DOW takes another huge smackdown

danger boy
danger boy Posts: 15,722
edited September 2008 in The Clubhouse
Ok.. i can't be the only one concerned or affected by this right? :confused:

I can't even begin to imagine how hard i've been hit. :eek: :mad:

AIG, WTF were you thinking? OMG!

the list just goes on and on, and on.
PolkFest 2012, who's going>?
Vancouver, Canada Sept 30th, 2012 - Madonna concert :cheesygrin:
Post edited by danger boy on
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  • sucks2beme
    sucks2beme Posts: 5,601
    edited September 2008
    More to come. The sloppy, almost criminal lending practices of the last few years
    is gonna cost us bigtime. My favorite, the fireman that was roped
    into a scheme where he bought four houses, rented them out to people
    with poor credit to rebuild their credit. Then, after a year, they were supposed
    to buy them from him when they could get a loan. Scammer is gone,
    two of the renters have bailed, fireman is in deep doodoo. HE BOUGHT FOUR
    HOUSES ON A NO DOCUMENT LOAN! $60k income, good credit, now he is
    screwed. Why did he fall for it? Who loaned a guy over a million smackers
    because he had a decent credit score?
    "The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." --Thomas Jefferson
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  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited September 2008
    Good.
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  • SKsolutions
    SKsolutions Posts: 1,820
    edited September 2008
    The most shocking thing to me is that no one blinked. Tax payers are now guaranteeing the risk with mortgages, but the profit will most likely be privatized. CEO's cook the books, take a 22M dollar performance bonus, declare bankruptcy, then get bailed by the FED in exchange for an IOU from the gov, which means me and you. This is all money that ostensibly will have to be paid back with interest by every working person, and at least a generation to come. With over 50 Trillion in unfunded liabilities, Capital Flight is a real possibility, and the only thing preventing it is other countries that are 'pot committed' on the dollar and the forced acquisition of US Treasuries. Helicopter Ben Bernanke can't stem the flow, and the printing press can't keep pace. A CEO gets out with all his cash and assets, yet the taxpayer get's boned, and collectively we all take a bath. Hang em all.

    /rant>



    Money creation primer
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-9050474362583451279

    Capital Flight, Hyperinflation.
    http://www.shadowstats.com/article/292?display=pdf
    -Ignorance is strength -
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  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited September 2008
    Don't tell me you guys were surprised by this......
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
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  • exalted512
    exalted512 Posts: 10,735
    edited September 2008
    I've been pretty lucky I havent been hit terribly by this yet. I've only lost a coupe hundred bucks on a 5k investment.

    Apple is taking a huge ****...50 bucks down in 1 month.
    -Cody
    Music is like candy, you have to get rid of the rappers to enjoy it
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  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited September 2008
    Lorthos wrote: »
    Don't tell me you guys were surprised by this......

    :rolleyes:

    Better run along and get a new screen name again.
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  • SKsolutions
    SKsolutions Posts: 1,820
    edited September 2008
    I did hear, or rather SEE some good news today. A red letter day in my book.
    -Ignorance is strength -
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  • nadams
    nadams Posts: 5,877
    edited September 2008
    I'm almost glad that I don't have anything in a retirement account.

    Right now, my retirement is going towards the principle on my mortgage. Also, paying off the stupidity of my youth (credit cards), and building up some cushion in case things get really bad and my workplace goes under. You never know these days...

    I'm only 22, I've still got time to do the retirement thing.
    Ludicrous gibs!
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  • shadowofnight
    shadowofnight Posts: 2,735
    edited September 2008
    One bonus to this....I bought 5 more oz's of gold the other day ( When I saw it at 770'ish something told me to buy ) and it closed a 105 dollars higher per oz today...and its going to skyrocket again with all this financial turmoil news :D

    goldprice.org's server is locked hard right now ;)
    The first rule of Fight Club is you don't talk about Fight Club
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  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited September 2008
    nadams wrote: »
    I'm almost glad that I don't have anything in a retirement account.

    There's no better time to have money in a retirement account when you're young. You'll be gobbling up all of the stocks on the cheap and making a mint when the cycle shifts in the other direction.

    Those that are panicking are either being sucked in by the press who are in the tank trying to scare people during an election year or made risky investments of their own...and they're on the bad side of the risk.

    The bailouts so far haven't been a bad thing, per say. AIG, while a bailout, was a loan that will be paid back if they're successful, which I have no doubt they will be. Their paper assets are still worth a lot of money, and oddly enough it's likely the taxpayers will come up on the plus side of this.

