The Hard Goodbye Pt. 2: Isolation Tweaks

DarqueKnight
DarqueKnight Posts: 6,765
edited April 2011 in Electronics
Introduction

From Part 1:
In the near future, I will be looking at some turntable tweaks, equipment cabinet vibration abatement, minor AC power tweaks, and of course, enlarging my music collection.:)

Satisfactory (for now ;)) results have been attained with electrical noise reduction efforts in my two channel system. I recently turned my attention to reducing mechanical noise (vibration). I tried several audio isolation products. I obtained the best results with Black Diamond Racing (BDR) isolation devices. The BDR devices use carbon fiber to absorb and dissipate vibration. I was pleasantly surprised to hear that the degree of sonic improvement brought by the mechanical noise reduction devices equaled, and in some aspects exceeded, the sonic improvements brought by the electrical noise reduction devices (AC power regenerator, audio grade outlets and audio grade power cables).

All of the two channel system's components are housed in, or on top of, a Salamander Synergy Triple 30 audio cabinet. The Triple 30 is a furniture grade unit that consists of two 67" wide x 19" deep x 1-1/8" thick MDF slabs that are covered in cherry hardwood veneer and joined by eight extruded anodized aluminum pillars. The doors are 3/4" thick solid cherry with black metal mesh doors. For better ventilation, I chose optional metal mesh side panels instead of wood and I did not install the thick vinyl rear panels. The combined weight of the cabinet and audio gear is 595 pounds.

The Triple 30 rests on a 3/4" thick Australian Cypress hardwood floor which is glued to the concrete slab. Stomping on the floor directly in front of either the turntable or SACD player does not cause a skip. Neither does slamming the cabinet doors or pounding my fist on the cabinet right next to either player. When the turntable stylus is resting on a non-spinning record, pounding on the cabinet top next to the turntable causes a dull "thud" sound through the speakers. Lightly tapping my finger on the cabinet top within 11" of the turntable is audible through the speakers. Beyond 11 inches, finger taps are barely audible. I use a low output moving coil cartridge (0.34 mV) and I have the phono preamp set to its highest gain of 76 dB. This represents a signal amplification factor of 6,310 which provides an output of 2.1 volts.

Black Diamond Racing (BDR) isolation devices first came to my attention through the November 2008 issue of Affordable Audio when a writer mentioned that he used BDR products with his Salamander Synergy Twin 30 cabinet. BDR products were also one of the isolation options recommended by Teres Audio. BDR's isolation cones and pucks were of interest to me because I did not like the look of isolation platforms on top of my audio cabinet.

BDRSet-Drk-r6x6.jpg
Figure 1. BDR carbon fiber isolation devices. Top to bottom: 5" Turntable Motor
Shelf, BDR Jumbo Pits (rows 2 and 3), Mini Pits, Mini Black Holes, Mk3 Cones and
Mk4 Cones.


The BDR items selected for evaluation were Jumbo Pits ($125 each), Mini Pits ($45 each), Mini Black Holes ($45 each), 5" Diameter Turntable Motor Shelf ($160), Mk3 Cones ($20), and Mk4 Cones ($20). The difference between the Mk3 and Mk4 cones is the Mk4 cones have a linear and neutral tonal character and the Mk3 cones have a warm tonal character with heavier bass emphasis. The interested reader can find detailed descriptions of each item at numerous websites. Black Diamond Racing does not have a website.

Listening Evaluations

I tried isolation devices under each component and loudspeaker in my two channel system. I only achieved good results with the turntable, SACD player and AC power regenerator. Therefore, this discussion is limited to those components. The unsatisfactory results with the speakers were not unexpected since SDA's prefer to be coupled rather than isolated.

SACD Player

D. J. Casser, the principal of Black Diamond Racing, advised that the stock aluminum isolation cones in the four corners of my SACD player case were largely ineffective. He advised the placement of vibration treatment under the disc drive and under the power supply since these were the areas of vibration generation. He was absolutely correct. The installation of BDR components under the power supply, disc drive and in the right rear corner (for stability) resulted in an immediate and significant reduction in the noise floor, more tactile sensation with an increase in image weight, and more bass definition, all without affecting the tonal balance. The best sound resulted from a combination of Mk4 cones and Jumbo Pits.

