Laptop Guru's...need your opinion!

pearsall001

Let me first preface this by saying that I don't know the 1st damn thing about computers...except how to turn them on. With that said, I'm looking at something used for my son (15). He's talking about Mac Book's, which are very expensive new.

There's a local computer store that sells used PC's & laptops. He has an Apple iBook G4 for $550 with a 90 day warranty:
1.07 ghz CPU
30gb hard drive
768mb ram
CD-RW/DVD-Rom drive
Sound Ports
2 USB Ports
Airport Wireless
Firewall Port
Microsoft Office for Mac 2008
iTunes, iLife, iWork, Garage band, Keynote, Bluetooth & new battery.

Also a Dell Latitude D630 for $475 with a 90 day warranty:
Intel Duo Core 2ghz
80gb hard drive
1gb Ram
CD-RW/DVD-Rom Drive
Sound Ports
2 USB Ports
Onboard Wireless
Windows XP Media Center Edition
Microsaft Windows XP, PC Tools Antivirus

Are either of these laptops a good deal? And if they are which one would you recommend. And if their not a good deal, what else would you recommend I take a look at in the $4-6 hundred range. Thanks

PhantomOG

I would definitely want something with more than a 90-day warranty, especially on something USED.

If I were you I would buy something new, with at least a one year warranty.

disneyjoe7

I'm in an anti Windows / PC mood so my input is Apple.


Standing by for other post.

Fireman32

Phil. You can get a brand new laptop for 500 to 600 dollars these days with all the holiday sales going on. I am going to buy a mac for my next computer but would stay away from that one as I think you can get a much better deal. If your going to go used I would choose the Dell. But again go new you get the full warranty and will not spend too much more.

polkatese

my two cents, and I am not a laptop guru:

if he wants apple, I would get him an apple. That iBook is older generation technology, but if the seller is reputable, then the price is reasonable. On used Apple laptop, the standard store warranty is 60-90 days. If he doesn't mind XP/Vista platform, then I would buy new. Dell is running a special this month, pushing your top-end price range, but it's new with 1 yr warranty:

http://configure.us.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&oc=DNDORX2

or Newegg:
http://promotions.newegg.com/NEemail/Dec-0-2008/system11/index-landing.html?nm_mc=EMC-IGNEFL121108&cm_mmc=EMC-IGNEFL121108-_-email-_-E0B-_-Netbook&cm_lm=fhidayat@excite.com

here is another source of reliable used Apple:
http://www.macofalltrades.com/Apple_G4_1_42GHz_14_iBook_1_0_60GB_SuperDrive_APX_p/g4142ib1.htm

shadowofnight

Does your son have a home computer or gaming console to do his gaming on ( If he plays games at all ) ? If so , I would say for a 15 year old I would grab one of dell's incredibly cheap new laptops ( Go here and scroll down for awesome deals that you can click right on...anybody can buy from the business site...just put any made up business name when asked ) and add the accidental damage and theft warranty for 99 to 119.

I never buy an extended warranty on anything....but dells extra warranty covers it if he drops it...gets stolen...etc. I know of a couple of people who have used their extra warranty and got new laptops ( Neither were stolen...both dropped and destroyed ) .

So if he is not going to game on it....those 399 to 599 brand new extra warranteed laptops would be perfect for a 15 year old. If he wants to play todays games on it, he would need more cpu/gpu horsepower then provided by those....but for everything else they would be perfect for your budget and piece of mind if he drops it or it gets stolen...both of which are much much higher for a boy in his age bracket.

disneyjoe7

PC based laptop with Vista and all, going back to my anti Windows mood.

shadowfax_70

When it comes to buying any pc may it be a laptop or a desktop you need to think of these few rules. Rule one look at what he will be using it for and determine what he needs in his machine. Second what kind of functions does he do currently that he needs plus any new ones. Last check to see what kind of warrenty you get and what it covers. The fine print is worth reading here. The more flashie the laptop is the better the warrenty needs to be. If you have any other questions feel free to ask. I'm a network admin for a living so I get these questions all the time from my co-workers for their kids.

