Sub for music w/LSI series

TouchOfEvil

Ern Dog wrote: »

That depends on how important it is to you how low the sub goes. Me- I love bass and the super low bass is the best part for me, so I went for the 15".

Well in that case i won't bother with the 8" then. I love low and deep so i guess the big boy is what i would want. Thanks!!!!:cool:

TouchOfEvil

NewHTguy wrote: »

One thing to consider is tht your Lsi 15s already go pretty low with their 8 inch woofers. So the question is what would a spl800 add. Personally I would not waste my time with anything less than a spl 1000. I can't justify that with anything concrete. However, you don't want a sub that doesn't truly add to your system.

Be sure to keep your eye on the clearance deals at Audioadvisor. I've found that their clearance prices fluctuate in a somewhat random fashion. What costs $700 one day can cost $900 another. If you take your time you can sometimes catch a good deal and it will have a full warranty. No affil, btw.

Awesome man, i have been just looking around used at a couple places so i will keep a eye out at the site you provided.
I don't think i'ma bother with the 8" as i doubt it would be enough to make me even close to happy. Thanks guys!!!

mmadden28

concealer404 wrote: »

Dynamos won't be much of an upgrade. Mmadden28 tried the Dynamo vs. the RW-10D awhile back, and the RW-10D was the winner for him. I bought the RW-10D, then auditioned a Dynamo myself for awhile, and i came to the same conclusion. We could both always place WHERE the dynamo was, but the RW-10D disappeared when placement was figured out. I'm a firm believer that the sub shouldn't be directional, i shouldn't have any idea where it is.

Good memory there Concealer...:cool:
Here's the thread if you're interested.

Note--I was back and forth between the two--But the votes from other members here kept pushing towards the Dynamo. The Dynamo is sealed and fast, while the Klipsch is ported-And it seems sealed is better for music and ported better for HT, but thats not a rule-just seems to be the way it turns out.

Factors that pushed me toward the Klipsch over the Dynamo included my listening preferences (more for HT than Music--I didn't have a dedicated 2 ch rig then), more transparent (at least in my room), and that I was on the fence between them. But the final deciding factor was likely that the Klipsch was $200 less so I got WAF points there . If I could have I would have kept them both.

What I really desired was to go for the ML Depth that Mantis suggested-but it was just out of my price range-I shopped on the gon and ebay for some time but never found the right price. Beyond that I was pretty much settled on getting an SVS PC12+ (cylinder) but then I stumbled upon a decent price for the Polk uPro4K at the Tweeter closeout and I can't pass up a great deal --Its been in my HT ever since--Although I'm still not done my search for the ultimate sub for HT use.

I have a Velodyne Micro that I'm consdering adding to my 2 ch rig for certain types of music (otherwise the SDA's do just fine on their own)-or I may use that Klipsch (yeah I still have it--its not leaving).

What is it about the Klipsch that's not enough? Is it Movies, Music or both?
What music or movies are you using for your audio tests?
Have you ever done a Bass response analysis of your room to see if you're getting all that you can out of your sub? (such as with a Velo SMS-1 or the free Room EQ Wizard?)
How are you setting you're XO freqs between the LSi's and the sub to make sure they aren't cancelling each other out?

mmadden28

As far as a remote goes, I absolutely can't stand the interface on the Polk, its just slow and tedious to control and you have to interpret the blinking lights to figure out what volume its set at--Give me a manual dial control anyday over that crap.

Anyway, I use a Velo SMS-1 for bass management in my system, and it really has fixed a couple big bass issues in my room--Now I might be able to get away with what the Polk sub's room correction thing did (and it got pretty close) and use the Polk's volume and or 3(?) EQ settings, but I'm continuing to use the SMS-1 anyway, if for nothing else, it does further improve my bass response, but more importantly its sooooo much easier to control with my Harmony remote--So I choose one of the preset EQ settings or pump up the volume on certain movies, etc--just makes it so nice to be able to customize on the fly how I listen.

And yes I also needed to play around with the phase quite a bit to get a good baseline response.

