GFI breaker question

disneyjoe7

Makes you wonder why one county allows 12v pool lights, where another county allows 120vac pool lights with a GFI. But the 12v pool light can have a whole water in the lamp and it may still work, where the 120vac light can only have about 1/3 filled water before you have troubles. I surprised the lamp didn't blow up with that water, the 400w lamps gets HOT. So hot if it's on you get keep your hand on it with water around you, it's HOT.

goingganzo

the more you trip the breaker the more it will trip. what i supect is curent inrush. get a seccond timer and stagger when you turn on the lights by 5 mins

disneyjoe7

I can't break up the lights of 100w spa and the 400w pool lamps. The controller for the pool is a Pentair Intelltouch I-5 which can control 5 items, pump, air blower spa, pool lights, landscape lights. That leaves one but can't be used as I use for a water feature which I call deck jets

But that doesn't matter as the breaker is ok it doesn't trip now or my light isn't leaking too bad yet. I say that as it looks like it is leaking again, but I'm waiting for it too warm up before I look at it again.

mmadden28

mmadden28 wrote: »

...
Besides, having that extra horsepower lets me feel the water in a much different way-the water features perform better, the imaging and separation of the sounds of the water splashing is so much more real, and its all so much crisper and lifelike. At night the lights create dazzling lights shows wheer before they were kind of dull and lifeless. All the hardness of the water is gone and has taken on a warmer feeling. ;):D:D:p I'm considering the new Emotiva reference pump next.

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

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BTW nice picture. But I'm confused about your 3.5hp water features.

Well I do have a waterfall water feature. That half hot-tub looking thing fills and overflows with water. It actually does perform better-much better flow rate when I want it. But, if you missed it, that comment was really tongue-in-cheek, kinda like talking about the improvements that a high current/wattage amplifier does for audio. :D

mmadden28

gdb wrote: »

Go BACK to a low, DC voltage light....That way if anything malfuctions...you won't get boiled alive !:eek::eek::eek::eek::D

I know I've been thinking of doing that-replacing my 2 - 500w lamps with some kind of multicolor LED thing. Something where I can change the color and brightness at will. Knock on plaster I haven't had any leak issues with my lamps yet. I can't stand the thought that I'm using 1000w of electricity when the lamps are on. :eek:

By the way DJ, lucky you being in FL, that you can change the lights right now. I have about an inch or more of ice in my pool

disneyjoe7

I'm thin blood person now, I don't like the pool when isn't 85f or so.

Rivrrat

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

I'm thin blood person now, I don't like the pool when isn't 85f or so.

Not only that, I pretty much don't even go in our pool until it's over 95 outside.

mmadden28

I don't have a heater (YET). My absolute lowest before I'll get in is 82 (water temp) and it has to be hot out.

I went to a friends pool who had a heater and I almost thought it was too hot-I think it was 92--it wasn't nearly as refreshing on a hot day. Besides the hotter it is the more chance for Algae, etc.

I would use the heater more to extend the season or add just a bit of heat. Right now we don't use it until mid June and shut down in Sept. With a heater I could probably open in May and close in Late Sept or Oct.

disneyjoe7

You're right 92f is too HOT. My heat solar mainly is requlated it shuts off at 85f as the sun can warm it up a little to 86f which I call......





MAGIC TIME

The prefect temp if you ask me, just warm enough where you can jump in without wishing to jump out, and low enough to be refreshing. The right temp in which you could stay for hours, read until you can't recognize your own hands

Rivrrat

Here in Tucson, my pool will get up close to 90 in July and Aug. I'll put a solar cover on late next month and we should be swimming by the middle of April, from May until mid Sept I won't need the solar cover, and it'll finally get too cold sometime in Oct.

85 is just about right.

mmadden28

mmadden28 wrote: »

I don't have a heater (YET). My absolute lowest before I'll get in is 82 (water temp) and it has to be hot out.
....

I just remembered, my minimum is actually 78.

82-84 is ideal (for me). Would be nicer if it were a tad warmer, but that's about as good as it gets here in SE PA, unless we have a heat wave. I might try a solar cover this year.

disneyjoe7

Well I guess it's true your blood does thin out. 82 to 84 is a bit cold to me, and 78f way too cold. So you know how I felt going in that pool at 66f for that light, but I didn't stay long.

mmadden28

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

Well I guess it's true your blood does thin out. 82 to 84 is a bit cold to me, and 78f way too cold. So you know how I felt going in that pool at 66f for that light, but I didn't stay long.