I had to play around a bit with placement and configuration. The following four configurations were tried:

1. Mk4 cone on top of Jumbo Pit. (Best sound-the Cary sounded like a completely different player!).
2. Jumbo Pit on top of Mk4 cone. (Close second compared to #1.)
3. Jumbo Pit on top of Mk4 cone on top of Mk4 Mini Pit. (Distant third compared to #1)
4. Jumbo Pit alone. (Dull sound-sluggish bass and slightly rolled off highs.)

CD306FrComp-Ro-r8x6.jpg
Figure 2. Vibration treatment resulted in significant improvement in every aspect of the CD 306 Pro
SACD player's sound.


The four stock feet have BDR Mini Black Hole isolation discs under them. This is strictly for aesthetic reasons as I did not like the look of the four feet just hanging in the air. The SACD player's cone feet are adjustable and are turned down so that they just barely touch the top of the Black Holes.

After 100 hours of play time, a radical change took place in the sound. The sound level was apparently much louder and the image weight had increased again. There was a higher degree of bass slam and overall detail. The sonic improvement was Such Good Sound that it brought to mind the improvements realized by a significant increase in amplifier power. Furthermore, I heard and felt for the first time that "effective 40" woofer" that is mentioned in the SDA SRS 1.2TL brochure.:D

I sent an email to D. J. Casser describing what I was hearing and he informed me that I was hearing my system after it had broken in (again) after the vibration treatments were applied.

Turntable

BDR Mk4 cones are standard equipment on the Teres 255 turntable. BDR Jumbo Pits were one of the solutions recommended by the manufacturer as a complimentary vibration treatment for the Mk4 cones. Placing a BDR Jumbo pit under each Mk4 cone resulted in the same improvements heard with the SACD player.

ElevTT-25Dsh-Pits-8x6.jpg
Figure 3. My analog game was kicked up a notch with a little vibration treatment.

Of course, since I had raised the turntable 1.5" I also needed to raise the motor 1.5". Two 5" diameter 3/4" thick carbon fiber BDR turntable motor shelves bolted together worked nicely. The BDR shelves have a threaded center hole. The motor's spike feet rest on Adona 3/4" diameter cone cups that have neoprene rubber pads under them. Without the cone cups, the motor's feet would slide off the BDR motor shelf.

I tried other types of platforms under the motor: Granite, Two 5" square 3/4" thick MDF platforms, MDF platform + BDR 5" Shelf, MDF + BDF Mini Pits and BDR Mini Pits + BDR 5" Shelf. The motor ran more quiet with lower belt and pulley noise with the double 5" Shelf. Changing the motor platform was analogous to shifting the focus of a camera lens. The best clarity and detail was heard with the double 5" BDR Shelf.

ElevMotor-25DSh-8x6.jpg
Figure 4. Improvisation can often provide audible benefits.

An even better option would be to eliminate the need for a motor platform by using a taller motor. However, that is a subject for a future thread.;)

TT-Hanger-Bracket-8x6.jpg
Figure 5. Don't ever throw anything away! This ceiling fan hanger bracket was just the right size,
shape and height for my clip-on turntable lamp.


Of course, since I raised my turntable 1.5", I also needed to raise my turntable back light 1.5". I could have easily built a small riser and clamped it to the end of my audio cabinet, but I wanted to take the lazy way out and see what I could find around the house first. I rummaged through one of the junk boxes in my attic to see if anything interesting turned up and it did. I found a ceiling fan hangar bracket that was the right size, shape and height. A couple of 2" c-clamps secured the bracket to my audio cabinet top.

TT-Lite-On-Bracket-8x6.jpg
Figure 6. Cool light at higher height.

Quasi-Quantitative Analysis

If I tapped on the cabinet top near the turntable while the stylus was on a non-spinning record, the "thumps" coming through the speakers seemed to be about half as loud with the turntable resting on the Jumbo Pits.