TouchOfEvil

mmadden28 wrote: »

What is it about the Klipsch that's not enough? Is it Movies, Music or both?
What music or movies are you using for your audio tests?
Have you ever done a Bass response analysis of your room to see if you're getting all that you can out of your sub? (such as with a Velo SMS-1 or the free Room EQ Wizard?)
How are you setting you're XO freqs between the LSi's and the sub to make sure they aren't cancelling each other out?

Movies are fine with the sub no real complaints there.
The biggest problem with the sub isn't REALLY the output but rather the extreme port noise that i honestly did not notice until i went with the LSI upgrade. I'm sure it was there before i guess i just didn't notice it but now it bugs me bigtime.
When i do listen to it i have a small blanket stuffed in the port to stop most of the annoying noise.
As for test music basically anything i listen to just isn't doing it for me.
I have not used a Bass response analysis on my room. Where can i find something like this to try out?
I will have to get back to you on the last one, need to look to see what the settings are at and the gf wouldn't be happy if i woke her right now lol.

mmadden28

Here's the site to download the app (its free).
You need a computer with a line input, or a laptop with an external sound card thingey with a line input if your laptop doesn't have a dedicated line-in. Lots of options suggested in the forums liked above.
At a miniumum you'll also need a Radio Shack SPL meter (you could get a mic (and the appropriate Mic pre, etc). So for $50-60 you have the basics.

If you find you need correction, you could buy a commercial EQ like the SMS-1 or go a less expensive route like also mentioned in the forums using a $100 Beringer Feedback Destroyer.

I'll see if I can find the thread on this forum, where I believe this was also discussed i a bit more detail. I kow its been brought up a few times...

mmadden28

vmaxer wrote: »

...
...the gf wouldn't be happy if i woke her right now lol.

If you wake her with the right frequency--it might make her very very happy :D

mmadden28

https://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=74442&page=2
See posts 77 and 80. not the detailed thread I was thinking of, but I'm beyond tired and can't search more right now...zzzz..z.z.z..z.zzz

pearsall001

NewHTguy wrote: »

That sounds like an awesome set-up. Where do you have those Velos crossed over? Just curious. Since I have powered subs in the Lsi 25's I have my 1200R crossed over at about 40-45 hz.

I run everything crossed over at 80hz. That works out well in my system & room. The Velo's blend in perfectly!!

concealer404

I'm still going with placement issue.... i have no port noise on my RW-10D, and it's plenty fast for me.

My dual S8s might be a LITTLE faster, and slightly more musical, but space constraints make that a little hard to keep set up, and they don't really have the sheer output the RW-10D is capable of.

I AM a little biased... i've always been a huge fan of the Canadian subs.

Sounds like you need a Paradigm Signature Sub 25.

http://www.paradigm.com/en/reference/subwoofer_only-specification-20-4-5-17.paradigm



I would KILL to hear one of these things.

NewHTguy

pearsall001 wrote: »

I run everything crossed over at 80hz. That works out well in my system & room. The Velo's blend in perfectly!!

That's what I would have guessed but I'm not familiar with your fronts. The one thing I don't like about my set-up is the difficulty of blending two 10in powered subs (in the Lsi 25s) AND the 1200R. In hindsight, I think two 1200Rs and a pair of Lsi 9s might be the best combo.

digitalvideo

I have an SVS which are great for home theater, but the best sub for the money that beats my SVS is the Elemental Designs for movies and music.

http://www.tweakcityaudio.com/forum/showthread.php?t=11

TouchOfEvil

mmadden28 wrote: »

Here's the site to download the app (its free).
You need a computer with a line input, or a laptop with an external sound card thingey with a line input if your laptop doesn't have a dedicated line-in. Lots of options suggested in the forums liked above.
At a miniumum you'll also need a Radio Shack SPL meter (you could get a mic (and the appropriate Mic pre, etc). So for $50-60 you have the basics.

If you find you need correction, you could buy a commercial EQ like the SMS-1 or go a less expensive route like also mentioned in the forums using a $100 Beringer Feedback Destroyer.