I didn't say 82 wasn't shocking-well it is for the first 30 seconds, after that its OK. But it really has to be a warm day.

66?? :eek::eek: No Frickin way no how. I'd a waited.;)

disneyjoe7

mmadden28 wrote: »

No olympic pool here and well except for the occasional bunny or two, its not PB Mansion. Its about 22500gals and the original pump was I think a 1.5 or something.

I use a Pentair Intelliflo pump. It has a programmable variable pump rate. I just program the pool size, water temp, how many turnovers over day and the times I want it allowed on and it figures out the rest. I forget where I read it, but it allows you to run very high GPM as necessary to get the desired turnover rate within the alotted time, thereby saving electricity in the long run. I guess that is why it has about 3.5HP capability. Of course the actual GPM will be limited by the rest of the system. I think my Filter is rated at max 120GPM--I haven't dbl checked that lately though, but I have had it running at about 90-100gpm thru 2" lines.

Yeah I was shocked to see that it was 3.5HP as well. Even more shocked to see it drawing about 3200+ watts at full bore, which is why I thought it odd that it could run fine at that hi current usage for an extended time, but trip when only pulling 200 watts or less (mind you it also tripped randomly at any current draw). IIRC it requires a 220v 20A circuit.

Couple nice things about it is that it promises to cut energy usage about 90% (no I haven't done any verification of that yet) and it allows me to still have it running (via programming) when we're using it but have it run at a low flow rate, thus making it near silent. Also, when I need to backwash or drain water out-I crank it up. It's much faster than before.

Besides, having that extra horsepower lets me feel the water in a much different way-the water features perform better, the imaging and separation of the sounds of the water splashing is so much more real, and its all so much crisper and lifelike. At night the lights create dazzling lights shows wheer before they were kind of dull and lifeless. All the hardness of the water is gone and has taken on a warmer feeling. ;):D:D:p I'm considering the new Emotiva reference pump next.

Well **** happens and my pump stop working its frozen, I'm going to pull it apart to see if it's repairable or what. If I need to replace it I'm thinking the Intelliflow pump for the power savings. I just don't know what it's going to need from my Intellitouch as for as controls. Do you have a 4 speed or 8 speed? Are you using yours stand alone just a timer? Sorry I'm confused.

mmadden28

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

Well **** happens and my pump stop working its frozen, I'm going to pull it apart to see if it's repairable or what. If I need to replace it I'm thinking the Intelliflow pump for the power savings. I just don't know what it's going to need from my Intellitouch as for as controls. Do you have a 4 speed or 8 speed? Are you using yours stand alone just a timer? Sorry I'm confused.

Hey, Looks like the water from my waterfall flowed back into the pipes and froze and cracked a valve. Looks like I'll have some repair work as well. . And I'll have to rethink how I close the waterfall next season.

You're in FL!! How in the hell did it freeze? Or do you mean 'frozen' as in seized?

I got the 'Variable Speed model, not the 4 or 8 speed settings (if it even comes in 8). It comes with a control panel right on the pump for standalone setup and programming (look closely you can see it above the motor). It also comes with a RS-232 cable to connect it to a control panel and I belive is designed for interfacing to an IntelliTouch.

Here is a link to a brochure. And another here. My pump mounted control panel is slightly different than these. I'm not sure exactly which model I have but it essentially the same.

disneyjoe7

I think something like 4-160 and sometimes its called VS-3050. It will be able to controlled with the Intellitouch controller but it's max out right now. It controls my pool pump, pool lights, the desk jets (3 jets water that is in the air to back the spa), landscape lights, spa air pump, solar panels and the propane heater. When I did the jet water I used an optional B output and the controller killed the last relay.


BTW doesn't that pump have a freeze protection mode, where its turn on at anything under 40f?

mmadden28

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

...

BTW doesn't that pump have a freeze protection mode, where its turn on at anything under 40f?

It does, but that assumes you keep the pool open. Closing the pool up here means, lowering the water a couple inches below the tile line to prevent popped tiles as the surface will freeze (remember my whole family was ice skating on it a few weeks ago). It also means that everything is drained of water and all the supply and return lines are blown out with compressed air and in some cases filled with antifreeze and sealed with rubber plugs.

