10g single or 14quad???

curved
curved Posts: 664
edited October 2008 in Speakers
I'm just about to order different speaker wire and need suggestions.....

Am I better off going with 10g single wire or 14g quad going from my Adcom 555 to my RTi8's?
Living Room:....................[HTML] [/HTML] Zone 2 (Workout Room):
AVR - Yamaha RX-V757......JBL 4312 Pro Monitors
Pre - Nak CA-5
AMP - Adcom 555 (Main)
Main - Polk RTI8**/RTiA5
AMP - Adcom 545II (Center)
Center - Polk CSiA4**
Sub - Snell Basis 300:p......Zone 3 (Outside)
CD - Yamaha CDC-555.......Def Tech AW5500
TV - Pani TH-42PZ80U
BR - LG BD390
Monster HTS1600 Power Center
Dedicated Circuit - (2) 20amp, (1) 15amp
Ben's IC, Canare 4S11
**Dayton and Sonicap Caps with Mills Resistors**
Post edited by curved on
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,813
    edited October 2008
    http://www.mitcables.com/
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • reeltrouble1
    reeltrouble1 Posts: 9,312
    edited October 2008
    Jesse you are so bad. But hell yea MIT is great.

    are you bi-wiring or not curved?

    RT1
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  • TNRabbit
    TNRabbit Posts: 2,168
    edited October 2008
    Here's a novel idea; 12 gauge SILVER cables for the upper range and 10 gauge COPPER cables for the lower range (bi-wired/amped)~!
    TNRabbit
    NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
    Sunfire TG-IV
    Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
    Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
    Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
    Carver AL-III Speakers
    Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer
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  • Sami
    Sami Posts: 4,634
    edited October 2008
    Do RTi8's fit 10ga? Does the Adcom? Just a thought. I think single 12ga would be more than enough unless it's a very long run. I wouldn't bi-wire.
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  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited October 2008
    TNRabbit wrote: »
    Here's a novel idea; 12 gauge SILVER cables for the upper range and 10 gauge COPPER cables for the lower range (bi-wired/amped)~!

    That's kinda what I do. Mine use AudioQuest Type 4 on the lows, and my silvers on the highs.

    As for the OP question the Starquad works well to. Using just any 10 ga wire will kill some detail in the highs, and may bloat the bass.
    Ben
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
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  • curved
    curved Posts: 664
    edited October 2008
    Appreciate the help guys!!

    The right will be about a 12 foot run and the left is right next to amp. Should I keep both runs the same? I always have in the past....
    Living Room:....................[HTML] [/HTML] Zone 2 (Workout Room):
    AVR - Yamaha RX-V757......JBL 4312 Pro Monitors
    Pre - Nak CA-5
    AMP - Adcom 555 (Main)
    Main - Polk RTI8**/RTiA5
    AMP - Adcom 545II (Center)
    Center - Polk CSiA4**
    Sub - Snell Basis 300:p......Zone 3 (Outside)
    CD - Yamaha CDC-555.......Def Tech AW5500
    TV - Pani TH-42PZ80U
    BR - LG BD390
    Monster HTS1600 Power Center
    Dedicated Circuit - (2) 20amp, (1) 15amp
    Ben's IC, Canare 4S11
    **Dayton and Sonicap Caps with Mills Resistors**
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  • leroyjr1
    leroyjr1 Posts: 8,785
    edited October 2008
    http://signalcable.com/ultraspeaker.html
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  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,782
    edited October 2008
    curved wrote: »
    Appreciate the help guys!!

    The right will be about a 12 foot run and the left is right next to amp. Should I keep both runs the same? I always have in the past....

    No need to keep them the same length, if that's what you mean. And with 12 ft, there is no need to even use 12 ga. 14, or even 16 would work fine.

    Why are you getting different wire?
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  • curved
    curved Posts: 664
    edited October 2008
    I have some older 12g - dad handed them down to me when he went with Audioquest cables (not Type 4 but kinda looks like it).

    I've swapped the older wires with a friends monster cable 12g and it sounded quite a bit worse. The bass wasn't as clean and it lacked midrange accuracy. I feel the old 12g sounds good, I just find the mid-bass to be a little strong for me (overbearing). I was hoping to find a happy medium....
    Living Room:....................[HTML] [/HTML] Zone 2 (Workout Room):
    AVR - Yamaha RX-V757......JBL 4312 Pro Monitors
    Pre - Nak CA-5
    AMP - Adcom 555 (Main)
    Main - Polk RTI8**/RTiA5
    AMP - Adcom 545II (Center)
    Center - Polk CSiA4**
    Sub - Snell Basis 300:p......Zone 3 (Outside)
    CD - Yamaha CDC-555.......Def Tech AW5500
    TV - Pani TH-42PZ80U
    BR - LG BD390
    Monster HTS1600 Power Center
    Dedicated Circuit - (2) 20amp, (1) 15amp
    Ben's IC, Canare 4S11
    **Dayton and Sonicap Caps with Mills Resistors**
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,782
    edited October 2008
    Sounds like what you really need is different speakers, ones that you actually like the sound of. Wire won't change the mid-bass.
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited October 2008
    William doesn't believe that we can hear differences between cables. Even though he's in the minority, he feels that he must sputter this malarkey whenever possible.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • Sami
    Sami Posts: 4,634
    edited October 2008
    Face wrote: »
    William doesn't believe that we can hear differences between cables. Even though he's in the minority, he feels that he must sputter this malarkey whenever possible.