I taped an electric hair clipper to the cabinet top and set up an analog sound level meter in front of the left speaker. With the clipper turned on and the stylus off the record, the meter read 57 dB-C.

With the clipper turned on and the stylus on the record and the turntable sitting only on the stock Mk4 cones, the meter read 74.5 dB-C.

With the clipper turned on and the stylus on the record with Jumbo Pits under the stock Mk4 cones, the meter read 72 dB-C. This represented a 44% reduction in vibration at the stylus.
Proud and loyal citizen of the Digital Domain and Solid State Country!
Post edited by DarqueKnight on

Comments

  • DarqueKnight
    DarqueKnight Posts: 6,765
    edited February 2009
    ClipperVibeTest8x6.jpg
    Figure 7. Another fiendish experiment provides quantitative insight.

    PS Audio Power Plant Premier AC Regenerator

    The PPP manual recommends the use of isolation devices.

    BDR Mk3 cones produced no difference in sound. Mk4 cones on top of Jumbo pits produced spectacular results when placed under my SACD player. This same combination under my PPP diminished overall clarity and caused a small loss of bass detail and articulation.

    Three Mk4 cones under the PPP worked. They further lowered the noise floor and made the image weight a little bit heavier. There were no tonal balance aberrations.

    I also tried a set of Boston Audio Tuneblock SE's under the PPP. This is what PS Audio uses with the PPP in their in-house set ups and at audio show exhibitions. The Tuneblocks sounded better than the BDR Mk4 cone/Jumbo Pit combinations, but worse than three Mk4 cones alone. I heard less overall clarity, bass detail and image weight with the Tuneblock SE's. The Tuneblocks and both BDR cone/pit configurations did not sound as good as the stock feet. This illustrates that advice is good to have, but your mileage may...and probably will...vary.

    Tuneblocks-Qtr-s.jpg
    Figure 8. The Tuneblock SE's were highly recommended by a very credible
    source, but they didn't produce satisfying results in my two channel system.


    I also installed a few Mk4 cones in my home theater system. Three Mk4 cones were placed in under the preamp/processor (Sony TA-E9000ES), front speaker amplifier (Adcom GFA-5500) and the Power Plant Premier that feeds these components. I did the pre/pro first, then moved the cones to the amp, then to the PPP. The PPP and the pre/pro sit on one of the adjustable shelves of the Salamander Synergy Quad 30 cabinet. The amp sits on the cabinet bottom. In each case, there was a loss of overall detail and a reduction in image weight and bass impact. The amp was the most affected and the pre/pro was the least affected.

    Conclusion

    The addition of BDR isolation products at certain locations in my two channel audio system provided audible and measurable benefits. Everyone's vibrational environment is different. If this sort of thing is of interest to you, I recommend committing some "play time" and reviewing isolation solutions from several different vendors. The experiences of others who have gear similar or identical to yours can provide some good insight for starting points.


    Associated Equipment

    01. Pass Laboratories X0.2 Preamplifier
    02. Pass Laboratories Xono Phono Preamplifier
    03. Parasound Halo JC 1 Monoblock Amplifiers with

    >Isoclean Fuses
    04. Teres Audio Model 255 Turntable with

    >Acid Etched Holographic Mylar Turntable Belt (DIY)

    >Sonic Purity Concepts and Design Reflex Record Clamp

    >Graham Phantom B-44 Tonearm

    >Ortofon MC Windfeld Cartridge

    >Teres Audio Signature III Turntable Motor with

    >Adona ¾” Cone Cups with Neoprene Pads under Motor Spikes
    05. Cary Audio CD 306 Professional Version SACD Player
    06. Polk Audio SDA SRS 1.2TL Speakers, Hot Rodded with