Kex

Fireman32 wrote: »

Phil. You can get a brand new laptop for 500 to 600 dollars these days with all the holiday sales going on. I am going to buy a mac for my next computer but would stay away from that one as I think you can get a much better deal. If your going to go used I would choose the Dell. But again go new you get the full warranty and will not spend too much more.

Those prices are far too high for used stuff IMO, especially the Apple with not even 1GB of RAM :eek: ! There are some great deals available new, as Fireman suggests. PC is much cheaper than MAC in general. If he doesn't need a laptop, Dell has a great deal currently on a mini desktop (small form factor, and can easily be moved occasionally if required).

Try this link for an example, if it's still working:

http://configure.us.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?oc=brpcagf&c=us&l=en&s=bsd&cs=04&kc=productdetails~d&lid=197374&dgc=BF&cid=7420

jacob.simpson

For that price you can easily get 4GB RAM, 120 - 250GB HARD DISK CAPACITY, Nvidea Graphics Card, 15.2 or 17 Inch Screen, just hunt around sometimes Frys comes out with best pricings, If you are looking Apple only then you can check www.apple.com and look for refurbished Macs you will get the best price with Apple warranty. as somebody said you can check dell or you can check Hp

SKsolutions

Unless he's going to play games on it, get him a netbook with a 10'' screen for 350-500.
It would be New, super portable, and have extended battery times 3-6 hours. They usually come with Windows XP so you avoid the whole Vista thing, and you get at least a 1 year warranty.

For cheap, I think HP is doing much better than Dell:
HP LINK

Samsung NC10 -6.5 hour battery time, and it's got some cool factor
Samsung LINK

I getting the Samsung for a spare, and my 18 year old son may get one for Christmas as well.

Kex

SKsolutions wrote: »

Unless he's going to play games on it, get him a netbook with a 10'' screen for 350-500 ...

Those are probably a great portable option, but just remember: 10" is very very small, and some never get used to it, including how tightly spaced the keyboard is. I used a Toshiba Portege 300CT with a 10.4" screen for three years (about ten years ago), and while I loved how portable it was compared to the rest of the competition back then, I would not now consider anything less than 12" practical for anything but occasional use (for added mobility and travel).

SKsolutions

Kex wrote: »

Those are probably a great portable option, but just remember: 10" is very very small, and some never get used to it, including how tightly spaced the keyboard is. I used a Toshiba Portege 300CT with a 10.4" screen for three years (about ten years ago), and while I loved how portable it was compared to the rest of the competition back then, I would not now consider anything less than 12" practical for anything but occasional use (for added mobility and travel).

''record of a band that plays those blues
well a band that plays the blues
she just loves my big 10 inch
record of her favorite blues"

I would agree if he were working or cranking out documents. Kids today:rolleyes: , have their own shorthand, and text on a 2'' screen all day long, so for the intended purpose, it may work well. If it's supposed to carry him over into college, where grammar and spelling may actually count for something, it may not be the best bet. The keyboard on the Samsung is 93% full sized. All my work is on laptops, so much that I can no longer find the keys on a desktop.

ZOOPDOOP22

Kex wrote: »

Those prices are far too high for used stuff IMO, especially the Apple with not even 1GB of RAM :eek: ! There are some great deals available new, as Fireman suggests. PC is much cheaper than MAC in general. If he doesn't need a laptop, Dell has a great deal currently on a mini desktop (small form factor, and can easily be moved occasionally if required).

YES!! I cannot emphasize enough STAY AWAY FROM THE iBOOK! That price is a complete and utter ripoff!! small hard drives and memory and no dvd burning on the ibook aside it is the PROCESSOR that makes this machine awful. Not just the clock speed at 1 GHz, this processor is single cored and doesnt hyperthread well meaning if you try to watch video and have itunes and ichat running you will get nothing but choppy frames; It just cannot multitask! I would not spend more than 200 dollars on that laptop. Heck, I had no interest in this computer at all by January 05.


