Harman Kardon Stinks

nellis8166

Need some advice guys...

I have a Harman Kardon AVR 525 that I bought back in November from CC. I have always loved HK's sound, but the damn thing overheats so easily and it shouldn't. I have never run the thing anywhere near clipping it and all my speaks are set to small. I have a separate amp running my mains and center so it's only got the four surrounds to push. It's well ventilated, I even tried putting a fan on it, no dice.
I'm so fed up with it I think I want to take it back. I bought it about four months ago...looking at getting the Oynk 700 or 800. Anybody have any feedback on these??? Is CC going to give me a hard time about exchanging the thing??? Thanks,

-N

pjdami

Nellis,

More than likely, at best, Circuit City will give you store credit. If this is the case then the Onkyo 700 is probably what you can get. If you bought your Polk speakers from them and are a good customer (repeat purchases) perhaps you can talk to a manager about not being happy after spending so much money on the 525 and tell him/her that you are not satisfied and want your money back. If they refuse both of these proposals then you will have to get it fixed through H/Ks warranty.

I was looking at H/K hard about three months ago when I was shopping for a receiver. I used to own a H/K many years ago when Rotel used to supply the amps for them. In the recent years H/K has had some reliability issues and that steered me away from them. I currently have an Onkyo integrated amp and Onkyo receiver that I don't even use for my main listening experience. Yamaha and Denon they are also Japanese models and it appears that my personal music listening tastes is steering away from these too.

If you can get your money back for a few hundred more, I would seriously take a look at Rotel 1055 or the Pioneer Elite model 45 (in your price range). The Rotel can handle four ohm loads easily if you want to get LSis later on. I saw and listened to the 1055 a week ago when I bought my Rotel cd player. the thing is amazing and left me floored. It weighs like 50 lbs and is engineered to have seperates performance. If I would have known about the Rotel three months ago, thats what I would have purchased and I wouldn't be going through this seperates issue now. I also believe that there are people on this forum running LSis on PEs (even though the manual says only 8 ohms).

good luck,
P.

Systems

Yikes, another HK horror story. I hope my CDR26 burner holds up. So far I love it, but I got the 5-yr ext warranty just in case.

phuz

What type of surrounds is it pushing? Are they 4 ohm speakers?

From my experience all of the later model H/K receivers run pretty hot, but I don't think it's much of a problem. You say fans didn't even help? Is it going into thermal protection? If so then you should be able to get it fixed or replaced by H/K. If not, then you shouldn't worry too much, they just run hot.

mantis

SOunds like another fan of the Rotel rsx1055.It's got my vote for the best sounding 1200.0 dollar receiver.It's amp section is so good.I would also use it to run Lsi.Rotel and 4 ohm loads go together hand and hand.Such a great entry level receiver with the desire to go seperates............

pjdami

What type of surrounds is it pushing? Are they 4 ohm speakers?

From my experience all of the later model H/K receivers run pretty hot, but I don't think it's much of a problem. You say fans didn't even help? Is it going into thermal protection? If so then you should be able to get it fixed or replaced by H/K. If not, then you shouldn't worry too much, they just run hot.

Hey Nellis,

Phuz brings up a good point. I automatically was assuming that your unit is going into protect mode and shutting off. When it is heated up is it too hot to put your hand on top of the unit and keep it there without discomfort/burning your hand? If its not this hot then it is probably fine. Many receivers run warm to hot with those big extended fin heat sinks in them. That's what they are designed to do.

My H/K used to run "warm to hot" and I was driving some JBL 3 - way floor standers and two Punch 15 inch subwoofers (custom built subwoofer) at college parties using both A and B speakers together with no problems (and only a 55 watt per channel 2 channel receiver from 15 years ago). But it never ran so hot that I couldn't keep my hand on top of it. I used to "cheat" though and put a big fan on top of it for the really big parties :cool:

Another thing to check is that you are running at least 16 gauge wire to all of your speakers including surrounds (14 gauge is preffered). The concerning thing here is that the receiver is not even running your mains and it is getting "hot".

How hot is "hot" and is it shutting down?

