Another Philoshophical Audio Thread

Early B.

Every now & then I look back on what I've gleaned from the multitude of previous upgrades. I've whittled down my audio philosophy into four basic principles:

1. Simplify your system in a complex way.

IMO, the best music appears to be simple. Ask any serious musician and they'll tell you that making simple music is hard to do. By simple I mean minimal accompaniment, great vocals and lyrics, and a powerful hook. Think about the greatest love songs ever made. They are simple. In fact, think about the greatest hits from the biggest artists and you'll probably find the majority of them to be simple songs. Think Stevie Wonder, Beatles, Elvis, etc. Think Motown, Memphis, and Abbey Road. Think Ellington, Rogers & Hammerstein, Bacharach, and all of the great song writers of the 20th century. Hell, all of country and blues music is simple, and blues is the progenitor of American music. Just ask Hendrix. (If he could, he'd tell ya.)

Likewise, your audio system should be developed using a simple approach. No bells and whistles or other junk in the signal path. For instance, one of the biggest upgrades I made was acquiring a passive pre. I only needed volume control between my CDP and amps, so why bother with a bunch of extra electronics like phono stages, tone controls, extra inputs, caps, resistors, opamps, power supplies, power cords, etc.?

But it takes lots of study and experimentation to develop a simple system to your liking. The biggest hurdle is determining what you want. That may take several years to figure out. The second biggest hurdle is determining what trade-offs you're gonna make to get what you want. That may take another few years to figure out.

2. At least two components in the chain should be immediately tweakable.

I love tube gear. If you don't like what you're hearing, pop in a different set of tubes. Problem solved. Likewise, if my system seems a bit bass shy, I can tweak the bass on my VMPS speakers. Problem solved.

A typical 2-channel system consists of four major components -- amp(s), preamp, source, and speakers. At least two of them should be tweakable. I really like where the audio community appears to be going -- speakers with active crossovers. Active crossovers represent the ultimate in tweakability.


3. No matter what you do, half of your CDs will still sound like crap.

My system is ruthlessly revealing. The better it gets, the more revealing the music becomes. But that's a double edged sword. Deal with it. Forget about trying to get your Metallica CDs to sound like audiophile-quality recordings.

4. Modify it.

I don't care how much you paid for your gear, it has inferior parts in it. Get rid of it and take your system to another level you didn't think was possible.


OK, I'm done. I feel better now. Thanks for yor indulgence.

nikolas812

I fly like paper. Get high like planes.....










Nick

WilliamM2

Such astute observations. Makes me wonder why you change equipment more often than your underwear.:)

Early B.

WilliamM2 wrote: »

Such astute observations. Makes me wonder why you change equipment more often than your underwear.:)

Not anymore. I've had the same CDP for about 4 years and the same speakers for two years. The latest additions -- Rogue amps and Placette pre are staying for a while. It took me a long time to determine that I wanted a tube amp(s) and a passive pre.

Like I said above, you gotta experiment a lot before you know what you want.

riglehart

Early B. wrote: »

3. No matter what you do, half of your CDs will still sound like crap.

My system is ruthlessly revealing. The better it gets, the more revealing the music becomes. But that's a double edged sword. Deal with it. Forget about trying to get your Metallica CDs to sound like audiophile-quality recordings.

I'm not an audiophile, but have decent gear. This is one thing I never realized until a couple years ago (I'm 41). The difference is STARK. One thing anyone getting into higher end gear needs to know is that there are a lot of crappy CDs out there that must have been mastered by a monkey. Even the same song from the same artist on a different CD (say a greatest hits) can be much different from the original.

McLoki

To be honest, I don't know if I would be happy with gear that started as good as it could get. Half the enjoyment I get from this hobby is making my gear better than it started. I can't afford to change often, but I can afford to tweak....

New parts for the LSiC should be here next week...

Michael

Conradicles

My VMPS Larger is quite nice, but I have not got into the tubes yet, but one day I might. Sounds like you have a great system.