If it HAS to be a mac for whatever reason you are not going to like to hear this but the refurbished macbook from Apple at $850 is a good deal

If you can get a PC here is probably the BEST value you can get new, $570 dollars, Vista, 2.0 Ghz Intel chip, 15.4 inch screen, Free upgrade 2 gigs of ram or +25 dollars for 4 gigs of ram (GREAT DEAL) 160 gb HD, Webcam, wireless, 8x DVD RW drive. Also there is free shipping to you before Dec 24th if you order now.


I wouldn't pass that up. Despite what you have heard Vista is a AWESOME operating system and I use it PERFECTLY on a 10 inch EEE Pc with 1.6 ghz and 2 gigs of RAM.

If it comes down to a netbook pass up the HP Mini. It runs Linux and just recently a bunch of companies released statistics saying that half of linux netbooks get returned and a quarter of windows ones do. Linux just isnt that great compared to windows. Trust me it works.. but a 15 year old wants something familiar and Linux will be a turnoff.


Happy hunting.

markmarc

I have the Mac iBook listed in your specs, I love what it can do, but the price is $200 too high. To be honest a dual core 2gHz is a much faster/powerful computer as long as it is running XP.

I also have PC laptop running Vista with 2 gigs with a dual core at 2Mhz, its still dog butt slow, I'll be upgrading to 4gigs after Christmas. I hope I finally get some decent performance.

ZOOPDOOP22

I also have PC laptop running Vista with 2 gigs with a dual core at 2Mhz, its still dog butt slow, I'll be upgrading to 4gigs after Christmas. I hope I finally get some decent performance.

Not to be a jackass but I need to clear something up. A your chip is 2 GHz, 2000 MHz. Second you must be running wayyy wayy too many background apps on your computer that are slowing it down. Lean is the way to run it man.

I run Vista on a 1.6 GHz Atom processor EEE PC 1000h with 2 gigs of ram and it runs fine. Your Core 2 is way way way way better than my single core atom. (I am using a SSD but that only gives me read/write benefits, not real calculation power) Vista is NOT slow.. if yours is your just the typical PC that goes to mac because they bloat their computer. No offense. Just remove start up apps. If that doesnt work you have mad viruses or something. The first thing you should do when you get a new PC is download AVG free antivirus. It is light years better than the Norton you have to pay for.

Lastly Mark, if your computer is in fact dog butt slow like you say I highly recommend you do these things. Download the gadgets "Quad Core Usage" & "iStat Memory." Also when your slowing down go to Task manager and go to the processes tab. Sort by Memory usage descending and then CPU usage descending. You should be able to find out what app is locking you up and close it. I'm sure you know this but then again you should know that your laptop is able to BEAST vista.

pearsall001

Much appreciated info & feedback fellows & ZERO you really laid it all out very well for me. I guess I have some homework to do, but it does seem like buying new is the way to go. My son isn't a computer gamer but he does like his Xbox 360. So I think that narrows the field right off the bat since he isn't a gamer.

I can attest to Toshiba being a good brand, I still use a P25 Series that I bought back in Nov of '03 & it still works like a charm & has every bell & whistle that was available at the time. I'll definetely take a lok at them (but I think they are a bit over my set budget). Thanks again guys!!

Airplay355

I had a sony vaio, it had asus and pioneer parts in it. The only sony part was 1 or 2 cd drives. The sony cd drive died. I wouldn't mind buying an asus if I needed a PC.

If you can afford a mac though I'd recommend one of those. I 'd typing this from a macbook pro.

markmarc

SD:
I run very few apps, just office and a browser. The install is quite fresh. I've talked with engineers from Intel's campuses here in the Silicon Forest, and they all agree that based on current typical laptop processors 4 gigs is minimum for decent performance (I should mention that mine is a AMD equivilent processor which gets snickers from the Intel guys, but the machine was a gift and I never complain about free). Now, if I were to back down to XP, I'd have a serious power demon. But the fact is that Vista is designed for laptops coming in 2010, when the power will match up to all of Vista's requirements. BTW, I swear by and use AVG.

I remember the same complaints for the first two years of XP, then boom out came the horsepower and service pack 2 and life was good on XP.