P.

nellis8166

Here's the scoop...
The HK was used as a pre/pro for my front and mains(LSi). It only ran my side and rear surrounds which are Rti28. Not a big load to say the least. Even at low volumes after about half and hour it would smell like it was burning and shut off...too hot to even touch. I hand checked every single inch of speaker wire for shorts etc...nothing.
I went to CC yesterday and the manager tried to tell me I didn't know what I was doing. I demanded my money back but he wouldn't do it. He ended up letting me exchange it for the Oynk 800, and if I don't like he promised he would refund the $.
Got it setup yesterday and have yet to listen to it. Setup is quite extravagant...many many menus...I'll test it tonight and let you know what I think...Anybody have any expereiance with this receiver???

-N

nellis8166

I agree with you 100% ATCVenom...that's why I have an Adcom power amp feeding the the LSi's up front with 200wpc.
The HK 525 blew up pushing four 8 ohm bookshelf speaks(RTi28). That's just not right...

-N

pjdami

Nellis,

I have owned Onkyo products before and they are good. But for the money you spent on the 800 you might can do better.

I demoed the Integra Research 6.3 (top of the line equivalent 700 and my Yammer in my house). Music wise the Yamaha blew the pants off the Integra. For movies and HT I preferred the sound of the Integra; especially with the center channel. It was a tough call for me but I went with the Yammer. At moderate volumes both amp sections sounded exactly the same to me in a "blind" test in the audition room at the Hi-Fi store listening to music. I couldn't tell them apart. At louder volumes the Integra ran out of juice before the Yamaha and both had similar wattage numbers. The way some companies rate wattage is a joke.

If you are going to use the 800 for a prepro for your mains (use seperate amp to drive your mains) and just drive the surrounds with the 800 you will be okay. In fact you probably could have gotten away with the 700 preouts for this and got the difference in store credit or refund? I never tried this with the Integra because I didn't have a seperate amp at the time. I'm interested in knowing about how you feel about the preamp section in the 800. There is a review somewhere about the preamp section in that receiver that I will have to dig up for you.

Your receiver will also go through some burn in time too. Most electronics settle in after about 70 hrs of use (actual quote from a manufacturer's website).

Glad to hear you got you H/K store credit though. Something was terribly wrong with your H/K. Shouldn't have been doing that and no you weren't doing anything wrong electrically wise from what I'm seeing.

P.

jdavy

I am happy with my AVR7000. Works fine. I even leave it on all day for the Dog when I am away at work. I keep the amp out of a cabinet so it has lots of air to keep it cool.

HBombToo

I use the Logic 7 circuits of my h/k more often than not. There have been many complaints with h/k on the board and I think I found my first flaw. While using my Audio Research DAC and the h/k logic 7 circuit on music I stimulated noise/static on my side surrounds. When I noticed the problem I switched too 2 channel and the noise subsided.

Just my 2c...

Bombed

STUFFMD

Hey HBomb,
I use an equalizer only with very crappy recordings, but in some surround modes with the EQ on I get a staticy noise in my surrounds as well. Never had it without the EQ on.Some modes it does it others it does not. Does the DAC have some kind of equilazation on it. Obviously the Equalization overloads the speakers in some respects. I don't think it's in your unit.
Does anyone know what exactly causes this effect.
Stuff

HBombToo

Originally posted by STUFFMD
Hey HBomb,
I use an equalizer only with very crappy recordings, but in some surround modes with the EQ on I get a staticy noise in my surrounds as well. Never had it without the EQ on.Some modes it does it others it does not. Does the DAC have some kind of equilazation on it. Obviously the Equalization overloads the speakers in some respects. I don't think it's in your unit.
Does anyone know what exactly causes this effect.
Stuff

I'm glad I'm not alone here...

I have considered as a source of my issue the introduction of the dual 20-39CS+ into the mix. The cables I use may be old but their shielded RCA that connects the SV101 to the Samson Amp . I refuse to believe this has caused the problem and am convinced that internally to the h/k not enough holdoff is in place. I figure that if a noise source was caused externally it would be there no matter what volumes I listen at and that is not the case.

I really think I am seeing the delta between a good box and a Damn Good Box when pushing my system.

Bombed again so forgive!

I need to fix my bad grammer but not right now.

Henry

HBombToo

I still have not fixed my grammer but has anyone given this more thought?

OH... BTW STUFFMD neither my external or the internal DACs of the h/k has equalization. Like I said I was listening to Logic 7 music mode in 5.1 channel.

HBomb