    Lets not start this again.
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,813
    edited October 2008
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    Sounds like what you really need is different speakers, ones that you actually like the sound of. Wire won't change the mid-bass.

    You couldn't be more wrong.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • curved
    curved Posts: 664
    edited October 2008
    haha.....they actually are NOT the speakers of my choice. See other post - 2ch/HT ;)

    When I did my little test (old 12g vs Monster 12g), the Monster wasn't nearly as overbearing in the midbass. I listened to the entire Jack Johnson cd through in the exact same listening spot with my sub off.
    Living Room:....................[HTML] [/HTML] Zone 2 (Workout Room):
    AVR - Yamaha RX-V757......JBL 4312 Pro Monitors
    Pre - Nak CA-5
    AMP - Adcom 555 (Main)
    Main - Polk RTI8**/RTiA5
    AMP - Adcom 545II (Center)
    Center - Polk CSiA4**
    Sub - Snell Basis 300:p......Zone 3 (Outside)
    CD - Yamaha CDC-555.......Def Tech AW5500
    TV - Pani TH-42PZ80U
    BR - LG BD390
    Monster HTS1600 Power Center
    Dedicated Circuit - (2) 20amp, (1) 15amp
    Ben's IC, Canare 4S11
    **Dayton and Sonicap Caps with Mills Resistors**
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,782
    edited October 2008
    Not to argue about wire, but even if you do believe it makes a difference, is that difference big enough to remove an "overbearing" mid-bass?

    I thought the differences were subtle, and that's why it's never been able to be verified, and why some hear it and some don't? Seems removing mid-bass would be easy to hear and measure.
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  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited October 2008
    I still find it amazing some can't hear the difference between cables:confused:, but the best advice I can give is try some used cables. If you don't hear a difference sell them, and get your money back. Anyone live near curved to let him try a decent set of cables?
    Ben
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
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  • Sami
    Sami Posts: 4,634
    edited October 2008
    F1nut wrote: »
    You couldn't be more wrong.

    When it comes to this matter nobody is wrong, nobody is right. It's like arguing if god exists or not; there's no proof in either way.
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  • curved
    curved Posts: 664
    edited October 2008
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    Not to argue about wire, but even if you do believe it makes a difference, is that difference big enough to remove an "overbearing" mid-bass?

    I thought the differences were subtle, and that's why it's never been able to be verified, and why some hear it and some don't? Seems removing mid-bass would be easy to hear and measure.

    Subtle differences can make a big difference....just ask my wife ;)

    I'll probably just try my dads cables, although I don't think I'll be spending that much on them.... I was just thinking about going with used as Ben stated or getting the BJ quad cable - it's only $40 and if I don't like it, I'll use it for my JBL CM
    Living Room:....................[HTML] [/HTML] Zone 2 (Workout Room):
    AVR - Yamaha RX-V757......JBL 4312 Pro Monitors
    Pre - Nak CA-5
    AMP - Adcom 555 (Main)
    Main - Polk RTI8**/RTiA5
    AMP - Adcom 545II (Center)
    Center - Polk CSiA4**
    Sub - Snell Basis 300:p......Zone 3 (Outside)
    CD - Yamaha CDC-555.......Def Tech AW5500
    TV - Pani TH-42PZ80U
    BR - LG BD390
    Monster HTS1600 Power Center
    Dedicated Circuit - (2) 20amp, (1) 15amp
    Ben's IC, Canare 4S11
    **Dayton and Sonicap Caps with Mills Resistors**
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,782
    edited October 2008
    Sami wrote: »
    When it comes to this matter nobody is wrong, nobody is right. It's like arguing if god exists or not; there's no proof in either way.

    Not true at all. Either it makes a difference, or it doesn't. There is considerable evidence that it doesn't, and none that shows it does. So don't say there is no proof either way.
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  • Sami
    Sami Posts: 4,634
    edited October 2008
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    Not true at all. Either it makes a difference, or it doesn't. There is considerable evidence that it doesn't, and none that shows it does. So don't say there is no proof either way.
    Well, there is no proof that god does not exist, is there? Let people believe if they want to.
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  • curved
    curved Posts: 664
    edited October 2008
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    Not true at all. Either it makes a difference, or it doesn't. There is considerable evidence that it doesn't, and none that shows it does. So don't say there is no proof either way.

