Speaker Wire Question

florad

Ok, this is totally a newbie question, but I want to make sure what I'm doing....I currently have a Polk CSi A6 center, FXI A6 & FXI 5 surrounds, and I'm hopeful to work on the RTi A9's later in the year to complete the setup. I'm getting ready to start remodeling my basement with a 7.1 theater and I need to know what kind of gauge speaker wire I should be buying to run in the walls. I'll be honest, I have no clue....I believe anything in wall should be CL2 rated, but should I be using 12 gauge? 14 gauge? 16 gauge? A combination of those depending on the speaker? Any help would be appreciated. Thank you!!!

thsmith

I use these http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10239&cs_id=1023901&p_id=2816&seq=1&format=2

WilliamM2

It depends on the length of the runs, and ohm rating of the speaker. For in-wall runs, I always wire for 4 ohm, that way you are all set in case you get different speakers later.

14ga would be fine for that, up to 40 feet. If the runs are longer, I would use 12ga.

rdb2001

WilliamM2 wrote: »

It depends on the length of the runs, and ohm rating of the speaker. For in-wall runs, I always wire for 4 ohm, that way you are all set in case you get different speakers later.

14ga would be fine for that, up to 40 feet. If the runs are longer, I would use 12ga.

Just a quick question. What did you mean when you said you wire for ohms. Found that interesting never heard that before outside of car audio when you wire your voice coils to ohm levels.

treitz3

All speakers have an ohm rating. The most common are 4, 6 and 8 ohm's and the rating can usually be found online by looking up the stat's of a given speaker or it can be found in the owner's manual for each respective speaker.

florad

treitz3 wrote: »

All speakers have an ohm rating. The most common are 4, 6 and 8 ohm's and the rating can usually be found online by looking up the stat's of a given speaker or it can be found in the owner's manual for each respective speaker.

So is it the lower the ohm, the lower the gauge of wire to use, or do I have it backwards?

rdb2001

treitz3 wrote: »

All speakers have an ohm rating. The most common are 4, 6 and 8 ohm's and the rating can usually be found online by looking up the stat's of a given speaker or it can be found in the owner's manual for each respective speaker.

I understand the ohm rating. How do you wire for ohms in home audio. Its not like you are wiring in series or parallel in car audio. But how do you wire for 4ohm in home audio when you are just running speaker wire not hooking up in series or parallel. I may be wrong but I am just curious of how that works.

treitz3

The ohm rating [resistance or impedance] of a particular speaker is already internally wired to achieve said ohm rating. The ohm rating is what you are looking for which as mentioned, are usually 4, 6 or 8 ohms. The lower the ohm rating, the more power hungry the speaker is. The higher the rating, the more efficient the speaker is. That said, the more power that is required the thicker the wire needs to be. Please note that as the thickness of the wire increases, the gauge decreases. Refer to this link for the mathematics......

http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm

rdb2001

treitz3 wrote: »

The ohm rating [resistance or impedance] of a particular speaker is already internally wired. The ohm rating is what you are looking for which as mentioned, are usually 4, 6 or 8 ohms. The lower the ohm rating, the more power hungry the speaker is. The higher the rating , the more efficient the speaker is. That said, the more power that is required the thicker the wire needs to be. Please note that as the thickness of the wire increases, the gauge decreases. Refer to this link for the mathematics......

http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm

I understand and thanks for the clarification. I had never heard that used that way before. I use 12 guage on my fronts and 14 guage on surrounds. So I guess he was saying go ahead and run the lower guage now because of upgrades in the future.

WilliamM2

rdb2001 wrote: »

I understand and thanks for the clarification. I had never heard that used that way before. I use 12 guage on my fronts and 14 guage on surrounds. So I guess he was saying go ahead and run the lower guage now because of upgrades in the future.

Exactly. No reason to rewire if you ever switch to 4 ohm speakers. Especially in-wall, as it can be a pain.

SirCujo

4-6-8 ohms make no difference to wire size. Speaker wire should have no or very little resistance. (18AWG uncoated copper will have 7.77 ohms per thousand feet, 16AWG is 4.89, 14AWG is 3.07, etc) Ohm ratings come from the speakers themselves, not the wiring in short runs. You size wire gauge by the power that you plan to run through them.

Copper wire (60'C rated) at 14 AWG can take up to 25 amps at 0-2000v in an ambient of 30'C (86'F), which is more than sufficient for most amplifiers out there. 16 AWG is in the range of 20amps, similar to above, just lower amperage rating.

(All specs from NEC 310-17 & 310-19 & NFPA 70-1993)

WilliamM2

SirCujo wrote: »

4-6-8 ohms make no difference to wire size.

You size wire gauge by the power that you plan to run through them.

These two lines seem conflicting.

You do realize that the NEC ratings are for safety, correct? While it is perfectly safe to add 4 or even 8 ohms resistance with speaker wire, most people will not want to waste half their amplifier power that way.