I was late closing the pool this year and even when running 50GPM, an ice block still formed and practically clogged the system. I think the freeze protection is strictly for pools that remain open year round and when when a freeze is a possibility. All it does is turn the pump on and flow water.

disneyjoe7

Sorry you had trouble with your pool, I thought when you to close a pool you should be down pass the return ports. My Intellitouch controller turns on the pool when it could freeze a pipe, working spa then pool every 15 mins or so.

mmadden28

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

Sorry you had trouble with your pool, I thought when you to close a pool you should be down pass the return ports. My Intellitouch controller turns on the pool when it could freeze a pipe, working spa then pool every 15 mins or so.

Thanks and ditto.
I tried that one year, before I got my own compressor to blow the lines out myself instead of paying a local company a couple hundred to close it for me. With the water below the returns, it was way too low-probably 2 feet below the tile line and that left too much plaster exposed.

disneyjoe7

Turf call there it doesn't seem like an easy way either way, but I wouldn't think having plaster exposed would be a problem. Then again I never owned a pool in the freeze zone. I found the trouble with my pump just a cap (at least 99% sure of that) so I don't know if the Intelliflow would be a good move or not at this point. A very interesting product there for sure, and I will be talking to my local pool dealer this Tuesday as they will be re-installing the solar system.

mmadden28

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

Turf call there it doesn't seem like an easy way either way, but I wouldn't think having plaster exposed would be a problem. Then again I never owned a pool in the freeze zone. I found the trouble with my pump just a cap (at least 99% sure of that) so I don't know if the Intelliflow would be a good move or not at this point. A very interesting product there for sure, and I will be talking to my local pool dealer this Tuesday as they will be re-installing the solar system.

It was about $1200, so if you don't need it yet...

Plaster apparently has to stay wet or it shrinks-its not a climate zone thing. My neighbors had a new pool put in and plastered and it was critical for them to get it filled soon after it was plastered. I found out the hard way when the same year (last season), my cover wasn't on as well because of the lower water level--anyway we had a big wind storm in Feb or something and the cover blew in. My wife told me with concern that the water level seemed kinda low--I explained to her that it was fine and that I lowered it below the return lines this year. Then I looked and saw that 80% of the water was gone :eek::eek:
I went out fearing a huge crack in the pipes or the pool itself. I heard a slight hum. I said to myself WTF is that? Then it dawned on me. When the pool cover blew in, so did the pool cover pump. And that little pool cover pump worked hard pumping all that water out of the pool.

Anyway the result was the plaster started shrinking and cracking. Wherever the original bond was poor, the plaster would bubble up. I had a couple pool replastering companies take a look and they all said the same thing. Replaster or do some repairs and get water back in the pool ASAP. Replastering and retiling was quoted at around $10k. I patched the bubbles and cracks myself and filled the pool-I'll deal with replastering some other time (like when I have the audio buying bug out of my system ).

disneyjoe7

I don't know what too add to your pool troubles. Sorry.

But I fixed my pump it was the cap $38.99 + tax its Pumping.

I asked about the Intelliflow pump with an Intellitouch that is Maxed out, they called Pentair to ask about that. I got a call back and they wanted my serial #, but I haven't heard back yet about that. I'm interested but I have a lot water toys, Pool cleaner, Solar, Deck Jets, Water fall, so I still confused if this would save some power or not.

disneyjoe7

Hmmm.... Some interesting input on Intelliflow pumps a major Orlando "Park" is pulling them for standard pumps.... To many problems with them. :eek:


Still checking into these.

disneyjoe7

I don't know hear that 4 pumps in a year on one pool, and hear to many problems locking up to run full on.

Then I hear no problems running for 6 - 8 months, and Pentair ran it under water for 2 days ok thats how they built it. Tested that way as most pumps I hear fail do to water leaking pass main seal, so they tested under water.

Who do I believe


So my pump works I'm keeping it. One consumer turned off.

disneyjoe7

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

Makes you wonder why one county allows 12v pool lights, where another county allows 120vac pool lights with a GFI. But the 12v pool light can have a whole water in the lamp and it may still work, where the 120vac light can only have about 1/3 filled water before you have troubles. I surprised the lamp didn't blow up with that water, the 400w lamps gets HOT. So hot if it's on you get keep your hand on it with water around you, it's HOT.

Ok round 2 for pool light, the clamp system bulb / gasket replacement has a learning curve IMHO. I got it out, re-assembled it so I see tonight if it works or not. I have Pentair / Amerilight lights with a clamp system I found out its best to tap clamps during the tightening process to even the pressure round light housing. Found also a little "Water Lube" coated to clamp ring helps also, as it seems old lights rings don't move easy on the clamps unless lubed a little.


I hope there's no round 3 with this light.