All that being said, I still would rather and do spend more time on my Mac iBook. I'm far more productive, and this is coming from a guy who teaches computers to k-8 students all day on XP machines. I do appreciate your time in replying to me.

eloplayspolo

to the last poster... i highly doubt that anyone from intel told u that.

I have been building PCs for 10 years now. i am 20 years old and majoring in Computer engineering. i know hardware very well and i know plenty about software. Microsoft isnt stupid. They made vista very resource heavy... but taht doesnt mean that u can disable some of those resource hogs.

Disable windows aero, windows sidebar, and make sure u use msconfig to remove all non microsoft aplications except for your antivirus/spyware ( i recomend windows live one care). it removed the zlob virus 3 months before any other company could even touch it.

As far as new laptops

all that being said..... if he plans to use it jsut for school, and wants to take it places. one of the coolest laptops on the block right now is the Acer Aspire One.... its 8.9" and runs 8 hours off of a 6 cell battery. It uses the intel atom Processor and has 1gb of ram and 120gb HD. It is ULTRA portable, Great battery life, and actually comes standard with windows XP.... AND ITS ONLY 399.99!!!!!!! you can find it on amazon actually.
http://www.amazon.com/Acer-8-9-inch-Netbook-Processor-Sapphire/dp/B001EYV9TM/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1229143740&sr=8-1
its on sale right now too with free shipping.

The reason i doubt that intel said that is that vista requires 512 ram... which is nothing anymore. and processor usuage while on the internet on my core 2 duo t7500 is 2%.... while watching a DIVX movie its 83%...... vista isnt the reason that that program uses more CPU, ITS THE PROGRAM. the operaiting itself is designed extreemly well... and its the applications u use along with it... and a users knowledge and choices that make a PC run slow. There is a reason bill gates has a couple more bucks in his pocket than the avg joe.... hes a very smart person... and surrounds himself with even smarter individuals... they arent going to make something for 4 years and have it not work as it should.... they learns things and try new things and thats why u constantly get updates form windows.

eloplayspolo

oh and as far as u "backing down to XP" with 4 gigs of ram... good luck on that unless u have a 64 bit version of xp... because it will only read 3 gigs of it.

audiobliss

Wow. Arrogant much?

I'd want to have better written communication skills before challenging people like that.

eloplayspolo

yeah... typos are a big problem.. u can tell how much i care. i wasn't trying to be rude... i just really cant stand to hear so many people complain about vista... when u can actually get it down to = resource usage if you just take the time to.

Gadabout

pearsall001 wrote: »

I can attest to Toshiba being a good brand, I still use a P25 Series that I bought back in Nov of '03 & it still works like a charm & has every bell & whistle that was available at the time. I'll definetely take a lok at them (but I think they are a bit over my set budget). Thanks again guys!!

My beloved laptop for the last 3.5 years took went down in October. I was on the road and really didn't want to be without a computer for a week. I thought I would go into Best Buy just to see what they had around and what the going prices are. I picked up a Toshiba A305, with a T5750 processor and 4Gb ram, Vista Home 64bit for $550.

Not the best, but certainly a fair deal. There are some good deals out there. I imagine I could have saved a few dollars and bought online, but I didn't want to wait. Also, if you can wait till the 26th, there will be even better deals out there as everyone clears inventory.

Scott

markmarc

Elo:
I teach several students whose parents work as engineers for Intel here in Portland. They are smart enough to recognize the old Sun Tzu proverb "Know thy enemy". They use AMD machines as comparisons in many, many dept's.

Respectfully, you may be a computer major, but those of us in the real world know that Vista still has flaws that need to be addressed and hopefully solved by SP2 when it comes out before true mass business adoption will take place.

You have stripped your machine down to it's basics, good for you, but most people wont. Why, because it's too much of a pain and that one false step and it becomes a mess to work with.

markmarc

Lasareath:
That's what we've done at our school, bought the machines with Vista licenses, then backed down to XP with licenses we've already paid for. perfectly legal and we are set for the future when Vista is worthy. :>)

ZOOPDOOP22

markmarc wrote: »

Elo:
Respectfully, you may be a computer major, but those of us in the real world know that Vista still has flaws that need to be addressed and hopefully solved by SP2 when it comes out before true mass business adoption will take place.