    We're not in a recession now, but we will be if any jackass politician tries to impose tax increases....something to chew on when you go to the polls.
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  • danger boy
    danger boy Posts: 15,722
    edited September 2008
    the terrible thing is we still have a few more days before the week ends... hold onto your boot straps, the worse could be yet to come. :(

    Listen to Demi, because the stock market it down.. this is a really good time to be investing.
    PolkFest 2012, who's going>?
    Vancouver, Canada Sept 30th, 2012 - Madonna concert :cheesygrin:
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  • danger boy
    danger boy Posts: 15,722
    edited September 2008
    nadams wrote: »
    I'm only 22, I've still got time to do the retirement thing.

    I used to think the same thing... and you do have plenty of time.. time to amass a huge retirement nest egg.. :D

    take it from someone that knows.. time has a way of slipping away.. before you know it.. you're in your mid 40's... on the other side.. and retirement is only now 20 yrs away.. :eek:
    PolkFest 2012, who's going>?
    Vancouver, Canada Sept 30th, 2012 - Madonna concert :cheesygrin:
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  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited September 2008
    On the flip side, I'd have a case of Pepto Bismol on hand if I were at retirement age. :(

    In all reality, I don't look at my retirement accounts more than a couple times a year.
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  • SKsolutions
    SKsolutions Posts: 1,820
    edited September 2008
    The polls, nor the new President, will have any effect on an entrenched and corrupt money/banking/legislative/lobbyist/political/financial system. Even the economy, in and of itself, has little to do with it at this point because it's a debt that cannot be paid back. The dollar rally is over. It was temporary and artificial. The Fed is now taking toxic and falling Equities in lieu of Treasuries, and allowing the creation of 'high powered' money based on it, . . . it's worse than bad. I don't think it's the meltdown, but it's just begun. Apply time to an exponential curve and see what happens.
    <a href="http://www.shadowstats.com&quot; title="Visit ShadowStats.com"><img src="http://shadowstats.com/imgs/sgs-cpi.gif?hl=1&quot; border="0" alt="Chart of U.S. Consumer Inflation (CPI)" /></a>

    <a href="http://www.shadowstats.com&quot; title="Visit ShadowStats.com"><img src="http://shadowstats.com/imgs/sgs-m3.gif?hl=1&quot; border="0" alt="Chart of U.S. Money Supply Growth" /></a>
    -Ignorance is strength -
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  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited September 2008
    SKsolutions wrote: »
    The polls, nor the new President, will have any effect on an entrenched and corrupt money/banking/legislative/lobbyist/political system. Even the economy, in and of itself, has little to do with it at this point because it's a debt that cannot be paid back. The dollar rally is over. It was temporary and artificial. The Fed is now taking toxic and falling Equities in lieu of Treasuries, and allowing the creation of 'high powered' money based on it, . . . it's worse than bad. I don't think it's the meltdown, but it's just begun. Apply time to an exponential curve and see what happens.

    Wrong. They'll have a deep and cataclysmically disastrous effect on the overall economy if they start taxing businesses and individuals, that includes fees and hidden taxes.

    The economy, as it is right now, is in pretty decent shape. Trust me, I know, people are spending lots of money and have been doing so for the last 2 years straight and it sure as **** hasn't stopped this week. This is primarily a mortgage problem. Obviously it doesn't completely end there, but things are hardly as bad as some make it out to be. You're talking about a potential meltdown and we're not even in a recession.

    The bottom line is greed. People taking risks they couldn't afford to make, both businesses and consumers. The same companies failing now were making money hand over fist several years ago. Now their assets are overpowered by their obligations.

    Some will learn an expensive lesson -- there are 2 kinds of luck.
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  • sucks2beme
    sucks2beme Posts: 5,601
    edited September 2008
    Big problem. More than Mortgage. Most people are carrying big debt.
    So are most companies. And these companies dumped all their assets to avoid takeovers.
    And their employees, so they can make stuff overseas.
    And uncle sam is so far underwater, it's scary. And the import Vs. export
    money flow is staggering. Added together it's a pot of trouble.
    I think the XMAS shopping season is gonna be a big letdown for stores.
    But what the hell do I know? Maybe the money fairy will come by and sprikle
    some dust on it. :confused:
    "The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." --Thomas Jefferson
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  • dkg999
    dkg999 Posts: 5,647
    edited September 2008
    I agree with the greed comment. You have pressures on companies to continually expand their business, revenue, and profits, and then you provide incentives to senior mgt that doesn't use a risk component to keep them in check. It all leads to business decisions that are questionable when closely scrutinized.