    >RD0198 Tweeters

    >Sonicap Polypropylene Capacitors and Mills MRA 12 Resisors

    >Premium Acoustically Transparent Silky Black Grille Cloth

    >Mortite Driver Seals

    >Foam Rubber Driver Basket Vibration Treatment

    >Cardas CCGR Tellurium Copper Binding Posts

    >AI-1 Dreadnought Custom Non-Common Ground Interface
    07. Audioquest LeoPard Tonearm Cable
    08. Audioquest Sky XLR Interconnects
    09. Audioquest Everest Speaker Cables
    10. PS Audio Power Plant Premier Power Regenerator For Source Components
    11. Black Diamond Racing Mk4 Cones, Mk4 Mini Black Holes, 5" Shelves and Jumbo Pits Isolation Devices
    12. Salamander Designs Synergy Triple 30 Audio Cabinet
    nowink.gif I still don't like your analog setup. You need to upgrade the turntable.

    What in hell would you know about playing records? I understand the ambient
    temperature of your house is hot enough to melt lead.~DK
    Proud and loyal citizen of the Digital Domain and Solid State Country!
  • SolidSqual
    SolidSqual Posts: 5,218
    edited February 2009
    This is a great post and very timely as I am also looking into some good isolation options. Any ideas what materials may be best to look for when choosing isolation tweaks? I was considering something like the Isonods which use synthetic gel-like material or perhaps the old maple blocks on spikes.
  • DarqueKnight
    DarqueKnight Posts: 6,765
    edited February 2009
    SolidSqual wrote: »
    Any ideas what materials may be best to look for when choosing isolation tweaks?

    The best recommendation I can give is to read widely and try a few things...and of course, let us know what you find out.:)
    Proud and loyal citizen of the Digital Domain and Solid State Country!
  • Goth child
    Goth child Posts: 38
    edited February 2009
    You mentioned that the sound improved after 100 hrs of use.Do you mean there was no immediate improvement?I would have thought that once the weight had "settled" on the cone any improvement would be almost instantaneous.Thoughts?
  • DarqueKnight
    DarqueKnight Posts: 6,765
    edited February 2009
    The installation of BDR components under the power supply, disc drive and in the right rear corner (for stability) resulted in an immediate and significant reduction in the noise floor, more tactile sensation with an increase in image weight, and more bass definition, all without affecting the tonal balance. The best sound resulted from a combination of Mk4 cones and Jumbo Pits.
    Turntable
    Placing a BDR Jumbo pit under each Mk4 cone resulted in the same improvements heard with the SACD player.

    Things sometimes get obscured in these long posts.
    Proud and loyal citizen of the Digital Domain and Solid State Country!
  • Goth child
    Goth child Posts: 38
    edited February 2009
    Things sometimes get obscured in these long posts.

    Duh,will be more thorough before replying next time,sorry.
  • phipiper10
    phipiper10 Posts: 955
    edited February 2009
    As always, nicely done. Love to hear of your discoveries. And then steal your ideas as my own! MWUAHAHHAAHAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Analog Source: Rega P3-24 Exact 2 w/GT delrin platter & Neo TT-PSU Digital Source: Lumin T2 w/Roon (NUC) DAC: Denafrips Pontus II Phono Preamp: Rega Aria MK3 Preamp: Rogue RP-7 Amp: Pass X150.8 Speakers: Joseph Audio Perspective 2, Audio Physic Tempo Plus Cables: Morrow M4 ICs & Audio Art SC-5 ePlus, Shunyata PCs Misc: Shunyata Hydra Delta D6, VTI rack, GIK acoustic panels
  • Whadyasay
    Whadyasay Posts: 300
    edited February 2009
    Why not just put the record player in another room that's quieter?


    :o
    Polk LSi9 Mains, Polk LSIC Center, Polk RT25i Surrounds, Polk M3II Rear Surround, SVS PB10-ISD Sub, Denon AVR 2809 (as digital pre/pro only), Sony BDP-S350, Oppo DV-981HD, Cambridge Audio Azur 540C (CD), Marantz MM9000 5-ch amp, Outlaw ICBM, Panasonic th-42PX85u HDTV, Behringer BFD Pro, Monster Power HTS 2600 Conditioner
  • SolidSqual
    SolidSqual Posts: 5,218
    edited February 2009
    Whadyasay wrote: »
    Why not just put the record player in another room that's quieter?