SolidSqual

Bump, this is what I needed to hear.

VR3

Simple is a great thing...

At one point in my audio journey... I had 5 2 ch amplifiers, 7 or so speakers....

Later on in the journey, I had stereo subs, one to many amps...

Im down to 2 speakers, 2 amps, a preamp and cd player - hands down the best this room has EVER sounded, period.

SolidSqual

Hmmm . . . I'm debating going passive.

mantis

Zero wrote: »

I prefer simplicity.

1 CD Player, 1 Integrated, and 1 set of speakers.

No tweaks.

No magic pebbles.

No rack full of hulking components.

No need to pop the hood and modify.

Just simple, solid electronics that suits my needs and wants. So far, I've been pretty happy with the approach.

It's a good approach. I like it.

Dan

SolidSqual

Both of you shut up. Youre stripping away my piece of mind. According to Early's philosophy, I am right on target.

mantis

SolidSqual wrote: »

Both of you shut up. Youre stripping away my piece of mind. According to Early's philosophy, I am right on target.

Let me reinsert it. There is no magic that will help you achieve your audio goals.
There is no reason to pop the hood and modify what is already perfection on it's level.
No reason to have a rack full of gear of that which you do not use.

The bottom line is when you sit in your chair , pop in the recording of choice and let go of the world for awhile. Like Calgon bubble bath.


Dan

Early B.

Have you ever re-read one of your old posts and said to yourself, "Damn, that's good. Did I write that?" :cool:

Fongolio

Early B. wrote: »

3. No matter what you do, half of your CDs will still sound like crap.

Same holds true for vinyl records.

George Grand

McLoki wrote: »

To be honest, I don't know if I would be happy with gear that started as good as it could get. Michael

There's more than a little truth in this statement.

Hilbert

Damn. Only about 10% of my CDs sound like crap. Obviously I have a lot of work to do.:)

george daniel

#3 and #4 are right on,, I gave up on getting most of my cd's to sound good,once I figured out WHY . No matter what you do,a bad recording is not gonna sound good without alot of "stuff" in the path.I run from source to pre to amps to speakers.I'm down to searching out the best recordings(CD,SACD,Vinyl) for myself and just treasuring it when I find it,and enjoying ,,, the only "tweak that I have made recently,is PIO caps on my tube amp,and yes, there is an audible difference.Alot more to be spoken on this subject,by those wiser and more experienced than I,, but one thing I've learned,if you have a system that has the "synergy" between components, sounds great,then leave it alone,,you may want to experiment with pc,ic, and sc's,but be in a position to be able to restore it. I bought my first set of Taylos ref monitors from Brad,, took em home,, had an Audible Illusions L-1,,Belles 350a,, and they never sounded better,, finally I've got the speakers back, but the Belles and then AI are long gone,,shoulda' kept them. I was going to make a point,, but kinda' got lost it my rant,, anyway,, I'll eventually get rid of the ELP and Adcom mono's and replace them with the Belles and AI,,and then I will rest.

Eh,, they are worse things though:cool:;)

BigMac

george daniel wrote: »

I'm down to searching out the best recordings(CD,SACD,Vinyl) for myself and just treasuring it when I find it,and enjoying

I received my sampler disc a few weeks ago and it sounds amazing. Plus it is 100% free. http://www.2l.no/sampler2007/

BottomFeeder

I'm still new at this whole gig. I've "only" gone through a few amps, a few sets of speakers, 1 pre and two cdp's. However I'm sure hoping to avoid the endless upgraditis that is obviously fun for some, but would serve only to continue audio frustration for me.

I want to build an excellent system (okay, I realize that that phrase is up for grabs, but it's primarily my ears that will be listening to it & no one else's) and then be done with it - for a loooong time. I also realize that the "finish line" is crossed at different times for different people, but I sure hope to get there sooner than later.

I'm still trying to keep enjoying the music, not endlessly tweaking my gear, as my goal...

Fat chance?