    The mortgage crisis will carry over to other segments of the economy, however you have to look at it as a painful and needed adjustment. When people with sub-prime credit ratings are allowed to by property with little or nothing down and then borrow 125% of the purchase price to pay off other existing debts ......... how did we really think that was a good idea?

    Even Warren Buffett got caught up in this! It's time the MBA's learn that you can only make "on the books" money so long by trading paper before the piper comes calling. Whatever happened to valuing consistent, financially solid performance of companies that may not be showing high rates of growth. I also wonder if some of this is tied to the disappearance of the manufacturing sector from the US economy?
    DKG999
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  • SKsolutions
    SKsolutions Posts: 1,820
    edited September 2008
    DEMI, I really don't get your reponse, but please see the big shiny chart above. It's a possible systemic failure. The president nor taxes will have any impact on it. The Austrian School economists are looking very smart right now.
    -Ignorance is strength -
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  • 4406bbl
    4406bbl Posts: 194
    edited September 2008
    What did you think was going to happen? Everyone deserves a house or three even if they do not work and then we send shovels full of money over to China for trinkets and Japan for a car, then blame corporate greed. The people running Freddie and Fannie are the real criminals and I bet they never get charged with anything,its the Democrates baby and we get to pay for it. Social engineering at its best.
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  • dorokusai
    dorokusai Posts: 25,577
    edited September 2008
    I'm amazed that someone in this list hasn't blamed Bush for this debacle....color me impressed.
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  • dkg999
    dkg999 Posts: 5,647
    edited September 2008
    dorokusai wrote: »
    I'm amazed that someone in this list hasn't blamed Bush for this debacle....color me impressed.

    He might not be smart enough to have created this mess :o
    DKG999
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  • SKsolutions
    SKsolutions Posts: 1,820
    edited September 2008
    Social engineering. It's simple.
    1) Create, foster, or allow a problem/crisis
    2) Suggest or impose a solution
    3) Extract a price
    4) Lather, rinse, repeat

    "Parties" are funded the same people at the same time, so they are different sides of the same coin. It really doesn't matter, it's just a different set of pet projects. . . but the money doesn't really exist anyway. . . so maybe that doesn't matter either.
    -Ignorance is strength -
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  • hockeyboy
    hockeyboy Posts: 1,428
    edited September 2008
    All I know is that I am glad I only trade stocks in the day. I would guess we have another 15-20% to fall in the US market. I have been making a fortune short selling. My concern is that all my money I am making is in dollars.
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  • 4406bbl
    4406bbl Posts: 194
    edited September 2008
    hockeyboy wrote: »
    All I know is that I am glad I only trade stocks in the day. I have been making a fortune short selling. My concern is that all my money I am making is in dollars.

    The dollar will be king in the end,this ship is sailing to europe and south america too.
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  • fossy
    fossy Posts: 1,378
    edited September 2008
    dorokusai wrote: »
    I'm amazed that someone in this list hasn't blamed Bush for this debacle....color me impressed.

    he is just a puppet as all of us know. we all do know that don't we ???:D
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  • fossy
    fossy Posts: 1,378
    edited September 2008
    just turn up the tunes -- it'll be ok
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  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 1,394
    edited September 2008
    Rescue a company at the citizens expense. Its ****. Is it just me or is the power somehow going all to the government? fannie and freddie... etc etc etc.. Its a slow process, but government will not be by the people..
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  • Dennis Gardner
    Dennis Gardner Posts: 4,861
    edited September 2008
    The best thing about economic news is that it keeps Al Gore's warming bunch on a back burner...........;)
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  • bobman1235
    bobman1235 Posts: 10,822
    edited September 2008
    I thought the best part was how everyone instantly turned into a financial expert. Amazing how we got into this mess when all you schlubs had all the answers the whole time :rolleyes:
    If you will it, dude, it is no dream.
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  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited September 2008
    SKsolutions wrote: »
    DEMI, I really don't get your reponse, but please see the big shiny chart above. It's a possible systemic failure. The president nor taxes will have any impact on it. The Austrian School economists are looking very smart right now.

    What is "it?" They economy? If so, that's simply 100% false.

    You seem to be basing the entire health of the economy on the correction in the housing market and people who invested in poorly managed companies.
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