I'll see if I can find the thread on this forum, where I believe this was also discussed i a bit more detail. I kow its been brought up a few times...

Sweet thanks for the links, i will take a look at em. I was at radio shack a couple weeks ago and i was gonna buy a spl meter but they said they no longer carried it. I guess i might have to get it online rather than in store.

TouchOfEvil

While i'm here what do you guys think about Duel SPL1000's for 1200 shipped? 10's not enough just go for the 15's or should make a nice difference?:D

NewHTguy

TouchOfEvil wrote: »

While i'm here what do you guys think about Duel SPL1000's for 1200 shipped? 10's not enough just go for the 15's or should make a nice difference?:D

I don't have any direct experience with the 1000s but it sounds like a good price. The real question is whether you are better off spending $1200 on two 1000s or on a single sub tthat can go lower. I would suggest you consider the frequency at which you would likely cross over the Lsi 15s. Here is my layman take on things based on slightly more technical reading: For really low base, having duel (i.e. stereo) is not that important because the wavelength is so long that your ear will not notice the location. Once the subs are providing frequencies above 100 hz or so, you may be able to determine where the base is coming from and can therefore benefit from a duel/stereo configuration. If you cross your Lsi 15s over at 60 hz, then a larger sub that can go deeper than the 1000s may be better. On the other hand, if you plan on crossing the 15s over at 80 hz or higher, then you might want to go with a duel set-up. I just don't know what would be the best crossover for 15s. Perhaps someone else can chime in?

TouchOfEvil

NewHTguy wrote: »

I don't have any direct experience with the 1000s but it sounds like a good price. The real question is whether you are better off spending $1200 on two 1000s or on a single sub tthat can go lower. I would suggest you consider the frequency at which you would likely cross over the Lsi 15s. Here is my layman take on things based on slightly more technical reading: For really low base, having duel (i.e. stereo) is not that important because the wavelength is so long that your ear will not notice the location. Once the subs are providing frequencies above 100 hz or so, you may be able to determine where the base is coming from and can therefore benefit from a duel/stereo configuration. If you cross your Lsi 15s over at 60 hz, then a larger sub that can go deeper than the 1000s may be better. On the other hand, if you plan on crossing the 15s over at 80 hz or higher, then you might want to go with a duel set-up. I just don't know what would be the best crossover for 15s. Perhaps someone else can chime in?

ATM i have the crossover set at 80hz. But, i could be at the wrong crossover point for the 15's...like you said i'm not 100%sure where i should be with them.

NewHTguy

To further complicate things, I believe there is an internal crossover in your Lsi 15s that dictates when the 8 inch woofer kicks in. I assume it kicks in at 80 hz. You'll need to read the manual to figure that out. As a result, you may run into difficulty blending two. The more I think about it, duel 1000s might work better with Lsi 9s, which do not go as low as the 15s. If I were you, I'd probably just look for the best SINGLE musical sub I could find. For what it is worth, I often think my 1200R is overkill given that I have Lsi25s. But I had the sub before I got the fronts. If I had the fronts first, I doubt I would have ever bought the 1200R because the 25s go pretty low and I'm mostly a two-channel guy these days.

TouchOfEvil

NewHTguy wrote: »

To further complicate things, I believe there is an internal crossover in your Lsi 15s that dictates when the 8 inch woofer kicks in. I assume it kicks in at 80 hz. You'll need to read the manual to figure that out. As a result, you may run into difficulty blending two. The more I think about it, duel 1000s might work better with Lsi 9s, which do not go as low as the 15s. If I were you, I'd probably just look for the best SINGLE musical sub I could find. For what it is worth, I often think my 1200R is overkill given that I have Lsi25s. But I had the sub before I got the fronts. If I had the fronts first, I doubt I would have ever bought the 1200R because the 25s go pretty low and I'm mostly a two-channel guy these days.

Not sure about the internal crossover on the 15's. I can't read the manual though because i bought them from vmaxer whom bought them from jerry and jerry had Ben upgrade the crossovers on em .........