BottomFeeder

Oooh! Looky looky!

I just passed 1000 posts (do I get a prize?) and I'm no longer a "Polkazoid" but an official "Polkhead!"

Oh! Warm fuzzy!

steveinaz

Use the least amount of electronics to get the signal passed. Less stages equals less processed music, in a nutshell.

nikolas812

Zero wrote: »

I prefer simplicity.

1 CD Player, 1 Integrated, and 1 set of speakers.

No tweaks.

No magic pebbles.

No rack full of hulking components.

No need to pop the hood and modify.

Just simple, solid electronics that suits my needs and wants. So far, I've been pretty happy with the approach.

The best sounding system I ever had consisted of this same configuration...









Nick

zingo

I probably will jump to using a pre when I can get my hands on the Pass Labs B1, but I feel that an integrated amp saves a lot of hassle and sounds pretty darn good.

cfrizz

Or in other words How to make a complicated sytem more complex (A Guide to a Happy Tweeker Audiophile)

Me, I'm going to buy the best my money can get, put it together, sit back & enjoy it for years to come.

While you're tweeking, I'll be enjoying my music!

THAT'S SIMPLICITY!!!

1. Simplify your system in a complex way.

Early B.

cfrizz wrote: »

Or in other words How to make a complicated sytem more complex (A Guide to a Happy Tweeker Audiophile)

Me, I'm going to buy the best my money can get, put it together, sit back & enjoy it for years to come.

While you're tweeking, I'll be enjoying my music!

THAT'S SIMPLICITY!!!

1. Simplify your system in a complex way.

cfrizz --

What if you could spend from zero to, let's say, $100 to significantly upgrade the sound of your system -- would you do it? Of course you would. That's what makes tweaks and mods so compelling. Sure, you can buy the best system you can afford and be happy with it, but in the back of your mind, you gotta know from years of participating on this forum that your system can (and should) sound better than it does, and it only takes a minimal effort to make it so. It doesn't get any simpler than that.

rayslifecycle

Enjoy what you have vs Strengthen weaknesses

Balancing the two is simply complex.

What do you derive more satisfaction from?

steveinaz

I think what Cathy may be alluding to is, why buy a $185 DVD player and stuff it with $600 worth of mods to make it a good CD player--instead by a $700 CD player and be done with it. I agree with this mostly because usually the more expensive player is going to have other enhancements that modifications don't provide.

Then again, to some people tweaking is a BIG part of their enjoyment of the hobby, and that's cool too. People get involved in audio for all sorts of reasons; nostaglia of tubes, tweaking, love for music, love for equipment. To each his own.

PolkThug

Convert all your media to mp3's, then everything will be equally crappy, and you won't know what you're missing.

BottomFeeder

PolkThug wrote: »

Convert all your media to mp3's, then everything will be equally crappy, and you won't know what you're missing.

Ach! Now why didn't I think of that! Now that's simplicity!

cfrizz

Early B. wrote: »

cfrizz --

What if you could spend from zero to, let's say, $100 to significantly upgrade the sound of your system -- would you do it? Of course you would. That's what makes tweaks and mods so compelling. Sure, you can buy the best system you can afford and be happy with it, but in the back of your mind, you gotta know from years of participating on this forum that your system can (and should) sound better than it does, and it only takes a minimal effort to make it so. It doesn't get any simpler than that.

Brad, I don't know any such thing, for that matter How in the world do you & the other tweekers? You DON'T! You just assume it can be better because it gives you an excuse to tweek! Which is all well & good if that is what turns you on.

I spend a damn good chunk of change on gear that has a good reputation for quality, longevity, & service. That's good enough for me.

steveinaz wrote: »

I think what Cathy may be alluding to is, why buy a $185 DVD player and stuff it with $600 worth of mods to make it a good CD player--instead by a $700 CD player and be done with it. I agree with this mostly because usually the more expensive player is going to have other enhancements that modifications don't provide.

YES! Thank you Steve, you get what I was trying to say.