    Perfect......I can hear the difference. :D
    Living Room:....................[HTML] [/HTML] Zone 2 (Workout Room):
    AVR - Yamaha RX-V757......JBL 4312 Pro Monitors
    Pre - Nak CA-5
    AMP - Adcom 555 (Main)
    Main - Polk RTI8**/RTiA5
    AMP - Adcom 545II (Center)
    Center - Polk CSiA4**
    Sub - Snell Basis 300:p......Zone 3 (Outside)
    CD - Yamaha CDC-555.......Def Tech AW5500
    TV - Pani TH-42PZ80U
    BR - LG BD390
    Monster HTS1600 Power Center
    Dedicated Circuit - (2) 20amp, (1) 15amp
    Ben's IC, Canare 4S11
    **Dayton and Sonicap Caps with Mills Resistors**
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,782
    edited October 2008
    Sami wrote: »
    Well, there is no proof that god does not exist, is there? Let people believe if they want to.


    Can't disuss religion here, but that's a silly comparison. Might as well say that there in no proof unicorns don't exist either.
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  • Sami
    Sami Posts: 4,634
    edited October 2008
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    Can't disuss religion here, but that's a silly comparison. Might as well say that there in no proof unicorns don't exist either.

    Well, there isn't. :)

    I was being kind to the cable believers when I said there is no proof either way, although everything points to there not being (within same gauge wire). It's a pointless discussion, no matter how much it is proven. People who believe, believe, that's why the analogy with the other thing.

    Just for the interests sake, how many believe wire makes a difference and believe EQ is evil?
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited October 2008
    A EQ adds another component and another set of cables in the mix, it can't lower floor noise, and it can't make bass tigher or highs crisper. It can only attenuate or amplify frequencies.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • Sami
    Sami Posts: 4,634
    edited October 2008
    Face wrote: »
    A EQ adds another component and another set of cables in the mix, it can't lower floor noise, and it can't make bass tigher or highs crisper. It can only attenuate or amplify frequencies.

    So basically what a cable allegedly does. Floor noise, ok, but bass tighter and highs crisper? Just the same as with cable.
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,217
    edited October 2008
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    Not to argue about wire, but even if you do believe it makes a difference, is that difference big enough to remove an "overbearing" mid-bass?

    I thought the differences were subtle, and that's why it's never been able to be verified, and why some hear it and some don't? Seems removing mid-bass would be easy to hear and measure.

    Here we go again. He/she says they can hear a difference and is asking advice about 2 specific types of cable. Why is your POV any more valid than his/hers? Fine if you don't agree but you're trying to convince he/she that they're not hearing a difference.

    They already stated they hear a difference. Since you 1) have never tried to hear a difference and 2) claim if a difference can't be measured then it doesn't exist, you can't provide the insight he/she is asking.

    Move along until someone asks whether or not they can hear a difference in cables................then you can apply your circular logic and give your opinion not ever having seen any empirical proof a difference can be measured.

    Cables matter

    H9

    P.s. Go with the Quad
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,782
    edited October 2008
    heiney9 wrote: »
    Since you 1) have never tried to hear a difference and 2) claim if a difference can't be measured then it doesn't exist, you can't provide the insight he/she is asking.

    Move along until someone asks whether or not they can hear a difference in cables................then you can apply your circular logic and give your opinion not ever having seen any empirical proof a difference can be measured.

    Cables matter

    No need to lie in your response.

    1.) I have tried to hear a difference in cables. I have even participated in blind testing. You are the one who has never really tried to see if you can hear a difference in cables.

    2. Please point out where I ever said that? Differences in cable can be easily measured, and have been. It's just not audible.

    I'll move along when you all stop giving bad advice, it's a public forum. If you don't want to discuss it, why don't you move along?
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  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited October 2008
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    I'll move along when you all stop giving bad advice, it's a public forum. If you don't want to discuss it, why don't you move along?


    Thats funny coming from you.

    Best advice is try it. Bad advice is don't try. That's the advice you give:confused: If you don't like it sell it. 9 out 10 people that try my cables send back the same exact report on burn in, and what happened to the SQ. That's plenty of proof to me.
    Rock on William.
    Ben
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
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  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,782
    edited October 2008
    And now you add the magic of burning cables in. You sound just like a cable vendor.
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  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited October 2008
    I would like to give some bad advice. Listen to William, and don't trust your ears. If you spend $1,500 on up for your system, and won't risk a possible $40-100 on an investment that can make a world of difference you are living in a tiny little box with a closed mind. Thanks for pointing that out that I am a cable vendor. You have seen my prices. I don't make much at all from what I sell. Figure the time, and materials, and you would ask why bother. Well I'll tell you why I bother. There are a number of cable company's that sell their cables at way too high of a price, and I don't like to pimp myself out, or my dignity over selling to Polkies. As always in these debates I recommend cables from another company, and not my own. I don't want people like you to make it sound like I care more about making a buck than my love for sweet sounding audio. Have you ever seen me try to push my cables on anyone? No you haven't. So stab away with your lame remarks like
    You sound just like a cable vendor
    Rock on Sweet William. BTW get your ears checked. Also removing your cranium from your anal cavity helps the sound tremendously.
    Ben
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
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