F1nut

If you're judging speaker wire by the gauge, you're missing the point.

mmadden28

SirCujo wrote: »

4-6-8 ohms make no difference to wire size. Speaker wire should have no or very little resistance. (18AWG uncoated copper will have 7.77 ohms per thousand feet, 16AWG is 4.89, 14AWG is 3.07, etc) Ohm ratings come from the speakers themselves, not the wiring in short runs. You size wire gauge by the power that you plan to run through them.

Copper wire (60'C rated) at 14 AWG can take up to 25 amps at 0-2000v in an ambient of 30'C (86'F), which is more than sufficient for most amplifiers out there. 16 AWG is in the range of 20amps, similar to above, just lower amperage rating.

(All specs from NEC 310-17 & 310-19 & NFPA 70-1993)

There's more to it than this. Power handling ratings on in-wall wiring designated for AC power delivery at 60hz is one thing, but that doesn't exactly translate the same when talking about cable used for audio at varying low and high frequencies.

Its not just about power handling, its also about capacitance and resistance to interference and other factors that can have an effect based on the cables design and metal content and purity.

You also have to size the cable according to the distance from the amp because of increased resistance. A thicker wire will have less resistance over long runs.

ben62670

One thing that I have found is that the dielectric has a great effect on the SQ. I use Teflon in nearly all my wiring. Thick cheap insulation sucks the life out of the music. Conductor material, and construction are two things often overlooked. My AQ Type 4's are only 15 gage equivalent with four solid connectors per channel. I used to run ~M~ 12 gage, but that stuff sucked the life out of my system. Clear as mud?

Knucklehead

The Truth about Speaker Wire

Despite the effectiveness of Gordon's cable demonstration and the truth about speaker wire, people visiting the McIntosh room at the shows, who had not experienced the cable demonstration, were disturbed that we were using ordinary heavy zip cord instead of one of the popular brands of speaker wire. Instead of listening to the McIntosh speakers and electronics, they recalled "bad" things they had been told about "common" speaker wire and this promoted questions about the "inferior" wire being used. When we changed the wire to a popular brand of wire, customers were happy with the setup, and directed their attention to the McIntosh equipment.

The demand for high quality speaker wire was increasing and appeared to be a new marketing area for several companies. McIntosh did not make or sell speaker wire. The solution seemed very obvious--rather than spend time and effort to create negative sales for McIntosh dealers who were beginning to sell speaker wire, it seemed best to encourage the speaker owner/customer to consult with the dealer about what speaker wire to use. Consequently, I no longer recommended the kind of wire or wire sizes in the speaker manuals.

By 1988, McIntosh no longer supplied audio interconnects with the electronics. Again, many kinds of special audio cables were available to the customer/owner. The dealer could also be consulted about what cables to use.

I credit the success of the speaker wire industry to their expert sales and marketing ability. However, it is my experience that ordinary copper wire, as long as it's heavy enough, is just as good as name brands.

Looking at this from a different perspective, there will always be those who will want expensive wire, not because there is an audible difference, but because they may value pride of ownership and prestige in a similar way to that of owning a Tiffany lamp or a Rolex watch. BY Roger Russell

F1nut

So, have you ever tried high end wire?

Knucklehead

i have, and it makes no audible difference to MY ears. To each his own. Ive read many columns from respected audiophiles who say not to waste your money. But if you have it to burn, go for it.

F1nut

Ok, what wire on what gear. Be as specific as possible.

Knucklehead

my wire on my gear...specific enough

F1nut

Well, if the best you can do is cite an article you read on the internet, then yeah that's specific enough to prove you have zero credibility.

Knucklehead

and you as well......because you have proven nothing...think about it..all talk....no proof that you have the slightest clue. anyone can say they have used this that or the other...besides...i said it was my opinion..you do know what that means dont you? this isnt a bash the fellow user forum you know.

F1nut

I'm not the one saying that wire doesn't matter, you are. Yet, when asked for some sort of personal experience, you came up with nothing, not a damn thing.

You're out of your league. The best thing you can do is quit digging.

Knucklehead

and while im digging im burying you...lol...your in no league...just turn on your RCA and let the rest of us have fun.

F1nut

Yep, your name fits you to a T. Good luck in life, with your IQ, you're going to need it.

Knucklehead

what a loser...F1 Nut sounds kinda **** to me...lmao

Knucklehead

you certainly chimed in when you heard the word ****.....lol

Knucklehead

shaddup.

Knucklehead

keiko? wtf is that?

broncsrule21@

Knucklehead wrote: »

what a loser...F1 Nut sounds kinda **** to me...lmao

That's a little over the top.

F1nut

broncsrule21@ wrote: »

That's a little over the top.

Comments like his are the result of a poor education, a lower than average IQ and the lack of a healthy family support system. When those factors are taken into consideration, I almost feel sorry for him.....almost.