You have stripped your machine down to it's basics, good for you, but most people wont. Why, because it's too much of a pain and that one false step and it becomes a mess to work with.

I respect people trying to give the right advice however Elo made very unnecessary suggestions. I used to have a HP 2133 (the first Mini note, aluminum version) and it ran Vista Business from a 1.6 GHz Via C7 processor. This computer had one core without hyper threading and was unable to properly run Vista. I had to do what he said, disable gadget bar etc etc.. in fact there is an entire webpage on how to optimize vista for the 2133. It still ran like crap. Once I moved to an Intel Atom chip 1.6 (overclock to 1.8) single core with hyperthreading the OS FLEW.

I want you to know I use Vista business 64 through the boot camp along side of OS X on one computer and Vista home basic on another; with this said I completely disagree that vista has any serious flaws that oh soo many hope will get fixed in SP2. Traditionally, if you look at the past it was SP1 that was the "OK" for businesses to adopt a new Windows version.

Regardless, it is not a valid point to say that companies are not ready to adopt vista. Its more like: In this economy large businesses are not willing to upgrade their cubicle farm with 100s of computers they bought in 2005 that still handle their needs fine but are unable to properly run the new OS.

The thread is for a laptop computer for a teenager.. and yes Vista is the right Windows platform to be looking for.

I'm not a computer science major but I could have been. I started writing html in the sixth grade. I'm 21 now and I make it my business to know this business. I'm not trying to be a know it all but the fact is I am that guy everyone I know goes to about computers. I've only met a handful of people who can show me up on the subject. (they are usually computer science majors).

This thread has gotten long and I just want to make sure the OP saw the HP I mentioned before. This is a great computer unless say a 13 inch size is a priority. If I were to buy this laptop I would get the upgrade to Core 2 processor, the 4 gig ram upgrade, and possibly the fingerprint scanner upgrade because its cool tech. (also it looks sexy)

eloplayspolo

the acer one comes standard with XP... thats why it lasts so long on a single 6 cell battery.

heres the problem i have with all these people saying blah blah vista sucks it takes up so many resouces and its slow... bull Sheet - there are so many programs in XP that take up more. yeah, u need more ram... but u dont see a computer sold with under 2 gigs anymore really.

audiobliss

It is flat out ridiculous to need 3GB or more to run a budget-priced computer for a 15 year old who isn't even interested in gaming. There's no justification for that in my book. Period!

John30_30

Good points and info all around, even the disagreements. One point I'd like to mention is you should cruise some of the techie hardware sites like tomshardware, crunchgear, computerworld, even TheReg, just to find out info on manufacturing screwups in new models as well as benchtesting.
Granted, they use serious tweakers to do benching, but they'll also report serious issues like the ongoing Nvidia GeForce 8600M GT GPU's that Apple has now had installed on a raft of new Macbook Pros.
No manufacturer is perfect, and even the best will have serious issues now and again. Surprisingly for all their user-friendly style and elegance, Apple are up among the highest with notebook problems, while Lenovo are consistently the best-built PC-based business notebooks.

Best bang for the buck right now? All over the place. Students are selling monster gamer rigs on CL for Xmas cash, Frys and buy.com will have crazy open-box and refurb deals. I like refurbs, but you'd probably have to be a bit more like the guys you're getting advice from here, knowledgewise to go those routes. Ebay has the Dell D630 latitude new, barely used, demos, refurbs, for steal deals. It is a very good business laptop. Their warranties and support are top-line, btw.

Bottom line- there's always a bit of a risk, so you do your homework and get as informed as you can with the strengths and weaknesses of different models.
Very important thing to consider also- factor in what your kid wants, what are his needs? If he needs/wants something portable for doing homework, web-cam I.M'ing, facebook stuff, you don't get a 20" high-end H.P. gaming rig, even if its got the equivalent horsepower and bells & whistles to run SDA's.