headphone out, rec out, and even 1 input. Kick it to $159 and you are stereo.

rs159

I wonder how the Tivoli's headphone out sounds? Most built-ins these days are pretty good, but not stellar IMO.

rs159

Originally posted by RuSsMaN
If you want to do what you mentioned above, just buy the Tivoli. What are they, $99?...

Actually, you can get them used (E-bay and such) for around $60.

RuSsMaN

No brainer then. I never even thought to look on ebay for em, might have to check that out.

Cheers,
Russ

rs159

For situations like in travel where durability is more important, maybe the PAL would be a better choice? That also has an aux input and it would more easily pack away and fit in teh safe when it has to

rs159

Russ, you can be proud - I picked up the materials at Home Depot yesterday and I just ordered some threes. If I'm lucky I'll have 'em together by next weekend. Unfortunately, I don't have a digital camera yet so the best I'll be able to do is a webcam until I get the photos developed onto a CD.

RuSsMaN

Awesome, can't wait to get a 'peek' at the project!

rs159

Just got the drivers today. The first thing I noticed was the wieght. These things are a bit heavier than they look. They have a very overbuilt feel. I love the phase plug, that thing is cool.

BTW, They are the 3" paper cones, despite the grey color. I was too lazy to turn off my webcam software's auto correction thing

rs159

I just got -one- of them together, sans base and pretty finish. So far I can tell that they have an F3 around 80hz and they sound very good with very clear mids and highs. The length of PVC between the top 90 degree piece and the bottom port is 3 feet, I started at 5, it was good, but way too high. I took it down to 4, and the bass was nowhere to be found. I took it to three and it was as good as five, but then it started to rain (go figure) so I didn't get to fine tune it any more.

Russ, you was right, the vocals are dead on. Female vocals are perfect considering they cost what, like $12 each?...

... but male vocals are where the problems are because the sound coming out of the open end gives it a "tubby" effect. I tried socks, old shirts, tissues, and a few other things and I can't seem to find the right balance between bass extension and deadening the mids coming out of the hole. Maybe lining the inside of the tube would do it, but i'll worry about that once I fine tune the length of the line to get the right bass extension.

Nothing is glued or permanantly nailed or screwed together yet. I feel like I'm playing with audio Legos - if something isn't right then replace it with another piece. Beats the hell out of spending a weekend building a box only to find it is too small.

RuSsMaN

These do need more than a few hrs break-in, give it a little time. I didn't like mine much at first, but after some run-in, they seemed to settle in.

Some polyfill/dacron should keep the bass, but kill that 'back wave' from the driver you are probably hearing. I don't know how deep you want to go, but here is also where port tuning/design can come into play.

Now I need to go buy some PVC, thanks an effin lot.

Don't forget to document the process, take some pics.

Cheers,
Russ