    :o

    Because then you'd have a long **** wire and tons of opportunity for EMI, not to mention you wouldn't be able to enjoy the looks of the player.
  • Whadyasay
    Whadyasay Posts: 300
    edited February 2009
    Shielded/balanced wire? Can't they use something like that?

    And you could always set up a small video camera in the other room and watch the record player on the TV, no?


    heh... :o
    Polk LSi9 Mains, Polk LSIC Center, Polk RT25i Surrounds, Polk M3II Rear Surround, SVS PB10-ISD Sub, Denon AVR 2809 (as digital pre/pro only), Sony BDP-S350, Oppo DV-981HD, Cambridge Audio Azur 540C (CD), Marantz MM9000 5-ch amp, Outlaw ICBM, Panasonic th-42PX85u HDTV, Behringer BFD Pro, Monster Power HTS 2600 Conditioner
  • SolidSqual
    SolidSqual Posts: 5,218
    edited March 2009
    Hey Guys,

    Just checking back in. I've been using the Isopods for about 4 weeks now and can say they do make a moderate improvement to my CD performance and an even better showing with my TT. That being said, I do not recommend them. After they've been used for a while, both sides of the isopods fuse to the component and the rack. So, when you go to dust the component and move it, the pods either rip or are left mishapen and stuck to either the component feet or the component stand. They may be cheap, but I don't like products that need replacing every time a good dusting is needed.
  • inspiredsports
    inspiredsports Posts: 5,501
    edited March 2009
    I've found that sometimes the most expensive and/or most elegant looking products don't provide the best solution.

    The $3 cork and rubber isolation blocks at the bottom right of the page listed below are just plain ugly, but provide one of the best overall isolation solutions I've found in 30+ years of tweaking.

    http://meniscusaudio.com/spikesfeet-c-111.html
    VTL ST50 w/mods / RCA6L6GC / TlfnknECC801S
    Conrad Johnson PV-5 w/mods
    TT Conrad Johnson Sonographe SG3 Oak / Sumiko LMT / Grado Woodbody Platinum / Sumiko PIB2 / The Clamp
    Musical Fidelity A1 CDPro/ Bada DD-22 Tube CDP / Conrad Johnson SD-22 CDP
    Tuners w/mods Kenwood KT5020 / Fisher KM60
    MF x-DAC V8, HAInfo NG27
    Herbies Ti-9 / Vibrapods / MIT Shotgun AC1 IEC's / MIT Shotgun 2 IC's / MIT Shotgun 2 Speaker Cables
    PS Audio Cryo / PowerPort Premium Outlets / Exact Power EP15A Conditioner
    Walnut SDA 2B TL /Oak SDA SRS II TL (Sonicaps/Mills/Cardas/Custom SDA ICs / Dynamat Extreme / Larry's Rings/ FSB-2 Spikes
    NAD SS rigs w/mods
    GIK panels
  • BlueFox
    BlueFox Posts: 15,251
    edited March 2009
    Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
    Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
    Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes

    Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
    Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
    Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables

    Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
    Three 20 amp circuits.
  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,136
    edited March 2009
    Nice write-up Raife. I use BDR Mk IV cones on the four corners of my VPI Mk IV turntable. D. J. Casser was kind enought to give me (free of charge) the screws that fixed the cones to the turntable base.
  • Toolfan66
    Toolfan66 Posts: 17,448
    edited March 2009
    That TT is BEAUTIFUL!!!! it gave me a woody.

    Nice Set up....:cool:
  • jim 249
    jim 249 Posts: 347
    edited April 2011
    The $3 cork and rubber isolation blocks at the bottom right of the page listed below are just plain ugly, but provide one of the best overall isolation solutions I've found in 30+ years of tweaking.

    Hi All; I am wanting to isolate my turntables from vibrations through the floor. My new to me Carver ALIII's have a down firing woofer that shakes the wood floors that I have and cause a low level hum. Do you think that these will do the trick for me to remove it? I don't have real high end stuff and do not want to spend a ton of $. Thanks for any help.